 sj |
||
|
||
Has Mudcat changed your thinking?
|
|
|
Subject: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: The Shambles Date: 16 Sep 01 - 01:47 PM Being able to read the many and varied views from the many and varied people on the forum for the last few years has certainly influenced my thinking and views.
Especially so at this present time, as I feel that I can both understand better and can identify more with my Mudcat friends in the USA, in particular.
Not that I expect my views to be agreed with. I was wondering if the same was true of Mudcatters from the US and elswhere? |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Justa Picker Date: 16 Sep 01 - 01:48 PM In more ways than you could possibly imagine. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Paul from Hull Date: 16 Sep 01 - 01:58 PM I feel the same as you Shambles.... I couldnt have learned a FRACTION as much of the US point of view on all this without the Mudcat, even though I do chat to a few Americans otherwise. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: wysiwyg Date: 16 Sep 01 - 02:12 PM Hey, could someone find the last thread on this topic and blicky it? I think it was "Minds Changed at Mudcat?" ~S~ |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: The Shambles Date: 16 Sep 01 - 03:10 PM I suppose I was thinking more of our thinking now. Would you be thinking differently now, without Mudcat? |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Don Firth Date: 16 Sep 01 - 03:21 PM Probably. Undoubtedly. As a result of what I've read on Mudcat, comments, viewpoints, and links posted, I know a lot more than I would have otherwise, and I have a much wider range of knowledge and opinions to chew on. Extremely valuable. Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Mary in Kentucky Date: 16 Sep 01 - 03:26 PM Hey Shambles, are you appreciating Beethovan more these days? ;-) When we discuss "change in thinking," I always think about a college class I had in persuasive speaking. As an exercise we had to line up across the classroom representing a spectrum of how we felt about a topic. After a person gave a speech on a controversial topic, we lined up again and noted if we had moved one way or the other on the spectrum. I don't think minds are changed 180 degrees (often anyway), but there is movement along the spectrum when we learn more and are influenced to move a little. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Max Date: 16 Sep 01 - 03:26 PM Here you go: BS: Mind-Changing at Mudcat? |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Mary in Kentucky Date: 16 Sep 01 - 03:28 PM I mispell Beethoven about half the time! |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Mary in Kentucky Date: 16 Sep 01 - 03:30 PM ...also misspell. sheesh... |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: wysiwyg Date: 16 Sep 01 - 03:33 PM Quite a contrast, this thread and the last. Thanks Max. Max, thanks for making this place be a place where we can try to deal with all this. REALLY THANKS, Max. ~S~ |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: DougR Date: 16 Sep 01 - 03:37 PM Yes, from time to time. DougR |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: catspaw49 Date: 16 Sep 01 - 03:50 PM I have found the past week to be very informative at the very least. Immediately after the attacks I read posts from otherwise sane and caring, compassionate, folks going off the deep end. As time passed I have seen them and myself as well, become more reasoned and thoughtful and full of ideas. I can only hope the same is happening in DC! I have also, as Shambles mentioned, found out a lot more about others around the world. Like him, I was able to see more clearly from outside the US perspective (and in his case, more from the US perspective). I would also like to commend all here as most of the discussions have been without undue rancor, save the occasional flaming idiot here and there. Even those with strongly held but differing views have, in the main, presented their cases with reasoned thought. Moreover, I have watched tons of TV coverage, read the papers, the internet news, and all of that and I must say that this place could compete well with any group of professional "talking heads" and are far more sane than most. We also have our field reporters and other news watchers so that a lot of information was colleced here and often the 'Cat was ahead of the TV coverage....no mean feat. So yes, in many ways my mind has been changed and I believe for the better. Were the 'Cat not here I would never have been stimulated in my own thinking (such as that is) to such a great degree. Thank you Max, but more...Thank you 'Catters! Spaw |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Bill D Date: 16 Sep 01 - 04:10 PM we have a great diversity of thoughts and approaches here, and some very well-spoken exponents of them. Beause I read the threads here, I see viewpoints expressed that I might not otherwise. I can't say that my basic feelings have changed, but I have sure enhanced them and learned about others. Simple discussions about cultural differences without the overlay of faces, accents and body language have allowed me to concentrate on words more.....but then it also makes me WANT to meet the people behind those words eventually, so I can refine my evaluations. I do know that I react to ideas & opinions I meet here, and it has undoubtably made changes in my life and attiutdes that even I don't 'see' immediately. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Eric the Viking Date: 16 Sep 01 - 04:34 PM I've always been interested in other people and other cultures, tried to be broad and fair in my outlook and thoughts, tollerant of other people and their way of life (except for mindless thugs etc, out and out extreme politics in any direction, I have even had friends who are tories!!-light hearted jest!) So I haven't changed radically. I have discovered that there are more people like me or I am one more like them. I have always believed we only had one world. My father fought with the Americans in WW2, liked most of them, hated war and what it did to all of us either as observers, combatants or recipients of it's horror.He always told me to dislike, never to hate except with extremely good reason. I have discovered a place where I can care more about people than I could have had they just been faceless or nameless. The people on Mudcat are like any small town. A good mix, some poles apart, others closer than family. Apart from the "mindles thugs"- most often posting as guests, causing trouble not really expressing their opinion). Mudcat hasn't changed my thinking much, my perception and the width of experience yes. Thanks Max, thanks to all the people I communicate with in one small way or another, friends. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Troll Date: 16 Sep 01 - 04:43 PM My mind has not been changed as far as basics, are concerned, but I feel priviledged to have been exposed to the ideas of others. This has led me -for the most part- to a better understanding of why they feel as they do and that aids in communication. troll |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: GUEST Date: 16 Sep 01 - 05:22 PM Yes, conditionally. It has also re-inforced my view that irrational prejudices are still alive and well. But, I'm only a guest.... |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Bill D Date: 16 Sep 01 - 05:30 PM both rational & irrational prejudices are alive & well....and I am a *member* who who has a few of each, and is trying to rid myself of the irrational ones |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Mr Red Date: 16 Sep 01 - 05:33 PM call me a pedant No.... but the people in it have |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Jon Freeman Date: 16 Sep 01 - 06:14 PM I have learned a bit about other cultures here but my experience seems slightly different to that of shambles in that I have learned "not all Americans (substitute who ever) think this..." and as a result, I tend to focus more on indivuals and their own thoughts and personality rather than immediately thinking well "an American would think that..." One question though: does Mudcat really represent a typical cross section of any country or culture? Jon |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: GUEST Date: 16 Sep 01 - 06:23 PM does Mudcat really represent a typical cross section of any country or culture? Of course not. A good thing too. If soveriegn nations 'had kittens' to the extent that some Mudcatters do, when faced with the slightest criticism, nay even suggestion, then the world would be a very strange place. No one would manage to agree on anything, there'd be lots of nice ideas that were never followed through... No, I'm glad the world isn't like Mudcat |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: steve in ottawa Date: 16 Sep 01 - 06:57 PM Writing down your own thoughts helps to clarify and sometimes change them, moreso when you are writing them down where someone else will read them and comment on them. Mudcat can't help but influence you, if you participate. Most recently, it was reassuring to hear Americans say: it's OK to have fun. Here in Ottawa, people were pretty upset over the WTC attack; over a hundred thousand showed up at Friday lunchtime for the rememberance ceremony on Parliament Hill, and that's several thousand more than can fit into that area. (and Ottawa and Gatineau across the river only have a million people total) Lots more turned away when they saw they couldn't get close. Anyway, I was glad to be encouraged by American Catters to perform whatever seemed right for the crowd at a beach on Saturday evening and throwing in several happy songs seemed to work out very well, especially for all the kids present. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: CarolC Date: 16 Sep 01 - 08:18 PM Something the Mudcat has done for me that I value very greatly...
Prior to my participation in the Mudcat, I knew that it was important to think globally. But I didn't have very many ways to put this into practice on a day-to-day basis. The Mudcat gives me a way to think and act globally, every day.
I echo the sentiments of those who have thanked Max for giving us this place where we can have such an opportunity. You are making a very big difference in the world, Max. I hope you understand that. Thank you. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Date: 16 Sep 01 - 09:04 PM I think Mudcat has helped me try to see the other persons point of view, I guess what I really meant when I started the thread last night when I was drunk is=After meeting qyite a few catters in the flesh, I have noticed that every single one of them was frendly, helpful and welcoming to a newcommer to their community.I have also noticed that when Mudcatters get together they never argue,I was at a festival in yorkshire recently and noticed that during the whole weekend, there was not a nasty word said to anyone.I feel it would maybe benefit us all if all those that can, try to meet up with other members occasionaly.I was a bit wary of this at first, I thought "what if I don't fit in?, I wont know anybody there or whatever" As for Mudcat been a true cross section of society, well in my experince of "folkies" both on Mudcat and elsewhere, they seem to be somewhat left wing in their political beliefs.I know this is a bit of a generalisation, but most of the folkies I have met have attended university, and seem to be mostly white collar workers, ie teachers, social workers. There appears to be very few manual workers here, ie shop assistants, factory labourers etc, so no I don't feel that the Mudcat is a good cross section of society. In the factories I have worked in, very few if any people were interested in folk music, I feel that one of the reasons for this may be ease of access to the product, ie in the UK we have 2 national classic music (BBC radio 3 & Classic FM) A national jazz station (Jazz FM), but no folk stations, there is very little folk played on UK radio, perhaps the odd half hour here or there. sorry I am waffling a bit here, oh well just a few thoughts.john |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: SINSULL Date: 16 Sep 01 - 10:14 PM Max - your first post since the Radio Show. Welcome back...or did you ever leave? I was concerned about you. Mudcat has made me more aware of how the US is viewed by the rest of the world. And in some cases, why. It has not always been a pleasant experience. I listen more now and more carefully. Has it changed my thinking? Probably not. But I am much more likely to listen and learn about opposing views. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Justa Picker Date: 16 Sep 01 - 10:20 PM Mudcat has made me more inquisitive about life. For instance, why do we always shout when we're having a phone conversation with someone on the other end, who's using a hands-free speaker phone? Or turn down the music on the car audio system when we're looking for a street address? |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: WyoWoman Date: 16 Sep 01 - 10:28 PM It's made the world significantly smaller to have friends in Australia and New Zealand and throughout the U.K., even though we've never met (with the rare exception of Mr. Sables, on his Grand Tour last year -- a major treat). I do think the experience has made me much more aware of what's going on in the rest of the world, and to pry me loose of whatever nationalism I might have been clinging to. I've never traveled, but I feel much more like a citizen of the planet now. Still love my country and pray for her wisdom and courage, in equal measure, but also feel keenly aware of the ripples that go far beyond our borders. ww |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Date: 16 Sep 01 - 10:47 PM Justa Picker-I agree these are intrigng questions, heres another, Why do people shout at deaf/hearing impaired people? They are deaf NOT stupid, just speak clearly and don't mumble. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Rick Fielding Date: 17 Sep 01 - 01:05 AM After over three years of visiting Mudcat on a very regular basis (it became like reading my morning paper, which I ALSO hate to miss) I'd say this is an exceptional cross section of folks...at least those affluent enough to own computers. My core beliefs not only remain, but are somewhat strengthened, but I HAVE changed certain belief patterns. I find it absoluty riveting much of the time. People's behaviour (especially my own) can be astonishing. Huge fun as well. Rick |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: mooman Date: 17 Sep 01 - 04:03 AM In many ways I think yes. I hope that I was reasonably open-minded before but the Mudcat has enbled me to learn and understand a lot more, and gain different perspectives on many issues, from a huge range of people GLOBALLY. This has, on the whole, been an enriching experience, and I must say that in real life I have yet to meet a 'Catter I have not liked. I believe Mudcat is a unique kind of site/community, what Bill Sables often calls a "big global folk club" with, by and large, a hugely supportive set of people in it. The relatively small amount of trouble we get here from time to time pretty much reflects what we come up against in our normal lives and does not, in any way, detract from my enjoyment and appreciation of this community. I would like to thank Max from the bottom of my heart for keeping this place going and giving me the chance to have dialogue with, and sometimes meet, some extremely nice, knowledgeable and interesting people. All my best to all mooman
|
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: GUEST,Celtic Soul Date: 17 Sep 01 - 10:58 AM Absolutely, yes. Reading her has changed my thinking. Not because others are persuasive or charismatic, but because they post evidence and facts that are varifiable. And that is the only thing that changes my mind. A very intelligent and learned bunch we have here! |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Steve in Idaho Date: 17 Sep 01 - 11:18 AM I don't know that I have changed my thinking so much as my "being." A hard thing to define - one's essence I suppose. The one thing that has consistently impressed me is the ability to express oneself. Whether one agrees or not with the view. And in this day it is nice to be able to choose what I will react to in a caring space in time. Peace - Steve |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Mrrzy Date: 17 Sep 01 - 11:26 AM Speaking as a statistician, we may not be representative but we ARE a cross-section. I would say not that Mudcat (or its members) have changed my thinking, exactly, more that they've changed my emotional response to this whole thing. That is, it's nice to know that there are a bunch of reasonably sane folks around the world, despite what the media are telling us... I am less filled with despair than I think I'd be without the Cat. But then again, bawling my eyes out at the local vigil Friday night probably helped more... |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Jack the Sailor Date: 17 Sep 01 - 12:38 PM I like MudCat a lot when the conversation is about music or is kept in a lighter vein. It's changed my life in that it has given me the ability to share the imagination and wit of some very bright people. The most useful thing about MudCat is the sharing of third party information. Some of the things in the Afghanistan thread for example were quite informative. Some of the folks here, including unnamed guest in this post are a lot more childish and rude than I am used to. I guess I am learning better how to cope with that. But sometimes it keeps this place from being the friendly refuge it could be. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: M.Ted Date: 17 Sep 01 - 05:20 PM As far as I am concerned, my thinking (and particularly my playing) has evolved just from having a chance to talk with people who care about playing, studying, and creating music. Second, and I can't overemphasize this, I my musical understandings have expanded substantially by having access to songs, lyrics, MIDIs, and the minds of people who collect and study these things. I have learned a lot about the process of finding ways to express ideas, particularly musical ones, in words. I have also learned a lot about when to keep my mouth shut, (or, actually, when I should have kept my mouth shut). I have also learned a little about proofing before I post, and more than a little bit about re-reading what I've written to make sure I've said what I thought I said--I have also realized how much you can learn from someone who is a total fucking idiot, if you read the post again, carefully- |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Little Hawk Date: 18 Sep 01 - 11:52 AM Yes... I've heard a lot of interesting viewpoints here, and found out things I would not have known otherwise. I am also gradually learning when to speak honestly and openly, and when to not speak at all, since it would only arouse misunderstanding and needless conflict. Mind you, I have to do that around here in my own town as well on occasion, among friends and acquaintances, so that just goes to show that Mudcat is much like any other human situation. - LH |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Rick Fielding Date: 18 Sep 01 - 12:20 PM I'll echo most of Ted's comments. One thing I've learned is that I really CARE about spelling mistakes. By nature and laziness, I'm a bad speller, but when I see so many misplaced quotation marks (especially in headers) and stuff like that, it makes me want to prufread at least a couple of times before hitting the button. It's sure not perfect yet, but a lot better than three years ago. Haven't been able to shake my "brackets" habit though (and I HAVE tried). Rick |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Jeri Date: 18 Sep 01 - 01:00 PM Rick, it's weird, but I seem to have developed a double standard. Of course, I probably always felt this way, but posting here has made me more aware of it. I detest my own imperfections, whether they show themselves as spelling mistakes, lack of clarity, offending people for no good reason, or not keeping my mouth shut at appropriate times. When other people do these things, I'm apt to not pay much attention to it, although the last two things sometimes get to me. I guess it comes with a greater acceptance of different perspectives. (I do the same thing with music though. Someone else hits a bum note, I ignore it and get on with listening. When I do it, I cringe and apologise, and hang on to that feeling of being a dunce. I also think I, too, might have a wee problem with brackets.) I read somewhere, (regarding Usenet and newsgroups) that it's the lowest form of internet life who feels compelled to point out spelling and grammar mistakes. Most of us are typing here the same way we would speak, and to run everything through a spell checker or lengthy editing for grammar would just get in the way of communication. So does complaining about it. If we had to make sure everything we said in a conversation was correct before uttering a word, most of us with perfectly good ideas to contribute would just sit around and listen to people with good language skills. Perhaps we'd simply go somewhere where people cared more about what we had to say instead of how we said it. Mind you, my writing ability has increased greatly from being here. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: John Hardly Date: 18 Sep 01 - 03:11 PM I couldn't agree more with what M.Ted said (rhyme time). As to learning to keep my mouth shut. Mudcat has spilled over into my 3D life in that it made me realize--in a graphic way that polite folk might not have told me--that what I have to offer to a conversation isn't often that interesting. Being the gregarious and somewhat opinionated type, I usually took people's politeness to mean that they were interested in what I had to say. When I first came to the Mudcat, it was a bit painful to have my participation in a thread completely ignored. But it was a good learning experience to make myself go back, read my posts, and realize that my offerings weren't interesting/funny/tasteful. Now, when a big event happens such as we've all just experienced, I'm at least a bit more likely to sit back and listen to others first (or maybe only. ...sure cuts down on the need to use my keypad much though... I've learned that earnest questions are far more welcome than declarative sentences. There is a mudcat "language" and it may take a good year to learn it...and you may never speak it. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Rick Fielding Date: 18 Sep 01 - 04:12 PM Hi Jeri. You said: "I read somewhere, (regarding Usenet and newsgroups) that it's the lowest form of internet life who feels compelled to point out spelling and grammar mistakes." Ha Ha! I've finally made it "the lowest form of internet life".....although I suspect the person who said it probably can't spell! I guess I'll have to be content to be in the lowER form of internet life though, 'cause I never (well almost never) do anything about it, other than mumble to myself. I have become more tolerant of religion and (gawd help me) gun ownership, since I've been in Mudcat. Rick |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Jeri Date: 18 Sep 01 - 10:11 PM Rick, in order to slide down the e-volutionary scale, you have to comment on an individual's writing skills. Generalised rants don't count. Mumbling to yourself doesn't count.
By the way, you're doing that bracket thing again. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: GUEST,CLETUS Date: 18 Sep 01 - 10:30 PM I dunno iffen Mudcat dun changed me enny but I do think that Ive lernt ta be purty tallerunt uv them folks whut doan spel nun to good. Sinz I got me a gud forth grayd edgeekayshun I kin git a bit persnickuddy bout ritin an all, but thair aint no senz inna gittin to up in arms bout folks whut aint had the same benafitz. An I shur doan holt with them whut gitz naztee an all. CLETUS |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Date: 18 Sep 01 - 10:46 PM Well said Cletus. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 18 Sep 01 - 11:10 PM |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: The Shambles Date: 19 Sep 01 - 02:48 AM When I first came to the Mudcat, it was a bit painful to have my participation in a thread completely ignored John your post was not ignored..... |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: The Shambles Date: 20 Sep 01 - 01:55 PM It has certainly changed the thinking of my local council, if not quite yet their policy.
They thought that I was alone in being prepared to write and question their policy and actions. Letters from many Mudcat friends all over world, has at least managed to get them to try and justify themselves in public. They are now making gestures, at least about taking the issue to Government. So many thanks from me, to Max and The Mudcat. |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: Art Thieme Date: 20 Sep 01 - 09:01 PM Mudcat has shown me the truth of my favorite old adage these days: The more things change, the more they get different. And, like Mudcat, things never stay the way they were when I learned to care about / love them. ART THIEME |
|
Subject: RE: Has Mudcat changed your thinking? From: The Shambles Date: 21 Sep 01 - 05:42 AM Letters from many Mudcat friends all over world, has at least managed to get them to try and justify themselves in public. Isn't there a law against that????????
|
| Share Thread: |
