Science of Tone Deafness

Subject: Science of Tone Deafness
From: Mrrzy
Date: 21 Jan 02 - 03:08 PM

Another very interesting bit on NPR about some new research into tone deafness. Fascinating, any thoughts from those who heard it? For the rest of you, try this. I especially liked the diva, yes she sang opera, in perfect rhythm and verse but no pitch at all... saying that while people might say she COULDN'T sing, nobody could say she DIDN'T sing... sounds like my mom!

Subject: RE: Science of Tone Deafness
From: Mr Red
Date: 21 Jan 02 - 06:13 PM

I've known singers who would be classed as tone deaf from singing "on stage" but get them at the back of the room in chorus and you wonder where the quality suddenly appears from. The real explanation in these circumatances is nerves, adrenalin causes muscles to twitch, the fight or flight syndrome. The larynx IS a muscle. Of course having someone else to pitch for you is also a remedy in these cases.
Misdiagnosis would skew the tone deafness figures.

Subject: RE: Science of Tone Deafness
From: Kaleea
Date: 22 Jan 02 - 02:43 AM

Some 20 odd years ago (yes, I know that they have been indeed odd!) I had a voice student who happened to be a square dance caller, and some of his dance attendees suggested he take voice lessons. The man could not match pitch in any way, shape or form. He had seemingly no ability whatsoever to recognize pitch and produce it. He had to to about 6 other instructors who, upon spending 5-15 minutes with him declined to go on. I agreed that if he were willing to give serious effort, we would leave anything resembling an ego outside the door, & I would work with him. I spent 2-- one hour lessons per week with him. We painstakingly worked on musical concepts such as melody moving up, down, and staying the same. He wandered vocally all up and down the keyboard for several minutes until I would say, "That's it!!" We worked in this such manner, and one day, he really began to be able to hear a pitch, and to my amazement, reproduce it vocally. After about 2 years, he could sing basic melody patterns for square dancing such as "so so so so (octave lower): SOL Ti Do" singing "allemande left and promenade home." When I finished college, I bid him a fond farewell as I left for teaching classroom music somewhere in the midwest. Since this experience, I truly believe that folks who sing "off key" or seemingly "tone deaf" are those who simply have not been taught--or have had a bad experience & are unwilling to sing in front of others. Granted there are some who would need the most extreme devotion on the part of student & instructor, but if we think about all the kids out there who are missing music in the schools, then we will find many kids who come up without having the valuable lessons learned--not just how to sing or play instruments & read music, but the lessons of discipline and wanting something so much that the kid is willing to devote much of their time to the learning. When there are so called "professionals" who sing "off key" it makes me wonder just who hired them & why,-- often with taxpayers money --to sing with professional ensembles & operas!

Subject: RE: Science of Tone Deafness
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 22 Jan 02 - 03:33 AM

I have no problem with pitch except for very low notes. I can remember in my teens (over 30 years ago) at youth club discos, the bass always seemed a semitone sharp, but I put that down to distortion by cheap equipment and over-driven speakers. Just a few years ago when I was in amateur theatricals, I accused a bass player of being way out of tune, and had to be persuaded by several others that he wasn't. These days, I've got my 12-string tuned w-a-y down to BEADF#B, and I have a real problem getting the bottom B into tune: it's too low for my tuner to register, and the beats against the octave B string arre too slow to be much help.

It's quite strange; it's not that I can't detect the pitch or distinguish the notes in the bass register: they just sound sharp.

Steve

Subject: RE: Science of Tone Deafness
From: Joan from Wigan
Date: 22 Jan 02 - 04:09 AM

I, too, have no problem with pitch except for low notes - my guitar is tuned to standard concert pitch, and I have problems hearing the pitch of the bass (6th) string. Many years ago in a physics class in school, our teacher did an experiment to find how high we could hear pitch. I could hear way above anyone else in the class, into the (?)ultra sound range. My vocals are also in the soprano range. Could these ranges be connected?

Subject: RE: Science of Tone Deafness
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 22 Jan 02 - 06:38 AM

Well, it's been a long time since I could sing soprano! But I do sing tenor; not quite high enough for top tenor in Barbershop (which may be a blessing). Maybe a straw poll among fellow Catters may shed light?

Steve

Subject: RE: Science of Tone Deafness
From: Mrrzy
Date: 22 Jan 02 - 09:23 AM

I agree with the misdiagnosis bit - I was certainly incapable of producing (or hearing parts of) pitch till I got away from my incredibly tone-deaf models at home and got into a musical dorm in college. But I could always tell THAT two tones were different, even if I couldn't reproduce the difference or say how large the difference was. My mom, however, not only can't tell whether 2 tones are the same or not, given 2 tones that ARE different she can't tell which is higher. And HER mother was very musical so it wasn't a modeling thing, she and one of my sisters really are terrifically tone-deaf. And one of THAT sister's daughters has perfect pitch, go figure. So there IS something to tone-deafness, even if there are also misdiagnoses, I think.