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Cornish Songs

In Mudcat MIDIs:
Trelawny


22 Feb 98 - 06:34 PM
Alice 23 Feb 98 - 12:32 AM
Wolfgang 23 Feb 98 - 07:00 AM
Jon W. 23 Feb 98 - 11:05 AM
Joe Offer 23 Feb 98 - 04:12 PM
Cliff 23 Feb 98 - 09:45 PM
John in Brisbane 06 Dec 99 - 08:11 PM
John in Brisbane 06 Dec 99 - 10:24 PM
alison 07 Dec 99 - 02:36 AM
Mountain Dog 07 Dec 99 - 09:01 AM
Margaret\W 07 Dec 99 - 12:07 PM
Wotcha 08 Dec 99 - 11:47 AM
GUEST,ianmarshall@sparticus.net 06 Jan 01 - 01:02 PM
GUEST,Mark. West Sussex. UK 06 Jan 01 - 02:56 PM
Wotcha 06 Jan 01 - 10:38 PM
John Wood 07 Jan 01 - 02:15 PM
Greyeyes 07 Jan 01 - 04:49 PM
paddymac 07 Jan 01 - 10:16 PM
GUEST,leeneia 08 Jan 01 - 11:13 AM
Malcolm Douglas 08 Jan 01 - 03:49 PM
GUEST 08 Jan 01 - 06:11 PM
GUEST,Kernow Jon 09 Jan 01 - 05:49 PM
GUEST,Kernow Jon 09 Jan 01 - 05:51 PM
Jim Dixon 09 Jan 01 - 08:03 PM
GUEST,leeneia 10 Jan 01 - 09:36 AM
GUEST,Dexter 13 Jun 04 - 04:28 AM
John MacKenzie 13 Jun 04 - 04:51 AM
Big Al Whittle 13 Jun 04 - 05:50 AM
Herga Kitty 13 Jun 04 - 06:24 AM
John MacKenzie 13 Jun 04 - 06:30 AM
Marion in Cornwall 13 Jun 04 - 09:01 AM
GUEST,Richard 13 Jun 04 - 09:10 AM
Mary Humphreys 13 Jun 04 - 11:56 AM
Herga Kitty 13 Jun 04 - 12:56 PM
Herga Kitty 13 Jun 04 - 01:03 PM
Joybell 13 Jun 04 - 06:40 PM
GUEST,Mingulay 14 Jun 04 - 10:05 AM
Marion in Cornwall 14 Jun 04 - 12:26 PM
MikeofNorthumbria 14 Jun 04 - 12:52 PM
Herga Kitty 14 Jun 04 - 02:36 PM
Jeanie 14 Jun 04 - 03:47 PM
Big Al Whittle 14 Jun 04 - 06:43 PM
GUEST,Cats at Work 15 Jun 04 - 04:38 AM
GUEST,Mingulay 15 Jun 04 - 08:35 AM
GUEST,kevin in northumberland 29 Jan 05 - 08:45 PM
LadyJean 29 Jan 05 - 10:40 PM
hilda fish 29 Jan 05 - 11:02 PM
Keith A of Hertford 30 Jan 05 - 06:04 AM
John P 30 Jan 05 - 08:38 AM
GUEST,Guest 30 Jan 05 - 09:23 AM
Flash Company 30 Jan 05 - 10:12 AM
breezy 30 Jan 05 - 11:44 AM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 30 Jan 05 - 11:51 AM
Mr Happy 30 Jan 05 - 12:49 PM
hilda fish 30 Jan 05 - 07:58 PM
Malcolm Douglas 30 Jan 05 - 08:39 PM
Mick Tems 30 Jan 05 - 09:30 PM
hilda fish 31 Jan 05 - 12:41 AM
GUEST,Mingulay at work 31 Jan 05 - 04:11 AM
robinia 31 Jan 05 - 08:09 AM
Bat Goddess 31 Jan 05 - 10:50 AM
GUEST,MMario 31 Jan 05 - 11:26 AM
Cats 31 Jan 05 - 12:04 PM
GUEST,Bob Coltman 31 Jan 05 - 12:10 PM
Snuffy 31 Jan 05 - 07:33 PM
robinia 01 Feb 05 - 01:03 AM
Marion in Cornwall 01 Feb 05 - 04:10 AM
Snuffy 01 Feb 05 - 08:55 AM
GUEST,Bob Coltman 01 Feb 05 - 05:09 PM
Snuffy 01 Feb 05 - 07:40 PM
GUEST,Padstow Pete 02 Feb 05 - 10:20 AM
Cats 02 Feb 05 - 04:34 PM
GUEST,Com Seangan 02 Feb 05 - 07:43 PM
Hawker 02 Feb 05 - 08:18 PM
GUEST,Padstow Pete 02 Feb 05 - 11:53 PM
Snuffy 03 Feb 05 - 08:41 AM
Hawker 03 Feb 05 - 12:22 PM
Snuffy 04 Feb 05 - 08:17 AM
Tradsinger 04 Feb 05 - 02:46 PM
GUEST,Onlooker 04 Feb 05 - 04:13 PM
GUEST,Colin Roberts 07 Feb 05 - 05:19 AM
Mary Humphreys 07 Feb 05 - 05:41 PM
BB 08 Feb 05 - 02:19 PM
Cats 08 Feb 05 - 06:20 PM
GUEST 15 Feb 05 - 07:23 PM
GUEST,Rene 28 May 05 - 03:20 PM
Sue the Borderer 31 May 05 - 06:12 PM
GUEST,cornish man ooooaaaarrrrr 27 Jan 06 - 02:43 PM
Cats 27 Jan 06 - 03:00 PM
breezy 27 Jan 06 - 07:33 PM
breezy 27 Jan 06 - 07:34 PM
breezy 27 Jan 06 - 07:42 PM
Lady Nancy 28 Jan 06 - 07:41 AM
BB 28 Jan 06 - 01:14 PM
GUEST,Jim 25 Mar 08 - 08:32 AM
GUEST,Phil Beer 25 Mar 08 - 09:00 AM
kimsky 25 Mar 08 - 09:13 AM
thimblerigg 25 Mar 08 - 10:16 AM
Celtaddict 25 Mar 08 - 04:28 PM
Leadfingers 25 Mar 08 - 04:33 PM
Hawker 25 Mar 08 - 08:30 PM
GUEST,Jo W 05 Sep 08 - 11:26 AM
Hawker 05 Sep 08 - 07:22 PM
Crowdercref 06 Sep 08 - 04:21 AM
GUEST,frank 21 Nov 08 - 01:03 PM
Cats 21 Nov 08 - 11:12 PM
GUEST,dizzyLisa 22 Nov 08 - 05:40 PM
GUEST,David Jones, Guest 22 Nov 08 - 10:27 PM
alanabit 23 Nov 08 - 03:27 AM
Cats 23 Nov 08 - 01:18 PM
Hawker 23 Nov 08 - 07:29 PM
GUEST,John from Elsie`s Band 25 Nov 08 - 09:52 AM
GUEST,Cornish 09 Jan 09 - 11:48 AM
greg stephens 09 Jan 09 - 12:26 PM
breezy 09 Jan 09 - 01:36 PM
GUEST,frank 25 Jan 09 - 07:17 AM
GUEST,doc.tom 25 Jan 09 - 07:21 AM
GUEST 01 Mar 09 - 10:44 AM
GUEST 17 Dec 09 - 03:37 PM
open mike 18 Dec 09 - 12:49 PM
GUEST,Sue White 26 Sep 10 - 11:18 AM
GUEST,Sue White 26 Sep 10 - 12:29 PM
GUEST,Sue White 26 Sep 10 - 12:42 PM
I don't know 27 Sep 10 - 06:20 AM
GUEST,Ian Cook 17 Oct 10 - 07:10 PM
Desert Dancer 18 Oct 10 - 11:10 AM
John Foxen 18 Oct 10 - 01:58 PM
GUEST,Frank Siegle 25 Feb 11 - 12:16 AM
scouse 25 Feb 11 - 05:28 AM
Cats 25 Feb 11 - 09:05 AM
Hawker 25 Feb 11 - 10:20 AM
GUEST,Lanreath Film and Recording Studio 21 Nov 11 - 12:22 PM
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Subject: CORNISH SONGS
From:
Date: 22 Feb 98 - 06:34 PM

I've posted a couple of Cornish songs recently Jan Knuckey and the Bellringer and have quite a few more. While they may not all be Cornish they are versions sung here and like all races we do claim them. But the point of my message is, is there an interest out there for these songs and tunes?

Regards
BAZ


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Alice
Date: 23 Feb 98 - 12:32 AM

yes.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Wolfgang
Date: 23 Feb 98 - 07:00 AM

yes


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Jon W.
Date: 23 Feb 98 - 11:05 AM

Absolutly.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Joe Offer
Date: 23 Feb 98 - 04:12 PM

Well, everybody around here knows how much I like corny songs.
What's that you say? Cornish?
Well, that, too.
Seriously, Baz, we'd sure like to see them.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Cliff
Date: 23 Feb 98 - 09:45 PM

Yes Please! And thank You. Also try a singer by the name of Jim Wearne who sings Cornish material only and has a couple of cassettes available. His webpage can be found at: http://www.chaven.com/users/coram/default.html


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 08:11 PM

Well there are a number of songs in the DT that are missing their tunes that are claimed to be Cornish in Peter Kennedy's Folksongs of Ireland and England. With assistance from Alison they'll be at MUDI in a little while.

Cambourne Hill
Cornish May Day Carol
Come And I will Sing You
The (Sweet) Nightingale

I'll do some work on:
Jowan Bon/John The Bone (Not in DT)
Trelawny - This looks like a great song (Not in DT)
The Tree On The Hill - A variant of Rattlin Bog

The other Cornish songs in the DT c/w lyrics and tune are:
Cornish Wassail
It Rains It Hails and Snows and Blows
The Holly Bears a Berry Hal An Tow Where Are You Going To My Pretty Maid

Regards, John


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Subject: Lyr Add: TRELAWNY (in Cornish and English)
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 06 Dec 99 - 10:24 PM

Here's Trelawny in both languages. With Alison's help the tune will be at MUDI in due course. Regards, John


TRELAWNY

1 Gans cledha da yn dorn yu lei
Gwyr, lowen an golon
Yth aswon Myghtern Jamys fel
Pandr' wrello Kernewon
Yu ordnys Ie ha prys ancow?
Trelawny dos dh'y fyn?
Mes ugans myl an dus Kernow
Gothfos an praga 'vyn
A vew Trelawny bras?
'Verow Trelawny bras?
Otomma ugans myl Kernow
A woffyth oil an cos

2 Yn meth an Capten, bew y wos
Gwas jolyf yn mysk cans
Tour Loundres kyn fe Carrek Los
Y'n dylerfsen dewhans
Ny a dres Tamar, tyr dhe dyr
By 'ny vyth Havren let
Ha scoth ryp scoth, cowetha gwyr
Pyu orthyn-ny a set?

3 Devedhys bys yn Fos Loundres
Gwel dek dhyn, ny a gry
Deugh mes, ownegyon oil, deugh mes
Gwell on. agesough-why
Trelawny yu avel felon
Fast yn cargharow tyn
Mes ugans myl a Gernewon
Gothfos an ken a vyn


1 A good sword and a trusty hand
A merry heart and true
King James's men shall understand
What Cornish men can do
And have they fixed the where and when?
And shall Trelawny die?
Here's twenty thousand Cornishmen
Will know the reason why
And shall Trelawny live?
Or shall Trelawny die?
Here's twenty thousand Cornishmen
Will know the reason why

2 Out spake the captain brave and bold
A merry wight was he
Though London Tower were Michael's hold
We'll set Trelawny free
We'll cross the Tamar, land to land
The Severn is no stay
Then one and all and hand in hand
And who shall bid us nay?

3 And when we come to London wall
A pleasant sight to view
Come forth, come forth, ye cowards all
Here are better men than you
Trelawny he's in keep in hold
Trelawny he may die
But twenty thousand Cornish bold
Will know the reason why


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Subject: Tunes add: CORNISH SONGS
From: alison
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 02:36 AM

Hi,

Most of the above tunes(thanks to John's MIDIs) are now available at Mudcat MIDIs

I have decided just to post them as MIDIs, not as MIDItxt.... if anyone really wants ABC for any tunes I post let me know and I'll post it.

slainte

alison


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Mountain Dog
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 09:01 AM

Dear Baz:

Thanks very much for the Cornish tunes! My wife and I have just returned from a seven and a half month sojourn in Cornwall (doing research for a variety of freelance writing projects on the subject of Sacred Beauty in Nature) and heartily enjoyed our stay. Most of all, we fell in love with the land and the Cornish people.

We had the pleasure of hearing concerts by an outstanding Cornish male voice choir as well as catching a wide variety of solo and ensemble folk artists in pub venues throughout the county.

So, the more Cornish music you can share with us, the better, in my book!

Many thanks for your contributions.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Margaret\W
Date: 07 Dec 99 - 12:07 PM

There's a Cornish Christmas carol, set by Peter Warlock earlier this century; I have a recording but no words/dots. It's worth checking out if anyone's keen.

Margaret


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Wotcha
Date: 08 Dec 99 - 11:47 AM

BAZ,

You know I like them all ! Cheers, Brian


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,ianmarshall@sparticus.net
Date: 06 Jan 01 - 01:02 PM

Hi!

Checked your site today - bravo!

Please tell everyone I am producing a CD this month called "21 SONGS OF CORNWALL!"

It`s a comprehensive collection of real TRADITIONAL stuff, none of yer Celtic revival mush, and as I`m the only singer actually IN Cornwall who`s seriously recorded this kind of material, I`d love everyone to know about it - and buy it!?

It would be nice to chat to anyone - yourself included - via e-mail as above (ianmarshall@sparticus.net OR cornwallsong@supanet.com.) I can tell them when the CD is finally issued, and how to order.

ALSO visit my temporary website for more detail: www.cornwallsong.supanet.com

Great to meet you! Love to all. Kernow bys vyken.

Ian Marshall (24, Trevecca, Liskeard, Cornwall PL14 6RH)


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Mark. West Sussex. UK
Date: 06 Jan 01 - 02:56 PM

Peter Kennedy's "Folk Songs of Britain and Ireland" has about 12 Cornish Songs with music and translation. Also Scottish Gaelic, Irish Gaelic, Welsh, Manx, Channel Islands and Romany. Also about 500 pages of songs in English. Weighs a ton, costs a bomb but is totally fascinating and an obvious labour of love. ISBN 0.7119.0283.6


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Wotcha
Date: 06 Jan 01 - 10:38 PM

Gee Ian,
BAZ is in Cornwall too ... Is he still about?
Cheers,
Brian


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: John Wood
Date: 07 Jan 01 - 02:15 PM

Of course Baz is still around.
I bumped into him first at the Cadgwith one-day festival,then at St.Ives folk club, and a couple of weeks later at the Wadebridge folk festival.<
Greetings John(from Norway).


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Greyeyes
Date: 07 Jan 01 - 04:49 PM

Ian, I'll pass this info on to the Music Librarian at Plymouth Central Library, where I work, and try and persuade him to order a copy for the Library (even though it's from the other side of the bridge):)

Have you thought of joining The Mudcat? It's free, it could be very useful to you, and perhaps more importantly, you could be very useful to the Mudcat.

Thanks for the info,

Paul


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: paddymac
Date: 07 Jan 01 - 10:16 PM

Ian - along with joining the Mudcat Family, you might consider donating a copy of the CD to the Mudcat auction. It would help the 'cat, and might generate a little publicity for the CD.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 08 Jan 01 - 11:13 AM

Ian Marshall, would you offer a few insights into how traditional Cornish music differs from "Celtic mush"? I have connections to a local Cornish society and an sincerely interested.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 08 Jan 01 - 03:49 PM

A couple more sets of Cornish language lyrics in the Forum:

Hal An Tow  Translation into Cornish by Talek and Ylewyth.

http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=26224#314213>Ma Grün War 'n Gelynen   -The Holly Bears a Berry (Sans Day Carol); translation into Cornish by Tyrvab (W. Daniel Watson).  In both cases, English text and tunes are already available in the DT.

Malcolm


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Jan 01 - 06:11 PM

Sorry, don't know how to do blue jobs but these URL's will take you to threads with Songs in Cornish plus translations and tunes.

Lyr/Tune Add: JAN KNUCKEY
Lyr/Tune Add: NAW MAP HARTH/NINE BRAVE BOYS
Lyr/Tune Add: DE HALA ME/MAY FEAST
Lyr/Tune Add: WHEN HA BLEJENNOW/FLOWERS AND WEEDS
Lyr/Tune Add: ESTREN/STRANGER
Lyr/Tune Add: JOWAN BUNT/MR. JOHN BUNT
Lyr/Tune Add: MOWES A VRY/PRETTY MAID

URLs converted to links. --JoeClone, 13-Jan-02.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Kernow Jon
Date: 09 Jan 01 - 05:49 PM

Ian
It's good to here from you but I would take issue with your claim to be the only singer IN Cornwall to be recording traditional stuff.
Hilary Coleman and Neil Davey have recorded some pretty good stuff with Sowena. Harry Glasson from Goldsithney( due in Winsconsin next month) has also recorded many traditional Cornish songs, he has also written some new material about life in Cornwall and Penwith in particular.
But good luck with the album, if there are any copies at Lowender Perran this year I'll maybe buy one.
Regards KJ


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Kernow Jon
Date: 09 Jan 01 - 05:51 PM

Sorry about the proof reading but you'll get the gist! KJ


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 09 Jan 01 - 08:03 PM

I did some research on Cornish music a while ago for a friend. Here are some of the web sites I found then. Maybe you will find them useful:

Cornish Links Directory
Cornish Links Directory: Music & Song
The Cornish Media Archive
Ilow.Kernow: The Cornish Musician's Site
Kesson Distribution: The Celtic Music Directory


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 10 Jan 01 - 09:36 AM

I see that there are no replies so far from Ian. Maybe he just dropped by here to plug his stuff.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Dexter
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 04:28 AM

Does anyone have the words - IN CORNISH - to 'Ilove the White Rose in it's splendour...............' ??


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 04:51 AM

Jack and Margaret King used to do a song called Cor Bugger Jagger, [not as rude as it sounds] which is definitely west country, but I don't know if it's as far west as Kernow. Anybody know anything about this song?
Giok


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 05:50 AM

Rosie Hardman wrote a song called the Road to Marazion


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 06:24 AM

Giok

Greg Stephens posted some of the words for Cor, Bugger Jagger on a thread about Cornish pasties last year....


Half a pound of flour and marge
Makes a lovely clagger
Just enough for you and me
Cor bugger jagger
Chorus:
O how happy us'll be
When us gets to the west country
Where the oggies grow on trees
Cor bugger jagger

I seem to remember another verse starting

"You make fast, I'll make fast,
Make fast the dinghy
You make fast, kiss my arse
Make fast the dinghy"

And the chorus ending

And we'll all go back to Oggie land....


Kitty


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 06:30 AM

That's the one Kitty, how lovely to see the words after all these years. I think I last heard it in The Cellar at CSH about 1965, but can only remember the tune to the 'We'll all go back to Oggieland' bit. I will look for the full set of words, and hopefully the tune too.
Thanks
Giok


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Marion in Cornwall
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 09:01 AM

Here you go Dexter, These are the words as per Henegan (I think by Merv Davy). As far as I can tell no-one seems to know of the origin of the song but these words were collected from Neil Plummer of St Stythyans, so the book says.

All the best Marion

An Rosen Wyn (The White Rose)

My agaran rosen wyn mar whek mar dek del dyfhy
An rosen whyn mar splan mar vryntyn a dhre dha gof amma dhevy.
Kensa pan whelys ow whek oll, yth esta mar dek avel ros;
Mes lemmyn mar dhys lyw dha vejeth, mar wyn avel rosen mayth os
My agaran rosen wyn, mar whek mar dek del dyfhy
An rosen wyn mar splan mar vryntyn a dhre dha gof omma dhevy


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Richard
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 09:10 AM

"The Cadgwith Anthem"
"The Floral Dance"


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Mary Humphreys
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 11:56 AM

Have you heard Mo Keast,who goes to Bodmin Folk Club sing in Cornish?
She has quite a few songs. I don't think she is a Mudcatter, but some of the Bodmin folkies may be. She won the National Folk Music Festival Singer's Competition some years ago. A great singer and a very lovely person.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 12:56 PM

Giok

I can't do the notation, but try, E, G, G, E, G, G, E, E, D, D,C.......

Kitty


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 01:03 PM

And for the chorus, top C, C, C, G, A, A, G.....

Kitty

PS i sang in an event with Mo Keast at the National last year, and endorse Mary's comments!


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Joybell
Date: 13 Jun 04 - 06:40 PM

Thank you all. I'm a member of the Cornish Association here in Victoria Australia. We do have a large collection of songs already but I'll pass these on to the other musical members of the group. Here we include Stephen Foster's songs, along with the "traditional" songs, in any musical happening because they were the popular songs at the time of the large migration of Cornish people to Central Victoria - 1850s on. Of course Cyril Tawney's work is also included - especially "The Oggie Man" Joy


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Mingulay
Date: 14 Jun 04 - 10:05 AM

On the subject of Cornish songs, does anyone have the words to
"In a Cornish Kitchen". The only person I have heard sing it is
Geoff Boughton whose whereabouts are at present unknown. More
than likely not trad, but I like it anyway

Cheers

Pete


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Subject: Lyr Add: CORNISH KITCHEN
From: Marion in Cornwall
Date: 14 Jun 04 - 12:26 PM

Pete, I think this might be the song you mentioned.
I can put in an abc of the tune if anyone is interested.

Regards
Marion

CORNISH KITCHEN

Why bless 'ee you knows all about it,
Avore I do tell 'ee a word
'Tis a boy and a maid, and a country glade
A story you've often heard,
How the boy lost his heart to the maid
Well the how of it's always the same;
'Tis where I met Nellie, that I wants to tell 'ee
She was tending the butter and craime.

In a Cornish Kitchen, with the log fire glow on the wall;
And the nickety nock o' the grandfather clock
The blue and white china and all:
The floor clean sanded, the table for supper was laid;
Her mother said stay, well what could I say
So I sat beside Jan's little maid.

Old Jan farmed about forty acres,
And I was his better most man;
So twas easy for me, to be seein' of she,
And that's how the courtin' began:
On Easter Day just a year after,
We marched off to church prinkly dressed;
I gived her the ring and all that sort of thing
And the parson chap he did the rest.

We've a Cornish Kitchen, with the log fire glow on the wall;
And the nickety nock o' the grandfather clock
The blue and white china and all:
There's the squab pie steamin', the table for two neatly laid
A chair for me and another for she
What was once farmer Jan's little maid.

I've seen chaps look wish't as a winnard
What you call scared out of their life;
P'raps starved as a baby or poor lived maybe
But'tis most times a troublesome wife:
Of course all the maids ain't like my maid,
What a joy of the world it would be,
If such maids could be found, to have one each all round
An' all be as happy as we.

We've a Cornwish Kitchen, with the log fire glow on the wall;
And the nickety nock o' the grandfather clock
The blue and white china and all:
We've a brave fire burning, the table for three is laid,
That's Nellie and me and the other you see,
Is our own dear little maid.

Prinky dressed – all dressed up
Squab pie – pigeon pie
Wish't as a winnard – a winnard is a redwing. They stop off in Cornwall for a rest on their way through and usually look pretty 'wished' when they arrive.


These words are from Henegan where the author states that it was written in the 1920's by Frederick Dale and sung by Edith Serpell & Charles Saunders. The publishers were Larway & Co. but the present owners of this firm have no record of the song.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: MikeofNorthumbria
Date: 14 Jun 04 - 12:52 PM

Greetings to all, especially Giok and Kitty,

Here is a fuller set of words for the notorious Oggie song:

"Where be goin' to Jagger?"   "I be goin' to Looe!"
"Gor, b****r Jagger, I be goin' there too!"
Oh how happy us will be,
When us gets to the west country
Where the oggies grow on trees,
Gor, b****r Jagger!

Half a pound of flour and marge makes a lovely clagger –
Just enough for you and me - Gor, b****r Jagger!
Oh how happy us will be …etc.

Up the Camborne hill we go, down to Helston Ferry.
Come on Jagger, don't be slow, come on Jagger, hurry!
Oh how happy us will be …etc.

You make fast, I'll make fast, make fast the dinghy.
You make fast, kiss my a**e, make fast the dinghy!
And we'll all go back to oggie-land,
To oggie-land, sweet oggie-land!
And we'll all go back to oggie-land,
Where they don't know sugar from …
Tissu paper, tissue paper, marmalade and jam …Oi! Oi!

Oggie, oggie, oggie! …..Oi! Oi! Oi!


Cornish Crib-sheet:

Jagger    = Mate; buddy (compare "Whacker" in Scouse, or "Acker" in Somerset)
Clagger   = Pastry
Oggie    = a Cornish pasty

The identity of the author is unknown to me: presumably it was someone Cornish and nautical. I learned it from Cyril Tawney in the summer of 1962.

Note for Kitty - Greg Stephens was a freshman in the Autumn term of 1962, when I introduced the Oggie song to Heritage, so he may have learned it there. (Though Greg does have Cornish roots, and may have learned it independently.)

Note for Giok - Like yourself, I used to be a regular attender at Jack and Margaret King's 's Saturday night sessions in the Cellar, C# House and may well have mangled the Oggie song at one of them in 1965. We may even have met: were you one of those who sneaked out to The Engineer for a pint during the interval? And did you dash on down to the Student Prince afterwards for Curly's All-Nighter, and catch the first train home on Sunday morning?   Happy Days!

Wassail!


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 14 Jun 04 - 02:36 PM

Thanks for the full version, Mike - I've been trying to remember where I first heard it. I suspect it was the Beach Store in Sidmouth (although I went on to Cornwall, with a couple of Herga friends who were subsequently Presidents of Heritage, after my first Sidmouth in 1968, and we went to a pub session in Cadgwith).

Kitty


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Jeanie
Date: 14 Jun 04 - 03:47 PM

Lots of tunes and songs in Cornish dialect and in Cornish to be found on the An Daras website ("The Doorway to Cornish Folk Arts").

Marion - it's good to see Merv Davey's name mentioned. I used to sing with him in the resident group at Falmouth folk club way back in the Dark Ages !


- jeanie


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Jun 04 - 06:43 PM

mainly traditional songs being mentioned but many great contemporary singers like Nigel Mazlyn Jones , Ralph McTell and Clive Palmer have Cornish connections - not to mention Noel Murphy. Hard to believe these guys haven't written something Cornish during their long sojourn so far away from the rest of us.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Cats at Work
Date: 15 Jun 04 - 04:38 AM

It's worth noting that Cornwall Songwriters who include in their number Mike O'Connor, Jon Heslop, Lucy Burrows, Roger Bryant, Tony Truscott, Kathy Wallis, Ron Openshaw et al, all have in their repetoire, traditional Cornish songs. They don't just write new songs. Mike has a vast collection of traditional songs and music which have been published,   Kathy sings traditional cornish songs which have been recorded, Tony Truscott won a competition at Pan Celtic for his songs in Cornish and both Tony and Mike have been made Bards of the Cornish Gorseth for their contribution to music in Cornwall. Contact any of them and they'll all be pleased to help in whatever way they can.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Mingulay
Date: 15 Jun 04 - 08:35 AM

Many thanks Marion, this is exactly what I was looking for. As for
the tune the one I remember fits to these words. As I thought it
is not "trad" but I still like it.

Cheers

Pete


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,kevin in northumberland
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 08:45 PM

I'v been looking for a site like this for ages.
Just what us ex pat cornish need.
keep it up kevin


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: LadyJean
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 10:40 PM

"I saw a snail drive a nail fye man fye
I saw a snail drive a nail, Who's the fool now
I saw a snail drive a nail from Penzance up to Hale."
Thou hast well drunken man, who's the fool now."

Penzance and Hale are both Cornish towns, I know because I've stayed in one, and passed through the other. Yes there are pirates in Penzance, they run shell shops, and assorted other tourist traps. But I did love Cornwall, and the people were so nice!


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: hilda fish
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 11:02 PM

Rob Strike, does traditional cornish melodies, Pyba , Dalla, Jim Wearne, Bagas Degol, Ånao Åtao, Bolingey Troyl Band, Aveldenn, Graham Ellaby, Mike O'Connor, and ross keltek all do traditional Çornish and are featured on CD Mammyk Ker, Kernow, Åll the ?est of Çornwall, more info www.kesson.com
In Australia the Çornish Åssociation, or singer/songwriter Çarrl Myriad (google it) are very useful re words and music of trad Cornish


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 06:04 AM

My cousin in Allet does The Cornish Alphabet.
He is no folkie, and it is a monologue rather than a song.
Anyone else know it?
If not I will get it from him, and post it drekly.
Keith.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: John P
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 08:38 AM

I have an old vinyl LP called "The Hole In the Piper's Head" by a group called Bucca. I'm afraid it's my only exposure to Cornish music. It has a song on it called "An Lader" which I know from other sources as "The Robber", an English song. Does anyone know if it started in Cornwall and got translated to English, or the other way around?

John Peekstok


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 09:23 AM

Hilda Fish gives a long list of singers in Cornish, but it omits Mo Keast (who was mentioned earlier in this thread by Mary Humphreys and Herga Kitty). Mo was born in Padstow, and is a cousin of Charlie Bate's. She has sung at Bodmin club for many years. She "learned her trade" under the tutelage of Charlie and Mervyn Vincent, and is now the repository of many of Charlie's songs. She also sings many songs in the Cornish language, and is a Bard of the Cornish Gorsedd; a very staunch and strong supporter of Cornwall and all things Cornish!


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Flash Company
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 10:12 AM

I had, and may still have somewhere, a book of Cornish songs which included 'One and All' and a version of 'The Tithe Pig'.
I'll hava a look up the cupboard and see if it's still there.

FC


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: breezy
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 11:44 AM

Cornish Dialect and Folk Songs by Ralph Dunston could well have used by Mr Penna, former teacher at Padstow Primary, Organist at St Petroc.

He taught the kids 12 songs from it and they performed it publicly in 1990. My daughter was in the chorus, aged 10-11.

I was given a copy by chance by another source shortly after and I was able to learn and perform The Tinners and once did Truro Agricultural Show

R D also was editor of the Cornish Song Book

Mo Keist ' Little Mo' to us sings Cornish Kitchen

Cornish lads By Roger B is becoming more widely sung out of county.

A new song to emerge is a song of Transportation to Slavery in Virginia by Ray Delf of Padstow

Does Larry Mac's Queen of the May deserve inclusion, and also how about Steve Knightley's Cousin Jack?


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 11:51 AM

just quickly while i get 10 mins on the internet..

my memory has been jogged about seeing Brenda Wooton live in the mid 70's when i was a teenager.
I cant remembe why i liked her or even what her music sounded like
[solo.. band.. ???]
i'm fairly certain she had a regular tv spot at the time
[fred wedlock show.. her own show..???]
and was prominent for singing in cornish,
maybe one of the last remaining fluent cornish speakers back then..?

i've not been able to find any useful info on internet,
so any info and links to sound files would be appreciated..
thanks....


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Mr Happy
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 12:49 PM

Does anyone have dots or tab for 'Song of the Western Men/ Trelawney'?


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: hilda fish
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 07:58 PM

Bucca had Neil Davey and his wife Hilary. Ån Lader is Cornish translated into English.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 08:39 PM

Any further information about Ån Lader/The Robber? I can't be sure what song you mean just from those titles. A version of Newlyn (Newry) Town/Wild and Wicked Youth? I've come across a modern translation into Cornish of a Sovay text, set to a Robber tune, but presumably that isn't what was meant here?


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Mick Tems
Date: 30 Jan 05 - 09:30 PM

The late, great Bucca - not just Neil Davey but Merv Davey. Merv and his wife Alison form the duo Pyba (bagpipes and drum) and are the proud parents of the duo Scoot, who appeared at Cwlwm Celtaidd (the Welsh Celtic festival) at Porthcawl this year. Merv and Alison evolved the Perranporth festival, the lovely, magic Lowender Peran - would that I could go back there, I miss it so much. The Daveys live at the Cornish village of Withiel.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: hilda fish
Date: 31 Jan 05 - 12:41 AM

Dr. Price are you Cornish/from Cornwall? Neil is a great personal friend along with his partner, Hilary. Sterenn, Merv & Ålison's daughter was staying with me while she was studying at Sydney Uni as an exchange student from Exeter. Neil lives at Carn ?rae near Redruth. Thus the question, are you Cornish? I've had severe exposure to Cornish music through many friends who are determined to revive both the language and the culture of this Celtic nation. The music and the dancing is an essential part of this cultural revival and the Davey's have been a very important part of that.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Mingulay at work
Date: 31 Jan 05 - 04:11 AM

To Guest punkfolkrocker, Brenda Wooton appeared with a guitarist called John the Fish in the 60's/70's. A large lady with an even bigger personality and voice to match. My vinyl heap used to contain an LP, must check it out. She was very Cornish my handsome.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: robinia
Date: 31 Jan 05 - 08:09 AM

I'd like to add my appreciation of "Trelawney" as a great song, with great historical roots.   I first saw a slight modification of the chorus (i.e. "and shall Trelawney die and shall Trelawney die, then twenty thousand Cornishmen will know the reason why") printed in a history book as the reputed "marching cry" for the "men of the west" when James II imprisoned and threatened to behead six bishops (including Trelawney, from Cornwall) for refusing to read from the pulpit a Declaration of Indulgence (it would have allowed Catholics to hold public office!). This uprising did not in fact occur; it didn't have to, as the six bishops, tried for seditious libel, were acquitted "amid great popular enthusiasm"; and shortly thereafter, in the "Glorious revolution" of 1688 James fled the country.
Anyway, reading all this I remember thinking what a great song that "marching cry" would make -- only to discover, when I got to Cornwall that (along with "the White Rose") it was practically the Cornish "national anthem"! Nobody remembered just what the song was about ("the closing of the tin mines?") but they loved its spirit. I guess you could call it Cornish chauvinism.
There's also local pride (Cornwall versus neighboring Devon!) in another Cornish song with a great chorus: "For it's fish and tin and copper, boys, and tree and pol and pen, and one and all we may rejoice that we are Cornishmen" (which evidently includes the knife-wielding Cornish lass who sends "young Nicholas" fleeing back across the Tamar).   That 's on a "Cornish Folk Song" cassette (Sue White and Gareth Hedges), along with the "Cadgwith Anthem" (sp?), "Lamorna," "Egloshalyle Ringers," the "Truro Agricultural Show," "Camborne Hill" . . . .Anyone know if those two are still singing?


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Subject: Lyr Add: FISH AND TIN AND COPPER
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 31 Jan 05 - 10:50 AM

Been meaning to learn this one for the past few years --

FISH AND TIN AND COPPER

Old Nick as he was wont to do
Went wanderin' up and down
To see what mischief he could brew
And made for Launceston-town.

Chorus:        
For 'tis fish and tin and copper, boys,
By Tre- and Pol- and Pen-
And one and all, we may rejoice
That we are Cornishmen.

Across the Tamar he had come.
Now you might think it strange.
For having left his Devon home,
Tried Cornwall for a change.
Chorus

Now when to Launceston he drew near
A-skippin' o'er the sod,
He spied a rustic cottage there
With windows all a-broad.
Chorus

And in the kitchen might be seen
A dame with knife in hand
To cut and slash and chop I ween
To make a pasty grand.
Chorus

"Good Mornin', Missus, what is that?"
"Of all sorts, it is daub.
'Tis beef and mutton, pork and fat,
Potatoes, leeks, and squab."
Chorus

"A Cornish pasty, sure", says she,
"And if thou doesn't mind,
I soon shall start to cut up thee
And put ye in, you'll find!"
Chorus

In fear he turned and straight did flee
Across the Tamar green
And since that day in Cornwall
He has never more been seen!
Chorus


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 31 Jan 05 - 11:26 AM

yes - that is one I've been working on as well.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Cats
Date: 31 Jan 05 - 12:04 PM

Last heard of Sue was living in Devon, making the occasional foray into our homeland, Cornwall, and Gareth was playing blues in USA. As far as I know they haven't played together for years.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Bob Coltman
Date: 31 Jan 05 - 12:10 PM

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the gorgeous West Cornwall pub song, "Lamorna" ("Away Down to Lamorna"). I was stunned when I first heard the recording of this by an uncredited singer--it's the late great Cornish singer Brenda Wootton--on the following site.

http://www.trelawnys-army.org.uk/ta/tasongs.html

While the song is originally an English music hall number, there is a Cornish-language version. See discussion thread in the archive...I won't attempt to summon it as I'm afraid of losing this message. (Not real adept at making links I fear)

Bob


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Snuffy
Date: 31 Jan 05 - 07:33 PM

Is that the Sue White who's now a stalwart of Bideford Folk Club, and is also into Border Morris dancing?

"Lamorna" is originally an English music hall number about the Pomona pleasure gardens in Manchester and had bugger all to do with Cornwall until some deaf idots misheard the name, in the same way as Country & Western became "some c*** from Weston".


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: robinia
Date: 01 Feb 05 - 01:03 AM

Yes, "Lamorna" is obviously of English music hall origin and a great chorus (pub) song -- high time I learned it, if only to teach Americans to clap along with the "wet, wet, wet" in the chorus here:
   
    Twa-a-a-a-s [lo-o-o-ong lead-in] down in Albert Square,
    I never shall forget
    Her eyes they shone like diamonds
    And the evening it was wet, wet, wet;
    Her hair hung down in curls
    She was a charming rover
    And we ro'ed all night in the pale moonlight
    Away down to Lamorna

Maybe someone else will post the verses? (about picking up a woman who turns out to be your wife -- the song manages to be both naughty and moral, very English somehow, so I almost forgot it was on my "Cornish" cassette).


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Marion in Cornwall
Date: 01 Feb 05 - 04:10 AM

Hi robinia,

Lamorna has already been posted, along with a midi-file, just click on the link below (I hope!).

Regards
Marion

Lamorna


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Snuffy
Date: 01 Feb 05 - 08:55 AM

Here's an older broadside version Lyr Add: DOWN TO POMONA


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Bob Coltman
Date: 01 Feb 05 - 05:09 PM

Thanks Snuffy for the Pomona post.

Must say I've learned to tread carefully in traditional-music turf wars. Thus when I suggested the song "Lamorna" on 31 January I was careful to say it was of English music hall origin. I was then, and am now, aware of everything that's been said on the forum concerning its origin, pretty definitively, in the Manchester music hall, with Pomona Gardens, and a possible London stage career as well.

In short, I was aware that "Lamorna" did not originate in Cornwall, and maybe should have been a little more expansive on the point. But I didn't think I needed to; it had all been said already.

But this isn't the first time I've run into "song rage" over whom this song in particular "belongs to." So I want to ask what the problem is. Is there a Manchester contingent feeling cheated of its song? I doubt it.

Nobody seems to argue over competing variants of other songs going native in other places...say, Streets of Laredo being more or less valid than "The Bad Girl." Would anybody much mind if a version turned up called "Streets of Nogales," or attempt to argue that it has "bugger all" to do with either?

I guess this goes to the heart of what the folk process is about... Help, help, I hope we're not about to slap a lid on creative change, because folks, when you do that, you just left the world of traditional song.

Must say I was surprised by the comeback, and hope we can be a touch more gentle with each other. But maybe that's me. Confrontation suits some folks' style, but I for one would rather endlessly repeat for the benefit of those who don't know than slam a newcomer making a contribution however uninformed.

Pomona? Lamorna? I happen to sing the less original Lamorna version because, all honors to Manchester and Pomona, I like Lamorna better. I don't really think I need a better reason, where two competing versions, each equally traditional, are available.

The DT and Forum were built on the spirit of inquiry and gently helpful interchange...and for the most part that still happens. Those of you interested in the topic may want to sample the Jerry Rasmussen-originated (hi Jerry) "Has the Folk Community Changed" thread. Bob

Bob


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Snuffy
Date: 01 Feb 05 - 07:40 PM

Sorry if you found my contributions confrontational, Bob: they were not meant to be.

If you look in the other thread, you'll find I say that whatever it's origins may have been, Lamorna now is a Cornish song. The fact that it has achieved Cornishness by naturalisation rather than by birth may well be known to both you and me, and has been said already in the other thread.

You say I for one would rather endlessly repeat for the benefit of those who don't know slam a newcomer making a contribution however uninformed - that was my intention here, to repeat, not to slam.

And like you, I think a century of folk processing has produced an improvement on the original. But the original is still the original.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Padstow Pete
Date: 02 Feb 05 - 10:20 AM

I love unite and unite cos lots of folk get the tune wrong


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Cats
Date: 02 Feb 05 - 04:34 PM

Except those of us who only sing it in Padstow on May Day. 'Oss 'Oss


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Com Seangan
Date: 02 Feb 05 - 07:43 PM

Nothing further to say but that I am delighted that the old Cornish songs in their nown Celtic language still survives. Their language "P" Celtic belongs to the Welsh family rather than the "Q" variety of the Scots and Irish.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Hawker
Date: 02 Feb 05 - 08:18 PM

If you want Cornish tunes, as well as those mentioned by Cats, try Fooch! Favourite Cornish Session and dance tunes Vol1 chosen and played by Neil Davey. Excellent - it comes with an accompanying CD which plays the tune at a slower speed first then at session speed! Great for musical novices like myself. Songs - Well! My wounderful husband Kevin Burrow has been singing Cornish songs since he could sing. He knows lots of them. He learned in the oral tradition and so his original was the person what he learned it off (whose original was probably who they learned it off etc. so what was the original.... or did you mean the taken down version snuffy?)
Sorry to be a bit picky about that Snuffy darling, but I do feel quite strongly that as a living tradition, we must accept each persons interpretation.... so long as it bears semblance of the original - no matter which we prefer! Hope to see you at Miskin. perhaps we can have a Cornish singaround and see who runs out first ...... That'll be me I guess, being an emmet. There is a song penned by myself about NOT being Cornish and living in Cornwall called The Emmet Song.
I am a little concerned that Ian Marshall thinks he is the only person in Cornwall taking Cornish song singing seriously - although we tend not to be too serious when we are singing! Perhaps he ought to get out a little ;0)
I also agree that Moe Keast doesnt get the credit she deserves, then there is Vic and Viv Legg, Thorn & Roses / Sylvia & Rowena, All of the Cornwall Songwriters, and a huge amount of other people all very very proud not just of the songs but that they are able to sing them.
Cheers, Lucy


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Padstow Pete
Date: 02 Feb 05 - 11:53 PM

Yes "Cats" very true, though I don't mind the visitors gettin the tune wrong as long as they bloody well try it and not just gawk. Wee 'Oss.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Snuffy
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 08:41 AM

Lucy,

It looks to me that people are getting on their high horses and reading into my posts things that just aren't there. Nowhere do I express any opinion whatsoever on what people should or should not sing - I restricted myself to factual matters about where the song came from.

My point was merely that, in a discussion on Cornish Songs it was relevant to point out that this song started off without the slightest trace of Cornishness, and only acquired it by the accidental or deliberate change of Pomona to Lamorna. By this change it has come to be perceived by both Cornish people and the world at large as a Cornish song

Once a song enters the tradition it can develop in surprising ways, and only a fool would try to proscribe this development on grounds of purity: let a thousand flowers bloom. By the original I referred to the song as the writer made it, whether in 1594, 1894 or 1994 - in the state it was at the very start of the chain, not at any other stage in its transmission.

I do not, and probably never will, sing the Pomona version. However, I have for years sung Lamorna and intend to continue doing so for many years to come. But I also reserve the right to point out when I sing it that it is only Cornish by adoption and used to come from much further north!

See you at Miskin, if not before - I'm down for breakfast kitchen skivvy again. Who knows, I might get promoted to plongeur


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Hawker
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 12:22 PM

Snuffs, stop getting sniffy, you know I'm always a little tongue in cheek, not having a go at all, and if I hadn't said it you can guarantee somebody else would - just like your comment about Pomona - I just enjoy singing and you do sing 'em well! You can dry my dishes and I'll dry yours - perhaps we can write that dishwashing shanty we all kept on about all weekendsee you soon,
Cheers, Lucy


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Snuffy
Date: 04 Feb 05 - 08:17 AM

You mean yellow marigolds instead of blood red roses?

And we can compare our Cornish versions of oxen ploughing.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Tradsinger
Date: 04 Feb 05 - 02:46 PM

One of my favourite Cornish songs is "Maggie May", not the sea-shanty one but the sentimental one "My darling witchy Maggie". Lovely song.

I also love the singing style in Cornwall, i.e. unaccompanied part singing, plus the way they bring in new songs and make them sound Cornish, such as "Da doo ron ron" and "Sloop John B". I heard a great rendition of "The Rose" in the London Inn last Padstow - unaccompanied and sung in parts of course. There are also the great songs that Larry McLoughlin of Padstow is writing, especially "Queen of the May" which has entered into oral tradition in Padstow.

Gwilym


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Onlooker
Date: 04 Feb 05 - 04:13 PM

Someone asked what had happened to Sue White - as far as I know she is still around and singing, although the last I heard she was intending to live abroad -whether this is now the case I know not. She does, however, have a website which might give more info. At present can't remember what the address is, but the words Cornishsinger will probably find it on Google!


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Colin Roberts
Date: 07 Feb 05 - 05:19 AM

I'm a Cornishman now living in Australia. I'm looking for words and music to a range of Cornish folk songs I can sing and play on guitar. Can anyone help?

Colin


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Mary Humphreys
Date: 07 Feb 05 - 05:41 PM

The best version of Maggie May that I have heard is sung by Moe Keast, who can be heard at Bodmin Folk Club most Fridays. She also sings in Cornish.
I don't know if she has ever recorded her songs.
Mary


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: BB
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 02:19 PM

Moe got her version from Charlie Bate.

Barbara


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Cats
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 06:20 PM

Mo has recorded some of her songs, Mike O'Connor put them down for her at Lyngham House Music.

Colin - I suggest you log on to the Lyngham House website where you will find lists of books which Mike has collated and published as well as his own work and that of Cornwall Songwriters. You'll find plenty there.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 07:23 PM

i THINK you mean janner not jagger. We still say Janner to mean farmer od in the RN to mean Cornishman. I've nevder hear anyone say Jagger in 24 years but we still refer to farmers as bring 'bleddy janner's"


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Rene
Date: 28 May 05 - 03:20 PM

Fascinating page. Enjoyed all the argy-bargy, but learned a lot.
Why does Richard Guest suddenly post `Cadgwith Anthem` and `Floral Dance?` I couldn`t see relevance to earlier posts.
I`ll wait patiently for a reply, as the site seems to come alive only every few months. X


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Sue the Borderer
Date: 31 May 05 - 06:12 PM

Just came across this thread and read Snuffy's question of 31st Jan about 'Sue White'. No - there are two of us. I'm the Bideford one and into Border Morris. The 'other one' was on the scene long before me. It took me a while - and some very blank looks on my part when I got asked strange questions - to discover there were 'two of us'.

Sue White


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,cornish man ooooaaaarrrrr
Date: 27 Jan 06 - 02:43 PM

does anyone know the lyrics to truro agiricultral show


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Cats
Date: 27 Jan 06 - 03:00 PM

If you go to www.an-daras.com/music you will find it along with the historical background and the dots. This is a good source for cornish songs.


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: breezy
Date: 27 Jan 06 - 07:33 PM

yes, and its on my 4th Volume made in 1989 along with the Tinner Boys

'So its off to Truro we must go to se the agericultural show'

that one

Sunday St Albans at the Comfort Hotel. Windward folk Club.

main attraction
the delightful
Liz Somcock


down boys


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: breezy
Date: 27 Jan 06 - 07:34 PM

Ahem

Liz Simcock

thank you


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: breezy
Date: 27 Jan 06 - 07:42 PM

its the cornish in me

ever had any in you?


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: Lady Nancy
Date: 28 Jan 06 - 07:41 AM

What about "the Ascott of Tetcott" which is a hunting song wherein the fox gets his revenge.... And it mentions places like Whitstone, Poundstock, St Ghennys (apologies for spelling if wrong) Ive got the words and the tune, but am actually missing two lines.... Used to sing it in the late '70s in a harmony group. Good song. But is it the right county?

Lady Nancy x


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: BB
Date: 28 Jan 06 - 01:14 PM

Great song, even if it is 'ARscott of Tetcott', rather than 'Ascott'. Tetcott is actually just in Devon, but Whitstone, Poundstock and St. Gennys are just over the border in Cornwall. Jim Causley has recorded it, and sings it really well. (Wish we'd got there first!) There's also a song called 'The St. Gennys Hunt', although I can't remember the details just now.

Barbara


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Jim
Date: 25 Mar 08 - 08:32 AM

I lived in Cornwall for some 7 years but, long before that, my misspent youth included regular Saturday evening visits to Cecil Sharpe House where I also heard Jack and Margaret King's rendition of "Gor Bugger Jagger".
On the subject of "The Oggie Man", I have often wondered at the several interesting similarities between that song and "Die Leiermann" from "Die Winterreisse".


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Phil Beer
Date: 25 Mar 08 - 09:00 AM

The aforementioned Cornish song book, although not really containing a vast amount of 'traditional' material is still a great place to go. I was born in Devon in 1953 but my mun is a Tonkin from Falmouth and we spent a large amount of our early years in Cornwall. My family are also Methodists and very musical and we actually did used to spend time around the piano as a family singing songs from the book. I recently was in Falmouth clearing out my aged Aunts house and found her copy which is in far better condition than mine. We also took charge of the fine old broadwood upright which now resides in my sisters house for another generation of of kids to learn music on. I've just been working with Exeter singer Dave Lowrey who aslo has a great affection for the book and has recorded 'The Cornish Smuggler' from it. In conversation with Cyril Tawney before he passed away, he also indicated a similar early exposure to music in precisely same way. There are plenty of copies still to be found if you search the old bookshops. Might base an album around it one day---


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: kimsky
Date: 25 Mar 08 - 09:13 AM

if you visit the Elowen myspace page, you'll find 2 contemporary Cornish songs - Oll an Gerriow/Noze Looan is widely played (not so widely sung) enjoy

http://www.myspace.com/elowenfolk

I know - shameless self-promotion!


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Subject: RE: CORNISH SONGS
From: thimblerigg
Date: 25 Mar 08 - 10:16 AM

Having spent several years researching the songs collected by the Rev Sabine Baring-Gould, I have followed a Cornish thread that has led me to songs that as far as I know are not shall we say in common usage at present. These are being added to a growing pile that I am convinced are unique to Cornwall.
The folk site www.wovenwheatwhispers.co.uk published an article I wrote titled 'Songs Unique to Cornwall'. Since writing the aricle which was based around the songs from my CD 'By Chance it Was', I am this year starting to perform the newly found songs here in Cornwall.

I am convinced there must be other sources, as Phil Beer says check out the book shops somewhere there must be some unsung gems waiting for an airing


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Celtaddict
Date: 25 Mar 08 - 04:28 PM

On our side of the Pond, Jim Wearne is still going strong, is a Bard of the Cornish Gorseth, and has a new website address
Jim Wearne's Cornish Page


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Leadfingers
Date: 25 Mar 08 - 04:33 PM

100 ??


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Hawker
Date: 25 Mar 08 - 08:30 PM

Just spent the evening singing NEW Cornish songs - rehearsing for the NEW Cornwall songwriters show 'Cornish Lads' which goes on the road at the end of May 2008. Bookings being taken now! Click this image to find out more!
Cheers, Lucy


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,Jo W
Date: 05 Sep 08 - 11:26 AM

I saw the new cornwall songwriters show ' cornish lads' at Bideford and they were brilliant!


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Hawker
Date: 05 Sep 08 - 07:22 PM

Thank you Jo,
It was a great show for us too, with such a receptive and responsive audience! We did it at Looe last night for Dehwelans (Cornish for Homecoming) and it rained and rained, we go home without having to swim, but there were some BIG puddles!
Cheers, Lucy
(Bal maiden!)


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Crowdercref
Date: 06 Sep 08 - 04:21 AM

W is water the bane of the mine...

oops sorry, wrong thread.


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,frank
Date: 21 Nov 08 - 01:03 PM

Can anyone help me ? I am seeking the words and music to the song "proper job", sung by the Holman Climax choir, thanks


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Cats
Date: 21 Nov 08 - 11:12 PM

I've e mailed the secretary for you to find out.


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,dizzyLisa
Date: 22 Nov 08 - 05:40 PM

I've posted a video on youTube of Mike Nicholson singing Roger Bryant's beautiful Cornish Lads with Hartley Morris Men

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=BUkAxP5GysM

I don't think the hyperlink works tho !


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,David Jones, Guest
Date: 22 Nov 08 - 10:27 PM

Does anyone have the words to Crantock Games? I think it is a Cornish song.
David Jones


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: alanabit
Date: 23 Nov 08 - 03:27 AM

Always one to be a bit of a spoilsport, I would like to make one or two comments about "The Song of the Western Men" or "Trelawney", as it is better known. It is indeed very popular in Cornwall - especially with male voice choirs. However, although it is about events in 1688, it was not written until 1824, by Robert Hawker, whom I believe, was Devonian clergyman. It has got a great tune and a rousing chorus. Undoubtedly it has been adopted with some relish by the Cornish. Now I'm not saying it is not Cornish now, but its ethnic roots could be called into question...


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Subject: Lyr Add: PROPER JOB
From: Cats
Date: 23 Nov 08 - 01:18 PM

Frank I have the words for you from the secretary of the choir.

Proper Job

Is there a land where cream is cream
and where a man has time to dream?
Is there a place where peace is peace
and where the race for change can cease?
Is there a coast where cliffs are cliffs
folk never talk in buts and ifs?
Can I escape this crazy stress?
Hear the Cornish answer, 'Yes!'

Proper job! First you cross the Tamar
Proper job! Sea breeze in your face!
Devon may be touchy
Cornwall is a Duchy
Proper job! Kernow is the place

Proper job! When the Lord made Cornwall
Proper job! Granite built with grace
Charm in every corner
Launceston to Lamorna!
Proper job! Kernow is the place.

Shades of miners
Tough hand liners
mighty man born
There in Camborne
Made an engine fine and fitty
'n if you must, then down
in Truro town -
There's a city

Proper job! Take a stroll up Fore Street
Proper job! Pasty in your hand
Saffron sweet and spicy
have a bit of nicey!
Proper job! Kernow is the land.

It is credited to Richards and Dearlove


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Hawker
Date: 23 Nov 08 - 07:29 PM

Alanabit,
Now I am sure you are not trying to mke ripples on the waters of fair Cornwall ;0)
Yes Devonian Rev Hawker was, but I believe that a person is said to be Cornish if Born there, well if this were true for songs, the song was penned in the county of Cornwall - granted the father (writer) was a devonian, but definately a song of cornish inspiration! LOL
Cheers, Lucy


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,John from Elsie`s Band
Date: 25 Nov 08 - 09:52 AM

Davy Jones Guest,
                "Crantock Games" is one of the songs from our repertoire and I have an mp3 recording on the computer of Tony and Iris doing it. If you could tell me in words of one syllable how to do it I will willingly put it in this thread.


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,Cornish
Date: 09 Jan 09 - 11:48 AM

I am terribly sorry to have to correct you but that would be Cornish not English


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: greg stephens
Date: 09 Jan 09 - 12:26 PM

???


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: breezy
Date: 09 Jan 09 - 01:36 PM

there'll be a Breeze in yer face alright


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,frank
Date: 25 Jan 09 - 07:17 AM

Dear alanabit,
I`m sure you are right about the reverend Walker, but the words of the song ar "Theres twenty thousand CORNISHMEN will know the reason why", I think he meant it to be a cornish song, don`t you?


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,doc.tom
Date: 25 Jan 09 - 07:21 AM

Or even CORNISH BOLD - depends which choir!


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Mar 09 - 10:44 AM

Actually Hawker did NOT write the original:

"Except for the refrain, the exact original words of the song are lost. Those given here are based on a 'restoration' written (c.1835) by the Rev. R.S. Hawker, of Whitstone, near Stratton, who died in 1875. In 1688, the Trelawney Song is said to have resounded in every house, in every highway, and in every street in Cornwall."

This comes from the Cornish Song Book, 1929, along with three versions of the song, one in Cornish language written by Henry Jenner.


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Dec 09 - 03:37 PM

Cornish Alfabet was song by Brenda Wootton on one of her LP's

lovely lady I had the pleasure of knowing
sadly missed

gerry


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: open mike
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 12:49 PM

I caught this t.v. show on PBS recently. apparently filmed in 2004
it is of a Cornish choir, descendants of miners who worked the gold
mines in California. Huell Howser is a t.v. reporter who has a series
on california

http://www.calgold.com/calgold/Default.asp?Series=Specials&Show=788

CORNISH CHRISTMAS

In this holiday special, Huell celebrates the holidays with the descendants of the original Cornish Carol Choir of Grass Valley. Join them as they reenact their 1940 concert of traditional Cornish Christmas Carols, which took place 2,000 feet below ground in a gold mine, and was broadcast nationally on network radio.


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,Sue White
Date: 26 Sep 10 - 11:18 AM

Hi folks! I am alive and well and still singing!
Lots of Cornish songs, as well as Irish
and Scottish.
Music available from www.kesson.com
+ new website,
http://sites.google.com/site/suewhittonytaylor
Old website:-
www.cornishsinger.com


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,Sue White
Date: 26 Sep 10 - 12:29 PM

Sorry! Can't type on my i-phone.

New website is

http://sites.google.com/site/suewhitetonytaylor

Regards, everyone.


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,Sue White
Date: 26 Sep 10 - 12:42 PM

I have just read through this thread, and have really enjoyed it all.

I have used the Baring Gould Book "Songs of the West" - and another book given to me by Jack Spurr, a Cornishman from Calstock way, "Cornish Ditties" I think it was called - for years, and based many of the songs on my CD "Best of Cornish Folksongs" from material in that book. Like Phil Beer I have used song books like that to sing from, since childhood. In my childhood it was family gatherings on a Friday night, and always with guitars, whistles and lots of humour (I was born in 1953 too Phil!)- in my native county of Essex.

Arscot of Tetcott was a song I found in "The Songs of the West", and which I also recorded and put on CD in the early 90s. So I did it a while before Jim C. (but a very modern take on it - not very folkie)

Another source for me was the singing of the Male Voice Choirs. Those lads are a mine of information on all songs Cornish.
I loved my time living in Cornwall (from 1978 until 1996) and am still trying to escape Devon and get back!


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: I don't know
Date: 27 Sep 10 - 06:20 AM

Just seen this thread & was pleased to see people asking about Brenda Wooton. A lovely lady who sung not only with John the Fish but with Mike Silver. I saw her with Mike in 1976 at the Applegate folk club in Castle Hedingham. Essex. Only my second folk night. My husband had been to her home in Cornwall when Jasper Carrot had been at a club night & they all went back for supper, he said Jasper never spoke a word except please & thank you & didn't even join in the sing a round. The only album we have of hers is Cornish songs of the sea. If there are others may be someone can let us know & we can maybe get copies.


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,Ian Cook
Date: 17 Oct 10 - 07:10 PM

@ Sue White

Did the Jack Spurr who gave you the book used to run a guest house in Wadebridge?


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 18 Oct 10 - 11:10 AM

There's a Wikipedia page for Brenda Wootton, with this discography:

    * Piper's Folk with John the Fish & Piper's Folk, (Private pressing, produced & distributed by Piper's Folk), 1968
    * Pasties & Cream with John the Fish, Sentinel Records, SENS 1006, 1971
    * Way Down to Lamorna, Sentinel, SENS 1056, 1972
    * Crowdy Crawn with Richard Gendall, Sentinel, SENS 1016, 1973
    * Pamplemousse, with Robert Bartlett, Barclay (French label), 1973
    * No Song To Sing, with Robert Bartlett and "guest" Alex Atterson on piano - Sentinel, SENS 1021, 1974
    * Tin In The Stream, with Robert Bartlett, Stockfisch (German label), 1974 (voted West Germany's folk album of the year)
    * Starry Gazey Pie, with Robert Bartlett, Sentinel, SENS 1031, 1975
    * Children Singing, with Richard Gendall, Sentinel, SENS 1036, 1976
    * Carillon, Transatlantic Records, TRA 360, 1979
    * Boy Jan ... Cornishman, with David Penhale (voice, guitar & bouzouki) and Richard Gendall (composer), Burlington Records, BURL 005, 1980[3]
    * La Grande Cornouaillaise, Burlington Records, BURL 007, 1980
    * Gwavas Lake, with The Four Lanes Male Choir, Burlington Records, BURL 008, 1980
    * Lyonesse, RCA, PL 70299, 1982
    * My Land, RCA, PL 70234, 1983
    * B Comme Brenda, Disc'AZ (French label), AZ 494, 1985
    * The Voice of Cornwall, Keltia Music KMCD67, 1996

~ Becky in Tucson


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: John Foxen
Date: 18 Oct 10 - 01:58 PM

The wonderful Brenda Wootton used to sing a song about a nasty character who got his comeuppance. It had a chorus that I remember (probably badly) as: "Serve you right you wicked old man - the devil catch you if he can." Can anyone come up with the title/lyrics/tune?


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,Frank Siegle
Date: 25 Feb 11 - 12:16 AM

Does anyone have "Three Knights" ("Tri Marghack") with Cornish lyrics. Or does anyone know where it might be attained. I have the English, but I also sing in Cornish (and the other Celtic languages) and would very much like to sing the song in Cornish.

Thanks.


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: scouse
Date: 25 Feb 11 - 05:28 AM

A great Cornish Song.....


                         Egloshale Ringers.

Come all you ringers good and bold,come listen to my peel,
I'll tell you of five Ringers brave that lived in Egloshale,
They bear the sway in any array,where ever they chance to go,
Good music of melodious Bells is their delight to show.

The foreman gives the signal,he steps along with toe,
He casts his eye about them all and gives them sign to go,
Away they pull with courage full,the heart it doth revive,
To hear them swing and music bring,one,two three,four and five.

Theirs Craddock the Corwainer first that rings the treble Bell,
The second is John Ellery and none may him excel,
The third is Thomas Carpenter,the forth is Thomas Cleave,
Goodfellow is the tenorman that rings them round so brave.

They went up to Lanlivery they brought away the prize,
And then they went to San Turdy and there they did likewise,
There's Stattenmen,Saint Maybenmen,Saint Issy and Saint Kew,
But the five lads of Egloshale did all the rest outdo.

Now to conclude my merry task,the Sovereigns health we'll join,
Stand every man I'll pass the flask and drink his health in wine,
And here's to Craddock,Ellery and here's to Thomas Cleave,
To Pollack and the Tenorman that rings them round so brave.


As Aye,

Phil.


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Cats
Date: 25 Feb 11 - 09:05 AM

St Tudy not San Turdy
St Mabyn Men not Saint Maybeenmen
Stratton Men not Stattenmen
and lastly it's Egloshayle

Hope this helps


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Subject: RE: Cornish Songs
From: Hawker
Date: 25 Feb 11 - 10:20 AM

LOVE IT!!!!!
San TURDY!!!!
ROFL


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Subject: Recording Cornish Songs
From: GUEST,Lanreath Film and Recording Studio
Date: 21 Nov 11 - 12:22 PM

Hi all,

I'm not Cornish, but have lived in Cornwall for five years now. Sang folk all my life, and now sing Cornish folk songs and love them. Having recently retired as an International Filmmaker I now have a small and private film and recording studio at my home near Looe.

Anyone wanting to record folk songs, or any other songs for that matter, check out my website and get in touch - www.lanreathstudio.co.uk


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