Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn

Subject: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 16 Jan 02 - 10:42 PM

Help again, Wolfgang! ;-)

I'm interested in the Christmas Carol Lippai. My music says it is a 19th century Tyrolean Carol. At the Volkslieder site here it gives the German words and the melody. (I like my melody better.)

My questions: 1) Is Lippai a proper noun (a person's name)? 2) Even though I have an English translation with my music, the German words are a bit different. (I'll write them later.) But my question is...do you think the German words at this site are reliable? In the 3rd line it says Mi, and my words say Mich. In the 4th line it says I instead of Ich. In the 5th line it says Heid, my word is Weid.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Wolfgang
Date: 17 Jan 02 - 06:07 AM

Mary,

I didn't know that song, BTW.

(1) Lippai must be be a proper name, (from websearches:) Hungarian, definitely not usual German. Since all sites that mention a region of origin for the song say it's Austrian, the Hungarian name makes sense, for at the time the song was written there was a sizable Hungarian minority in Austria.

(2) Frank who hosts that site is not a scholar, sometimes he just copies the songs from other sites or relies upon what people send him without being able to check, so you should never in general rely on lyrics from that site as you might rely on lyrics from a book.

However, in this case the words you mention are well within the usual range text variants. The lyrics are in dialect, so deviations from proper German are to be expected. Mi instead of mich and I instead of Ich are just fine and fit into the dialect. Heid instead of Weid is a slight change of meaning but it also fits well.

So far I see nothing in the lyrics themselves that hints to anything unreliable I just see slightly differing versions you may pick from as you wish.

I'll have a look at some books tonight and shall post more if I find something.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 17 Jan 02 - 02:14 PM

Lippai is a rather common Hungarian name. (Schools and institutions are named after Janos Lippai, who devised a perpetual calendar in 1660).
The song is about the birth of Jesus. Lippai, get up at once! It's as bright as day! A child is born, angels are singing, there is a young woman who must be the mother, etc.
The song was probably copied from the site http://web.utanet.at/toscher/Weihnachten/ because the note at the end (An old Christmas song which is still sung now and then by folk (or rural) singers at divine services), is the same on the ingeb site. The lyrics are accurate.
I couldn't find an English translation, but there seems to be one in a book advertised at www.kididdles.com/shop2. The International Book of Christmas Carols, 164 arrangements with chords, $24.95 plus postage.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 17 Jan 02 - 02:56 PM

Mary, could you please post the English lyrics that you have? It would be much appreciated. I don't believe that I have ever heard the carol.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Jan 02 - 12:48 PM

The city of Bremen has a number of Christmas carols, English as well as German, with midis, inc. Lippai, at www.hansestadt-bremen.de/xmas4u/index2.html. The midi for Lippai is the same as the one at ingeb.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 18 Jan 02 - 01:01 PM

Sure, Dicho. Give me a little time. Don't you think it sounds familiar? But then I may have it confused with another Tyrolean song.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Jan 02 - 01:35 PM

In Austin, Texas, there is a German gesangverein with adjacent open-air beer garden where we spent a lot of time as Texas Univ. students (large steak tartare 75 cents, large schooner dark beer 15 cents- this was in the 1950s). We enjoyed the songs when singing took place. As a result every old German song sounds familiar, but that is as far as my memory takes me.
In the mid-19C Prince Carl von Solms of New Braunfels brought a colony to central Texas. In the 1950s, German texts were still used in some of the primary schools.
Thank you, Mary. I look forward to the words. Quite a number of websites with the German, but no English version turned up.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 18 Jan 02 - 02:20 PM

LIPPAI 19th Century Tyrolean Carol
Lippai, steh auf vom Schlaf! "Was ist denn da?" Mich wundert's dass d'schlafen kannst. "Ich schlaf schon." Geh mit mir auf die Weid, Schau, was für wunder geit. 'Sist so licht wie am Tag. "Was wär das?" Bethlehem hiesst der Ort! "Wer hat's gesagt?" Ich hab's vom Engel g'hört "Hast ihn gefragt?" Ein Jungfrau keusch und rein Soll seine Mutter sein, Dort wo der Stern brinnt. "Geh nur geschwind!" So schön ist keins geborn Wie das Kind! Dass's auf dem Heu muss lieg'n Is rechte Süd! Ich tu die Mutter frag'n Ob ich's mit mir darf trag'n; Ich hätt die grösste Freud. "Du redst gescheit."		Lippai, get out of bed! "No, I'm asleep." There never was such a sleepy head! "Sleeping deep." There is a glow in the night From a great star shining bright! See, it is bright as day! "What did you say?" He's born in Bethlehem. "How do you know?" The angels, I learned the place from them. "They told you so?" Mary, the blest mother mild, Tenderly cares for her Child There, 'neath the beaming star. "Can it be far?" No sweeter, lovelier Babe Could I name. His bed nothing but a pile of hay, O, what a shame! Mary, if only I might Hold the dear Savior tonight, Pure joy I'd owe to you. "Please let me, too!"

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 18 Jan 02 - 02:25 PM

Dicho, in my book a second voice "echos" the first verse by starting one measure later and leaving out the last line.

Is there any interest in a Christmas Carol permathread similar to the Spirituals permathread? I'm investigating carols anyway, but my interest is mostly just tunes I like as opposed to completeness. Joe and MMario pretty much say go for it...but as Susan told me, it's a lot of work. Even if I organized things, I would need lots of help. Any takers?

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Jan 02 - 03:19 PM

A lot of work just to go through DT and Forum. I put in @christmas and came up with 5 pages DT and, including Forum, 81 pp. @carol yields 3 pages DT and 53 pp. inc. Forum. There are others that don't come up under these two collectives. The first step would be to go through this material. A lot of carols are in the Forum but not the DT.
A definition of carol would also be needed. Religious and secular Christmas carols? There are a lot of parodies as well (see the posting today on the Christmas Day in the Cookhouse carol, which uses God Rest Ye Merry, Gentlemen as a tune, and considered by a number of old UK soldiers as their favorite).
Our idea of carols is largely based on the Germanic Central European-British Isles-Ireland area. There are a large number from the Iberian Peninsula that are seldom, if ever, heard as well as from the eastern area of Russia, inc. all of the Orthodox material,etc., Latin America, etc.
I am afraid that it would be quite a large project even to be representative.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 18 Jan 02 - 03:48 PM

Dicho, those are the same comments Susan made. For right now I don't intend to pursue the permathread idea, I'll just post interesting songs that I find, but it seems that many are not in the DT or forum.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Jan 02 - 05:05 PM

Mary, that may be best- just post those that you find and like. Joe complained about posting the spirituals separately. I would suggest a new thread, however, perhaps just titled "Carols I like- Mary" or similar, and post them all to that thread. You could let in others who wish to post a carol (but emphasize no BS except history or new music).
Thanks again for "Lippai sollst..." It is a good, fast-paced, human carol and deserves more exposure this side of the water.
A comment about Brahms (you prob. already know this). He liked but was not a scholar of folk music. He used what he liked and mixed up melodies from the German traditions with the Hungarian gipsy-Magyar tunes. At least three of the Hungarian dances are solely his own compositions.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Tom French
Date: 18 Jan 02 - 07:30 PM

Hi Mary from Kentucky

Lippai is as great carol, I went to a boys school, and our sister school used to sing that carol. I loved it and wondered why we never got to do it. It brings the ethereal home in a reality for those who are waiting.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 20 Jan 02 - 11:08 PM

See a temporary midi here. Single line midi sent to Joe.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Wolfgang
Date: 21 Jan 02 - 07:16 AM

It is always difficult to post corrections to lyrics in dialect, for there is never a single correct way to transcribe dialect, but there is definitely one mistake in the German lyrics:

'Süd' (verse 3, line 4) has to be 'Sünd'. One word means 'south' and the other 'sin', quite a difference.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 21 Jan 02 - 08:02 AM

Wolfgang is correct...my typo. I'll alert Joe.

Subject: RE: Lippai sollst gschwind aufstehn
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 21 Jan 02 - 09:07 AM

Hi Mary,

in regard to your questions:
1. Lippai or Lippei is a southern diminutive of the German Philipp, the final -ai last step of a process of palatalization. Other guesses about Hungarian origin and others are wrong.
2. The differences in text are coming from a transformation of a traditional dialect text into High German as in the Zupfgeigenhansl, where also Weid is given. The text in ingeb.org semms to me more reliable, since it gives the song in its original language. In all songs I stumbled over green plains I found the word heid(e), not weid(e). "Weide = Pasture" is in the Alps referred to as "Alm".

Wilfried