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BS: credit cards
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Subject: credit cards From: 53 Date: 09 Nov 01 - 09:36 PM do credit cards pose a problem in your wallet, or are they just there for looks? BOB |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: CarolC Date: 09 Nov 01 - 09:40 PM They're handy as a second form of ID for times when I want to pay with a check in stores that require 2 IDs, but I don't use them for anything other than that. They charge too much interest. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Date: 09 Nov 01 - 09:43 PM Hi BOB, my advice is don't get a credit card.A few years ago I had one, when I had a good job in a casino, I found out that if you don't pay the bill on time they are really expensive, I think it is better to save up for what you want and pay for it in cash. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: katlaughing Date: 09 Nov 01 - 10:04 PM After almost 20 years without any, paying everything by cash, we have two. We keep them for emergencies and/or to reserve motel rooms. We are very careful with them and neither of us charges anything with talking it over with the other. I like the security of having them in case of emergencies, mostly, kind of like my cellphone, that's the only reason I have it, too. We also pay much more than the minimum each month, so that we keep them paid off pretty much all of the time. I have seen too many people get into trouble with them, to risk that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: GUEST Date: 09 Nov 01 - 10:21 PM testing Testing Testing Testing Testing Testing |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: GUEST Date: 09 Nov 01 - 10:22 PM This concludes my test. Now back to your regularly scheduled thread. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Shall Date: 09 Nov 01 - 10:37 PM I find that you need a credit card for car rentals. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 09 Nov 01 - 10:55 PM credit cards do provide for an emergency and they are good to have for that, at times i would have been in a mess if i didn't have acredit card, i wonder what the most popular one is, MC VISA or DISCOVER or AMEX we have 3 of the 4 and they have been lifesavers. BOB |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Gypsy Date: 09 Nov 01 - 11:09 PM We use them as 30 day loans to ourselves, and never carry a balance. The handsome mando player uses a debit card exclusively. These days, just TRY to write a check when out of town! |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: kendall Date: 10 Nov 01 - 05:49 AM I got one 20 years ago because you can not rent a car without one. I never carry a balance, and have never paid interest. I see them as an emergency tool only, although, one month I paid everything by CC and was amazed at how much money I spent that month! Lucky it was less than my income. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Mike Byers Date: 10 Nov 01 - 07:13 AM Credit cards are handy and useful, so long as you can keep them under control. I use Gypsy's approach, which helps make up for the low interest rate my bank pays on savings. My dad has gone a step further with this: he has an account with an outfit that automatically pays off his credit card balance the day it's due, thus maximizing the "loan" without paying interest. But keeping credit cards under control is the trick, and many credit card companies charge not only interest but a late payment fee as well. It's also common for companies to chare two months interest on a one-month balance, so you have to be sure you always pay the balance on time. Between us, my wife and I get around 30 offers for credit cards every month, and this leads me to believe that there's lots of money to be made in this business. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 10 Nov 01 - 10:09 AM good answers, we try to keep our balances paid each month also , but there are times we have to carry a small balance. BOB |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Ma-K Date: 10 Nov 01 - 11:55 AM We use credit cards for air plane tickets and a FEW other things Always pay all of it every month. We never charge more than we know we can pay in one month. Credit cards make good picks.....Mary |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Hollowfox Date: 10 Nov 01 - 11:57 AM I have one for emergencies and unforseens, through my credit union. I use it at least once a year, just to keep it active, and pay it off promptly. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Uncle_DaveO Date: 10 Nov 01 - 02:26 PM My (almost) only use for a credit card is when ordering merchandise out of town, especially for my small business. I ask the person I'm dealing with for the amount the invoice will be. I then immediately get to the computer and pay that amount to the credit card company. For some reason I dislike writing a physical check, so I use CheckFree for almost all bills. Ordering by CC and paying electronically immediately avoids hassle of the physical checkwriting process, the cost of stamps and envelopes, the delay in the mail (and possibly clearing of the check before they are willing to ship). Dave Oesterreich |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: JohnInKansas Date: 10 Nov 01 - 03:31 PM For a good number of years I kept a couple of credit cards because my employer(s) demanded that I do so. They are necessary to "post" as a deposit for both hotel/motel rooms and auto rentals. I continue to keep one card for use in ordering things - especially over the internet, but occasionally by telephone. It is virtually impossible to do business without one. The concern I have about them is the recent "rewriting" of their terms to: 1. Require that no payment is "on time" unless accompanied by their statement for that payment. 2. Charge exhorbitant "late fees" for any payment not made "on time" AND "accompanied by the proper statement." 3. Increase rates to outrageous rates if any payments are "late." A year or so ago, on three consecutive payments, I mailed my payments within 3 days of receiving the statements, and each of the 3 payements was charged a "late fee" (of $30 in this case). It did not matter that in each of these "billing periods" they posted payemts of 5 times the "minimum due." By controlling the mailing date (bulk mail with no postmark) and by using an artificial "preprinted" mailing date on the statement, THEY have total control over whether you CAN pay "on time." And this company was using delayed mailing to artificially inflate their return. In this case, the additional $30 "late fee" made their effective return on my account about 15% (annual rate).
In addition, they attempted to increase their interest rate, based on "late payments" from the original 9% to 34.9%. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Ed. Date: 10 Nov 01 - 04:20 PM The big problem is when (although you promised yourself to use them properly), you lose your job, bills start stacking up etc... Too easy to become half ruined. I no longer have any. And hope I never do again. Ed
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Amos Date: 10 Nov 01 - 06:09 PM Used them for years; we just subtract them from the checking account so we never run over funds on hand. The only discipline they require is to never carry debt on them, as they are usurous. And never use one that charges an annual fee. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Gypsy Date: 10 Nov 01 - 08:33 PM Call them up, John. Have had late fees imposed on me 3 times, each time because the bill was sent 5 days before the due date, leaving no mailing time to send back. Each time, i called, and requested that they remove the fee, and they did. If they didn't, i would certainly cancel the card. That will work on membership fees, as well. If you carry a balance, you can negotiate the APR in many cases, too. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: JohnInKansas Date: 10 Nov 01 - 09:55 PM Gypsy: I'm well aware that you can do all kinds of negotiating with them, but a contract is a contract, and they don't have to negotiate once they have created the "fiction" that you have accepted their rules. What do you do if they suddenly decide not to be "nice guys" anymore - and start billing you that 35% (or more) interest rate? Why would they put this language into their "contract" if they never intend to use it? John |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: kendall Date: 10 Nov 01 - 10:03 PM I wonder how many of these companies are run by democrats? |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: GUEST,Fortunato Date: 11 Nov 01 - 09:37 AM Credit Cards are like Casinos, if you think you're going to win, sucker, you're an imbecile. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Grab Date: 11 Nov 01 - 05:50 PM John, yes a contract is a contract, but you can back out any time, the same way they can. You pay your last payment off, that's it. They decide to arbitrarily change terms (eg. interest rate), it's entirely up to you whether you keep it or not. Graham. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: JohnInKansas Date: 11 Nov 01 - 06:37 PM Grab Those of us who are able to keep things under control can usually back out. The hook there is that you have to pay off the balance to get out of the contract. If they've posted that your interest rate has been tripled, because you were "late" with payments - will you be able to find the money to pay off anything more than a modest balance. (They won't mention that they prevented you from making the payments on time.) People do use their credit cards for emergencies. The expectation - and usually the reality - is that they can and will pay them off. It is not always realistic to pay them off instantly, otherwise - it wasn't an emergency. And where does their right to "punish" you come from - with "punitive" late charges that have no relation to any real cost to them, and with "punitive" interest rates that have no relation to the money market. If a person is having real trouble with the the typical "2% of balance" minimum payment, how would a 36% annual rate (3%/month-roughly in interest alone) make it more likely the debt could be resolved. "It doesn't matter because it doesn't hurt me" is not a very satisfying attitude, when there is the real possiblity that a lot of people could be injured. But then I worry too much - sometimes even about others. John |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 11 Nov 01 - 06:43 PM you just have to be careful and read the fine print. BOB |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Gypsy Date: 11 Nov 01 - 07:58 PM John, the power of saying, "Negotiate, or cram it" is awesome. There are a bezillion companies waiting for you to transfer balance, with incentive. Don't let the b-----ds get you down. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: gnomad Date: 12 Nov 01 - 12:30 PM Interesting to read of the deliberate mailing delays, that's one I've not come across before, despite nearly 30 yaers working in UK banking. I would suggest that no reputable company would (or should) try it here, but that if they did any victim should (1) take it up thru the appropriate authorities, who WOULD be interested and (2) get a card from another firm, they are falling over themselves to offer good balance transfer terms. On cards in general I have one (only) which I use as a means of settlement for remote transactions, or to pay for items costing more than I happily carry in cash. The trick as I see it is always to clear the acc monthly, any borrowing requirement can almost certainly be met more cheaply elsewhere. On the whole use cash wherever possible, it's so much easier to keep track. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 12 Nov 01 - 09:09 PM i have a texaco gas card and i buy my gas from the same place and i always put in on my card and when the bill comes in i always pay it off in full each month, so far i've had the card for 5 years and never paid 1 dime in interest, it's just easier to use than cash or check, so you can just write 1 check a month for your gas bill. BOB |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Date: 12 Nov 01 - 09:36 PM I think banks are a big rip off, I keep all my money in a big box under my bed.john |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 12 Nov 01 - 09:39 PM i need to get a big box. BOB |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Gypsy Date: 12 Nov 01 - 10:26 PM Where's your bed John? |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 13 Nov 01 - 11:27 AM what does a bed have to do with creditcards? oh i get it you can find his pot of treasure under his bed. BOB |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Celtic Soul Date: 13 Nov 01 - 12:28 PM If the idea of revolving credit (Credit Cards or Lines of Credit) scares you, you *could* try a charge card. The difference being that a charge card requires you pay the *entire balance* the following month. In this scenario, the onus is upon you, the consumer, to police your own spending. Should you not pay off the charged amount, they hit you with interest and fees (which *can* be worse than many Credit Cards), so you have to be careful not to overdo. As an example, traditional American Express cards are "Charge cards", not "Credit Cards". With Credit Cards, again, the idea is that the onus is upon the consumer to police his or her own spending. Again, there is the interest to consider. Some credit cards seem a really sweet deal, but read the fine print. Many offer astoundingly low rates for a term, and then jack you up to the ceiling (usually once you've already spent some huge sum, and are hooked in). Here in the states, what with prime having been shaved *yet another* half point last week, the interest that some credit cards are charging is outrageous. Be careful. The other option is a debit card, which will bear the Visa or MasterCard logo, and which can be used anywhere they are accepted, but which takes the funds directly from a checking without charging you interest for the purchase. These walk like a credit card, talk like a credit card, and are *processed* through the very same system as credit cards, but won't wind up costing you hundreds extra in interest. The catch is, you have to have the cash in your account at the time you make the purchase. Another catch is, if you *reserve* a car/hotel room with it, it *will* freeze those funds for a term, which means you will not have access to them until the hold is pulled off (usually, this occurs a day or so after some other method of payment is used to pay off the purchase, or the "reserve" is rescinded). I have counseled many a client to treat their Debit Card as if it *were* a Credit Card by making regular payments into the account as if it was owed. In the long run (especially if the checking account is interest bearing), you could wind up with more money rather than less (paid out in interest), and still have the access to a "Credit Card" for those instances when one is necessary. As a side note, if ever your Debit Card will not work as an ATM (to draw funds from an ATM, or at a POS (point of sale) transaction), try using it as a Credit Card. The 2 are processed through entirely different systems, and so, if one is down, the other likely will not be, and even if it is, most stores can process a Credit Card purchase even if the system is down. It allows you a greater amount of freedom than an ATM card alone does. Another benefit is that, nowadays, you are protected by the same insurances that protect Credit Cards (through the Visa or MasterCard agreements). If unauthorized purchases are made, contest them. You may be held liable for a portion of the funds, but it will not be the entirety. I personally prefer the Debit Card. I don't like to use money I don't have, and my Debit Card can be used for reserving flights, reserving car rentals, or at stores that do not offer POS (point of sale) purchases with ATM cards, and I skip the interest altogether. I pay only for the purchase itself. Uh, yes, I'm in banking...is it obvious? ;D |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: JohnInKansas Date: 13 Nov 01 - 05:38 PM I think everybody's missed my point. I don't have any particular problems with my credit cards. I have noted that every card I have, every card that I have gotten rid of, and every card soliciation I recieve in the mail (usually about 8 per week) has changed their terms, to increase "late payment penalties," to increase potential interest rates to outrageous levels, and to impose these things for conditions that they, not you, can control. I'm particularly offended that they try to paint their "reason" as though it's the card holders' fault for something that is within the card issuer's control. I don't think many of those who have replied have actually read the "fine print," as there seem to be few who comprehend what I'm talking about. I'm not scared. I'm just disgusted (with the card companies). John |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: GUEST Date: 13 Nov 01 - 06:01 PM They're a great tool for people with discipline, a terrible tool for those without. Ever mindful of the temptation to buy something I don't have the cash for, like a new Martin D-45 or a Porsche, I use a credit card to buy everything else: gas, groceries...anywhere and everywhere they'll let me use it. At the end of the month, I pay off the balance, which, barring unforseen expenses, is the sum total of necessary things I would've had to pay for throughout the month anyway (I've done a budget long enough to know what I can and can't afford in a monthly period. Plus if you save all the receipts you know what you've spent at any given time in a month). With Discover, you get a cash-back bonus at the end of the year based on your charges (a pittance, admittedly) so I figure, perhaps inaccurately, that Novus is paying me for using their card for expenses I would have normally incurred (at least I get to delude myself with warm fuzzies for thinking that I'm screwing them instead of the other way around). I write one check at the end of the month, don't have to flash cash and expose myself as a walking ATM machine to some enterprising young criminal, and I use the cash-back bonus as a flimsy hedge against inflation (if you figure in the bonus you are paying 99 and 8/10 centavos for something that cost a dollar). Plus it's great training for the day when the new and improved New World Order kicks into high gear. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: CamiSu Date: 13 Nov 01 - 06:03 PM I have one card I use for Wavestar's education. It is so much easier than trying to send funds overseas. I just noticed that my interest rate has gone down markedly this last month. The other card I have, I try to pay off every month. I have gotten into trouble before. And while some companies are reasonable, some are definitely NOT! I am shucking cards as fast as I can with the exception of these two. Ironic as I am working on being able to take cards for my sales. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Terry K Date: 14 Nov 01 - 08:35 AM Unless I've not read carefully enough, no-one has mentioned one of the biggest single advantages of credit cards. It is simply that the credit card company is in partnership with the retailer, hence has joint and several liability. Thus if anything goes wrong with the transaction (e.g. faulty goods/retailer gone bankrupt) the card company has to take over the responsibility. It's the safest way to shop. Cheers, Terry |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Gypsy Date: 14 Nov 01 - 11:34 AM That's right, Terry. and, yes, I DO read the fine print. And check my statement each time it comes in. That's why i know how to argue with the companies when i think they have done something that i don't approve of. The problem i see most often is complancency on the part of the consumer. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Date: 14 Nov 01 - 07:13 PM Terry works for a credit card company! (I think) |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Gareth Date: 14 Nov 01 - 07:22 PM NO john from hull - it could mean that Terry works in a consumer rights, or trading standards organisation. By the way, the advantage of using my plastic over the border means I don't have to wade through a mass of Welsh when the first screen comes up on the ATM. Does anybody know the actuall figure for those who opt for the Welsh Screen on ATM's, unofficially the Electricity Company in South Wales has had Six (6) requests for accounts in Welsh, out of roughly 300,000 Gareth |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 14 Nov 01 - 09:24 PM a credit is just a good tool to have when you need it and you never know when that will be. BOB |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Celtic Soul Date: 14 Nov 01 - 10:20 PM John in Kansas wrote: "I think everybody's missed my point". John? are you the same person as 53? If so, you're right, I missed the point when I read the initial posting. I just slipped into bankerese and rattled off. If such is the case, sorry hon...I surely must have missed something in the read.
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Terry K Date: 15 Nov 01 - 01:51 AM Terry doesn't work for a credit card company, nor in any other of those things! I'm just a consumer who wants the best financial protections I can get. The credit card companies absolutely HATE the fact that they are considered in partnership with the retailer because it costs/can cost them loads of dosh if/when things go wrong. Cheers, Terry |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: GUEST Date: 16 Jan 02 - 01:02 AM . |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 16 Jan 02 - 03:10 PM iguess that i need to pay mine off, so they won't be left glenda to pay. BOB |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Date: 15 Oct 02 - 12:40 AM i still think banks are a big rip off.john |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: GUEST Date: 15 Oct 02 - 11:10 PM Make your own legal tender the state should not have the only monopoly so why not trade and barter and avoid the taxes no one needs credit then other than his word and a man is only as good as his word is not before the law or the state but before his fellow man who knows him best for his honor |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: KingBrilliant Date: 16 Oct 02 - 07:39 AM Coming home over-slaked one night I dropped my purse into next door's garden (funny enough they didn't know our surname after 15 years despite we chat all the time) - anyway........ I spent my sunday hangover trying to get through to the "lost card" call centre. Didn't get throught til monday. NOT impressed. Luckily next door mentioned the purse in the pub & they knew instantly which drunk it belonged to - but I cancelled the card after that & won't be getting another. I am really bad with cards & am on my 10th issue of my switch card (for which you have to go into the bank & get them to start the numbering at one again). Kris |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 16 Oct 02 - 09:22 AM I didn't refresh this one. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: 53 Date: 16 Oct 02 - 10:51 AM Credit cards are a good thing to have if you know how to use them. |
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Subject: RE: BS: credit cards From: JudeL Date: 17 Oct 02 - 08:22 AM I don't know if it operates differently in the US but in the UK banks and creditcard companies cannot just change the rules on you without notice, in this country that is illegal. I have both a credit card and a debit card, and have had for a least 15 years. The debit card I use in a similar way that I used to use a check book with a guarantee card. I don't tend to carry much cash around as I found that I would spend cash much quicker and with much less awareness of where I'd spent it, then end up wondering where it all went. With cards I am much more disciplined. Both my cards are from the same bank and they have the facility that I can get info or transfer funds using a phone banking service as well as their branches on the high street. The due date for the credit card is the same day of the month each month, and in case I forget (my memory is not always that good for stuff like this) I have a direct debit set up on my current (checking) account so that the credit card company will recieve the minimum payment due before I incur any late charges if I don't pay it off first either in part or in full. Find yourself a good company (on average I get about one a week offering me a new account with zero interest on balance transfers for 6 months) - that don't mess you about, and if a company does treat you unfairly report them to whatever is the American equivalent of Trading Standards, and also to consumer programs which broadcast cases of bad practice by companies which the public then know to avoid. |