Hymn Detectives:Origins?

Subject: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: John E
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 03:26 PM

I am seeking information re: the origins of some common Christmas carols. They are: Joy To The World, O Little Town Of Bethlehem, Silent Night. I've been able to find out some on each of these in the Cyberhymnal and a few other micronuggets from other more or less reliable sources. The DT is a bit short on source info. ALSO, anyone besides me know this one: "The Merry, Merry Christmas Bells"? It goes "Oh hear them ring, those merry, merry Christmas bells, the merry, merry bells, the ringing of the Christmas bells. There's more to it, but that's the chorus, and I'm beginning to think it's a local wonder. P.S. Thanks, Susan for your help.

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 03:32 PM

REAL History of "Silent Night"

Spaw

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 03:37 PM

More on Silent Night as well as everything else you need is on THIS WEBSITE (scroll down a bit)

Spaw

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: MMario
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 03:49 PM

re: Joy to the World: from this Handel FAQ

"Joy to the World was not composed by Handel. The tune first appeared in the early 1830's in English tune-books. William Holford revised the tune and published it (which he called Comfort) in the mid-1830's and attributed it to Handel because of the tunes' resemblence to the opening phrases of the choruses Lift Up Your Heads and Glory to God from Messiah. The American composer Lowell Mason (1792-1872) in 1839 retained the attribution to Handel, changed the tune-name to Antioch, and united it with Isaac Watt's hymn [i.e., text] for the first time. Thus, Joy to the World was born. "

see here for Silent Night

and re: O little town...

"Phillips Brooks was born in 1835. He began serving Holy Trinity Church in the City of Brotherly Love, at the age of 24. He was an Episcopalian Priest. In 1865, he went on a trip to the Holy Lands - visiting Bethlehem on Christmas Eve, riding there on horseback. As he prepared his Christmas service for 1868, Phillips recalled his trip three years earlier and penned a 5 stanza poem which we know as O Little Town of Bethlehem. The poem was written especially with the children of the parish in mind.

The day after he wrote this poem, Phillips handed it to Mr. Lewis Redner, the Church Organist and Sunday School Superintendent and requested him to write the music for it. Rev. Brooks said, "If it is a good tune, I will name it "St. Lewis' after you." Thirty six children first sang this song on December 27, 1868."

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 03:53 PM

Joy To The World- Words, Isaac Watts, 1719, Songs of David Imitated in the Language of the New testament. Music?

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 03:55 PM

Joy to the World- music supposedly from the old tune Antioch. Nothing in Handel like it.

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 03:59 PM

"Based" on some of Handels' works.

HEY GUYS.....Click on that website I linked and you'll see it's both pretty thorough and accurate.

Spaw

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: MMario
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 04:35 PM

nice site 'spaw. (one of the few you've ever linked to that got through the filter. I'm amazed!)

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 05:00 PM

The tune Antioch has been traced to 1820's England. Thomas Hawkes Collection of Tunes, pub 1833, has it. This is the tune to Joy To The World.

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: John E
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 08:56 AM

Thanks folks. 'specialy like that spot, 'Spaw

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 10:40 AM

SJ, did you get the PM I sent in reply to yours?

~S~

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 11:41 AM

A lot of fluff and myths have been spread about the origin of "Silent Night" since its creation. The power of the Internet has increased the flow of both fact and myth. Some of the stories are cute. They just aren't exactly true. In this essay, you will hopefully find the facts concerning the origin of this great carol of Christmas and the proofs that show its true authorship.--Bill Drennon

The above quote is from the Central Valley Christian School which has a lot of good information about the histories of various carols here.

Here is another site, Montrose Music, which has several Christmas Carol histories.

I'm always looking for the histories of carols and hymns, so if anyone has any more sites please post them. It seems that there are books written about this topic, but free info is hard to find. Then, because this is the Internet, you really want to check your sources.

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 15 Nov 01 - 11:53 AM

oops Spaw, I didn't check you second link before I posted! Go ahead, chastise me! (I was going to say something else, but thought better of it.)

Subject: RE: Help: Hymn Detectives:Origins?
From: Burke
Date: 16 Nov 01 - 12:05 PM

Here's some additional information on O Little Town of Bethlehem.

I understand that while in the US we use Redner's original tune, in England "Forest Green" is more widely used.