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info about Paul Clayton??

DigiTrad:
DONE LAID AROUND


Related threads:
Paul Clayton biography coming in Sept 2008 (33)
Reissue of LP: Paul Clayton: Folksinger (14)
Wanted: Memories of Paul Clayton (32)
Paul Clayton - where is he buried ? (6)
Paul Clayton (1)
(origins) Origins: Who's Gonna Buy You Ribbons (Paul Clayton (12)
Paul Clayton on Dave Garroway Show? (6)
Happy! – Mar 3 (Paul Clayton) (2)
(origins) Origin: Done Laid Around (37)
Lyr Req: laying down in this old town to long.. (3)
Lyr Req: Gotta Travel On (Paul Clayton) (8)
Lyr Req: Gotta Travel On (Paul Clayton) (13)
Lyr Req: Lonesome Road (from Paul Clayton) (13)


Art Thieme 06 Feb 98 - 09:03 PM
Barry Finn 06 Feb 98 - 11:00 PM
Joe Offer 07 Feb 98 - 04:13 AM
Frank in the swamps 07 Feb 98 - 06:59 AM
Barry Finn 07 Feb 98 - 10:30 AM
Bruce O. 07 Feb 98 - 12:18 PM
Art Thieme 07 Feb 98 - 12:30 PM
Bruce O. 07 Feb 98 - 01:02 PM
Art Thieme 07 Feb 98 - 01:24 PM
Bruce O. 07 Feb 98 - 02:12 PM
Ferrara 07 Feb 98 - 03:54 PM
Bruce O. 07 Feb 98 - 04:07 PM
Art Thieme 07 Feb 98 - 05:00 PM
Joe Offer 07 Feb 98 - 05:13 PM
Art Thieme 07 Feb 98 - 11:06 PM
Joe Offer 08 Feb 98 - 02:19 AM
rich r 08 Feb 98 - 07:38 PM
Phideaux 09 Feb 98 - 11:04 AM
Bruce O. 09 Feb 98 - 11:46 AM
Phideaux 09 Feb 98 - 12:34 PM
Joe Offer 09 Feb 98 - 02:46 PM
Paul Stamler 10 Feb 98 - 01:22 AM
Art Thieme 06 Mar 98 - 10:15 AM
Bruce O. 06 Mar 98 - 10:23 AM
Art Thieme 06 Mar 98 - 11:32 PM
Bruce O. 07 Mar 98 - 02:26 PM
Art Thieme 07 Mar 98 - 07:51 PM
Bruce O. 08 Mar 98 - 03:03 PM
Paul Stamler 10 Mar 98 - 03:26 AM
Anon. for fear of Carol---Yep, it's me! 10 Mar 98 - 04:05 AM
Bojangles 10 Mar 98 - 03:36 PM
Art Thieme 10 Mar 98 - 04:26 PM
MarcB 11 Mar 98 - 01:01 AM
Bojangles 11 Mar 98 - 04:04 AM
Art Thieme 11 Mar 98 - 11:09 AM
11 Mar 98 - 11:14 AM
Bojangles 11 Mar 98 - 12:20 PM
Barry Finn 11 Mar 98 - 01:44 PM
Art Thieme 12 Mar 98 - 12:34 AM
Bojangles 12 Mar 98 - 03:55 AM
Bojangles 12 Mar 98 - 01:57 PM
Stefan Wirz 28 Jul 02 - 02:12 PM
dick greenhaus 28 Jul 02 - 04:23 PM
GUEST,Tom_Costner 02 Mar 06 - 03:11 PM
Abby Sale 02 Mar 06 - 03:43 PM
SINSULL 02 Mar 06 - 04:09 PM
WFDU - Ron Olesko 02 Mar 06 - 10:37 PM
GUEST,maggiemay 22 Nov 06 - 11:31 AM
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katlaughing 24 Nov 06 - 11:58 PM
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Subject: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 06 Feb 98 - 09:03 PM

Folksinger Paul Clayton has always been a favorite of mine. Learned many songs from him. Met him once backstage at the Gate Of Horn in Chi. He NEVER got in the way of his song/story. (That probably accounted for his lack of commercial success.)He had a tragic end. Anybody know his details or life story or whatever?? Thanks! Art Thieme


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Barry Finn
Date: 06 Feb 98 - 11:00 PM

Art, don't know if this will mean much to you. I have an old LP of his, goes back to June 1956, so I'll type out the notes from the jacket, seeing that due to it's age it may be rare outside of places like this fourm. It's off of "Whaling & Sailing Songs, From The Days Of Moby Dick, Sung By Paul Claton"."Paul Clayton was born in the great whaling port of New Bedford, Mass. where his ancestors were whaling captains & seafaring men; his grandfather, from whose singing he first became interested in traditional songs, outfitted whaling ships for many years. The songs & shanties sung by whalers been his particular area of study for some time. His research in the old logs & journals of the New Bedford Whaling Museum & Public Library has resulted in original contributions to the folk music field which have recieved high commendation from folklore scholars. Recently he was invited by the 'Moby Dick Premiere Committee' of Warner Bros. & the city of New Bedford to appear as an enterainer at the various festivities in conjunction with the world premiere of the motion picture 'Moby Dick'. Included on this record are many of the selections he sang at that time. In addition to having previously recorded a number of longplaying commercial records, Mr. Clayton has also recorded songs traditional in his family for the Archives of the BBC, the Flanders Ballad Collection at Middlebury College, Vermont, & for the Library of Congress". Hope this was of interest. Barry


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 04:13 AM

Yes, Barry, it was of great interest. I just picked up a $5.99 Paul Clayton CD at Tower called "Sailing and Whaling Songs of the 19th Century," CD 389 from Legacy International, Box 249, Pismo Beach, CA 93448. It has 20 cuts, from "The Maid of Amsterdam" to "Santy Anna." I wonder if it's the same as the LP you have, or if it's a combination of a couple of LP's. Legacy International has reissued a lot of older folk recordings, of mixed sound quality - this one is excellent.
The notes don't say anything about Paul Clayton himself. Lou or Barry, can you tell us any more? Hmmm. I wonder if the whaling museum in New Bedford can tell us more - by the way, the museum is a great place to visit.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Frank in the swamps
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 06:59 AM

I have an old Folkways L.P. with him called "Fo'csle songs and shanties" It's short for Forecastle, part of the old sailing ships. I don't have it in the house, but if this thread is still around by the time I get over to where it's stored, I'll add some more info. If memory serves me right, Paul Van Ronk sang on that album also.

Frank I.T.S.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Barry Finn
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 10:30 AM

Joe, sound like the same LP. This was on Tradition Records #1005, it has the same songs you mentioned & a total of 20. Some of the others are; Girls Around Cape Horn, Old Stormalong, The Dying Sailor To His Shipmates, Saturday Night At Sea, Round The Corner, etc. Sounds like you got a reissue at a great price. Don't know much more about Paul, except his name keeps lurking in the backround, people crediting him with this or that, thanking him for one thing or another, mostly in days before my time. Barry


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bruce O.
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 12:18 PM

Wow, I was told long ago that Paul Clayton (Worthington) had commited suicide, in the late 1960's as I recall. Are there two of them?


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 12:30 PM

NO, that's the only Paul Clayton--at least that's the one I'm asking about. He must've made 50 vinyl LPs. Possibly more. He wrote a song called "Whose Gonna Buy You Ribbons When I'm Gone" that Dylan took and "re-wrote" as "Don't Think Twice It's Allright". (Am bein' charitable when I say "re-wrote".) Paul Claton was Dylan's chauffer during some wild rides & druggy times as I recall. Thanks for some input on this!!Art Thieme


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bruce O.
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 01:02 PM

I have two old Paul Clayton (Wothington) records (and two newer Art Thieme ones)
Timber (Logging/ Loggers songs); Riverside 12-648
British and American Murder Ballads; Washingon WLP 727 (reissue of Riverside?).
Both are, I think, from the late 1950's. I know who it was that told me he was dead, and I'll try to dig up more there (Art has probably met her at FSGW get togethers).


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 01:24 PM

Bruce O.--Thanks. I have the TIMBER-R-R-R Lp and it's on Riverside (but later reissued on Washington. What I'm looking for is some of his later history. (All the Riverside stuff--along with Kicking Mule where my first 2 LPs were---are now owned by Fantasy.) I doubt I'll be able to get the rights to issue those myself.But am hoping they might issue those some day before the year 3098. Quite frustrating to have that all tied up. Art


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bruce O.
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 02:12 PM

I've sent name, at al., of my source to Art via e-mail. As are some others here, I am on b--l-l list.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Ferrara
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 03:54 PM

I also heard, from a fellow who knew Paul Clayton, that he had committed suicide. "Who's Gonna Buy You Ribbons" wasn't the only song that was swiped from under him. He discovered/collected "Gotta Travel On" (Done laid around, done played around this old town too long, etc) but it was rewritten to give it a more uptown sound, and Clayton never received either credit or royalties of any kind.

Now - this may be pure "fakelore" that I am making up out of whole cloth -- but my memory says that he may have also discovered/collected "Copper Kettle." But it's been almost 30 years.... I'm sure about Gotta Travel On, though.

My friend had the highest respect for Clayton as a folklorist and musician.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bruce O.
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 04:07 PM

I see my spelling above was incorrect. His full name, I was told, was Paul Clayton Worthington.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 05:00 PM

Howdy folks; "Done Laid Around This Old Town" had many people ADD verses to it. Some of those: P>SEEGER, Bill Monroe, Billy Grammer & Clayton too. I believe all are listed on that copyright. But I never knew his last name was Worthington. Pretty fascinating discussion & thanks for digging in on this. Oh, I just got with Ballad-L recently. ALL OF THIS is brand new for me & I'm just amazed at what's out here. Been pretty isolated lately and these sites are a fine way to stay connected with old friends! I keep saying THANKS, but I do mean it!(I recall Paul taking an electric heater in the bath with him---a very strange way to go.)Regards, Art Thieme


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 05:13 PM

When did Paul Clayton die, Art, and how old was he?
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 07 Feb 98 - 11:06 PM

Don't recall when Paul died, Joe; never knew how old he was. One of the verses to "Done Laid Around" was written by Larry Ehrlich of the Chicago area, back in the 50s. He's on the copyright too I think. He was (or is) a labor lawyer. Larry Ehrlich can be heard on an old Riverside LP called "Chicago Mob Scene". It's a sampler of various artist like Bob Gibson (very early Bob), Pete Stone, etc. The cover of the album featured a drawing of a street sign at the corner of Chicago & Dearborn. Old Chicago folkies will recall that that was where the first GATE OF HORN was located in the basement of the Rice Hotel. Gibson was THE star of that club; saw a barefoot Baez open for him. Also, the New Lost City Ramblers opened for him. They all were startin' out back in the 50s and had to get their vacations together from their day jobs so they could do the gig. (This computer seems to be a great place for nostalgia on tons of levels. Feels good to dredge it up and indulge myself this way.)Art Thieme


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Joe Offer
Date: 08 Feb 98 - 02:19 AM

Keep the stories, coming, Art. It's great to learn about that stuff.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: rich r
Date: 08 Feb 98 - 07:38 PM

Besides the whaling songs, I have 2 other LPs with Paul Calyton. One was mentioned in the thread on Revolutionary Songs, "American Songs of Revolutionary Times". On that album Paul sings "Locks & Bolts", and "The Swapping Song" solo, and also "The Gambling Suitor", "The Deaf Woman's Courtship", "The Devil's Questions", anad "The Riddle Song" with Jean Ritchie. A biographical paragraph appeals on the record jacket, that contains much of the same information (including some of the same wording) as the one posted above from the Whaling album. Both albums were recorded in 1956. He is the text of that paragraph:

"Paul Clayton was born in the great whaling port of New Bedford, Massachusetts, where he early became interested in folksongs through those that were traditional in his family. By the time he was 15, he was presenting a series of radio programs on folkmusic, and has since appeared on radio and television programs in England, Canada and Cuba, as well as in the United States. He has made numerous recording trips through the southern mountains, as well as other areas of the United States and Europe. He has made several commercial recordings of folksongs in addition to having recorded for the archives of the Flanders Ballad Collection, Middlebury College, Vermont, the BBC collection, and the Archive of American Folksong at the Library of Congress. At present he is editing a volume of folksongs of Virginia, Kentucky and North Carolina, for publication by The Folklore Press in 1957"

The other Paul Clayton album is "Paul Clayton Sings Unholy Matrimony - 2" (Elektra 147). There is a Volume 1 also. Vol 2 contains such songs as: The Wooden Legged Parson, Will The Weaver, The Old Wife Who Wanted Spruncin', The Dumb Wife, The Husband With No Courage In HIm, The Dirty Wife, Life On The Installment Plan, A Quick Way to Be Rid Of A Wife, Home Sad HOme and others.

rich r


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Phideaux
Date: 09 Feb 98 - 11:04 AM

The Library of Congress got all the Folkways material. Check their web page to see if any Paul Clayton recordings are available.

www.si.edu/folkways/

Bob Schwarer


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bruce O.
Date: 09 Feb 98 - 11:46 AM

Smithsonian Institution got Folkways material, and have reissued many songs on CD's.
I forgot that I have the 'Unholy Matrimony' record, too. I forgot where I learned it, but remember that 'The old wife who wanted spruncin'" (18th century Scots) was a text collected in Virginia.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Phideaux
Date: 09 Feb 98 - 12:34 PM

Yea, Smithonian.

Bob S.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Joe Offer
Date: 09 Feb 98 - 02:46 PM

Smithsonian Folkways has always had cassettes available of all of the recordings from the old Folkways catalogue. I haven't ordered any because I've never been happy with the durability and sound quality of commercially-produced cassettes. Now I see that you can get all the Folkways recordings on CD, for twenty bucks a disc (can't recall what they charge for shipping). Has anybody here gotten one of these custom-made Folkways CD's, and can you tell me what you think of the quality? I don't mean the regular CD reissues they've come out with - I have several of those, and I'm very happy with them. What I'm interested in are the new CD's that they make up for you on request. Twenty bucks for a custom CD sounds too good to be true.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Paul Stamler
Date: 10 Feb 98 - 01:22 AM

The sound quality of the Folkways custom CDs varies depending on the quality of the original tape -- which, in the case of Folkways recordings, varied from abysmal to (in a few cases, most notably Peter Bartok's recordings of the New Lost City Ramblers) audiophile quality. As far as I know, they're not doing any fancy remastering and noise reduction of the original tapes, just dubbing them cleanly to DAT and thence to recordable CD. So take the basic sound quality of the Folkways LP, subtract all the scratches and the surface noise from the recycled frisbees Moses Asch used for vinyl, delete the wow from the off-center hole (I once called my best friend up long-distance in great excitement when I bought a Folkways LP and the hole was actually in the center), add some treble because Asch didn't really believe in the RIAA curve, and you've got a decent result unless the original tape was hideous (like Bela Bartok's acoustic recordings of Hungarian village music).

Back to Paul Clayton; there was a long thread about him on the rec.music.folk newsgroup a couple of years ago. His life was most unhappy; it was common knowledge in the folk community that he was gay, which was still unacceptable in most of society. He made several attempts to achieve the kind of popular success that Bob Dylan had managed, but never came close, which left him quite bitter, especially after the "Don't Think Twice" affair. (I have one of his late recordings, "Paul Clayton: Folksinger!", a Nashville production by Boudleaux Bryant on Monument; while overproduced, it's not all that bad, and the material is excellent.) After being banned from some clubs due to his orientation, he retreated to a mountaintop and committed suicide ca. 1965.

Peace. Paul


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE SHANTY BOY ON THE BIG EAU CLAIRE
From: Art Thieme
Date: 06 Mar 98 - 10:15 AM

A song I got from Paul after a hoot at the old GATE OF HORN in Chicago---about '59 I think. Never remembered his tune but used Joe Heaney and Ewan MacColl's tune from "Morrissey and the Russian Sailor". Here's "THE SHANTY BOY ON THE BIG EAU CLAIRE" pretty much as I recorded it on one LP & a later cassette. It's a grand Wisconsin ballad apparently written by W. N. Allen of Wausau in the late l870s. It's the old Romeo & J. tale once more. By the way, a RAPIDS PIECE is a section of a larger log raft that can be separated for easier navigation of the rapids. The rapids at Mosinee was quite treacherous. A dam of sorts was built there to make for easier navigation and to create a pool beyond the dam. But one can surely see the rocks of the old rapids below the dam on the Wisconsin River right in downtown Mosinee. (As far as I know, Paul Clayton never recorded this ballad.)

Every girl she has her troubles. Likewise, a man has his.
I'll relate to you the agony of a fellow's story, viz.,
It relates about affections of a damsel young and fair,
And an interesting shanty boy from off the Big Eau Claire.

Now, this young and dauntless damsel was of noble pedigree,
And her mother ran a milliner shop in the town of Mosinee,
Sold waterfalls and ribbons and imitation lace
To all the high-toned people in that great and festive place.

The shanty boy was handsome. He had a curly head of hair.
No better man could there be found from off the Big Eau Claire,
And the milliner said her daughter a shanty boy never should wed,
And Sue was truly saddened by the things her mother said.

The milliner took up all her goods and she went and hired a hack,
And she opened up another shop way down in Fond du Lac.
Sue grew broken-hearted. She was weary of her life,
For she dearly loved her shanty boy but was forbidden to be his wife.

So when brown autumn came along and ripened all the crops,
She lighted out for Baraboo and went to picking hops,
But in this occupation, she found but little joy,
For her mind it kept returning all to her shanty boy.

She caught the scarlet fever and lay ill a week or two
In Asa Baldwin's pest house in the town of Baraboo.
The doctors tried, but all in vain, her helpless life to save.
Now millions of young hop lice are dancing on her grave.

When this news reached her shanty boy, he quickly to perceive,
He hid his saw in a hollow log and then he quick did leave.
He hired out as a hauler on a fleet of Sailor Jack's,
But the milliner's daughter's funeral to his mind came frequent back.

He fell off of a rapids piece at the falls of Mosinee,
Which ended all his fate for life and all his misery,
And now the broad Wisconsin rolls its waves above his bones.
His companions are the catfish; his grave a pile of stones.

And the milliner, she is bankrupt and her shop has gone to rack.
She talks quite strong of movin' away from Fond du Lac.
Her pillow it is haunted by her daughter's auburn hair,
And the ghost of that young shanty boy from off the Big Eau Claire.

HTML line breaks added. --JoeClone, 18-Oct-02.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bruce O.
Date: 06 Mar 98 - 10:23 AM

I don't have a copy handy (or a list of Allen's songs), I seem to remember that he also wrote one "The Banks of the Little Eau Clare". [Been to the Circus World Museum in Baraboo? Devil's Lake near there used to have a Playboy Club (never got there, I had a wife at that time.)]


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 06 Mar 98 - 11:32 PM

Bruce, you are correct-------but the name of the song I think you're getting at is "The Banks Of The Little Eau Pleine". W. N.Allen is William Allen-----also wrote his songs under the name of "SHAN T. BOY". His songs, (these two anyhow), both contain a single "place" in each of 'em where, upon hearing it, the listener wonders if the writer is pulling your leg. Ie. the "hop lice dancing on her grave" in Eau Claire and/or the description of her lover's clothing (pretty outrageous) in Eau Pleine. Versions of both can be found in the wondrous collection BALLADS AND SONGS OF THE SHANTY BOY by Franz Lee Rickaby. (1925) I, too, had a wife then (still have same one & she has me!) but I did do a gig at that Playboy Club. (see the WONDERBRA thread for insight) Back then I did whatever I could to pay the rent! Art Thieme


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bruce O.
Date: 07 Mar 98 - 02:26 PM

Art, you're right on the name. I'm getting old and forgetful. I knew about Rickaby's book, but never managed to get a copy.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 07 Mar 98 - 07:51 PM

Mr. Bruce O., Rickaby's book is still available. It was reprinted for Clearfield Company, inc. by Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.----Baltimore, Md.----1993 (soft cover) I ordered it from our mall bookshop and eventually it came in. Art


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bruce O.
Date: 08 Mar 98 - 03:03 PM

Thank you, Art.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Paul Stamler
Date: 10 Mar 98 - 03:26 AM

Art, I always heard the line from "Shanty Boy off the Big Eau Claire" as "millions of young *hoplites* were dancing on her grave". Always thought the reference was to a poetic name for lightning bugs. On the other hand, I just looked in my dictionary and found that hoplites were heavily armed foot soldiers of ancient Greece. Another great theory shot to hell by a pesky little fact.
Peace. Paul


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Anon. for fear of Carol---Yep, it's me!
Date: 10 Mar 98 - 04:05 AM

Paul, It's PROSYLITE------nothin' to do with bugs at all. Although the lice and other insects do swarm like some prosylites. Lightning bugs, on the other hand could actually shed light on the situation---unlike many prosylites I know.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bojangles
Date: 10 Mar 98 - 03:36 PM

I remember Paul Clayton...a very talented guy--lived in a cabin near Charlottesville and had a vast repertoir buttressed by his association with Professor (of folk music) Arthur Kyle Davis at UVA. I learned "I learned about women from her" from Paul. He had adapted and put to music Kipling's "To the Ladies" to get the end result. Sadly, Paul took his own life. I thik that happened about 1965.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 10 Mar 98 - 04:26 PM

I LEARNED ABOUT WOMEN FROM HER was sung and recorded by Frank Crumit back in the 1920s (or 30s). I first heard it sung by Jim Kweskin in the 1970s. Fred Holstein did it at the Earl of Old Town (chicago) for quite a while back then. He learned it from Kweskin. Kweskin learned it from Crumit's 78 rpm record. I've got that Frank Crumit version on a cassette of favorite stuff now.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: MarcB
Date: 11 Mar 98 - 01:01 AM

Whew. Didn't expect to get teary tonight. Just reading this thread for the first time. Had forgotten, I'm ashamed to admit, the enormous influence Paul Clayton had on my early days of singing, probably instrumental through the Whaling album and others, in steering me toward specialization in traditional music. Thank you all for helping recollect this connection.

Other "unsung" heroes of mine that shaped my early interest in traditional stuff were Oscar Brand and Norman Luboff.

For those of you who mentioned the Smithsonian Folkways connection. The only recording I have ever done was on Folkways. Can you email me the information on how to order CD's of the library. I despaired of my albums ever seeing the light of day again(and they probably don't deserve the bright light of high noon) but would love to own my own CD copy. Thanks. Marc B Marcbridge@aol.com


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bojangles
Date: 11 Mar 98 - 04:04 AM

Art T. This is my first time on this cyberspace board, but It blows me away! Jim Kweskin and I were a duo that performed regularly at the Club 47 Mt. Auburn in Cambridge Mass in the winterof '59 and sping of '60. I had a gig at The Laughing Buddah in St Louis right after school and while I was gone Jim put together the Jug Band. I had been studying folk music at Harvard under Professor Albert Friedman..Jim was at Boston University. Jim came and stayed with me in 69 or '70 but I lost track of him after that although I know that he got hooked up with Mel Lyman, a charismatic guru, and Jim's recordings seemed to stop there. Any idea where Jim is now? Other luminaries around the Club 47 scene were Tom Rush, Fritz Richmond,Bill Kieth,Debbie Green and Rolf Kanh, Rick von Schmidt and more. Joan Baez a year earlier had started playing there for pocket change until Bob Gibson (I think) got her up on stage at the Newport Folk Festival and she was immediately catapulted to a position where pocket change wouldn't do. I would much appreciate any info on Jim.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 11 Mar 98 - 11:09 AM

Bojangles----- Don't know where Jim Kweskin is now! I used to hit the TOAD HALL old record & book place with him (Rockford) when we were on the same bill at Charlotte's Web in Rockford in the 70s.

Club 47 (Boston) is now Passim's----Did a gig there a while ago opening for Bill Stains.

Was just listening to an old tape of Kweskin on Ella Jenkins MEETING HOUSE FM radio show back around '60 I think.(Chicago) He sure could pick. His "Cuckoo" was amazing.

SO, who the heck are you, Boj.?? Nobody 'round here uses their real names! Can't figure out why. I'm too new to this computer thing to get all the fine nuances though. If ya want to say somethin controversial you can always get rid of the name on a note altogether. What is there that I'm not getting in this? Why not use real names?

JOHN HANCOCK(not)--------- Arthur D. Thieme


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From:
Date: 11 Mar 98 - 11:14 AM


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bojangles
Date: 11 Mar 98 - 12:20 PM

Thanks, Art, for your input. It'll keep me coming back. A story on Jim..He was performing solo at Wolftrap and I went to hear him, taking my wife along. She was mesmerized by him onstage, but during the three days he stayed with us at our home in Richmond Va he regarded her as a shortorder cook whenever he awoke on his erratic schedule. As we were getting ready to head to the airport after 3 days of pickin' and singing he turned to me and said "Look,You've got a good woman that'll look after you, but when this life begins to wear thin I'll be waiting for you to come join me in California. My wife overheard, recognized that there was no room for her in Jim,s proposal,and I'm afraid that at that point Jim's welcome evaporated. That all happened, I now figure, in about August of 1970. Thanks for straightening me out on the source of I LEARNED ABOUT WOMEN FROM HER.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Barry Finn
Date: 11 Mar 98 - 01:44 PM

Thought I saw Jim's name in this area (Boston) performing a few, maybe 3 yrs back with the U & I band, I think the U & I has some sort of spiritual over/under tones, but not cult or Mel Lyman/Fort Hill like. Barry


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Art Thieme
Date: 12 Mar 98 - 12:34 AM

That was some strange stuff goin' down back in those times. Best way to avoid it was just not to get too close. We're still here but Butterfield and Bloomfield (a friend) and Clayton and Jim Jones etc. are long gone on their voyage to that spaceliner beyond that comet. Chicago was a grand time (as was Boston) back then. What wondrous sounds! Siegel-Schwall Band, Charlie Musselwhite, Butter & Bloomfield, and Muddy & Wolf and Little Walter and Otis Spann & Jimmy Cotton & Big Joe Williams and his 9-string guitar & Blind Jim Brewer & Martin, Bogan and Armstrong (Howard Armstrong is still going strong) & Walter Vinson & Elmore James----not to mention the fine jazz scene! Whew!! It was the ONLY place to be back then! Sure glad I was there. ART


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bojangles
Date: 12 Mar 98 - 03:55 AM

Art, It's too late and I am too weary to be lucid and articulate, but I have been struck by your thoughtful entries, and it is certainly clear that you have covered some ground and have done so with your eyes open. Apparently you are still at it as am I (and so are my three sons). I have tried without success to look you up in the "Folk Music Yearbook of Artists 1964" by Jandel Productions which included most everyone who was breathing in the folk world. I am pictured on page 94 on the same page with Dave van Ronk, Sonny Terry, Brownie McGhee, Memphis Slim, The Stanley Brothers, and even the Smothers Brothers. Professor Friedman at Harvard had urged me to make a career out of folksinging, a suggestion that I hardly expected from a Harvard professor! When I left Jim Kweskin in Cambridge to sing in St. Louis the Berlin crisis was on and a draft notice was not long in coming. Jim decided to "drug out" as he termed it. I went into the Army and found myself on a top secret mission to Vietnam with guitar in hand. I sang to Cambodian troops most of whom ended up in the killing fields. Upon returning I sang protest songs...on one occassion at the Village Gate with Pete Seeger and Phil Oakes. Judy Collins asked me to consider touring with her, and at about that point I decided to focus on singing and playing for love rather than for money. This is probably not the appropriate forum for personal notes, but I can't seem to address messages to anyone except a few folks on a pop-up menue. Perhaps this note answers a few questions anyway. -Peter Stanley


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Bojangles
Date: 12 Mar 98 - 01:57 PM

That's interesting. Jim had been through hilltop sitting on good brown rice diets (and nothing else). Songs I remember playing with him included San Francisco Bay Blues, Stagolee,Crying Holy, Sister Kate.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Stefan Wirz
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 02:12 PM

gathered the few things I could find about Paul Clayton and added them to my American Music site: Illustrated Paul Clayton discography
Add'l info most welcome !
Stefan


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 04:23 PM

For a while, Paul Clayton was "the most recorded young folksinger"--"young" to leave Oscar Brand out of the mix. THis was, reportedly, because he provided his own notes, making life very easy for Kenny Goldstein, who handled Artists and Repertory for Riverside Records.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: GUEST,Tom_Costner
Date: 02 Mar 06 - 03:11 PM

I knew Paul Clayton in the early 60s. Saw him first in Charlottesvillle, where I went to law school. He was around after a Carolyn Hester concert produced by husband Richard Fariña.
New Lost City Ramblers opened for Carolyn.

There was an after party at Paul's place, where we hit it off. I was living in Paris mainly, Manhattan partly, and saw him twice afterward in New York City. The last time he was staying at the Hotel Earle on Washington Sq., the hotel that was immortalized in Baez's "Diamonds and Rust."

Very sweet, shy guy. And handsome as well.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Abby Sale
Date: 02 Mar 06 - 03:43 PM

See Happy for tomorrow, March 3


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: SINSULL
Date: 02 Mar 06 - 04:09 PM

Art,
I just started a thread on the Gate Of Horn. Check into it and if you want the postcard, it's yours.
SINS


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 02 Mar 06 - 10:37 PM

"Whaling & Sailing Songs, From The Days Of Moby Dick" was recently re-issued on CD by Empire Musicwerks. They did a lovely job of remastering.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: GUEST,maggiemay
Date: 22 Nov 06 - 11:31 AM

Sad to hear about Paul committing suicide. I knew Paul in Paris when we both lived in a youth hostel. He was keeping out of the Korean war I think. 1951. He collected old newspapers and sold them to buy food. He was a generous, lovely man. If he was gay he didnt know it then. I have a couple of forty fives he sent me a few years later. He told me Burl Ives would be singing his song Lenora let your hair hang down on tv and I watched it. By this time i was married and didnt keep up the correspondence. I listened to him sing gotta travel on lots of times. I always thought it was I've laid around not Done laid around. I will have to find my record and if possible play it. He also used to sing Peggy O I hope someone reads this Paul was my first love and I have a small photo of us together in Paris. Maggie


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: GUEST,Doreen
Date: 22 Nov 06 - 01:10 PM

Has anyone got a copy of Paul Clayton's 'Who's gonna buy you ribbons when I'm gone'?


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 22 Nov 06 - 09:36 PM

Yes, I have it. The song was included on one of the two LP albums Paul Clayton made for Monument Records---an attempt at bringing him into the more heavily produced sound. Can't recall which of the 2 it was on though. My LP was fading fast, so I put it on a cassette----where it remains to this day.

Art


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: GUEST,Doreen
Date: 23 Nov 06 - 05:07 AM

Thanks Art, how closely does it resemble Dylan's 'Don't think twice'?


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Joybell
Date: 23 Nov 06 - 04:32 PM

True-Love sings it. I'll get him to post the words when he gets up if nobody beats me to it. Can't see it in the DT. Haven't checked Google yet. It's quite close to "Don't Think Twice".
Cheers, Joy


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Subject: Lyrics add: Who's gonna buy you ribbons
From: Joybell
Date: 24 Nov 06 - 07:39 AM

times on the railroad gettin' hard, babe,
last night i woke up and saw it snow.
remember what you said to me last summer
when you see me walkin' down that road.

cho:
it ain't no use to sit and sigh now, darlin',
it ain't no use to sit and cry now.
it ain't no use to sit and wonder why, darlin',
just wonder who's gonna buy you ribbons when i'm gone.

so i'm wandering down that old dusty road, darlin'.
you're the reason that i've got to travel on.
still i can't help wonderin' on my way, darlin',
who's gonna buy you ribbons when i'm gone

cho:

(learned from a 45rpm single by Paul Clayton, c1962. flip side: "The last cigarette".)

                            hildebrand


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 24 Nov 06 - 03:19 PM

...and that was the title of the Monument LP----as I remember it---The Last Cigarette.

Doreen, P.M. Kat Laughing. She can give you my e-address. I'll send the album to you.

Greg and Joy, HOWDY for sure!

Ed Trickett has recorded the song on Folk Legacy.

www.folklegacy.com

Art Thieme


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: GUEST,Doreen
Date: 24 Nov 06 - 05:34 PM

Thanks Art.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: katlaughing
Date: 24 Nov 06 - 11:58 PM

Doreen, just in case you aren't familiar with how the PM system at Mudcat works, just join as a member by clicking on "Membership, up top. It is free, easy, and will NOT get you spammed. Once you've done that, go to Your Personal Page, also listed at the top menu bar and choose Send a Message, type in "katlaughing" and write away, then hit Send. :-) That way you can send personal messages to anyone else who is a member, except Art, who has been a member for umpteen years but can't get his cookie or something back. So...we work around it. Hope this makes sense.LOL

All the best,

kat


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Jim McLean
Date: 25 Nov 06 - 01:30 PM

Thanks, I think I have joined now.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Doreen
Date: 25 Nov 06 - 01:51 PM

I am using Jim McLean's PC nut I think I have joined now.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Joybell
Date: 28 Nov 06 - 04:15 AM

Hello Art. Welcome Doreen.
Cheers, Joy


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Doreen
Date: 28 Nov 06 - 09:37 AM

Thanks for the welcome guys, I'm sure going to enjoy this site.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: DeeRod
Date: 28 Nov 06 - 09:48 PM

I knew Paul pretty well. He'd come into DC for gigs at the Showboat(Chalie Byrd's club) and some times for hoots at the Cellar door.I had a front page obit in Wash FOLK STRUMS but don't recal the date.
Now where was I when Dylan went electric? Back stage drinking beer with Paul Clayton and Norman Kennedy. One thing about palling with those two, they left the girls for me.


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Thomas Stern
Date: 30 Nov 06 - 06:04 PM

The University Of Massachusetts at Dartmouth (UMD) Library and
Special Collections houses Paul Claytons papers and recordings.
http://www.lib.umassd.edu/ARCHIVES/findaids/MC4.pdf


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Subject: RE: info about Paul Clayton??
From: Stefan Wirz
Date: 08 Jun 09 - 03:41 AM

anyone knows where Paul Clayton is buried ?
(checked Bob Coltman's book but couldn't find anything about it ...)
Stefan


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