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Origins: Snows of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe

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GLENCOE


Related threads:
Tune Req: Glencoe (15)
(origins) Origin: Glencoe Massacre (Jim McLean) (59)
The Massacre of Glencoe—Favorite Version (102)
Lyr Req: The Massacre Of Glencoe (37)
Chords Req: Glencoe (23)
Tune Req: Ballad of Glencoe (10)
(origins) Origins: Ballad of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe (39)
History & Present: Glencoe Massacre (46)


GUEST,Graham Kimber (gcemea@aol.com) 24 Aug 01 - 08:40 AM
IanC 24 Aug 01 - 08:53 AM
GUEST,George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca 24 Aug 01 - 11:19 AM
GUEST,andymac 24 Aug 01 - 01:19 PM
GUEST,Beadie 24 Aug 01 - 02:06 PM
GUEST,Boab 25 Aug 01 - 03:00 AM
George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca 25 Aug 01 - 12:39 PM
GUEST 31 May 11 - 02:33 PM
Soldier boy 31 May 11 - 07:33 PM
Jim McLean 01 Jun 11 - 10:29 AM
Soldier boy 01 Jun 11 - 01:53 PM
Jim McLean 01 Jun 11 - 01:56 PM
Soldier boy 01 Jun 11 - 08:28 PM
Teribus 02 Jun 11 - 01:22 PM
Allan Conn 02 Jun 11 - 03:24 PM
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Subject: Snows of Glencoe
From: GUEST,Graham Kimber (gcemea@aol.com)
Date: 24 Aug 01 - 08:40 AM

any ideas who wrote these lyrics, its a beut song. I have looked for it on the database but with no luck, so if its ok with you guys here are the words and chords.

The Snows of Glencoe

C              F           C            Am
They came in a blizzard we offered them heat.
F G C G
A roof o're their heads dry shoes for their feet.
C F C Am
We wined them and dined them they ate of our meat.
F G C
And slept in the house of McDonald.

Chorus:-
C F C
And White is the snow that sweeps Glen coe.
C G
And covers the graves of McDonalds.
C F C
Cruel was the sword that raped Glen coe.
F G C
And slaughtered the house of McDonald.

They came in the night when the men were asleep.
This band of Argyles through snow soft and deep.
Like murdering foxes amongst helpless sheep.
They slaughtered the house of McDonald.

Chorus:-

Some died in their beds at the hands of the foe.
Some fled in the night and were lost in the snow.
Some lived to accuse them that struck the first blow.
That slaughtered the house of McDonald.

Chorus:-

They came from Fort William with murder in mind
The Cambell's had orders Prince William had signed
Put all to the sword were these words underlined ----
And leave non alive called McDonald

Chorus:--end.


Pre-formatted text entered for 1st verse & chorus and line breaks - <br> - added. --JoeClone

Search for "glencoe" threads

Glencoe in the Digital Tradition.


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Subject: RE: Snows of Glencoe
From: IanC
Date: 24 Aug 01 - 08:53 AM

This thread should provide you with the information you need.

Cheers!
Ian


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Subject: RE: Snows of Glencoe
From: GUEST,George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: 24 Aug 01 - 11:19 AM

Graham, the song is called the Massacre of Glencoe. It commemorates a situation whereby the clan MacDonald gave guest priviledges to its' enemy the Campbells. Inviting them to stay over night in their own castles, the MacDonalds did not realize the Campbells were in the employ of the English who wanted their lands.

According to legend, most of the MacDonalds were slaughtered in their sleep when the Campbells arose and took the castle. Ostensibly they were carrying out orders of the English King who had outlawed the MacDonalds.

It's never been forgotten. The song itself was written some time after, but as you can see, the feelings are still quite strong.


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Subject: RE: Snows of Glencoe
From: GUEST,andymac
Date: 24 Aug 01 - 01:19 PM

To my knowledge the song was written by Jim McLean, not sure when (late 60s??), he also wrote several other songs recorded by Alastair McDonald on an album called "Scottish Battle Songs" which Jim produced. My own favourite of his was a song called "Where is the Glasgow?" which was written in response to a song of the same name by Adam McNaughtan which Jim McLean considered over-romantic. That song is on an album called Gallus Glasgow Songs and sung on it by Iain Mackintosh. Jim Mclean today is not around the Scottish folk scene and works (I think) in electronics.


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Subject: RE: Snows of Glencoe
From: GUEST,Beadie
Date: 24 Aug 01 - 02:06 PM

My family name was MacDonald until two generations ago. My Grandfather married a member of a sept of the Campbells as his second wife and was told by my Great-grandfather to change his name.

The anymosity runs even into the twentieth century.


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Subject: RE: Snows of Glencoe
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 25 Aug 01 - 03:00 AM

Aye---a good song. Our little group have it as part of the repertoire over here on Vanc. Island, and it's a frequent request. The history upon which it is based, however, has been [in common with nearly all such histories]somewhat embellished. The culprits in the affair were not all Campbells, but were a mix of members of a military unit commanded by "Argylle", who WAS a Campbell. On the night, 35 MacDonalds were killed. It is almost certain that many more would have died had they not been told to "scarper" by some of the men who were reluctant to carry out their dastardly orders. Thirty five souls, and a tale of infamy known the world over; how many have heard of the "fight at Drife Sands" where the Armstrongs and the Johnstones fell out with each other? Death toll among the Armstrongs alone---four hundred. No romantic songs there---- Still, no excuse for a night of treachery in Glen Coe. And it is a good song.


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Subject: RE: Snows of Glencoe
From: George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: 25 Aug 01 - 12:39 PM

It hadn't anything to do with the actual numbers of the lost and slain.

In the highland culture, guest rights were sacrosanct. Anyone travelling to and fro could expect to be treated well when stopping for the night, even if it was in an enemy's home. It was and is a tradition of the peoples there. When the "Campbells" abused that right, it is what shook the society and is remembered as "a night of infamy".

I don't know if this is where the Campbells got their name or not. In Gaelic, the name derives from Cam and Beul. Cam = Crooked or Bent and Beul = Mouth. So the name of the Campbells literally means Crooked Mouth or in common English parlance - Liar


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Subject: RE: Origins: Snows of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 11 - 02:33 PM

hello Graham Kimber,
wie geht es Dir? antwort


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Subject: RE: Origins: Snows of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe
From: Soldier boy
Date: 31 May 11 - 07:33 PM

Not sure about where the notion of castles comes from.

Sorry but it sounds like an embroidered Disney fairy tale to me.

I have camped on the site of the Massacre in Glencoe and saw no castle. I believe the McDonalds were just simple crofters who took the 'guest' Campbells into their own simple abodes overnight to offer safe passage as they supposedly travelled through the highlands.

Of course I could be wrong and am willing to be corrected.

Chris


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Subject: RE: Origins: Snows of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe
From: Jim McLean
Date: 01 Jun 11 - 10:29 AM

Chris, I don't know where you got the idea about castles. There was no castle but again the MacDonalds were more than simple crofters offering hospitality. I wrote the song around 1963, I think, and as already been told, the murders were politically motivated and aslo cotrary to laws of hospitality. The story can be read in John Prebble's book 'Glencoe' whic was published after I wrote my song.


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Subject: RE: Origins: Snows of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe
From: Soldier boy
Date: 01 Jun 11 - 01:53 PM

Thanks Jim and I think that this is such a poignant and well crafted song.
I love Glencoe and have always thought that it has such a haunting atmosphere.
The first time I camped there between the Clackhaig (not sure of spelling!) Inn and the river Coe was in 1971 and I also bought John Prebble's book 'Glencoe' at the same time (or possibly one or two years later as we went to Glencoe three years on the trot) so I will have to have a rummage about to see if I can find it.

Mr reference to castles was in response to what GUEST George Seto said earlier on this thread on 24 Aug 01.

Chris


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Subject: RE: Origins: Snows of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe
From: Jim McLean
Date: 01 Jun 11 - 01:56 PM

I see what you mean, Chris. I'm afraid George Soto got the situation and the story completely wrong.


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Subject: RE: Origins: Snows of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe
From: Soldier boy
Date: 01 Jun 11 - 08:28 PM

Seems he's done it before Jim. Sometimes too much misguided information leads to misinformation or just plain mischief.

Sorry to see on some of the off-shoot threads here how some people have questioned the provenance of you as the writer of this great song around 1963 and confused the song with different songwriters.

It must get really irksome and frustrating for you. Personally I would get mad as hell but you seem to take it in your stride and remain a calm and respectful true gentleman. Good on ya, you have my full respect.

Chris


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Subject: RE: Origins: Snows of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe
From: Teribus
Date: 02 Jun 11 - 01:22 PM

"Subject: RE: Snows of Glencoe
From: GUEST,George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca - PM
Date: 24 Aug 01 - 11:19 AM

Graham, the song is called the Massacre of Glencoe. It commemorates a situation whereby the clan MacDonald gave guest priviledges to its' enemy the Campbells. Inviting them to stay over night in their own castles, the MacDonalds did not realize the Campbells were in the employ of the English who wanted their lands.

According to legend, most of the MacDonalds were slaughtered in their sleep when the Campbells arose and took the castle. Ostensibly they were carrying out orders of the English King who had outlawed the MacDonalds."


Complete and utter crap, where in the hell do you get your historical information from? Mel Gibson? A comic?

A couple of sites that may educate you:

1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacre_of_Glencoe

and in greater detail for those who do not like wikipedia

2: http://www.electricscotland.com/history/glencoe/

The MacDonalds of Glencoe offered hospitality to two Companies of the Duke of Argyll's Regiment (Soldiers of the Crown acting under orders of the Secretary of State over Scotland and Lord Advocate, John Dalrymple, Master of Stair - A Scot.

There were never any "Castles" in Glencoe.

Nothing English about this sorry affair at all it was entirely Scots in its making and execution.

Nothing to do with an English King wanting MacDonald land, which is a ridiculous concept in any event as the King of both Scotland and England the "English" King automatically owned all the land in Scotland and England, had he wanted it, it would have been his at the stroke of a pen.


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Subject: RE: Origins: Snows of Glencoe / Massacre of Glencoe
From: Allan Conn
Date: 02 Jun 11 - 03:24 PM

"Nothing English about this sorry affair at all it was entirely Scots in its making and execution."

I had the same conversation with a guy on newsnet a while back. Because William was the King of England this poster deemed it was therefor the fault of 'the English' which as you suggest is absolutely absurd. William was also the King of Scotland as well as King of Ireland - so we could equally say it was the fault of the Irish! As far as I see it when James VII and his brother before him were on the throne Presbyterians who refused to swear allegiance were persecuted and sometimes murdered. That is the Killing Times. State terror carried out by the Scottish govt under the auspice of the Scottish monarchs. When James lost his power base in England the Scottish Estates met and the result ended in hime being branded a traitor and stripped off the Scottish throne which was then offered to his daughter Mary and her husband William. The tables were then turned and people who wouldn't swear allegiance to the new monarchs were then in turn persecuted. Again state terror by the Scottish govt with the acquiesence of the Scottish monarchs. Nothing to do with the English as such.


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