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BS: The Naming of Cats
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Subject: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 21 Oct 01 - 07:21 AM Since Gargoyle has complained that Morticia's kitten-naming thread Here was getting out of hand well before reaching 100+ messages; then just to upset him/her here is a thread extension. Firstly, welcome, Loki, to the Mudcat community; you have found a very good home with Morty and Gomez. Secondly I think it is entirely appropriate to spend a lot of time and threadspace considering the name of a cat. As was noted in the earlier thread no less an authority than Old Possum himself devoted a poem to this subject, thankfully with fewer notes than his Wasteland. Some of the names suggested have been most imaginative, but I am still choking over SINSULL's suggestion of Cletoris. Incidentally for those gentlemen Mudcatters who are still wondering how they might locate a lost Cletoris; the answer is that you have to go down to hunt pussy. (I know MudGuard's command of English is excellent, but if he is a little puzzled will someone please take him aside to explain this idiomatic language.) I have to go back to the 3D world for a while, but will return later to retell my favourite shaggy dog story involving cats and Irish music. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Linda Kelly Date: 21 Oct 01 - 08:20 AM speechless...... |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Susanne (skw) Date: 21 Oct 01 - 09:05 AM Matthew, once you've successfully hunted her down, does your pussy then give head? Sorry - a mistake! I never post to BS threads on principle. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Linda Kelly Date: 21 Oct 01 - 09:08 AM I'm even more speechless than I was before! |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 21 Oct 01 - 09:19 AM Susanne do you mind if I don't answer that one! I quite agree that we need to get back to some serious work. On this thread seoithin agus (Celtic Lullaby Brián and Malcolm Douglas and others have been doing some excellent research. Malcolm has mentioned the versions in The Songs of Elizabeth Cronin. Go and follow them up, you are in for a treat. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: 53 Date: 21 Oct 01 - 03:29 PM i don't even like cats, |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Dead Horse Date: 21 Oct 01 - 03:36 PM Cats have three names. One that we know them by. One they call themselves. And one the next-door neighbour calls them when found crapping on their geraniums! |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Naemanson Date: 21 Oct 01 - 05:21 PM As I learned at my daddy's knee all cats are nam4ed Fred. Humans give them a name but that is only our own little egotistical fantasy. As for how all cats can share one name you only have to consider the feline ego. Since any individual feline believes he or she is the only worthy creature on earth then it follows that nothing else would be worthy of the name "Fred". therefore each cat believes she or he is the only one named "Fred". |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Midchuck Date: 21 Oct 01 - 08:26 PM Here's ours. (They're now 7 months old and a lot bigger when these photos were taken.) P. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: okthen Date: 22 Oct 01 - 06:44 AM 4 out of 5 kittens approached the back door and nervously pawed snow for the first time, 4 out of 5 kittens returned to the fire, the 5th took a running dive at, chased its tail and hid in snowdrifts. We couldn't get it back inside for an hour, this is the night we named it MENTAL. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Morticia Date: 22 Oct 01 - 07:13 AM I have read Loki your welcome, Matthew and she seemed quite impressed although she was more impressed by the ball I just bought for her( bribery for another vet visit this afternoon).She is far and away the most mischievious cat we've ever been owned by...I spend all day fishing her out of places she shouldn't be in, such as the washing machine, clearing up the upset wastepaper baskets and rescuing her from the places in which she has got herself stuck.In short, I am having a wonderful time *BG* and Loki is definitely an appropriate name! |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Gypsy Date: 22 Oct 01 - 11:14 AM Just keep her away from mistletoe! :) |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: mooman Date: 22 Oct 01 - 11:46 AM Sorry couldn't resist after the Gargoyle/Morty fuss. Apologies to Henry Reed...
Today we have naming of Cats. Yesterday, mooman |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Paul from Hull Date: 22 Oct 01 - 12:06 PM *LMAO* |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 22 Oct 01 - 03:13 PM mooman, thank you for that delightful parody, and for reminding me of Henry Reed: from Judging Distances A barn is not called a barn,to put it more plainly, Or a field in the distance, where sheep may be safely grazing. You must never be over-sure. You must say, when reporting: At five o'clock in the central sector is a dozen Of what appears to be animals; whatever you do, Don't call the bleeders sheep. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 22 Oct 01 - 03:45 PM After the uncharacteristic crudity of my opening message on this thread (for which I shall do suitable penance by posting the lyrics to an old Gaelic song later), I did promise a shaggy dog story. Here it is: The Dancing Cat A long time ago in West Kerry, there was a wonderful house-party going on one night.The fiddler's elbows were racing up and down as he played The Gander in the Pratie Hole,The Pratie in the Gander's Hole, and the whole of Bridie's Granda's set. The drink was flowing freely; the half-door was off its hinges, and one old fellow was stepping away neatly on it. Couples were reeling across the floor, while some others were actually dancing. Up in the loft two cats were looking down on the scene; the first one became so carried away by the music that he started to dance. He leaped into the air, and performed the neatest little entrechat you ever saw.Says the second cat, "I didn't know you were into all this trad stuff." "Oh yes," replies the first one "You see it runs in the family. My old man gave his guts for the fiddle." After the session was finished, and the sun was coming up over the hills, at last the fiddler gets home, and says; "You'll never believe what happened tonight. I saw two cats, and the were talking to each other." "Nonsense," says his dog, "Everyone knows cats can't talk." Jellicle Cats come out tonight, Jellicle Cats come one come all: The Jellicle Moon is shining bright- Jellicles come to the Jellicle Ball. My ex-cat Timmy in fact had a strong aversion to Irish music, but that's perhaps another story for another day. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 25 Oct 01 - 09:26 AM Timmy's Story [Musical Content Rating: Low] Timmy was more or less foisted on me by my then girlfriend C. She herself kept five cats; occasionally as many as six or seven, or as few as two or three, depending on numbers of strays arriving or leaving, and on local traffic conditions. She felt I ought to have at least one cat as well, so a serial strayer by the name of Timmy duly arrived. He was a three year old ginger tom who had run away from three or four good homes already In order to settle him C thought it would be a good idea to keep him locked in the house for a while. After a few weeks in which Timmy shredded my wallpaper, ripped my curtains, defecated in my bathtub (and sometimes in his litter tray), I let him out. He shot up a tree and became stuck. In rescuing him he gouged large chunks of flesh from both hands and my face. Curiously he seemed to feel that this created a blood bond between us, since he decided to stay. I installed a cat flap the next day. During this period C and I retained our separate homes, as I drew the line at sharing my life with a caterwaul of cats. We also had differing musical tastes; she was not mesmerised by my LPs "of old crones screeching in Gaelic", and I was unable to share in her adulation of Freddie Mercury. Consequently we did not spend much time listening to music together, and I rather lost my own interest in folk music. Later our differences, musical and otherwise, became so strong that we were left with nothing to talk about, and we drifted apart. The last time I went to see her she had added a large German shepherd dog to her menagerie, and he, playfully, but still painfully, chewed on my testicles. We have not met since. Timmy however remained. I acquired a CD player, and lots of goodies from Topic, and tons of Irish albums. It was noticeable that Timmy was not a trad lover, and he spent less and less time at home. Finally when I started playing Mary MacNamara's music to him he had had enough, and stalked off. I discovered that he had planned his departure well, and had settled in two or three separate new homes, which were warm, comfortable, and quiet. He still drops by for a visit from time to time, checks to see whether I still have my CD player, and then returns to one or other of his homes. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 01 Nov 01 - 08:07 PM I rather lost this thread, owing to 3D events intervening, but there is another cat story which is worth telling. Timmy and the Magpie [Musical Content Rating;Nil] In a previous incarnation, Timmy had clearly been a gigolo. While he showed no interest in female cats (he had been Taken to the Vet by a civic-minded previous owner); he was extremely affectionate towards ladies of a certain age. On sunny days he would lie on the pavement [=sidewalk] to the front of my house, and at the approach of a sweet old lady he would roll over onto his back and purr loudly, exposing his tummy to be tickled. His come-on was almost invariably successful, but occasionally he made a mistake. When this occurred, and he realised his stomach was being tickled by a male, he would swiftly sink his teet and claws into the poor man's hand. When old ladies were thin on the ground Timmy used to watch a family of magpies that patrolled the lawn at the front of my house. He would sometimes attempt to stalk them, but the parent magpies usually scolded him so effectively that he would pretend that he was really only chasing a leaf. One day, however, I came home from work to find my house in a state of chaos: books were strewn all over the floor, crockery had been smashed into little pieces, and there were traces of blood around. I was about to phone the police to report a burglary when I heard a strange, harsh noise. There was a young magpie cowering below a dresser, while Timmy, in the opposite corner, was glaring at the bird. Clearly Timmy had somehow dragged the young bird in through the cat flap, and the two of them had fought great battles all over my house. I managed to catch the magpie in my laundry basket and I released it outside, much to Timmy's disdain. After this experience Timmy never troubled the magpie family again, but stuck to his elderly ladies. There once were two cats of Kilkenny, Who each thought that was one cat too many, they fought and they fit, They scratched and they bit Till instead of two cats rhere weren't any. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Little Hawk Date: 01 Nov 01 - 09:05 PM There are many excellent names for cats which most people have overlooked. Devious, Lascivious, and Salacious come to mind...the latter 2 are for male cats in particular. Ennui would also be a good name for a cat. 53...you DON'T LIKE CATS??? How can you go on living? - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Morticia Date: 01 Nov 01 - 09:13 PM Loki, in whose honour this thread was conceieved ( or so she percieves it) wishes it to be known that she has settled in satisfactorily, is running the Addams household in a sensible manner and,vets visits notwithstanding, is finding life very much to her requirements.Morticia is covered in enough scratches to earn her place as plaything of the month, Gomez is attendant on her every whim and the children of the household now understand their place is to provide a warm spot through the cold of the night, irrespective of how many times she wishes to be let out to visit the litter tray or food bowl.She would like to pass on her thanks to Bron, her regal nod to the rest of the Mudcat enclave that have taken her safe passage through life to their hearts and vouchsafe her royal recommendations to those other Mudcat cats, who, being clearly somewhat inferior to her Majesty are, nonetheless, worthy of notice as citizens.
Loki |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Sorcha Date: 01 Nov 01 - 09:14 PM ahhaaaahhaaahhaa! I somehow missed this the first time around.......marvelous, all. Then there was Mike Flynn--a very LARGE ginger TOM ALL OVER...........he was a riverboat man from the get go. We roomies used to argue about who forgot to flush the loo.........until we caught Mike on the commode......... |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Charley Noble Date: 02 Nov 01 - 09:58 AM Our current fancy is to name our cats with Ethiopian names, a carryover from some period in the mid 1960's when I worked as a Peace Corps teacher in that distant land. We provide residential services to Tilahun, Tejitu and Gashay. Tilahun is a black semi-longhaired cat with a fluffy tail and enough Simese or Burmese to earn her the name of "Yawser" at the refuge where we were adopted by her; the name means "my shadow." Tejitu is a calico cooncat from another refuge center, full of mischief, and her name translates literally as "full of honey mead," a traditional name for a bargirl. Gashay is really a neighbor's cat who claimed that he was cruelly abandoned and used to look very thin; our two cats who are very territorial were somehow persuaded by his smooth talking to let him join their pack; his name means "my shield," a traditional name for warrior comrades, and now used as an honorary address for taxi cab drivers and waiters who you would like good service from. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 03 Nov 01 - 01:23 PM The Tailor's story of the Catspaw Candelabrum [Musical Content Rating : Nil ] [Thread Relevance : Low ] Did you know that it was because of the instinct of an animal that the indigo dye first came to Ireland? I'll tell you the history of it, and divil a lie is there in it, though most people won't give in to it. Years ago there was a boat came into Bantry harbour, and the captain of it came into the town. He was on his way from India. He had a few drinks and fell into conversation with some of the people in the town, and got intimate with them. He was a decent, conversible type of man, and, as the evening was coming, they asked him to play a game of cards, and he said that he would as he was staying the night anyway. They were playing for some time and the light was failing as the night came. One of them lit a piece of a candle and put it on the table. But with the banging and the thumping of the cards in the excitement of the play the candle kept falling down. Then one of them said that he would go and look for a sconce, but the captain of the boat said 'No', for he had a better sconce than any one they could find in Bantry town. He had a bag with him, and he pulled the bag from under the table and took out a cat. He put the cat sitting at one end of the table and put the candle between his paws. It was one of the neatest bits of business you ever set eyes on. All the town came in to look at it, for they had never seen the likes before. The captain explained to them that he had trained the cat in this business, for when they were playing cards in the Indian Ocean there were terrible rough seas, and no candle would stand up for them. All the town marvelled except one man, who said that it was well enough, and he had admiration enough for the captain and for his cat, but that nature was a greater thing than training. The two started an argument, and they almost came to blows. Then they decided to bet a wager on who was right. The captain bet a cargo of indigo blue that learning was greater than nature, and the man from Bantry bet a farm of land that nature was stronger than learning. They carried on with the game, and when it was over, the captain put his cat into the bag and went away with himself to bed. He stayed the following day, and that night they all played cards again, and the cat was at the end of the table with the candle between his paws. The man who had the wager bet with the captain was playing too, and half-ways through the game he took a mouse out of his pocket and put it on the table. As soon as the cat saw it he dropped the candle and chased the mouse, and the man from Bantry won his wager and proved that nature is stronger than learning. The captain paid him the cargo of indigo dye, and that was how the indigo first came to this country. From: The Tailor and Ansty, by Eric Cross, Mercier Press, Cork, 1942 "The world is only a blue bag. Knock a squeeze out of it when you can." The tailor also had a good story about Johnny Jerry's sow and an eel, which is a tale for another day. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Phil Cooper Date: 03 Nov 01 - 02:40 PM Margaret and I played in Winston-Salem, North Carolina a few years back and were housed with a family that had a cat named Tajeen (terrible phonetic spelling I'm sure). They said it was Moroccan for stew meat. If the cat got you up terribly early, I suspect the name might come out with a bit more feeling. I mentioned my cat, Hendrix, in a thread about animals and music. I named him after Jimi Hendrix. After his demise I got an older cat named Killer, though I changed it to Henrietta (Killer just didn't seem appropriate when she was middle aged and elderly). My current cat is named Worf and really likes his name. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Phil Cooper Date: 05 Nov 01 - 11:21 PM Every house needs one cat for every room. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Little Hawk Date: 05 Nov 01 - 11:43 PM Here is a great name for a cat: Murphy's Law Here's another: Napoleon's Delight And also: Montezuma's Revenge - LH p.s. Murphy, Nappy, and Monty for short (the call names) |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: GUEST,guest Date: 06 Nov 01 - 12:29 AM Cats, no matter how they may act, have a certain dignity. Over the years the ones I have lived with have been called Friedemann, Portia Anastasia, Chingachkook, Fenris, Orca, Hector, and Melvin. Melvin is the exception. He is the anti-cat. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: mooman Date: 06 Nov 01 - 04:35 AM Thanks for the extract from "The Tailor and Ansty" Matthew! It's a good few years since I read both it and Robert Gibbins' "Lovely is the Lee" and its sequel which also make reference to the Tailor and Ansty. In brings back fond memories of many vists to wonderful Googaunbarra where the Tailor ans Ansty lived and where one can still view their graves. Marvellous stuff! mooman |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 06 Nov 01 - 05:42 AM Johnny Jerry's sow and the eel: A Story from The Tailor [Musical Content Rating: Nil] [Thread Relevance: Low] [Irish Censorship Board Rating: Banned] "There are people who walk through the world who see nothing and hear nothing and learn nothing and know nothing. I don't know why they are alive at all. There are animals learn quicker and have more sense than a deal of human beings. "I saw a curious thing in this line myself a few years ago. Did you ever know that a sow is a very intelligent animal? "I was on the road to this side of Turendubh. There is a pool there at the side of the road, and a 'johnny the bog' had caught an eel in the pool and was swallowing him. The 'johnny the bog' is a strange kind of bird. He has only a straight gut. "Well, he was swallowing the eel and he wasn't making much of a hand at the business, for the eel ran straight through him, and the 'johnny the bog' kept swallowing him and losing him again. "Johnny Jerry had a sow at that time and she was always on the side of the road. She came along and she stood for a while and watched the 'johnny the bog' go through the performance several times. Then she made a grab for the eel herself and swallowed him and clapped her backside up against the wall! "Now wasn't she a cute and a quick scholar? Yerra, don't be talking. A man can see a new wonder every minute of the day, if only he has the intelligence to know a wonder whe he sees one." From: The Tailor and Ansty by Eric Cross The Tailor The Tailor was Tim Buckley, who lived with his wife, Ansty, in Gougane Barra. He was a great storyteller, Irish speaker, and a singer as well. A number of people used to visit him to hear his stories, and to learn Irish from him, and some of these became great friends with him, including Frank O'Connor the short story writer and translator. Eric Cross wrote down some of the Tailor's stories, and this was published in 1942 as The Tailor and Ansty. The book was banned by the Irish Government of that time as being "in its general tendency indecent". The records of the Irish Senate debates over the banning of this book have themselves been struck from the record lest pornographers would buy the proceedings and peddle them to deprave and corrupt the youth of the nation. It has been said that the list of books banned by the Irish Censorship Board constitutes an excellent guide to the world's greatest literature, but while most authors could treat such ridiculous attitudes with the contempt they deserved, the effect on the Tailor and Ansty in Gougane Barra at that time was devastating. For telling old stories with a Rabelaisian relish, he and his wife were shunned by their neighbours, condemned by the church and isolated from their friends. Times have changed since then and the book has been openly sold in Ireland for many years. Read it for a wonderful account of a great couple who brought light and laughter into the lives of many. "Take the world fine and aisy and the world will take you fine and aisy" The Tailor |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: GUEST,2 feathers Date: 06 Nov 01 - 11:59 AM How dull of me to think you only wanted cat names! What great names and stories. I was only going to tell you the names of my cats...many in my life before they took revenge and I became allergic to the dander. Cleocatra, Cat-ass-trophe, Katya, Sophisticat and more less interesting names: Spooky, White Bibby. Cleocatra learned how to open the screen door by turning the handle. Sophisticat liked to eat buttered stringbeans. Turned up her nose at a dish of milk. My mother took White Bibby miles away when I was about 11 years old. She never found her way back. I wept for days. Considering she was a cat lover who used to sneak kittens into her mother's blanket closet when her mother was out, and knew how to use cat talk, the desertion was uncaracteristic of her. Mother used to stand on the street (Brooklyn about 1913-14) and meow. All the neighborhood cats would come out, sit down in front of her, and look up into her face waiting for the next instruction. Mom never knew exactly what she was saying, but the cats all did. Spooky attacked my friend Janet when she came in to the house. Janet had dozens of cats wandering in and out of her house. Spooky must have smelled cat rather than Janet.Katya came when Spooky was a pretty old cat. She thought Spooky's tail was made just for her to pounce on. Spooky became angrier and the tail whipped up and back more quickly to Katya's delight. Finally Spooky had a nervous breakdown and retreated to the top of the refrigerator where her twitching tail was out of Katya's reach. I miss having cats and being allergic to them is the pits. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Charley Noble Date: 06 Nov 01 - 01:38 PM Well, it's another first for Tilahun, a pigeon. How she managed to drag it through the catdoor is a mystery. Maybe Tejitu and Gashay pushed while she pulled, the old push-ma-pulla trick. We only saw feathers scattered from one end of the house to the other when we got home, and even after a basement to attic search turned up nothing more. Three days later I was looking for my boots in the front closet, you know the long red ones, when I saw something move...Wasn't a rat, just one bedraggled pigeon. Well, I brushed it up, hydrated it, and launched it out the second floor window above the porch and after some midflight corrections, to comphensate for missing feathers, it made it back to the top of the roof to share its tale of woe, and its cleaver escape. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Fortunato Date: 06 Nov 01 - 03:39 PM I was once married to a woman who had three cats. They had quite normal names, like Buddy and William and Simon. Their true names however were quite different and were like the names of Tolkein's Ents, experential. Buddy's true name was Jumps out of windows, bites the hand that feeds it and dislikes everyone equally. William's true name was Always shits next to the box and steps in it, destroys clothing and furniture indiscrinately and whines incessently. Simon's true name was Loves to piss in guitar cases, Constantly ill and shreds the arms of the caretaker on way to the vet for expensive, ineffective treatments. Utah Phillips says don't own anything you don't have to feed or paint. I say don't own anything that bites or pisses in your guitar case. I'll pet yours.
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 08 Nov 01 - 07:55 AM Thanks to all who have contributed to this thread, which, as Morticia has pointed out, is dedicated to Loki who joined the Mudcat community at Llanstock, and therefore has a special place in the hearts of those of us who were there. Perhaps one day she will get a song or poem in her honour, but she can't have The Pride of Llanfair! Charley, I loved your tale of Tilahun and the pigeon. Anyway having mentioned Frank O'Connor previously I thought of a poem he translated which has some thread relevance. The Scholar and the Cat Each of us pursues his trade, I and Pangur my comrade, His whole fancy on the hunt, And mine for learning ardent. More than fame I love to be Among my books and study, Pangur does not grudge me it, Content with his own merit. When-a heavenly time!-we are In our small room together Each of us has his own sport And asks no greater comfort. While he sets his round sharp eye On the wall of my study I turn mine, though lost its edge, On the great wall of knowledge. Now a mouse drops in his net After some mighty onset While into my bag I cram Some difficult darksome problem. When a mouse comes to the kill Pangur exults, a marvel! I have when some secret's won My hour of exultation. Though we work for days and years Neither the other hinders; Each is competent and hence Enjoys his skill in silence. Master of the death of mice, He keeps in daily practice, I too, making dark things clear, Am of my trade a master. This poem, written in Irish, was found in the margins of a religious manuscript from an Austrian monastery. It had been written by one of those anonymous scholar-monks from Ireland who kept the flame of learning alive in Europe during the Dark Ages. I can imagine the monk in his cell with his dim eyesight turning away for a moment from his task to write this truly delightful poem comparing his quest for knowledge with his cat's hunting for a mouse. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Charley Noble Date: 08 Nov 01 - 09:16 AM Mathew - A nice tale, and one wonders how far back this journey with the cats began. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Paul from Hull Date: 08 Nov 01 - 12:48 PM Can I ask where you found that, Matthew, & the background behind it? Are those notes about it your own, or what? |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 08 Nov 01 - 01:22 PM O'Connor's translation comes from his book Kings,Lords, & Commons: an Anthology from the Irish of which I have a paperback copy published in 1970 by Gill and Macmillan. If it is not still in print it ought to be. There are other translations; one by Kuno Meyer appears in his Ancient Irish Poetry, and in his notes Meyer dates the poem to the 8th or 9th century. Robin Flower also made a translation, but as Frank O'Connor comments "Robin Flower's well-known translation in the metre of 'Twinkle, twinkle, little star' ignores the slowness of the original, which approximates more to iambic pentameter." The notes to the poem are my own, and somewhere I have read which Austrian monastery was the source but I can't track the reference down. Is St Gall in Austria? Meyer cites a text and translation in Thesaurus Paleohibernicus, ii, p293. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Paul from Hull Date: 08 Nov 01 - 01:44 PM Thanks for that, matey! More info there than I can get my head around, so to speak, but interesting stuff! Cheers! |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: lamarca Date: 08 Nov 01 - 01:49 PM I have a 20-year-old Siamese kitty whose round-the-house name is Val, but whose full name is Valeria Victrix; her brother, alas, didn't live up to his name of Koshchei Byezsmyertnui (Koshchei the Deathless...). Val is my old lady - still spunky, verbose and demanding, but incredibly attached to her humans. I have just finished reading a wonderful book by one of my favorite nature writers, Sue Hubbell, called "Shrinking the Cat: Genetic Engineering Before We Knew About Genes". In it Hubbell discusses the human penchant for engineering species of animals and plants for our own use long before "GMO" became a dirty word - we have created corn, silkmoths, apples and cats for our own pleasure and use. Modern cats were evolved from Felis sylvestris libyica by selecting the smaller, less excitable, more affectionate and more attractive offspring over generations of inbreeding; different breeds of cats arose due to different views of what constituted "attractive". Another favorite little book is one I found in a used bookstore of Edward Lear's pictures and writings about his beloved cat, Foss. For a picture of Lear and Foss, go here; for info on the book, For lovers of cats. Edward Lear, compiled by Vivien Noakes and Charles Lewsen, London, Collins, 1978, ABEbooks has a copy here (this link won't work if the book sells...) |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 08 Nov 01 - 02:02 PM lamarca what a wonderful site that is, and please greet Valeria Victrix for me. One of the illustrations on the site you linked to looks very like a cartoon drawing by Art Spiegelman. Have you come across his graphic novels Maus and Maus II about the Holocaust in which Jewish people are drawn as mice, victims of Nazi cats? It is extremely powerful, and moving, and very effective as a retelling of that terrible time. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Paul from Hull Date: 08 Nov 01 - 02:21 PM I've just realised that I've been reading this thread with great enjoyment for a Fortnight now, & posted to it more than once (& I know that some Americans arent aware of the term 'Fortnight' - meaning 2 weeks - presumably a contraction of 'Fourteen Nights) .....& I havent yet told you about my 2 menaces. Spike is around 7 years old, but seems older & wiser than that (& always has) He's black everywhere, though when the light is behind him, it can be seen that his fur is actually a very pleasing shade of Dark Brown. He's a fairly affectionate fella when the mood takes him, but can be fairly aloof for the most part, though he LOVES to stand or lie on peoples shoulders...wrapped around their necks like a black fur 'scarf'. He TRIES to talk to me...though in fairly brief sentences, & cant see why cant understand him as well as he seems to evidently understand me. Slick, on the other hand is just thick... He's black & white, & about 2 1/2 (he & Spike arent related, btw). All that he takes the slightest interest in is food... or should I say, anything that he THINKS might just possibly be edible.... He's a bit rougher in 'play' than Spike ever was, & is also as clumsy as Hell, so I'm never short of a fair few scratches because of him. He's not without his own charm, however, cos he often makes a sound more like a 'chirrup' than a miaow, & I've never known a cat purr so much when it suits him, & he's warm & comfy....the lad positively 'buzzes' - like he's got a little electric motor in him..... |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 09 Nov 01 - 04:34 AM Paul, thank you for introducing Spike and Slick to us; they are welcome aboard the Mudcat. Charley Noble wondered how far back the association between cats and humans extended, and I am sure some learned 'Catter will be able to provide a link to a website which explores the history of this relationship. There is a story that The Great Moggie In The Sky spent five days creating the world, and then curled up to sleep in a little box behind the central heating boiler. After a while She woke up and prowled around the house, miaowing loudly until She realised that there was nobody there to feed Her. On the sixth day therefore She created humans to open tins for Her, and to serve Her every whim; to open doors to let her out, and then immediately have to open them again to let Her back in. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Charley Noble Date: 09 Nov 01 - 04:12 PM Thanks, Mathew. That will do for a start! |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: lamarca Date: 09 Nov 01 - 06:23 PM Matthew, I have seen parts of Maus, but haven't actually read the whole thing. I like Spiegelman's work, though - he occasionally has pieces in The New Yorker. As far as cats' association with humans, I'll go back and check Sue Hubbell's book - she gave a couple references to research trying to establish the length of time cats have deigned to live with us. One thing I do remember from that chapter is that in the late 1800's archaeologists were digging up so many cat mummies in Egypt that they were being used as ballast in ships returning to England, where they were sold to be ground up as fertilizer. Fortunately, enough have been preserved that they have been used in studies comparing anatomy and DNA changes between ancient and modern cats. Wild cats (not feral kitties, but Felis sylvestris) have brains that are 20-30% larger than domestic cats, mostly in the sensory regions as befits a predator that has to hunt its dinner instead of waiting for a human to open a tin. Siamese cats have brains 5-10% smaller than the average domestic cat, something I've always suspected from the sometimes gormless behavior of mine... |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: JennieG Date: 09 Nov 01 - 08:15 PM Our girls don't bring prey inside as we don't have a cat flap (they have 4 humans to open doors, why do they need a cat flap?) but occasionally we find exploded birds on the back step...little piles of feathers, a leg, a bit of wing...for all the world as though the poor bird self-destructed! Our girls are Prickle, so named because as a kitten on the way home from the animal shelter 14 years ago she had very prickly little paws; Belle who is a beautiful big ginger girl; and Binky, a dark tortie. Binky was named after Death's horse in the Terry Pratchett books. Cheers JennieG |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Charley Noble Date: 10 Nov 01 - 05:01 PM Well, here's another story about a family cat: Grendal and the Cream Separator Father never liked cats, nor was he especially fond of Grendal, our newest little gray kitten who was always getting into everything, usually something disgusting, and then would try to climb into Father's lap. As I remember it, we were all having breakfast in the farm kitchen, and Father was pouring milk into the big milk separator in the corner of the room. Milk separators are machines designed to magically transform milk into cream and skim milk by centrifugal force, sort of like a particle accelerator. Ours was a modern one run by electricity. Anyway, Father flipped on the switch and sat down for breakfast, when one of us noticed Grendal disappearing under the machine. Mother immediately got down on all fours and tried to grab her tail; but she, the kitten, was already climbing out of reach, amidst the grinding gears. Mother was about to pull the plug to stop the machine, but was stopped by Father who was justifiably concerned about ruining a morning's work for some rude little animal, and besides he hadn't heard a single screech. So we all continued eating our breakfast, with an occasional glance at the machine, whirling out its cream and skim milk. Father was whistling a cheerful tune, which I think was "Dunderbeck's Machine." When the machine had completed its cycle, Father got out his screwdriver, removed the side cover plate and there was Grendal siting in the drip pan, somewhat greasy but none the worse for wear, still staring at the maze of gears. From that day on, she was inseparable from her favorite hangout whenever Father was processing the milk. Cheerily, Charley Noble |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 12 Nov 01 - 04:37 AM Another Tale; (not about cats) The Tailor on Owen Roe O'Sullivan The Tailor and his wife Ansty had the greatest respect for the procreative talents of men and women and, barring priests (who had professional exemption in those days before the Bishop of Galway!), measured the prowess of people by their fertility. Ansty would always ask guests how many children they had, and was astounded one day when a young married woman asked if the animal in the field was a bull or a cow. She mused over this all day "That was a queer kind of marriage. What was she married to? They must have had the strange carry on. Didn't know the difference between a bull and a cow, and married!" Anyway one day there was talk of the Kerry poets, and the Tailor drew attention to some of the lesser-known talents of Owen Roe O'Sullivan: "One of those and the greatest of them, was Owen Roe, Owen Roe O'Sullivan. The rest of them, O'Donoghue, Ferriter, and O'Rahilly, were only walking after him. He was one of the greatest poets that ever was. Its no use for anyone to be talking. They were all poets in those days, every bloody man. "But that was not all about Owen Roe. He was an auctioneer as well, and he was middling good as a doctor as well. He was good enough at every trade. He spent a part of his time in the Navy, and was at the battle of Waterloo. But do you know what was his best trade after poetry? It was making small lads. "He was one of the most frolicsome men that ever was. It was said of him that if he threw a copper over a fence it would, like as not, fall on the head of one of his own. He must have been as good as King Solomon almost. "One day a young gossoon met him on the road, and Owen spoke to him for a while, and then he gave him a penny, telling him that the next time he saw him he would give him a shilling. Well, by the mockstick of war, what did the young lad do? He hopped over the fence and ran over a couple of fields and was there on the road before Owen Roe again. "'You said that you would give me a shilling the next time you saw me,' said he. "'True for you,' answered Owen. 'Here is the shilling, and another for your intelligence. You must be one of my own.' From The Tailor and Ansty by Eric Cross The image of Owen Roe as a naval officer at the Battle of Waterloo is brilliant, and it is wonderful to think of him walking the Kerry countryside, scattering poems and children with equal liberality. However, I think that by now we are reaching the limits of the tolerance allowed by the copyright laws, and anyone wishing for more of the Tailor's stories will have to go out and buy the book. He was one of the masters of the art of storytelling in Ireland. In the meantime, welcome to JennieG and her cats; Binky, Prickle, and Belle. Also thanks to Charley Noble for the tale of Grendal - the cat who got the cream! |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Morticia Date: 12 Nov 01 - 09:13 AM Well, for all my agonising regarding the naming of Loki, it turns out her real name was OOOOWWW, gerroff yer bugger, you've just drawn blood again!. It seems I had only to wait and her name would become obvious. I look like one of those poor unfortunates that self-harms with razor blades and due to a particularly fetching bite mark on my neck, it seems we now own a vampire kitten...anyone knowing where I can obtain garlic kitty-bics will earn my undying ( and I may mean that literally) gratitude. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Charley Noble Date: 13 Nov 01 - 08:51 AM Morticia - Our Tilahun shares similar traits with your Loki. I've suggested to my wife Judy, whom Tilahun bonded with at the early age of "YOWSAHHHH" that she sprinkle her neck with paprika, berbare, or some other spicy essence. You might try that and share the results, since Judy refuses to comply...;-) |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Morticia Date: 13 Nov 01 - 09:25 AM Strange as it may seem, Charley, I think I can understand Judy's reluctance.Going out smelling like someone's dinner isn't up there on my top ten of favourite things to do either....but I may be driven to it yet and if I am, I'll let you know. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Naming of Cats From: Matthew Edwards Date: 13 Nov 01 - 01:31 PM Glad to hear more news of Loki, Morticia. Have you thought of following Tony Blair's example and revoking Clause iv (=Claws 4! Sorry). Anyway I couldn't think of a new cat story for today, but looking back I see that I commented on the pernicious effects of the Irish Censorship Board on Irish culture, and there is a story which illustrates this very well. Thread Digression: The Banning of Brendan Behan One night during the Emergency years there was, as usual, a lively argument going on in the special writer's and artist's carriage of the Dublin Underground Railway. The writers were complaining about the activities of the Censorship Board, and how it was becoming impossible to earn a living from literature. James Joyce, who had popped over by submarine from Trieste to check the house numbers on the Vico Road for his new novel, was bemoaning the fact that the only thing the warring nations agreed on was the banning of Ulysses. The now statelier and plumper figure of Gogarty pointed out that the only way he could escape being placed on the Index was to write all the dirty bits in Attic Greek. At the bar, Flann O'Brien was getting extremely drunk, again, thanks to the barman allowing him three drinks for the price of one in consideration of his Triune identity. He was trying to jot down a note on the back of his ticket for a pun on Greeks in the attic to use in his novel. Sean O'Faolain complained about the stagnant state of Irish culture, and illustrated his remarks by pointing to the pools of Guinness spreading across the floor: "That's Irish writing today for you; a stain on the floor of a railway carriage." Young Brendan Behan cheered and shouted, "Up the IRA!" All the others glared at him, and wondered who had let him in as he hadn't written anything yet. However a minor Joyce brother murmured that he was so-and-so's nephew, and anyway he could sing a bit. After a while a general agreement began to emerge that being banned by the Board conferred an élite status on those writers. Consequently Gogarty was elected spokesman to approach the Managing Director of the Railway, Mr L.H.Corner, with a view to securing a private compartment, with a bar, restricted for the use of banned writers. At this, Brendan Behan, who didn't want to be left out of anything, leaped out of the carriage at Emmet Station and scribbled a rude song on the walls (in both Gaelic and English as prescribed by Regulation 42 Ch.11 sect.xlvii of the Railway), and signed his name below. He was duly banned by the Censorship Board the following day, and thus he became the first author to be prohibited without having anything of his published. Of course musicians were also allowed on the Dublin Underground, or the Four-Cornered Railway as it was popularly known afer the four brothers Corner who constituted the Board of Directors. Indeed there was one memorable night involving Margaret Barry and a bicycle...but thats a story for another day. line breaks fixed by mudelf ;-)
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