The Mount Rushmore of Folk?

Subject: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST,Bailey
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 03:10 PM

My four faces would be Dylan, Guthrie, Van Ronk, and Ramblin' Jack. How about yours?

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: MMario
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 03:14 PM

My personal ones? Probably Bruce O.;Sandy and Caroline Paton; Dick Greenhaus; Jean Ritchie.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 03:28 PM

this is almost too difficult to be worth discussing!, would you include/omit collectors? Child, Sharp, Lomax, Ritchie, etc. or just performers? trad or folk stylists? it raises all the long-thread arguments about authenticity, personal preference,etc.

i.e. what is a real mount rushmore anyway?

and then we'd get into the early or late Elvis discussion as to how to portray them

young Dylan? vs cheesy Slim WHitman mustache Dylan?

etc. I give up

abandon all hope ye who enter this thread!

no, really, give up, back out, check out something else!

no, really, don't get caught in this maelstrom!

aahhhhhh, too late............

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST,Les B.
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 04:08 PM

Oh hell - just put a Strad copy fiddle, a Gibson banjo, a Martin guitar and a Webber mandolin up there and be done with it !!! :)

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: MichaelAnthony
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 04:44 PM

I find it a straight-forward question, and it's implied it's performers.

I would put up Guthrie, Dylan, and two others. Haven't found the two others yet.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: pattyClink
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 05:49 PM

We have a farm museum/park in our town where festivals happen to be held. On your way in you pass a little rose garden, it's about 20 feet across, round. In the center is a statue of a farmer who has stopped his hard work long enough to sit and read a book for a few minutes. It's wonderful. So if ya ask me, it ought to be a few nameless people sitting in a circle, sharing tunes, because that's what folk is about, not a celebrity roster.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Steve-o
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 06:56 PM

Bailey, My "favorites" might be closer to those you have listed, but the ones that belong on the Mt. Rushmore are none other than all four of The Weavers!

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 07:12 PM

Mine would show Guthrie, Seeger, Lomax and Jean Ritchie. Or perhaps Phil Ochs, Bob Dylan, Joan Baez and Tom Paxton. Of course, if it was in England it might feature MacColl, Lloyd, and that Waterson-Carthy couple. Scotland - Hamish Henderson, Jeannie Robertson, Jean Redpath and Alex Campbell. Ireland - the original Planxty line-up, or else Andy Irvine, Christy Moore, Donal Lunny and Paul Brady. Northern Ireland - the Sands Family. Wales - difficult, how do you cut four separate choirs in stone?

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 07:13 PM

piffle...it nothing but another popularity contest!...and popularity contests are invariably won by someone with high visiblity...but not usually by those with the most talent or importance. (and influence and fame do NOT always imply talent OR importance!)

If I voted for Maybelle Carter, Jeannie Robertson, Bob Copper & Dave Macon, who'd even pay attention?..(and those 4 don't begin to touch the possibilities!)

People who start these things are 'usually' just looking for a way to say "Dylan" again,,,*sigh*

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: DonMeixner
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 07:17 PM

Carl Sandburg, The academician and collector, the gatherer of America's voice.

Joe Hill, The everyman, the rabblerouser and eye opener, before Woody there was Joe

Malvina Reynolds, the woman who showed women that strength has a song and voice and a power.

Any small childs, boy or girl, the hope and future of a tradion.

That would be my choice and why.

Don

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Art Thieme
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 08:32 PM

Elvis, Patti Page, Rosemary Clooney and me.

When we were a group, as I've said before, we called ourselves Preslwy, Page, Rosemary and Thieme

(Art)

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 08:34 PM

Doc Watson, Mississippi John Hurt, The Carter Family and Woody Guthrie. Each of them have had a far-reaching effect on the following generations. BilD... I paid attention to your nominations.. Dylan has been equally influencial, so maybe I'd consider him in the foothills. Rushmore Hill.

Jerry

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST,jonesey
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 09:17 PM

The reps from Wales would be Dafydd Iwen, Robin Huw Bowen, Dylan Thomas and Sian James. At the opening ceremonies the Alarm would re-unite, the Wild Welsh Women would do a few tunes, bring Catherine Zeta-Jones on for the balance of the the set. Mike Peters would do a little solo turn after which Richard Burton's version of 'Under Milk Wood' would be played. Then all the performers would come back out to sing a rousing rendition of "This Land is Your...oops wrong country!

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 10:11 PM

Dafydd Iwen did a house concert here (Wash DC)...oh..maybe 15-18 years ago...great musician, story teller, and spokesman for the Welsh language and cause!...

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Coyote Breath
Date: 09 Apr 02 - 11:43 PM

Oh gawd here comes that P.I.T.A. CB:

I would love to see Mount Rushmore un-defaced. The Black Hills should be liberated from tourism and returned to their rightful custodians.

I feel that monumental sculpture is a perfectly awful way to honor the "greats" of any music, especially people like Joe Hill and Woody Guthrie et al.

Ok, I got THAT off my chest. I WOULD like to see recognition given to almost all those mentioned (Presley, Page, Rosemary, and Thieme?) Go to your room Art!

CB

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 10 Apr 02 - 02:59 PM

Mine would show Guthrie, Seeger, Lomax and Jean Ritchie. Or perhaps Phil Ochs, Bob Dylan, Joan Baez and Tom Paxton. Of course, if it was in England it might feature MacColl, Lloyd, and that Waterson-Carthy couple. Scotland - Hamish Henderson, Jeannie Robertson, Jean Redpath and Alex Campbell. Ireland - the original Planxty line-up, or else Andy Irvine, Christy Moore, Donal Lunny and Paul Brady. Northern Ireland - the Sands Family. Wales - difficult, how do you cut four separate choirs in stone?

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST,johnnythebone
Date: 10 Apr 02 - 03:11 PM

Dylan deserves his own mountain.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 10 Apr 02 - 03:14 PM

Sorry for the double posting, same problem as in another thread - my PC said it couldn't get through last night. Liar!!

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 Apr 02 - 04:33 PM

Coyote Breath, you've just said what I was going to say. Building a statue and sticking it in a town square or something like that is one thing. Vandalising a mountain, and sticking a bunch of politicians, or even musicians, on its side is quite another.

And I'm certain that anyone who'd be worthy of a place on the mountain would agree on that.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Amos
Date: 10 Apr 02 - 04:41 PM

I've always enjoyed the noion of Mount Rushmore being a monument to the ideas that resided in those heads, not the heads themselves. Nature being as prolific in all things as she is, I think she can spare a mountain to indulge a little idealism.

As for the Mount Rushmore of folk music, I'm afrtaid you'd need a hundred mountains just to start, and I think any of the candidates would prefer to hear their music being sung or played than to see their faces carved in a hill somewhere. I'm for doing that instead!

A

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 10 Apr 02 - 06:45 PM

Four ordinary people.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: kendall
Date: 10 Apr 02 - 07:35 PM

Folks dont get memorialized on mountains.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: kendall
Date: 10 Apr 02 - 07:46 PM

Most of the people mentioned are not, in my opinion, folk singers. How could you leave out Buryl Ives and Rachael Higgins, (my 6th grade teacher)

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Morticia
Date: 10 Apr 02 - 07:55 PM

Art, you should be ashamed *BG*...

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Coyote Breath
Date: 11 Apr 02 - 12:17 AM

Amen, McGrath!

Amos, nature ain't the issue. The paha sapa (black hills)are sacred to the Northern plains people.

American ethnocentrism designated the ancient mountain to be a "perfect" place to honor those men.

The people of the Northern plains were NOT consulted and to many of them it is as though someone "tagged" the Sistine Chapel with gang graffitti.

Yes the ideals of Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln deserve to be honored and are in many, many, ways. Teddy, on the other hand...

CB

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Amos
Date: 11 Apr 02 - 12:41 AM

CB --

Well, Teddy was a jolly and energetic guy, but I concur he doesn't really qualify to have his face carved on a sacred mountain. And I understand what you are saying about the land. If it mitigates anything, the sculptor, Gurtzon Borglum, rejected the original fatcats idea of putting Western heroes up on the mountain. in a way, he understood the sacredness of what he was dealing with. Here's what he said in 1924 when undertaking the project:

"We believe the dimensions of national heartbeats are greater than village impulses, greater than city demands, greater than state dreams or ambitions. Therefore, we believe a nation's memorial should, like Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln and Roosevelt, have a serenity, a nobility, a power that reflects the gods who inspired them...."

Regards,

A.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Apr 02 - 01:39 AM

Art, is your name pronounced "Time"?

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Dan Schatz
Date: 11 Apr 02 - 03:18 PM

I'm with Guest. Four ordinary people, sitting on a porch somewhere. (Carved on a moutain that has consented to have faces carved on it.)

However, Art Thieme could now join Nikos A.on a Mount Rushmore for punsters.

Dan

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: kendall
Date: 11 Apr 02 - 08:34 PM

Teddy never humped a servent/ slave, never suspended Habeas Corpus; but, he did put the "robber Barons in their place, and he drove the republicans nuts with his Trust Busting. How you stand depends on where you are standing. However, I do agree that it was damed presumptious of that guy to deface a sacred mountain. Come to think of it, that's one of the reasons Ben Laden hates us today; infedel troops on sacred ground. We never learn, do we?

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST,McFeeney
Date: 12 Apr 02 - 04:17 AM

My mountain would have Bob Dylan, Joanie, Woody, and Roger McGuinn.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Steve-o
Date: 12 Apr 02 - 11:51 AM

".....it was damed presumptious of that guy to deface a sacred mountain. Come to think of it, that's one of the reasons Ben Laden hates us today; infedel troops on sacred ground. We never learn, do we?" Ummmm-hummmm....I guess that "damed presumptious" guy should have looked up in the Sacred Mountain Directory before defacing them with that horrible graffiti. And Ben Laden surely is the guy to teach us all about what is "sacred", ain't he?? We started out with a mild little question about who the all-time great folk singers might be, and it degenerated all the way to this degeneration. AAAAArrrrrgggghhh!

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: kendall
Date: 12 Apr 02 - 11:55 AM

Steve O your reply is a good example of our ethnocentric attitude. We are never wrong!

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Don Firth
Date: 12 Apr 02 - 01:12 PM

An interesting exercise, if totally pointless. I recall George C. Scott refusing the Oscar for "Patton," and saying that first, he thought if anyone was going to win it that year, it should have been Melvin Douglas for "I Never Sang for My Father," and second, the whole idea of a "best actor" is idiotic. There is a level at which an actor has achieved excellence, each actor is unique, each performance is unique, and there is no "best."

The number of folk singers (born to the tradition) and singers of folk songs (those who came to it later) who have achieved this kind of excellence, by however you want to measure it (by the way, how do you measure it?), would take several mountain ranges and it would still leave a bunch of people out. Besides, both the Park Service and the environmentalists would probably squawk very loudly.

I cast my vote with pattyClink, above, at 09-Apr-02 - 05:49 PM.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST,paul pierce
Date: 12 Apr 02 - 04:31 PM

I don't think we have to get on our high horses here. It's a hypothetical question, and it's OK to have an opinion after all. Isn't it? It was where I grew up, anyway. I don't think we have to get into a "best" this or "best" that, either. It's MY personal Rushmore, and feel free to may YOURS different. "You can be in my dream if I can be in yours."

Without further adieu: Woody Guthrie, Pete Seeger, Ralph Stanley, and the mighty Bob Dylan.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 12 Apr 02 - 05:11 PM

Woody Guthrie, Pete Seeger, Leadbelly, and for the fourth......hmm... Bill Monroe? Jimmie Rodgers? Jean Ritchie? Dylan? Could be any of those, or...?. Not a "best" list, but a "very significant" list of those who brought/brings this music in some of its American forms to the fore. I'm assuming that this thread is asking for U.S. musicians for the "Rushmore" type sculpture? Hard enough to name four, let alone making it an international sculpture. I treat this as Guest Paul does - it's just a hypothetical question.

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: greg stephens
Date: 12 Apr 02 - 05:24 PM

we dont know their names and we dont know their faces so forget it

Subject: RE: The Mount Rushmore of Folk?
From: GUEST,Disco Danny
Date: 13 Apr 02 - 01:50 AM

I'm going with Neil Young, Carter Stanley, Emmylou Harris, and Dylan.