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BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers

Justa Picker 07 Nov 01 - 01:06 PM
MMario 07 Nov 01 - 01:11 PM
jeffp 07 Nov 01 - 01:14 PM
catspaw49 07 Nov 01 - 01:16 PM
alanww 07 Nov 01 - 01:21 PM
Kim C 07 Nov 01 - 01:32 PM
catspaw49 07 Nov 01 - 01:42 PM
kendall 07 Nov 01 - 01:52 PM
Little Hawk 07 Nov 01 - 01:55 PM
MMario 07 Nov 01 - 01:59 PM
jeffp 07 Nov 01 - 02:05 PM
JohnInKansas 07 Nov 01 - 02:06 PM
Kim C 07 Nov 01 - 02:06 PM
Jon Freeman 07 Nov 01 - 02:09 PM
JohnInKansas 07 Nov 01 - 02:14 PM
catspaw49 07 Nov 01 - 02:20 PM
mousethief 07 Nov 01 - 02:34 PM
8_Pints 07 Nov 01 - 02:36 PM
kendall 07 Nov 01 - 02:42 PM
wysiwyg 07 Nov 01 - 02:57 PM
Justa Picker 07 Nov 01 - 03:01 PM
GUEST,Deda 07 Nov 01 - 03:08 PM
mousethief 07 Nov 01 - 03:10 PM
GUEST,Jenny the T 07 Nov 01 - 03:18 PM
Sorcha 07 Nov 01 - 03:29 PM
Kim C 07 Nov 01 - 04:07 PM
Helen 07 Nov 01 - 04:50 PM
kimmers 07 Nov 01 - 05:12 PM
RangerSteve 07 Nov 01 - 06:11 PM
Janie 07 Nov 01 - 06:27 PM
brid widder 07 Nov 01 - 06:33 PM
Janie 07 Nov 01 - 06:41 PM
Murray MacLeod 07 Nov 01 - 06:58 PM
sophocleese 07 Nov 01 - 07:04 PM
kendall 07 Nov 01 - 07:22 PM
Llanfair 07 Nov 01 - 07:34 PM
mmm1a 07 Nov 01 - 07:36 PM
Murray MacLeod 07 Nov 01 - 07:44 PM
Jon Freeman 07 Nov 01 - 07:47 PM
Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 07 Nov 01 - 09:21 PM
Jon Freeman 07 Nov 01 - 09:39 PM
R! 07 Nov 01 - 09:46 PM
Gypsy 07 Nov 01 - 10:46 PM
Lyrical Lady 08 Nov 01 - 01:38 AM
Homeless 08 Nov 01 - 09:31 AM
Morticia 08 Nov 01 - 10:02 AM
catspaw49 08 Nov 01 - 10:07 AM
Greyeyes 08 Nov 01 - 10:21 AM
Greyeyes 08 Nov 01 - 10:26 AM
lamarca 08 Nov 01 - 11:02 AM
GUEST,JohnB 08 Nov 01 - 12:48 PM
Lyrical Lady 08 Nov 01 - 01:40 PM
Kim C 08 Nov 01 - 01:45 PM
Helen 08 Nov 01 - 05:02 PM
Helen 08 Nov 01 - 05:15 PM
GUEST,Sooz(at work) 09 Nov 01 - 08:20 AM
mmm1a 09 Nov 01 - 07:09 PM
Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 24 Dec 01 - 08:18 AM
GUEST,Desdemona 24 Dec 01 - 11:58 AM
artbrooks 24 Dec 01 - 01:57 PM
Abuwood 24 Dec 01 - 04:49 PM
gnu 24 Dec 01 - 05:35 PM
GUEST,Jenny the T 10 Jan 02 - 12:59 AM
Stilly River Sage 10 Jan 02 - 02:31 AM
Helen 10 Jan 02 - 06:32 AM
Terry K 10 Jan 02 - 10:26 AM
Stilly River Sage 10 Jan 02 - 11:10 AM

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Subject: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Justa Picker
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:06 PM

Yes, I could go to consumer report online websites, but I'd like opinions from Mudcatters who have bread-makers, as to which is the best, and most reliable.

My S.O. has informed me she would like a bread-maker for Christmas, and so I begin my research as I do with any purchase. Price is not an issue. I want something really good, and considered the best in its class and something long lasting and not prone to breaking down or requiring a lot of maintenance. Any 'Catters who own bread-makers, tell me what you have and why and how much you love it. (Friends have suggested the Black and Decker.) Thoughts? And my thanks in advance to those that respond. (The rest of you, just ignore this thread.)


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: MMario
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:11 PM

we have a 'NoName' - and since the first two paddles broke - haven't had any problems with it. But getting those spare parts was murder!


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: jeffp
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:14 PM

My wife has a Breadman - 1 1/2 pound capacity. She loves it and so do I - we get homemade bread more often this way.

jeffp


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:16 PM

I'm interested here too JP. Karen has never expressed any interest in one because 1)she makes outstanding bread, and ejoys it, and 2) Neither of us have ever found one that anybody else was using that we liked!

We both love homemade bread (far too much) and would probably ise a bread machine that made GOOD bread, especially bread that looked like bread! So many of the things make wacky shaped loaves or have a big hole up through the loaf. I know it's partly the recipe and all, but I'd like to hear the comments by people who actually believe they know of some that make reasonably good bread.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: alanww
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:21 PM

Try the Panasonic top of the range. Mine is an SD-206 (I think it was approx £150 in the UK but no doubt it would be half that in the USA). It produces great bread and I use it several times a week!

Round goes the wheel of fortune ...
Alan


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Kim C
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:32 PM

Your SO already has a breadmaker - a pair of hands. :-) They make bread far superior than any loaf made by a machine.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:42 PM

See Kim, that's the way Karen feels too and she likes doing it.....Unfortunately it's not as often as either of us would like. We haven't seen one yet that could really do what either of us would consider "good homemade bread."

Any more details folks? Loaf shape, taste?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: kendall
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:52 PM

Save your money. Your local super market sells raw frozen bread dough that is every bit as good, and, it is a hellava lot cheaper.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Little Hawk
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:55 PM

Yeah, don't people just make bread with their hands? Why would anyone design a machine to do it?

Oh...to make money...oh, yeah...

- LH


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: MMario
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 01:59 PM

I have to admit - given my 'druthers' I would make bread by hand - and usually I make bread when I really need to knead, pummel, etc. But the bread maker comes in handy in that with it, I'm not the only one in the house who bakes bread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: jeffp
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:05 PM

Some people just don't have the time to make bread by hand all the time. Also, you need a counter at an appropriate height for kneading and shoulders that can take the strain. Another consideration is that it takes less energy to heat the relatively small volume of a bread machine versus the oven. Of course, in the winter the oven gains in this balance as it creates a nice warm spot in the house and tends to gather family and cats to its environs.

I know that we get home-baked bread more often than we would without the machine.

Additional details about the Breadman -

1 1/2 pound loaf, but they make a 2-pound model also

Loaf is a rectangular solid with square cross-section, about 6 inches by 6 inches by 10 inches long (going from imperfect memory here)

There is a hole in the bottom caused by the impeller that mixes the ingredients together. It only spoils one slice though.

When a loaf rises more than expected, you get a mushroom cap on the top that sometimes forces the lid open. No harm is done, and the "mushroom" is usually eaten by whoever takes the bread out when it's done.

The machine has a timer so you can put the ingredients in and set it to finish just before your meal.

It will never replace homemade bread, but it beats store-bought loaves, unless you go to a bakery instead of a grocery store; and even then, you just can't beat that baking bread aroma!

Hope this helps

jeffp


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:06 PM


My S.O. occasionally uses her Hitachi (HB-B201) which is a fairly unexceptional machine. Like most, it makes a small loaf with a hole in the end.

The biggest benefit we've had from the thing is that the "acceptable mediocre" loaf you get out of it has prompted me to dig out the recipes and make some "real" bread - which has shamed her into doing the same occasionally.

Look for a machine that has at least two "rise" steps in the cycle. The pre-pack mixes use "fast-rising" yeast, and the makers' claim is that two rises is enough, but my favored "scratch" recipes generally use at least 3, and up to 5. Hurrying the process makes large "pores" unevenly distributed through the loaf.

My main objection to the "machine breads" is that most have the same inferior crust. Not much you can do about it - it seems to be the nature of the beast method.

Stand by for the S.O.'s rebuttal of anything I've said.

John


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Kim C
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:06 PM

I know Spaw, it has been AGES since I have had time to bake bread. I think it's time I made some time. I miss it. It's always very exciting when it works!

I have not tried the frozen bread dough but I have heard other reports that it is pretty good.

Now, just about everyone on this list knows that I think bread machines are the devil. However, I will concede that they might possibly have their good points. One, they do save time. Two, they are probably a godsend for people who have allergies to certain grains & such & can't eat regular storebought breads. Three, you have the flexibility to make whatever the hell you want. (but you have that anyway, when you make something yourself)

Justa Picker, the thing is... I have NEVER had a bread machine loaf that tasted like it was a real homebaked loaf of bread. Real homebaked bread has a certain density to it that the machines just can't seem to duplicate. A real homebaked loaf doesn't have the same kind of big fat holes in it that storebought or machine bread has.

It just ain't the same. It just ain't!

However, people that I know who have a machine love it, probably because they don't know any better. lol Anyhow, I think The Bread Machine is supposed to be pretty good. Is that the Black & Decker one? I don't know. But B&D has a good reputation, so I think you could trust anything they make.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:09 PM

Funny this one should crop up as I had a play with my mother's machine this week end. Hers is a Morphy Richards. It took me 3 attempts (juggling the quantities a bit and discovering the 1st yeast I used was no good) to get what I wanted but the 3rd loaf was just about right.

The complaints I have are this only makes a 1 1/2lb loaf - I'd prefer a 2lb loaf and the stiring thing tends to stick to the spindle and be hard to get off. Also, I'm not sure - do they all just have preset programs or do some allow some degree of manual control? - maybe they don't need it.

The good side is I like it. You can get a great loaf for very little effort and I think once you have worked out the balance of ingredients to be as you want them (I find the white loaf my mum bakes strictly to the book recipe too sweet for example), it should be easy to get consistent results.

Jon


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:14 PM


No thread is worthy without a little strife and dissension.

Our use of the bread machine fell drastically when I got the S.O. a good counter-top mixer. Not actually a heavy duty, and corkscrews instead of real dough hooks, but I caught a Farberware on sale for about $60 (US), and it will do the heavy mixing on the dough.

Of course, if you raise this possiblility, you'll end up needing to get her both(?) - I did.

John


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:20 PM

Thanks for the additional info John and Jon.

John, your point on the mixing is well taken. We get a lot more of Karen's homemade since I bought her a Kitchen-Aid. Man, what a great machine that is!!! They don't back up to the price, but the damn things are worth every penny....SOLID piece of equipment!

Spaw


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: mousethief
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:34 PM

I'll repeat what I always do when this comes up: be careful where you put it. We had ours on the counter, and it "walked" off and smashed onto the floor. Watch it make bread once or twice, see which way it "walks" and then position it so it can't fall off the counter.

Alex


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: 8_Pints
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:36 PM

I have a Breville fan assisted BreadMaker - We really like it! It does produce loaf shaped loaves, but of course there is the obligatory hole in the bottom where the mixing blade rests. I bought it when it was on special offer from Comet, it was about £70. I do like making bread by hand, but don't get round to it very often - I have neither time nor energy after working full time! (Unless I have had a particularly stressful day, in which case the pummelling can be a great release!)

I have discovered a bread mix which has been developed for bread machines - it is available from Lakeland Ltd (They do mail order) It is Australian and made by a firm called Laucke. There are 5 or 6 different types and though the mixed pack with a sample of each in, works out expensive (Nearly £1 per 1kilo loaf) it was worth it to find the ones we liked the best. I now buy the 5 kilo sacks that work out considerably cheaper. (There are sachets of yeast included in each packet) Our favourite is the German mixed grain with the Crusty white coming a close second!

Happy baking!

Sue vG


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: kendall
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:42 PM

When you add up the cost of the machine, the cost of the ingredients, the cost of the power and the time it takes, it is just not cost effective. Besides, with the store bought raw dough, you can have fresh fried dough for breakfast. Add it all up folks, I think you will agree.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: wysiwyg
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 02:57 PM

What, no mention of the previous thread? I gotta write up the Amish bread bucket all over again?

*G*

'Course I only skimmed this one... maybe I missed it...

~S~


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Justa Picker
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 03:01 PM

Appreciate the comments so far...but let's just say for now and for the sake of this discussion, that she wants a bread maker and is NOT interested in making it with her own hands and from scratch (although naturally I can appreciate this advantage over everything else.) She's hellbent on a bread maker. So? More bread maker suggestions and recommendations and comments?


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: GUEST,Deda
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 03:08 PM

I have a BreadMaker (I think??). I don't use it often enough but when I do my husband and I are very happy with it. There's a pre-packaged 10-grain bread mix that comes out particularly well, and has won praise even from my very close friend who is a great cook and bread-maker herself. I don't make any bread from scratch for 3 reasons: 1 is just time, I don't have enough, 2, I have carpal tunnel and my hands are not up to it, and 3, I live a mile above sea level and I was never able to master the adjustments you have to make, not only in ingredients but also in rising time. But then I have never had much previous experience or luck making bread from scratch.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: mousethief
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 03:10 PM

Loved my Zojirushi. X got it in divorce. Sigh.

Alex


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: GUEST,Jenny the T
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 03:18 PM

I love my breadmaker, but I've only let it bake the bread once. That funny-looking loaf was just not satisfactory at all.

I like to make bread by hand, but it's awfully time-consuming, and I have other things to be doing, too. So I let the bread machine mix the dough, time the rises, and do all but the final kneading.

I do that last bit myself, and then I pop the dough into the real oven. That way, I get a proper loaf, of my own recipe, and meanwhile have taken care of the housework, walked the dog, played a few tunes ...

My machine is a Hamilton Beach, I think. It only has one paddle, but it seems sturdy enough, and does the [desired portion of the] job for me.

JtT


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Sorcha
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 03:29 PM

I don't have one and don't want one (it has a cord, therefore is User UnFriendly!), but my aunt does. She has had several, and says you just have to experiment with amounts and recipes until you get it right. She threw away a lot of bread before she got it right.

Just buy a top of the line brand with a good warranty and you should be OK.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Kim C
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 04:07 PM

I want a Kitchen-Aid! We had one at the ice cream store where I used to work. The thing with gadgets is, though, Mister is the one who has to clean 'em, and he probably curses my mother everytime he sees food processor parts in the sink. (she gave it to us) I think this is why he didn't want to put the George Foreman grill on our Christmas list.

ditto what Sorcha says.... if she really wants a bread machine, go ahead and get her a good one. Is there a consumer reporting site on the Net you can check out? There's probably plenty of sites on breadbaking & such that might be able to give you more suggestions.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Helen
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 04:50 PM

I bought a Breville Breadmaster Big Loaf here in Oz for about $AU280 in 1999 - they've come down in price since then I think. It makes rectangular loaves and has the problem of the two paddles getting stuck in the base of the bread, but I now have a few recipes which I seem to work well. I am getting more into it now that the results are more reliable, and I've had it for 2 years.

My favourite is to fry up some onions until they are golden brown and put them in just after the dough has been mixed. Yum!

I like mine because it has various settings and I can just make the dough or go the whole hog. I can make pizza dough, or pasta or doughnuts (haven't tried these) or hubby makes dough for Indian breads.

I made an apple twist one day by making the dough in the machine, then letting it rise once, then getting it out, making the twist with the apple in it, then letting it rise in the pre-warmed oven, and then baking it.

The next version up from the one we bought cost maybe $AU50 more and the only difference we could see was that it had a nifty compartment for added chopped ingredients and they were torpedoed in at exactly the right time in the cycle. Ours just beeps at the right time. Didn't need to get that automatic. When they invent one which fries the onions as well I might consider it - NOT!

For someone who has never made bread before it is a good thing to have. And I agree about the reasons why some people have a bread machine or no home made bread at all.

8 Pints, thanks for the tip on the Australian bread pre-mix. I have been avoiding the pre-mixes so maybe I'll try that brand out.

Helen


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: kimmers
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 05:12 PM

I have some old Hitachi model (I think). It was a gift, so I didn't get to pick, but I've been pleased. I often use it to mix up dough for bread or pizza; I have small hands and chronic eczema that gets irritated by being coated with dough, so the hand-kneading is not my favorite thing to do.

It was a godsend during the nine-month-long kitchen remodel, during which time I cooked with the microwave, the crockpot, the rice cooker and the bread machine.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: RangerSteve
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 06:11 PM

Don't get the one that looks like R2D2 and makes cylinder shaped bread. The shape of the bread isn't practical for making sandwiches. Otherwise, it works fine.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Janie
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 06:27 PM

I vote for Zojirushi. I make all of our bread, usually whole wheat. Have had Panasonic and Zojirushi and by far prefer the Z. It can handle the heavier whole wheat doughs. I have the smaller model. I DO find it cost effective. Organic whole wheat breads in my area cost $3.00 to $3.89 per 2 lb. loaf, My cost using bulk purchased organic whole wheat bread flour is about $1.05 per 1 1/2 lb. loaf. I have had the Z for 5 years now, have replaced the paddle once (cost about $5.00 including shipping) and now need to replace the pan ($70.00 approx.) I paid $140.00 for it on sale. I have averaged baking 4 loafs per week. Am now using a Panasonic my nephew has loaned me until I can order a new pan. It does not mix the dough as well--I have to stand there and scrape the sides of the pan while it is mixing. I am grateful for the loan, but can't wait to get my Z back.

Good luck and happy shopping.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: brid widder
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 06:33 PM

does any one use one of these machines to make gluten free bread?...I've looked in the free recipe books that come with them but haven't seen a gluten free recipe, this would be the selling point for me.

also if you use it for normal bread can it be easily cleaned to use for gluten free bread without contamination by flour?


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Janie
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 06:41 PM

There are bread machine recipe books that have really good recipes. With attention to detail (monitoring the moisture content of the dough during the first kneading until you have a feel for how much moisture your current batch of flour is generally going to require, for example) I have consistently produced loaves every bit as good as when I used to do all the kneading myself. I will often proof the dough in the machine then shape it, let it proof again and bake it in the oven in a conventional pan. Why bother? The weird shapes and/or paddle holes lead to inefficient use of the bread, especially when you are making lots of sandwiches for kids lunches.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 06:58 PM

I agree with kendall that it is not cost effective.

Just like it is not cost effective to spend over a thousand dollars on a Taylor guitar to make your own music when you can buy a CD of much better music for under $15.00.

Murray


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: sophocleese
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 07:04 PM

My mom has a bread maker of some model, I'll check which kind when I next visit. Mom has arthritis and cannot do all the kneading that's necessary but, like Jenny the T she takes the dough out of the machine and cooks decent shaped loaves in the oven. She even makes the now almost forgotten cottage loaves.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: kendall
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 07:22 PM

So, who spent over a thousand?


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Llanfair
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 07:34 PM

Mine is the cheapest on the market, Hinari or some such. Cost £50 and makes square loaves. I never mastered the art of breadmaking, and never got wholemeal bread to rise properly. It does in my machine, and I love it. I can make "Bara da" which is half white and wholemeal, and now you can get white softgrain flour, I am content!!.
And the smell is wonderful!!!
Cheers, Bron.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: mmm1a
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 07:36 PM

I've had my machine for 4 yrs now , its a west bend, not an expensive model. I like it,never could get the hang of making bread by scratch though i've tried several times. The only problem i have had with mine is the bread sticking to the pan, took care of that by very litely oiling the pan corners , since I have been doing that ,no problems. Also the paddles tend to get stuck in the bread but since I slice offthe heal first thing it doesn't bother any one. There are all kinds of bread machine books available and they have many good recipes. I hope you and your wife enjoy yours. mmm


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 07:44 PM

I would hazard a guess that very few Taylors cost less than a thousand, kendall.

Incidentally, rereading my post, I should stress that I was not intending any personal slight on you or your music!

Murray


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 07:47 PM

Bron, my microwave is a Hinari - again cheap but it has given me several years good service. I suspect they are probably a better known brand under a different name. It happens a lot - one that springs to mind is I had a "Saisho" (or something like that) radio-cassette - the bits inside were JVC, another, at one time, a Comet's own brand washing machine was something like a Hotpoint 9520 with a different console panel and a couple of very minor changes - the quality of build and the essential parts were the same...

Jon


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 09:21 PM

Mousethief-To stop your machine moving whilst in use, place a damp tea-towel underneath it.
Justa Picker-If you want the best you can get go for a commercial quality macine, try nisbets(www.nisbets.co.uk), they have two departments, one for trade ie restaraunts & hotels, and one for ordinary customers.Order from the trade centre, it will be a bit cheaper, Kenwood is a good name to go for, my mixer is a Kenwood Chef, it is commercial quality, has had loads of use and has never let me down.
Llanfair & Jon-My microwave is Hinari as well, it only cost me 40 pounds from Makro cash & carry.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 09:39 PM

Just another aside as I've drifted to other things. I have seen products, again with slight variations but this time under the manufactures name made and to go out to specific chains. Led me to wonder about some of the "if you can find the same product at a rival we will refund..." things you see in stores. If that practice is common, you never will find the idendical product at a rival store!

Jon


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: R!
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 09:46 PM

Kendall, when you mentioned fried bread dough, were you talking about doughboys? That was a breakfast treat my auntie used to make when I was a wee girl. I always thought it was a Rhode Island thing. Anyway, how do you make them?


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Gypsy
Date: 07 Nov 01 - 10:46 PM

They don't do well for gluten free bread. Tried to make it for me gluten intolerant mum, and made excellent bricks. Use a kitchenade for that. Otherwise, having done both make bread (and churn butter at the same time!)and use a bread machine, must say i love my machine. If i take it out after the final kneading, and dump in bowl, and thence to oven, no one knows the difference. Make certain that: it will make a 2 pound loaf (the size of most store boughten bread) and that it has a wheat cycle. Having to reset for stubborn flours, like wheat or rye is a nuisance.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Lyrical Lady
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 01:38 AM

I have made soooo much homemade bread ... at point in my life I put food on the table by selling bread ...made 20 loaves every morning using my Kitchen Aid ... back when they were made by Hobart ..now they are Maytag I believe ... anyhoooo....now I have a Black and Decker bread machine and it makes a decent loaf ... if you find a good bread book, there are some good recipes. I personally find the difference in how the bread tastes depends on the quality of yeast ... the bread machine yeast doesn't do it for me. I prefer to mix my yeast (cake is best) in water and add to the machine (you have to adjust the liquid in the recipe). And remember that salt kills yeast so one has to be very careful when putting ingredients into the machine.

LL


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Homeless
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 09:31 AM

I've had two cheapie bread machines (sorry, don't remember the brands) and each of them wore out after about two years. The first one got to the point the loaf wouldn't come out of the pan (warpage?) and the second one quit cooking the bread fully - it was always very moist.
I don't know what the life expectancy of one of these is, but two years seems short to me. Tho granted in the fall and winter I was making at least one loaf a day, usually whole grains. (and does anyone who works full time and has two young children have time to hand make a loaf of bread every day?)

For me, cost efficiency wasn't a factor. We never eat white bread, and avoid the preservatives when possible. Making my own bread meant I could use flours that usually aren't available as bread in stores like amaranth and quinoa. Also, I did a lot of flavored things like Orange cinnamon bread, Prune bread, Lasagna bread and other strangeties. And the timer was nice too. There's nothing quite like waking up and 10 minutes later biting into a hot slice of Raisin/date/walnut/oatmeal bread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Morticia
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 10:02 AM

Well, I have been thinking of buying one for some months now....but was worried it would end up in the furthermost kitchen cupboard with the rest of the 'helpful' gadgets...but you guys have convinced me it would be worth a go.
mmm1a....are you Irish? I've only known my family refer to the end pieces of bread as the heel before now.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: catspaw49
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 10:07 AM

It's pretty common here Mort. The only other thing I've heard it called is "crust" by some but that always seemed od to me since the loaf is surrounded by crust.......Antway, we call it the heel in this house too.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Greyeyes
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 10:21 AM

This link has comparisons of various machines, while this one has information on making gluten-free bread with a machine.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Greyeyes
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 10:26 AM

Also, the end of the loaf was always referred to as the knob in my family, it was highly prized.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: lamarca
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 11:02 AM

We asked for a bread machine for a wedding gift, and our friends chipped in and got us a Breadman Plus. It makes up to a 2 lb. loaf, vertical with the paddle hole in the bottom. We don't experiment much, but have been using the same oatmeal bread recipe in it for 3-4 years to make sandwich bread. It's a good, basic machine for making good basic loaves (although the square slices are a bit on the large side).

The King Arthur Flour site sells two models - the Breadman TR2200C and the Zojirushi V20 Home Bakery. Both of these are fairly reasonably priced, at $100 and $150, respectively. Consumer Reports made a big deal out of the noisiness of particular models, but that never particularly bothers us with our Breadman.

Another good thing about bread machines is that you can use the machine as a mixer and controlled temperature rising chamber, and then take out the dough, shape it and bake it in a regular oven to get a better crust and more appealing shape. I've used it to mix Italian dough for pizza crust, too (you still have to roll it out, though - I've never learned how to throw it spinning in the air!)


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: GUEST,JohnB
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 12:48 PM

Ours was the cheapest we could get that looked and felt decently made, can't remember the make. It also like Mousethief's walked off the counter. We still use it, although the top falls off now if you let it fall back too far. Like Homeless, we make weird breads with different stuff in them. The currant favourite (pun intended) has sunflower seeds and marmalde in it. My SO. used to make bread by hand two to three times a week but with the rheumatoid arthritis having taken it's toll the machine makes the best bread we have had for years. JohnB


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Lyrical Lady
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 01:40 PM

It's the heel in our house too, but only on a long french type loaf. We call the ends of store bought sliced ... crusts.

LL


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Kim C
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 01:45 PM

Now see, I can bake bread, no problem. I've only ever lost one batch.

I can make pie. I can make plum pudding (and the sauce too). I can't bake a cake from scratch worth a shit, though. Maybe I need that Kitchen Aid!!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Helen
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 05:02 PM

Another bread thread here, with recipes


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Helen
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 05:15 PM

Okay guys. Stop just talking about these great & reliable bread recipes and start posting them in the thread I just linked to - pleeeaaase! Oatmeal, sunflower & marmalade, "Orange cinnamon bread, Prune bread, Lasagna bread and other strangeties" (love that word).

Helen


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: GUEST,Sooz(at work)
Date: 09 Nov 01 - 08:20 AM

I stuff my freezer with home-made bread rolls every week. I use a food processor to mix the dough and real fresh yeast. (Not the dried extra slow stuff). I can have bread rolls out of the oven within one hour of putting the ingredients in the processor. Who needs another machine?


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: mmm1a
Date: 09 Nov 01 - 07:09 PM

Mortcia nope no irish blood here , German on my Moms side and Scottish and sweedish on my Dads. I never knew that the ends of the loaf were called anything else but heels :). Helen I will look up some of my recipes and post them for all most of mine are pretty basic. mmm


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 24 Dec 01 - 08:18 AM

There is a Kenwood bread machine in Allders for 100pounds (reduced from 120).


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: GUEST,Desdemona
Date: 24 Dec 01 - 11:58 AM

I have to agree with Spaw's post above: I wish they'd make one that produced bread that was SHAPED like bread!

We loooooove fresh bread, but with 3 kids under 15, we'd need a machine that made multiple loaves to keep the place supplied! My mum had 4 kids & always made about a dozen loaves at a go, and the idea of one loaf at a time just seems inadequate to me.

On the other hand, the idea of a lovely loaf of fresh bread every morning is not without appeal----I suppose my main concern would be the effect such a thing would have on my butter consumption ;~) !


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: artbrooks
Date: 24 Dec 01 - 01:57 PM

No machine here...the offer has been made and resoundingly rejected. Herself used to bake bread at least weekly, but not since the kids hit their mid-teens and she's been working full-time. Understandable. We tend to call the end of the bread the "kri'-tchick"...Yiddish, I think.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Abuwood
Date: 24 Dec 01 - 04:49 PM

We just had a machine for Christmas, the girls bought it for me so it can't have been that expensive it is a Goodmans. The bread is gorgeous, doesn't have time to get cold in our house and the smell when you get up in the morning is wonderful! My New Years Resolution is to set it every work day and wake up to a proper breakfast using the rest of the loaf for lunchtime sandwiches. It is just the right size for 2 people. Go on take the plunge and enjoy it. They put all sorts of chemicals in bought bread nowadays, whatever the government feel is healthy ingredient of the month, you don't know what you are eating. Cheers Alison


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: gnu
Date: 24 Dec 01 - 05:35 PM

Didn't read the thread. Haven't got time. A friend of mine has tried several brands and says the best is Black & Decker... seriously.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: GUEST,Jenny the T
Date: 10 Jan 02 - 12:59 AM

Me mum does a right fine job. They look like a bum with a knob hot from the oven.


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Jan 02 - 02:31 AM

Okay. A bread maker (with hands) will now weigh in. I thought bread machines were superflouous, and told my Dad so when he told me about his. But I gave him my recipe for whole wheat bread, modified for his machine. Darned if a machine didn't come in the mail the next week, from Dad. We tried it out, I was talking to him on the phone about it, and said "we'll have to get used to the wierd shaped loaves," to which my (now ex) husband shouted from across the room "we're used to it! We're used to it!"

We have several machines in the family that came from (now defunct) DAK. He got his machines from Welbuilt. I think the last place I saw one of those was at Sears (in the US) for about $100. They're great machines, and you can adjust the level of brownness, the type of bread (has a wheat setting), and like one post above said, if you clean the counter or put it on a damp cloth, and make sure it is toward the back of the counter, it'll stay put.

My recipe for whole wheat bread in a three pound machine loaf:

1 tablespoon yeast
3 cups white flour
1 cup whole wheat flour
1/4 cup brown sugar
1 teaspoon salt
2 tablespoons olive oil
1 1/3 cup warm water

Put the yeast in first, then the flour, sugar, and salt. Make kind of a bowl shape in the flour for these and the water, especially if you're going to use a timer setting and let it mix and bake later. Then your yeast will stay dry until it starts mixing.

I use the manual setting a lot, so that it does the work on my dough, then I take it out and shape it. I make rolls and pizza dough in there frequently.

My roll recipe that people request for potluck dinners:

1 tablespoon yeast
3 cups white flour
1/2 cup whole wheat flour
2 tablespoons granulated sugar 1 teaspoon salt
1 egg (warmed to at least room temp.)
3 tablespoons (approx) olive oil (I just pour it in till it looks right)
1 cup warm water
A healthy shake of garlic powder, ~1-2 teaspoons
2 to 3 teaspoons dried oregano, ground in the palm of your hand before dropping it on the dough

I put this in the machine on the manual setting, regular speed or turbo if I'm in a hurry. As you can see by some of my measurements, this is what my ex called "vibration cooking"--you just put the ingredient in until it "feels right." Not a method for novices.

If you make this dough without garlic and oregano, it's wonderful for cinnamon rolls.

My parting shot, the SINGLE biggest reason people of my acquaintance go out and buy bread machines:

Fresh baked bread is about as close to mother's milk for an elemental food as I can think of. The response is an instantaneous lunge for a serrated bread knife and a tub of margarine. Now imagine this: you set the machine up before you go to bed, and set the timer so the loaf will quit baking at the time you get up. (They often cool for as much as 30 minutes with a fan running after they bake. This sometimes leaves them soggy if you let it cool in the machine). You roll out of bed, get to the kitchen to start your tea or coffee just as the bread finishes. Pop it out, let it cool for a couple of minutes, then go get the kids up. It's much easier to get them out of bed when they smell the bread. Their stomachs bring them to the breakfast table. It always works here!

Sorry to go so long--I hope the recipes help. They are for the large 3-pound loaf, but with the exception of the egg, everything measures easily in smaller amounts. For a smaller loaf, figure the standard large egg equals a quarter cup of liquid. Substitute some of the egg for a little of the water. This size loaf also fits a standard size (US) bread pan. Bake at 375 for about 40 minutes if you make it on the manual machine setting, or just make this loaf by hand.

Maggie


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Helen
Date: 10 Jan 02 - 06:32 AM

Thanks for the recipes, Maggie. You're going to start me off on another bread making binge. Just when I got ove the last one.

Oh well, I'm enjoying these great recipes.

Helen


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Terry K
Date: 10 Jan 02 - 10:26 AM

Yep, just got the latest Panasonic. Fantastic, it makes bread-shaped bread (unlike the weird shape the old model makes) and is a success every time. (Nearly - my attempt at onion bread refused to rise). I've generally stuck to the standard loaves so far and the 50% wholewheat is to die for. And you really wouldn't have got me eating wholewheat without good reason. A revelation!

Cheers, Terry


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Subject: RE: BS: Absolute BS - Bread-Makers
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Jan 02 - 11:10 AM

I should note that in the above recipe I use water instead of warm milk in my roll dough because we have dairy allergies. In many cases I think it improves bread to not use milk. But the original recipe calls for it. I often add a couple of tablespoons of dry soy milk to the mix then add the water when milk is called for.


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Mudcat time: 18 October 3:44 AM EDT

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