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Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday

DigiTrad:
WHISKEY ON A SUNDAY or COME DAY, GO DAY


Related threads:
Who is/was Glyn Hughes (27)
Seth Davy / Davey info please (53)
Chord Req: Whiskey On A Sunday (32)
Info: Whisky on a Sunday (53)


Raggytash 08 Feb 02 - 03:03 PM
MMario 08 Feb 02 - 03:23 PM
Joan from Wigan 08 Feb 02 - 03:32 PM
Barry Finn 08 Feb 02 - 08:17 PM
Joan from Wigan 09 Feb 02 - 03:03 AM
Joan from Wigan 09 Feb 02 - 03:14 AM
Raggytash 09 Feb 02 - 03:27 AM
Hrothgar 09 Feb 02 - 04:51 AM
Jim Dixon 23 Aug 08 - 06:02 PM
GUEST,machree01 24 Aug 08 - 09:21 AM
Q (Frank Staplin) 24 Aug 08 - 03:09 PM
Matthew Edwards 24 Aug 08 - 08:22 PM
GUEST,manda 11 Nov 08 - 04:03 PM
breezy 11 Nov 08 - 04:18 PM
Arkie 11 Nov 08 - 10:50 PM
Mr Happy 12 Nov 08 - 04:38 AM
Mr Happy 12 Nov 08 - 04:41 AM
Bernard 12 Nov 08 - 06:37 AM
Manitas_at_home 12 Nov 08 - 06:50 AM
John MacKenzie 12 Nov 08 - 07:12 AM
Mr Happy 12 Nov 08 - 07:55 AM
SINSULL 12 Nov 08 - 03:30 PM
GUEST,Jake 12 Nov 08 - 05:41 PM
GUEST,machree01 13 Nov 08 - 06:18 AM
GUEST,Rich 13 Nov 08 - 03:34 PM
GUEST,DESI 14 Dec 08 - 07:28 AM
scouse 14 Dec 08 - 07:56 AM
Richard Bridge 14 Dec 08 - 08:38 AM
Joybell 14 Dec 08 - 04:56 PM
Bernard 14 Dec 08 - 06:35 PM
Richard Bridge 14 Dec 08 - 07:27 PM
GUEST,Bill the sound 14 Dec 08 - 07:30 PM
Bernard 14 Dec 08 - 07:36 PM
Mr Happy 08 Jan 09 - 11:00 AM
GUEST,White Camry 08 Jan 09 - 03:35 PM
GUEST,Dave MacKenzie 08 Jan 09 - 08:02 PM
banjoman 09 Jan 09 - 07:43 AM
Les in Chorlton 09 Jan 09 - 07:51 AM
Noreen 09 Jan 09 - 08:46 AM
Malcolm Douglas 09 Jan 09 - 08:57 AM
Malcolm Douglas 09 Jan 09 - 08:58 AM
Nigel Parsons 09 Jan 09 - 09:03 AM
Noreen 11 Jan 09 - 07:50 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 11 Jan 09 - 09:14 PM
Matthew Edwards 12 Jan 09 - 05:25 AM
Matthew Edwards 12 Jan 09 - 12:32 PM
GUEST,John Forrest Liverpool 12 May 09 - 04:52 PM
GUEST,Chrissie 28 Jun 09 - 10:22 AM
vectis 28 Jun 09 - 10:30 AM
Noreen 29 Jun 09 - 07:32 AM
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Subject: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Raggytash
Date: 08 Feb 02 - 03:03 PM

I would like to find who wrote the Ballad of Seth Davy and definitive words if possibly

    He sat on the corner of Bevington Bush
    astride of an old packing case
    and the dolls at the end of his plank went dancing
    as he crooned with a smile on his face

    Come day go day
    wish in me heart for Sunday
    drinking butter milk all the week
    whisky on a Sunday


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Subject: DT Correction: Whiskey on a Sunday (Glyn Hughes)
From: MMario
Date: 08 Feb 02 - 03:23 PM

Whiskey on a sunday is attributed to Glyn Hughes in the DT
WHISKEY ON A SUNDAY or COME DAY, GO DAY (from DT)
(Glyn Hughes)

Come day, go day
Wish in my heart it were Sunday
Drinking buttermilk thru the week
Whiskey on a Sunday

He sits in the corner of Bevvington Bush
On top of an old packing case
he has three wooden dolls that can dance and can sing
And he croons with a smile on his face

His tired old hands tug away at the strings
And the puppets dance up and down
A far better show than you ever would see
In the fanciest theatre in town

And sad to relate that old Seth Davy died
In 1904
The three wooden doll in the dustbin were laid
His song will be heard nevermore

But some stormy night when you're passing that way
And the wind's blowing up from the sea
You'll still hear the song of old Seth Davy
As he croons to his dancing dolls three

Recorded by Irish Rovers
@drink @death
filename[ COMEDAY
TUNE FILE: COMEDAY
CLICK TO PLAY
SOF

Popup Midi Player





(Note from Joe Offer, 30 May 2022. It appears that the Digital Tradition lyrics are taken from the Irish Rovers recording, but a few words are different in the recording. Below is my transcription of the recording, but I'm not convinced that the Irish Rovers are a definitive source for the song)
Irish Rovers Recording: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OI-THvHvZg0

WHISKEY ON A SUNDAY (from Irish Rovers)
(Glyn Hughes)

CHORUS
Come day go day
Wish in my heart it were Sunday
Drinking buttermilk through the week
Whiskey on a Sunday


He sits on the corner of old Beggar's Bush
On top of an old packing crate
He has three wooden dolls that can dance and can sing
And he croons with a smile on his face

His tired old hands tug away at the strings
And the puppets they dance up and down
A far better show than you ever would see
In the fanciest theatre in town

And sad to relate that old Seth Davy died
In nineteen-hundred-and-four
The three wooden dolls in the dustbin were laid
His songs will be heard nevermore

But some stormy night when you're passing that way
And the wind's blowing up from the sea
You'll still hear the song of old Seth Davy
As he croons to his dancing dolls three


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Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY ON A SUNDAY (Glyn Hughes)
From: Joan from Wigan
Date: 08 Feb 02 - 03:32 PM

WHISKEY ON A SUNDAY
(Glyn Hughes)

He sits in the corner of old Beggar's Bush
On top of an old packing crate
He has three wooden dolls that can dance and can sing
And he croons with a smile on his face

CHORUS
Come day go day
Wish in my heart it were Sunday
Drinking buttermilk through the week
Whiskey on a Sunday

His tired old hands tug away at the strings
And the puppets dance up and down
A far better show than you ever would see
In the fanciest theatre in town

And sad to relate that old Seth Davy died
In nineteen-oh-four
The three wooden dolls in the dustbin were laid
His song will be heard nevermore

But some stormy night when you're passing that way
And the wind's blowing up from the sea
You'll still hear the song of old Seth Davy
As he croons to his dancing dolls three


I don't know if this is the original version or not - I remember from years ago a singer telling us that Seth Davy actually died in 1902, and I always sing that date in the version I do (which isn't the above, by the way). This version is from a website which gives lots of information about Dancing Dolls.

Joan


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Barry Finn
Date: 08 Feb 02 - 08:17 PM

I think there was quite a nice thread on this some time ago. Good luck, Barry


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Joan from Wigan
Date: 09 Feb 02 - 03:03 AM

There are two previous threads:
Seth Davy info please and
Whisky on a Sunday.

The version I know is the same as that quoted by roopoo in the first of the above links, and is the one sung by most if not all of my fellow Liverpudlians.

Joan (originally from Liverpool)


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Joan from Wigan
Date: 09 Feb 02 - 03:14 AM

Out of curiosity, I've just been looking on the web for Beggars Bush and Bevington Bush. The former is apparently in Dublin, while Bevington Bush was/is in Liverpool: "the name of a thickly wooded valley between Bevington Hill and Everton Hill. An inn on Bevington Hill was called 'The Bush'." The area has not been 'thickly wooded' for many many years, but the area fits. As the version of the song quoted in the DT is that sung by the Irish Rovers, perhaps they changed the location to suited their Irish origins?

Joan


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Raggytash
Date: 09 Feb 02 - 03:27 AM

A dancing doll is a wooden manikin pivoted at the shoulders, hips and knees, held by a thin rod about 18 inched long drilled into it's back. It is made to dance by placing it on a 4 x 24 inch thin plank which is then drummed with the fingers causing the doll to "dance" The second verse in the version I know goes "his tired old drummed a wooden beam, and the puppets dolls they danced the gear, a far better show than you ever did see, at the Pavvy on New Brighton Pier. This again would indicate the Liverpool connnection


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Hrothgar
Date: 09 Feb 02 - 04:51 AM

I know the dolls as "nimblejacks."


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Subject: Lyr Add: COME DAY GO DAY or MASSA IS A STINGY MAN
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 23 Aug 08 - 06:02 PM

Marsh, Richard. Marsh's Selection, or Singing for the Million, Containing the Choicest and Best Collection of Songs Ever Embodied in One Work, New York: Richard Marsh, 1854, page 92:

COME DAY, GO DAY.
OR
MASSA IS A STINGY MAN.

Sung with everlasting shouts of applause by the
renowned old Dan Emmit.


1. Oh, massa is a stingy man,
And all his neighbors knows it,
He keeps good whiskey in his house,
An neber says, here goes it.

CHORUS: Sing come day, go day,
God send Sunday,
We'll drink whiskey all de week,
And buttermilk o' Sunday.

2. A stray dog come to town,
'Pon a bag of peaches,
De horse run off an he fell down,
And mashed 'em all to pieces.
Fala du, fala du da du da la,
Fula du fala du lala du la du la.

3. Hoe cotton, dig corn,
Den we feed de niggies,
An oh, lord Moses,
What a luscious time for niggas.

4. Black Jen's got a holler tooth
An says it's always aching,
But when she puts de hoe cake in,
Den it stops a plaguing.

5. Oh, missus says we eat too much.
An wear out too much trowses.
She'll make us feed on atmosphere.
And dress in nature's blowses.

6. She sent consumption Joe one night.
Tobacco leaf to kiver,
It made him sneeze out de moonlight.
An cough away his liver.

7. Oh, massa loves to hug de gals,
And missus doesn't knows it.
But as I like de angels too,
I believe I won't exclose it,

8. Oh, missus says we shouldn't eat,
Kase we don't work a Sunday,
But natur keeps digestion's mill,
A-goin as well as Monday.

9. Massa sich a stingy man,
I no more ketch him possum.
I roast and eat him in de wood,
And den I swear I loss him.

10. Old Jake went out to shoot,
And when de gun it go off,
It kick his right ear out o' joint.
Den fall and smash his toe off.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Whiskey on a Sunday
From: GUEST,machree01
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 09:21 AM

I have Whiskey On A Sunday - Danny Doyle 1968 LP, Danny
is great at singing it, a briiliant album 12 songs in all.


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Subject: Lyr. Add: MASSA IS A STINGY MAN (minstrel, 1841)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 03:09 PM

"Massa Is a Stingy Man," composed and sung by R. W. Pelham and pupil Master G. W. Pelham (The Little Ace of Spades). Firth & Hall, NY, 1841. Indiana Univ. Sheet Music Collections.

Lyr. Add: MASSA IS A STINGY MAN
G. W. Pelham, 1841

Old master is a stingy man and ebry body nowes it,
He keeps good brandy in his house and neber sez here goes it.

(Dance inserted by the Pelhams)
2
Mr.: Unkel John he came to toun he had a load of Peaches
Masr.: The wagon broke down he slipt and mashed dem all to pieces,
3
Mr.: A strayed dog he come to town and had on calaco trouses
Masr.: He swore he could not see the town dar was so many houses.
4
Mr.: My sister sal she dremt a dream she dremt she was a jumping
Masr.: She tort she eat a musharoon as big as any pumpkin.
5
Mr.: And then she went to climb a tree and two or three to boost her
Masr.: And dar she sot a flinging corn on our bob tail rooster.
6
Mr.: Now far you well my sally dear and far you well my honey
Masr.: Far you well my dearest love I am going to make some money.

The changes in these songs seem capricious, but they were constantly modified to suit different audiences and to avoid repetition at succeeding performances, and when they were 'borrowed' by different troupes.

In 1943, Firth and Hall included it in a folio of Ethiopian Quadrilles, with Lucy Long, Old Dan Tucker, De Boatman Dance, and Ginger Blue. (Virginia Minstrels given on the title page). Musical scores only, no lyrics. In the Lester Levy collection.

Also in 1843, "Come Day, Go Day" was the title used by Buckley's Minstrels. http://www.circushistory.org/Cork/BurntCork3.htm

"Massa Is ..." appears in a MS of 48 tunes collected by Dan Emmett, dating c. 1845-1860. They are discussed in a paper by Hans Nathan, "Early Banjo Tunes and American Syncopation," The Musical Quarterly, vol. 42, no. 4, pp. 455-472 (not seen, first page at jstor.org).


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 24 Aug 08 - 08:22 PM

Its nice to see this topic revived, and the discovery by Jim Dixon of the Daniel Emmit song confirms that the chorus is a lot older than the Ballad of Seth Davy, as Greg Stephens suggested on another thread about the song.

Glyn Hughes was a folk singer in Liverpool in the late 50's and 60's who died quite young, and it seems that he wrote this song about 1959 after hearing stories about Seth Davy from older people who remembered seeing him. Glyn Hughes recorded the song for Fritz Spiegl about 1959, and amazingly, some years later, Fritz Spiegl discovered some old lantern slides of Liverpool scenes one of which featured a group of children watching a black man in a bowler hat making some wooden dolls dance on a plank. The scene can definitely be identified as being outside the Bevington House Hotel in Liverpool. All this information comes from the late Fritz Spiegl's Liverpool Street Songs and Broadside Ballads published by the Scouse Press as Liverpool Packet No 1.

Seth Davy is also mentioned by Ray Costello in Black Liverpool: The Early History of Britain's Oldest Black Community 1730-1918 as "another black street entertainer...a West African often seen in the Scotland Road area of the city accompanying his cheerful songs with a dancing puppet show."

The Black community in Liverpool has made a substantial contribution to the musical and cultural life of the city (and the world) which is only belatedly being acknowledged. Seth Davy, like Billy Waters earlier on in London, was a street entertainer who deserves celebrating. Some other Liverpool black musicians include the jazz musician Gordon Stretton, the 60's soul singers Joe and Eddie Ankrah of the Chants, and the great Cavern singer Derry Wilkie.


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: GUEST,manda
Date: 11 Nov 08 - 04:03 PM

The song was written in liverpool - but changed to suit the irish


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: breezy
Date: 11 Nov 08 - 04:18 PM

nobody has mentioned the Spinners, till now, who may be able throw further light on the subject.

Any Spinners out there?


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Arkie
Date: 11 Nov 08 - 10:50 PM

The lyrics above indicate that the dolls were puppets worked by strings. My recollection of the song referred to the dancing dolls mentioned above which are also called Limberjims here in the Arkansas Ozarks.


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Mr Happy
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 04:38 AM

Jackie & Bridie used to do this song & had dolls dancing on a wooden stave as accompaniment


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Mr Happy
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 04:41 AM

ps

not the kind with strings.

The dolls were wooden with jointed limbs, had a stick in their backs, & the puppeteer sat on the stave & banged it with a fist, so that the dolls danced a sort've tapdance!


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Bernard
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 06:37 AM

According to this site the writer was Glyn Hughes...


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 06:50 AM

...and not Glyn Hughes as credited in the first couple of postings then?


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 07:12 AM

Jig Dolls.

JM


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: Mr Happy
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 07:55 AM

Its a little disappointing to find that many've the songs I'd thought old & traditional were actually composed in the 1960s & 70s


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: SINSULL
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 03:30 PM

Mr. Happy, if a song is good, it doesn't matter when it was written. Share it.


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: GUEST,Jake
Date: 12 Nov 08 - 05:41 PM

The Houghton Weavers did a terrific version of this song. It's sang beautifully and the melody is lovely.


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: GUEST,machree01
Date: 13 Nov 08 - 06:18 AM

I have a Danny Doyle album, called "Whiskey On A Sunday" {1968} the song remained at No. 1 in the Irish charts for 10 weeks.


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Subject: RE: Who Wrote The Ballad of Seth Davy
From: GUEST,Rich
Date: 13 Nov 08 - 03:34 PM

For info, from www.fsc.org


Whisky on a Sunday, AKA Come Day, Go Day, AKA Seth Davy was written in the 1960s by Glyn Hughes. Hughes was born in Liverpool in 1932 and died there in 1972. During his brief life he had many occupations: journalist, short-story writer, bookseller's assistant, musician in a circus, film extra, hotel liftman and song writer, to mention only a few. The song is about a well-known Jamaican street entertainer in Liverpool in the 1890s/1900s and has been recorded by among others The Dubliners, The Irish Rovers and Rolf Harris.

Gerry Jones, Liverpool singer, says:
"Seth Davy was a real person, he really existed, and he died a couple of years into the 20th century. There was a street and a pub, both called Bevington Bush just north of Liverpool City Centre, and Seth Davy did do a busking act outside.
"In his book Liverpool: Our City - Our Heritage, Freddie O'Connor tells us that in 1760, half a mile from Marybone (St Patrick's Cross) along Bevington Bush Road was a hamlet named Bevington Bush which had an inn called simply the Bush, which became a favourite haunt for folk to travel out into the country, to the Bevy Inn, as it became fondly known. With the opening of Scotland Road, the ancient Bevington Bush Road became a minor road amidst the massive slum district that would soon engulf it. As the district was built up it also lost its original name.
"Please do not be taken in by any Irish versions of this song, or any reference to "Bebbington". Bebington is "over the water" - not in Liverpool at all. I know the truth for a fact because, when I was a brand-new teacher in the Dingle in 1963, our old lollypop man told me that he had actually seen Seth Davy doing his stuff. So I have spoken to a first-hand witness.
"I have heard that Seth Davy's own singing was a non-too-wonderful monotone, and not the pleasant melody that was written about him in the 60s folk boom."


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: GUEST,DESI
Date: 14 Dec 08 - 07:28 AM

As an Irish singer who performs this song, I can confirm that indeed it's not an Irish song at all, but as most people point out it stems from Liverpool where there was a real street entertainer named Seth Davel. Many somgs get 'adopted' by my country folk and Seth Davely has the sound of a good Irish song, bit like Dirty Old Town who many Irish and English believe to be Irish, in fact the 'dirty old town' in question refers to the home town of the writer Ewan Mc'coll, Salford near Manchester. It's a cedit to Glyn Hughes writing skills that many including myself originally thought it to be a much older traditional song, I'll be singing Seth Davey tonight 14/12/08 as it happens
Desi, the artist formerly known as, who?


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: scouse
Date: 14 Dec 08 - 07:56 AM

I learn these words over on the "posh." side. i.e. The one eyed city!!

His tired old hands drummed wooden beams
And the puppet Dolls they danced the gear
A better show ever, that you would see
At the Tivvie (Tivoli) or New Brighton Pier

An on some stormy night down "Scotty." road way
When the wind's blows up from the sea
You can still hear the sound of old Seth Davy
As he croons to his dancing dolls three.

As Aye,

Phil.


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Dec 08 - 08:38 AM

It occurs to me that the ranges of local words to this song is supportive of the Karpeles defintion.


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Joybell
Date: 14 Dec 08 - 04:56 PM

Does anyone else keep falling into 3/4 time while singing this song, or is it just me?


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Bernard
Date: 14 Dec 08 - 06:35 PM

Uhh?!!


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Dec 08 - 07:27 PM

I never bothered to think about it but isn't part of it 4/4 and part 3/4?

I, however, do "the WIld Mountain Thyme" in 4/4.


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: GUEST,Bill the sound
Date: 14 Dec 08 - 07:30 PM

I found this track on a Max Boyce album, The Miles and the Roads
he gives credit to Glyn Hughes, I hope he's right.
Bill


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Bernard
Date: 14 Dec 08 - 07:36 PM

I've always done both entirely in 3/4...

Bill the Sound... don't let Manitas hear you say that! I had the temerity to post a link to a website... it seems that someone had already mentioned the Glyn Hughes connection... sshhh!!

;o)


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Mr Happy
Date: 08 Jan 09 - 11:00 AM

So clearly, the DT version is off the mark as it mentions strings being pulled to work the dolls.

The plank or wooden beam isn't referred to at all


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: GUEST,White Camry
Date: 08 Jan 09 - 03:35 PM

"The song is about a well-known Jamaican street entertainer in Liverpool in the 1890s/1900s ... "

Was Seth Davy black, then?


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: GUEST,Dave MacKenzie
Date: 08 Jan 09 - 08:02 PM

I was told that Bevington Bush was the site of the old Liverpool Sally Army Hostel.


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: banjoman
Date: 09 Jan 09 - 07:43 AM

I have known this song a long time, and when I first learnt it I remember my Mum telling me that her Grandmother had related how she had seen a man with dancing dolls outside the Bevington Bush pub which stood on the junction of bevington Bush and Scotland Road - I remember that - so it probably confirms the date suggested by White Canary.


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 09 Jan 09 - 07:51 AM

"The song is about a well-known Jamaican street entertainer in Liverpool in the 1890s/1900s ... "

Was Seth Davy black, then?

Chances are...


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Noreen
Date: 09 Jan 09 - 08:46 AM

I've only ever heard it completely in 3/4.

...Bevington Bush which had an inn called simply the Bush, which became a favourite haunt for folk to travel out into the country, to the Bevy Inn...

Hence, going for a Bevy?!


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 09 Jan 09 - 08:57 AM

The trouble with songs that are discussed over multiple threads is that few people bother to read the other ones, so the same questions and answers tend to be repeated and the same ground covered over and over again; not least when an old discussion like this one is revived after six years of merciful oblivion by somebody with nothing new to say. Such people tend to resurrect the least informative thread available, of course.

There is more information about Davy himself in other threads (see links above) including the fact that Fritz Spiegl reckoned to have seen a photograph of him. See Matthew Edwards' post in Lyr Req: Whiskey on a Sunday.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 09 Jan 09 - 08:58 AM

The recent resurrection of another thread on this song reminds me that the information Matthew mentions isn't in my copy of Liverpool Packet No 1: is the attribution wrong, or is there a sheet missing from mine? Is the photograph reproduced anywhere?

Also, Matthew quotes Ray Costello as describing Seth Davy as 'West African': was 'West Indian' (for 'Jamaican') meant, or is there some dispute as to his place of birth?


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 09 Jan 09 - 09:03 AM

Noreen:
I think you'll find that Bevvy is a shortened form of Beverage.

Cheers
Nigel


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Noreen
Date: 11 Jan 09 - 07:50 PM

That's what I had always assumed, Nigel- but it could just as well be the other- do you have any evidence?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 11 Jan 09 - 09:14 PM

Anything factual about Seth Davy anywhere?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 05:25 AM

>>>>Anything factual about Seth Davy anywhere?

As a street entertainer Seth Davey/Davy must have led a fairly marginal existence, and I haven't been able to trace him so far in Census or other official records. I'd expect there to be a death certificate from around 1900-1905, but he might have been recorded under a different version of his name.

Given that the historian of Liverpool's Black community, Ray Costello, has described Seth as a West African in Black Liverpool: The Early History of Britain's Oldest Black Community 1730-1918, while other accounts have descibed Seth as Jamaican, Malcolm asked if there is a dispute about his birthplace. To which I can only say that there is as yet no firm evidence to go on for either place; we are relying on people's memories of what they heard from their parents and grandparents and other older people. All the same I expect Ray Costello's information has some substance to it.

Glyn Hughes, who wrote the song in the first place, never knew Seth Davey but only learned the story from the memories of older people so some of the 'facts' in the song may be wrong.

Its possible that there are some more facts to be uncovered in the Liverpool archives, or that the local papers may contain some other memories, but it may take some time before they turn up.

Matthew Edwards


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 12:32 PM

According to the Scouse Press website copies of Liverpool Packet No.1 Liverpool Street Ballads, Broadsides and Sea Songs etc are still on sale for the very reasonable price of £2.45 plus postage.
Since Malcolm's copy was missing the text of Seth Davey with the illustration of the Bevington Bush street scene, I'm not sure whether the current edition includes this, but the Packet is still good value for money.
In the meantime I have emailed the Scouse Press to ask if the original lantern slide depicting Seth Davey is still in their possession. I'll report back here if and when I get a reply.

Matthew Edwards


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: GUEST,John Forrest Liverpool
Date: 12 May 09 - 04:52 PM

A wonderful song,

Rolf Harris sings it with the doll on you tube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yl96bDSvL-g&t=74s.

Incidentally Going for a "Bevvy" has nothing to do with
the song, it means going for a beverage.


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: GUEST,Chrissie
Date: 28 Jun 09 - 10:22 AM

Seeing as though the song mentions the Pavvy (New Brighton (Floral)pavilion), and New brighton pier, could the frist line also be interpreted as Bebington Bush - thus aligning it more to Wirral?


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: vectis
Date: 28 Jun 09 - 10:30 AM

I thought the line read
The palais or New Brighton Parade.


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Subject: RE: Origin: Ballad of Seth Davy / Whiskey on a Sunday
From: Noreen
Date: 29 Jun 09 - 07:32 AM

You can interpret it any way you like, Chrissie (as many people do!) but the orginal words say Bevington Bush.


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