BS: The Rubble - not Barney.

Subject: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: GUEST,John Gray / Australia
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 04:36 AM

As with all of you, I watched the TT horror. Only 2 years ago I had been up to the observation deck. So, I've got a pretty good idea of the volume of the collapsed rubble. I'm intrigued as to just where its being carted to.
Manhatten is an island and I imagine there's not a hell of vacant land to dump the rubble. It's not like sneaking down to a vacant lot at midnight with a wheelbarrow full of lawn clippings or an old sofa. Somebody is going to notice if you dump 100,000 tons of rubble behind the trees in Central Park.
Maybe create another island in NY harbour, say, Liberty Island II.
Someone please enlighten me, where's it all going?

JG / FME

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: Mrrzy
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 10:00 AM

Interesting question. And are they checking it for DNA traces, to match against all the brushes brought in by the families?

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: Marymac90
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 10:32 AM

From what I gather, the rubble is taken by barge across the Hudson River to a dumping area outside the city. They are going through it at the site as well as they can, looking for any discernable traces of human remains. Any found would be tested for DNA and compared to samples from the missing brought in by their loved ones.

Yours in grisly curiousity,

Marymac

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 10:50 AM

They should have treated the place as a grave, to be turned into a quiet place where they all lay together, not a development site to be cleared.

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: GUEST,John Gray/Australia
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 11:14 AM

I agree to a degree McGrath, but surely the site couldn't be left "as was".

JG / FME

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: Mrrzy
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 11:25 AM

Indeed, what was left of those poor people can still rot and create horrible health issues. I hear it still smells horrible down there... but I'm all for a commemorative something on the site, let's not just rebuild and pretend this never happened. What did they do with the site of the Murray building, or whatever it was called, in OK City?

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: mousethief
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 11:31 AM

They built a large park with a memorial at the site of the Murray building.

Alex

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: Sorcha
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 11:38 AM

Photos of the Murrah Memorial are here.

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: Sorcha
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 11:40 AM

This article says that some if it is being taken to Fresh Kills Landfill on Staten Island........and somehow, some of it ended up in scrap yards........

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 11:58 AM

To build the WTC, the 17 or so acres that it occupies was dug out to create something they call "the bathtub" which goes more than seven stories below the ground level--apparently, even the debris from the two towers not enough to fill it--at any rate, there seem to have been huge bank vaults in the lower levels, which still contain billions, if not hundreds of billions of dollars worth of gold bullion and jewels. They would hardly want to leave that buried with the dead.

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: GUEST,Dan Kelly
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 12:15 PM

Rebuild it bigger and better. I don't want to remember bin Laden and his assholes. They've already taken up way too much of our thoughts.

Dan

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: SharonA
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 01:00 PM

Dan Kelly: A memorial at the WTC site would not be erected for the purpose of remembering bin Laden and his assholes, any more than the Murrah Memorial could ever be a tribute to Tim... ah... what's-his-name, I forget! ;^) It would be erected in memory of the victims, and of the bravery of the police and firefighters who died trying to help the office workers. Lots of us want to remember those who were killed, and keep them in our thoughts, not only to mourn but to move us to do everything we can to prevent terrorists from ever attacking again.

In addition to the reasons given here for cleaning up the site:

(a) I don't know if they're still holding out any hope of finding the black boxes from either airliner; it would be miraculous if any of them was still in good enough shape to extract information from. But I'll bet they're still looking anyway.

(b) The area was declared a crime scene, so perhaps they're still hoping to find clues.

(c) In addition to the bank vaults, there's merchandise in the underground shopping areas that's already been looted. I think that clearing away the debris will reduce and eventually eliminate the temptation to future looters to endanger themselves by entering the debris field.

(d) I imagine that, eventually, they will want to rebuild the underground transportation system, even if a memorial is erected at ground level.

(e) I'm sure that at least some of the victims' relatives would prefer to have their loved ones' remains interred at a family gravesite, where the relatives can mourn at a location that doesn't remind them of the horrible circumstances of the person's death. (I know that I, for one, would not want to be buried at my workplace!)

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: Mrrzy
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 02:20 PM

Seeing newly-built towers would remind me more of the horror than seeing the skyline with no towers, as it is now, as it was before they were built.

Any info on the search for evidence of the identities of the body parts (or smaller things) they find?

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 02:50 PM

Our ancestors would have known better. They'd have covered the whole thing deep in earth, and built a huge mound over it. And left the gold and so forth to lie with the dead.

Subject: RE: BS: The Rubble - not Barney.
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Nov 01 - 03:21 PM

I think not McGrath--the living clean up the mess and rebuilt, otherwise every city in all of civilization would be nothing a massive memorial for the victims of wars, plagues, fires, and massacres beyond number. History is full of grand disasters, and every great city has survived them--