BS: Wild Moggie Help

Subject: Wild Moggie Help
From: Ian Darby
Date: 09 Dec 01 - 09:06 PM

Any ideas on how to get what we think is a wild (or mildly psychotic) cat to join the family?

Herbert calls three times a day to be fed and sits on the steps in the back garden and blinks at us until we open the door.

At first (this has been going on for a couple of years) he wouldn't come within ten feet of us, but he's gradually built up enough confidence to actually come in the house to eat and his personal space has decreased to three feet.

He doesn't appear to be able to meow and communicates by hisses and growls. Our 28 pound Tabby, (a cross between a victorian gin queen and Bessie Smith) gets on really well with him but he appears not to be able to stand humans and I for one can't fault him.

By the way, I think the 'blinking' thing is quite important, its obviously some kind of feline mind control, but if you do it back at them you definitely get a response........

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 09 Dec 01 - 09:19 PM

G'day Ian,

Is this a British Wild Cat ...(alleged to be totally untamable) ... or a domestic cat gone feral? We never see the real Wild Cat, here in Australia, but a few generations of feral breeding selects for bush cats starting to look like the Wild Cat part of their ancestry (that's where the 'tabby' comes from in the domestic breed).

Even these part-Wild Cat types are so vicious that, when rangers trap them in National Parks, they shoot them in the trap, rather than risk getting within reach of the buggers! Naturalists have suggested that the conditioning and instincts of the cat family mean that an outsider will be (somewhat) submissive to an established cat, so your 28lb tabby is fine (Wild and domestic are closely enough related to interbreed) ... but don't expect any of this submission to rub off onto yourself.

Have fun ... observe ... at a safe distance.

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 09 Dec 01 - 09:23 PM

G'day again,

I probably should have thrown in the comment that a Wild Cat won't 'meow' - that's a sound that cats have developed for use on humans ... sort of 'feline pidgin' (much the same way that domestic dogs have learned that a bark gets a response from humans).

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Robin2
Date: 09 Dec 01 - 10:15 PM

The "blinking" you mention has sometimes been called by cat behaviorists as a "recognition" response. (I blink to show I know you). Cats will often blink back at you when you blink at them, perhaps to show they know you as one of their group.

I've taken in and tamed many feral cats, but I have to wonder with Bob, is this a true feral cat, or a wild cat? I know here in the states, many small wildcats also can't meow, but only hiss and growl. What does he look like?

Robin

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 Dec 01 - 11:13 PM

The long, slow blink can also be an expression of contentment and love, sent from cat to the person they own, as well as being a recognition and sort of a handshake.

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 01:03 AM

G'day Robin2 / Ian Darby,

I'm feeling my way here because I don't know where Ian is. When I speak of "Wild Cat", I mean Felis sylvestris, the European Wild Cat, which interbred with the Egyptian cats brought to Europe by the Romans to produce most of what we foolishly think of as the domenticated cat Felis catus - a medium size, relatively tameable, cat with a tendency to have the tabby markings of the Wild Cat ancestor.

If Ian can approach to within three feet ... it is probably not a pure-bred Wild Cat!

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Bert
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 01:47 AM

Why, what's wrong with feeding him and letting him come and go as he pleases? Also he could be someone else's pet. Our black cat goes and eats elsewhere a lot but I don't think he'd let anyone get too close to him.

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 02:04 AM

Just sit still and let him know you trust him. Have a bowl of food nearby and as he gets used to eating from it, move it a little closer each day.

I for one would be happy to let him do as he pleases though. Having just acquired two anything BUT wild cats, (huge great cushions of things, totally adorable, but so BIG!) I'm having the same trust problem.

LTS

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Helen
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 02:05 AM

I have been using the blinking system for years to make friends with domestic cats.

I have come up with the theory that if a cat is on the attack, or checking out the aggression levels of another cat, or even trying to mesmerise its prey, then it would stare unblinking into the eyes of the other animal. If the cat wasn't sure if you were friend or foe, then it would do this, but if you blink at it - and I do this repeatedly, shutting my eyes for a second at a time - then it gets the message that you are not on the attack. And eventually it will blink back and thenat some point the cat's body language changes from alert & wary, ready to fight or flee, to something a little bit more relaxed.

I find it is a very good way to make the acquaintance of domestic cats, and it might even help with your feral cat, but then again, it might not.

I've seen a few books about communicating with a cat through body language, sounds, etc so maybe you could brush up on your non-verbal feline communication skills.

Helen

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Tone d' F
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 04:24 AM

I have dealt with a couple of these, I found that getting down to they're level worked really well although I got a few comments about laying on the floor for over an hour or so.

Pick a dy when no one will come into the room you feed it and have a lot of patience,

Two cats I tried this on are now well adjusted lap tarts, the other adopted us long enough to have a litter then left

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: CharlieA
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 05:20 AM

so what about winking? my cat does that alot as well as blinking.

Cxxx

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Ian Darby
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 05:22 AM

Thanks to everyone for all the help and advice. Bob, we live on the edge of the countryside in Lancashire, England.

There are farms nearby and woods at the bottom of the street. We think our pal may be a farm cat. We don't want to kidnap him or anything but if he is a stray it'd be nice to give him somewhere to live.

We also have around five other cats that obviously come from good homes but still come round to be fed.

Thanks again.

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Ella who is Sooze
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 11:55 AM

I had a wild cat, but we had him from a kitten. With him he was like hell let loose for months. We were afraid to put our heads on the backs of our sofas - as often or not we'd have cat on our head. Sticking your toes out of bed was a no no, or dangling your feet from the edge of a sofa also a no no.

After he got used to us, and settled in, stopped running round the house, climbing curtains, wallpapered walls or just find him somewhere completely unattainable - he became so lovely.

He always retained a certain bit of wild cat, was a ferocious micer, and would never forget it if you had wound him up whilst playing with him.

I often went into the garden after playing with him, only to be chased round the garden by him, leaping in the air - with cat leaping behind me trying to attack me (when I was about 6). He never forgot, oh, and he never like men...

Something to do with being attacked. Only my dad was exempt from this, and when I'd have a boyfriend around they'd quite often find themselves being attacked - growled at, or eyed up in an unfriendly manner... I reckon he was that cat out of Terry Pratchets books, as yess eventually he only had one eye too.

But on the good side, he was ever so lovely, would hug us like a human, rubbed noses, and so loving when he felt like it.

My advice is hang in there, take it slowly, don't rush him. Little and often, give him attention, don't threaten him, if he doesn't want to come then just say ok. Oh, you could just try putting your hand out - palm down as if a gesture for him to sniff it. That usually helps, but don't go to him, let him come to you. Wild cats are usually extremely stubborn and haughty, naturally suspicious of humans. But keep trying.

E

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: Pip Freeman
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 12:26 PM

I found two kittens in our wood, I think they were more likely to be ferals than dumped domestic ones. They were very tiny, sick, cat flu, an injured eye and lots more, and needed to be nurtured with glucose and milk, they cost me a fortune in vets bills.

Now I have a tabby ex-tom called Oedipuss, he has become very much an indoor cat, slobbing in front of the fire. He is very tame, but still has the instincts of a wild cat and can pin your hand down and kick and bite you. The other one a pretty silver grey female called Bella, still prefers being outdoors, and runs away from you and hides, not tame at all. However when you do catch her she is totally gentle and never scratches. There's nowt so queer as cats!!

Subject: RE: Help: Wild Moggie Help
From: GUEST,Gusty
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 01:18 PM

Ian,

They say that a cat born in the wild is impossible to tame or domesticate, whether they are bonafide wild cats, or from litters borne in the wild of a stray mother cat that once lived with humans. (I refuse to say "owned by people." Nobody "owns" a cat, if you catch my drift.) At any rate, the Mrs. and I have successfully domesticated three "wild" cats through the years. All three became very affectionate, docile, and laid back.

One poor soul was scavenging for a meal in our dustbin one evening. He was nothing but skin and bones, absolutely filthy, smelly, and extremely skittish in the presence of human people. (Cats are people, too.) He was a longhair, but you could still see his ribs. It was really heartbreaking to think of him out there in the night with no warm kitty bed to sleep on. (Yes, I'm soft when it comes to our animal friends.) We started leaving him a bowl of food outside on the doorstep. We'd watch through the window as he would creep out of the shrubs and scarf down the food. Soon, we were able to open the door a crack and speak to him while he enjoyed his meal. My wife started calling him Fergus (Fergie) because of his thick reddish fur.

Late one bitter cold night, we were awakend by the rattling of the metal mail flap on the door. My wife was convinced it was Fergie, trying to get our attention. I thought it was the wind. But, sure enough, I opened the door, and in he walked. Our two cat pals, Tigua and Jamie, were not at all pleased, so we let him stay in the foyer with the door closed to keep them separated. Next morning he was yowling to get let out. This went on for several months, and he was beginning to look much more heatlthy. He'd cleaned himself up, his coat was filling out, and he had this big, thick mane, rather like a Maine Coon. By this time, he was allowing me to pick him up and cuddle him, but only momentarily. Then, one night, he didn't appear. We were only a little concerned, and didn't give it much thought. Next morning, my wife woke me up, shouting for me to come and see Fergie. What a state he was in. The whole side of his face was bloody. He'd been outside the door when she went to bring in the milk. I gathered him up, put him in a transport kennel, and took him to our vet. The blood turned out to be from an abscess on the side of his face that had burst. The vet fixed him up, gave him all his shots, and refused to take payment from me. He offered to keep Fergie at his office until we could find him a good home, since our two boys would not stand for an intruder. The Cat Protection League found him a nice loving family who took him in. They were even considerate enough to call us up and offer to let us come see him after he'd settle in. What a magnificent boy he turned out to be! A beatiful, big red tom, just as laid back as he could be.

We don't really know if Fergie had been abandoned, or if he was actually born wild. We suspect the former, since this was in a U.S. Navy housing complex in Brechin, Scotland. Navy families were notorious for acquiring pets while they were there, and then leaving them behind when they transferred. But, this story goes to show that "wild" cats can be tamed. Hope this gives you the incentive to persevere. Best of luck. Happy Christmas.

Gusty

Subject: RE: BS: Wild Moggie Help
From: GUEST,Gusty
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 01:24 PM

Damn. Typos in my last post. Sorry to you pedants. I won't let it happen again.

Subject: RE: BS: Wild Moggie Help
From: weepiper
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 05:03 PM

The blinking thing is cat smiling. I like doing it to cats I walk past on the street - you sometimes get an astonishing reaction, I think when the cat isn't used to a human doing it. It will sit up very straight and stare at you for a moment, then half-close its eyes to check you mean it. If you do it again, 9 times out of 10 the cat will come over and demand a fuss.
Apparently this is also why cats often dislike babies (they stare) and love people who are allergic to them (they turn away with squinty eyes)

Subject: RE: BS: Wild Moggie Help
From: Robin2
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 07:20 PM

Ferals can be tamed, it just takes a lot of patience. I've tamed about 20, caught and adopted them out. The younger you get them, the easier it is. Some are harder than others.

Subject: RE: BS: Wild Moggie Help
From: lady penelope
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 07:26 PM

Sorry to burst the 'recognition' bubble on the blinking thing, but actually it's a domination thing. To stare directly at a lot of animals ( mainly carnivors ) is a challenge, our feline friends are no different. The blink is a way of backing out of the challenge without losing face. It's usually done between animals that see themselves as equals ( us included ). Dogs usually soften the 'challenge' by tilting their heads to one side.

All the advice above is good. We had a feral farm cat. She started off by finding the most astonishing places to hide ( she actually managed to hide behind the kettle in the kicthen once, we tore the place up looking for her), occasionally performing the 'wall of death' and ended up hogging the fire and eating pizza with the rest of us.

She was never a 'cuddley' cat, but was quite happy to turn you into her personal hot water bottle if you stayed still long enough. Like Ella's, she had this large capacity to bear a grudge, and twice retalliated against supposed acts against her ( like going to the vet, etc. ) by waiting till I was asleep and then widdling on my shoulder! Lovely. I miss her.

Good luck.

TTFN M'Lady P.

Subject: RE: BS: Wild Moggie Help
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 07:35 PM

I agree with Lady P about the blinking thing - did it once and the sodding cat stuck it for about 3 mins then tried to take my eye out!

Must try that with Amber though, who has gone into her basket in a sulk. She's still eating and drinking but from being the first out to explore, she's obviously happier in her snug safe box. Not wild, just bloody livid!

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Wild Moggie Help
From: Sorcha
Date: 10 Dec 01 - 08:50 PM

A domestic feral kitten showed up here in Jan 2 years ago in the midst of a blizzard. I put canned tuna just inside the open door, and when she finally came in (hour and a half) I snuck up and shut the door.

She spent 4 days totally catatonic--would not move no matter what. Hid in my closet (with food and water) for another 3. Then she moved upstairs to Kate's bedroom (the only room upstairs) and hasn't been down since. Once in a great while she will come 3 steps down and sit on the stairs, participating vicariously in Family Life. Kate is the ONLY one who can get close to her or pet her.

She sleeps with Kate, and close friends of Kate who are here often are sometimes allowed to pet her. I swear the cat is schizophrenic---she watches things we cannot see, hears things the other animals don't hear......will NOT go outside (tried putting her in a harness with leash just once!). One weird cat. Definitely a feral domestic--she is white with large black spots and a Panda Face. Black heart between her front legs. Appears to be a cross between a Persian and a Manx--long hair, 3/4 tail and a real high rear end. Wish she was more sociable. Her name is Millefiori--Millie.