how is Nic Jones

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 05:20 PM

Greg,

There is a common language with which we can rationally discuss controversial opinions: the language of civility, which tolerates other people's points of view and opinions.

Perhaps that language is foreign to your worldview?

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: John Routledge
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 05:17 PM

The CD is a triumph. The cover unfortunately isn't.

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Sondra Willis
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 05:03 PM

Nerd,

I would say yes, some of us would judge the character of a person who has done what Nic Jones has done with this CD, and that it is not unreasonable to do so.

I am aware of the history of Nic's unfortunate accident and his subsequent troubles with Celtic Music. None of that excuses the cover art, IMO. Rather, it reveals something about the man I was shocked to discover, particularly in light of his disability.

You seem to be saying I have no right to judge someone I don't know personally. If this were not a public figure, I would agree. However, Nic Jones is a well known and highly regarded figure in the English folk scene. In that regard, I do have a right to judge his actions--particularly an action so blatant and, in my view, offensive.

I had always enjoyed Nic's music. However, my opinion of him as an artist and a man plummeted when I saw the cover art. I realize others will have different opinions, and that they are as free to express theirs as I am mine.

As I said earlier, I stand by my criticism of the artist and the man for his choice of cover art. Truth, like beauty and humor, is in the eye of the beholder. I have spoken the truth as I see it. The cover art on this CD was bound to be commented upon because of it's shocking nature. Are we not to express our opinions on it, unless they are either positive or supportive of Nic Jones?

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: greg stephens
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 04:57 PM

You accuse Nic Jones of "getting a cheap laugh at the expense of disabled people". Then you claim not to have personally attacked him. I dont think we have a common language to discuss this rationally.Bye.

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Sondra Willis
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 04:46 PM

If anyone here cares to see what I view as more appropriate art representing the disabled community, please have a look at this website, which is a gallery of art created by disabled artists:

www.vsarts.org/gallery/exhibits/disability/index.html

I have not personally attacked Nic Jones. He has made it perfectly clear by his choice of cover art, that he wishes to thumb his nose at the disabled community. THAT is downright shameful, no matter what the man has been through.

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST,ed silberman
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 04:17 PM

Ralphie - Thank you for the apology and claification. A buddy of mine clued me in to the "trolling" phenomenom on Mudcat. I think I can understand why you might be, to use you word, oversensitive. Has it really been twenty years? In any case it's good to learn that Jones has at least some degree of health and functionality. May that continue to be so and increasingly so. Thank you all for helpful responses.

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST,greg stephens
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 03:38 PM

I dont normally get involved in the more controversial aspects of Mudcat, but I have to say that that Sondra Willis' personal attack on Nic Jones, given what the poor man's been through, is downright shameful.

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Nerd
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 03:09 PM

Sondra,

I'm sure we're all sorry that Tony Hall's cover "art" offended you, and God knows I thought it was in poor taste too, but isn't humor a very subjective thing? Should we make assumptions about Nic's value as a person because he did the equivalent of telling an offensive joke?

Speaking up for Nic, what Ralphie is alluding to is that Nic's recordings have been "buried" in record company vaults for years which, together with his disability, "killed" him as a recording artist. The cover is alluding to that situation more than to his disability per se.

Ralphie, who is Nic's friend, is far more qualified to judge his humanity than either you or I, but I for one think his humanity IS demonstrated in his music. The loving way he selected, arranged and sang old songs, the slight chuckle in his voice during humorous passages, and the way his guitar creates the perfect mood for each song, suggest to me a man of great sympathy and artistic vision. The cartoon proves he has a sick sense of humor, too. Remember, our imperfections are part of what makes us human, too.

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Sondra Willis
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 12:22 PM

I have heard Nic's music. It still doesn't change my opinion of the cover art on the latest CD.

Being disabled doesn't mean you have compassion and decency, any more than being a musician means you have compassion and decency. A tiny minority of disabled people do, at times, wish to draw attention to themselves from the able bodied communities, and offend and alienate other disabled people in the process, which is what I believe he has done here. He is getting a cheap laugh at the expense of disabled people, IMO.

I stand by what I said. My opinion of Nic Jones plummeted when I saw the cover of Unearthed. You can try and sanitize the cover art all you want, but I'm not buying it anymore than I'm buying your suggestion that Nic's humanity is demonstrated in his music. I disagree on both counts.

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: Jeanie
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 12:13 PM

It's so good that a new audience is finding Nic Jones through that CD - *and* to hear that he's been performing live with his son. I was lucky enough to hear him loads of times, as a regular at "The Castle" - Brentwood Folk Club - in the late sixties and early seventies. Brilliant. Don't know if you ever look in to Mudcat, Nic and Julia, but if you do, I was one of that terrible gang who used to sit on top of the piano in the corner...

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: Ralphie
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 11:38 AM

Sondra
It was never Nics intention to annoy people with disabilities....God knows, he's been living with his for 20 years.
It was actually a bit of a side swipe at the people who've denied him his just rewards for far too long.
Again, apologies if you are offended by the sleeve.
But, If you listen to the record, I'm sure you'll be touched by Nics humanity.
Best Wishes
Ralphie

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Sondra Willis
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:49 PM

I too had been looking forward to the release of "Unearthed" but when I saw the cover, I was so put off by it, I decided not to buy it. He may be a good musician, but I don't think he is a very compassionate or sensitive human being.

Nic Jones and Tony Hall don't speak for the disabled community I am proud to be part of, thank goodness.

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: Ralphie
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:43 PM

Sledge...absolutely true...
Joe (Nics son) is a damn fine guitarist...(Left handed too), and I think it was a Pete & Chris Coe gig up north somewhere...missed it meself, bugger!
I don't think it will become a regular gig, but, I know he really enjoyed himself...He's still writng songs, so, maybe, one day....!!?
Ralphie

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: sledge
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:33 PM

There was report on the Fairport Convention list I think that said Nic had played a gig recently with his Son, his Son did most of the work but Nic was able to contribute significantly to what was described as an enjoyable evening, the first of many more we hope.

Sledge

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: Ralphie
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:27 PM

Ed....Worry not...and please accept my apologies for any offence.
None intended I assure you.
There have been a few anonymous Guests making trouble recently, and I 'm probably a bit oversensitive..Sorry!
And Jeri.... The cartoon spawned the title..Tony wasn't given any orders regarding the cartoon, just the basic info that we were recycling old tapes....It all came out of his warped imagination !!!
By the way the dog is actually a pretty good likeness of Nics faithful hound, Harry
All the best and sorry again for any misunderstanding
Ralphie

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: Jeri
Date: 20 Apr 02 - 10:02 PM

I FINALLY bought "Unearthed" from Camsco at the NEFFA festival today and listened all the way home. Wonderful CD!! I've heard a cut or two by Nic Jones from the Folk Roots/fRoots compilation CDs. Other than those, this is my first experience hearing Nic, and I've been missing a LOT.

The cover cartoon IS icky, but knowing Nic wanted it makes a big difference. Did the cartoon come about because of the CD title, or was it the other way around? Or coincidence?

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ed Silberman
Date: 20 Apr 02 - 05:06 PM

I only log on to Mudcat as a guest very irregularly so if I performed some ettiquette slip pleaase pardon me. I assure that my request for an update on Nic Jone' condition was sincere and can be taken on face value. Thank you to all who answered with good info and/or where to get good info. Sorry I forgot to include my name when I made my inquiry.

Ed Silberman

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: Ralphie
Date: 18 Apr 02 - 09:16 PM

Re - Reading the original "GUEST" message, why do I get the feeling that I've been HAD by a troll...
If not, I apologise, If I have........Ah Well, so it goes, at least it keeps the interest in Nic alive...So, bit of a backfire then...!
Cheers Ralphie

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: Ralphie
Date: 18 Apr 02 - 09:10 PM

To set the record straight.....And to avoid unnecessary digging through the Mudcat archives....
Nic, insisted that the Tony Hall cartoon of his (dis) interring, be the front cover of "Unearthed"...He fell about laughing when he first saw it!!...
Gonna argue with that?....I don't think so....!
The threads on this site concerning Nic, and his recent activities are too numerous to list, and I'm not going to start another one, but.....Do a search, and all will be revealed....Rest assured, he was hale and hearty when I spoke to him last week.
Ralph... (Prod "Unearthed")

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST,LesB (UK)
Date: 18 Apr 02 - 02:06 PM

Hi Thanks for the Phil Beer link. An interesting site. Les

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 18 Apr 02 - 10:20 AM

Some relatively recent info on Nic can be found on www.philbeer.co.uk.

Pete

Subject: RE: how is Nic Jones
From:
Date: 18 Apr 02 - 04:43 AM

Last year at Sidmouth, during Shirley Collins talks about her early years travelling with Alan Lomax recording in the states she suddenly turned round and ran towards rhe window which was open as it was very hot. She embraced a rather drawn looking but happy man looking in the side window, and seemed overjoyed to be with him. I couldnt work out who he was, but you will guess that it was Nic, one of my heroes, so he is still trolling around, but presumably unable to play to previous standards for whatever reasons. I was disturbed by the recent art work on his double CD Unearthed by tony hall, and wondered if he regarded it as a bit of a joke, I certainly dont like the implications of it, but what do I know?

Subject: how is Nic Jones
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Apr 02 - 02:51 AM

Lookin for information about Nic Jones' condition? I haventheard anything for years. No one talks about it anymore. i've even met people who know his recodings but never even heard about his accident! I'm still concerned after all these years.