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Andy Griffith Show & Dillards

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53 21 Apr 02 - 09:49 PM
DougR 21 Apr 02 - 09:51 PM
53 21 Apr 02 - 09:53 PM
Charcloth 21 Apr 02 - 09:55 PM
Steve Latimer 21 Apr 02 - 10:04 PM
X 21 Apr 02 - 10:12 PM
53 21 Apr 02 - 10:21 PM
GUEST 21 Apr 02 - 10:34 PM
khandu 21 Apr 02 - 10:43 PM
WFDU - Ron Olesko 21 Apr 02 - 11:07 PM
X 21 Apr 02 - 11:52 PM
CarolC 22 Apr 02 - 12:33 AM
X 22 Apr 02 - 12:39 AM
DougR 22 Apr 02 - 01:23 AM
GUEST 22 Apr 02 - 03:00 AM
GUEST,jonesey 22 Apr 02 - 07:16 AM
kendall 22 Apr 02 - 07:19 AM
kendall 22 Apr 02 - 07:20 AM
GUEST,BIll Kennedy 22 Apr 02 - 09:19 AM
53 22 Apr 02 - 10:02 AM
X 22 Apr 02 - 10:09 AM
Lynn 22 Apr 02 - 10:32 AM
alinact 22 Apr 02 - 10:36 AM
GUEST 22 Apr 02 - 10:41 AM
Lepus Rex 22 Apr 02 - 11:01 AM
SharonA 22 Apr 02 - 11:19 AM
SharonA 22 Apr 02 - 11:31 AM
GUEST 22 Apr 02 - 11:49 AM
SharonA 22 Apr 02 - 12:11 PM
Lonesome EJ 22 Apr 02 - 12:40 PM
CarolC 22 Apr 02 - 01:04 PM
Ron Olesko 22 Apr 02 - 01:10 PM
Lonesome EJ 22 Apr 02 - 01:15 PM
kendall 22 Apr 02 - 01:29 PM
Steve-o 22 Apr 02 - 01:29 PM
GUEST 22 Apr 02 - 01:43 PM
GUEST,Jac Holzman 22 Apr 02 - 01:59 PM
Lonesome EJ 22 Apr 02 - 02:06 PM
GUEST,Jac Holzman 22 Apr 02 - 02:42 PM
Lonesome EJ 22 Apr 02 - 02:50 PM
53 22 Apr 02 - 09:53 PM
Lepus Rex 22 Apr 02 - 09:58 PM
53 22 Apr 02 - 10:00 PM
Lynn 22 Apr 02 - 10:03 PM
Lonesome EJ 22 Apr 02 - 10:03 PM
GUEST,Bill Kennedy 23 Apr 02 - 10:06 AM
Mooh 23 Apr 02 - 10:23 AM
DougR 23 Apr 02 - 04:34 PM
kendall 23 Apr 02 - 04:40 PM
Steve-o 23 Apr 02 - 05:04 PM
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Subject: Andy Griffith Show
From: 53
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 09:49 PM

Does anybody like the Andy Griffith Shows in which the Dillards portray a hillbilly band called the Darlings. I love that show.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: DougR
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 09:51 PM

Yes, Bob, I do. But I liked the Andy Griffith Show with our without the Dillards.

DougR


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: 53
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 09:53 PM

Yes, Doug I do too. Bob


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Charcloth
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 09:55 PM

on of the best show ever on TV


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 10:04 PM

I was a big fan. The Darlings sure added something to the few shows that they were on. How about Earnest T. Bass?


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: X
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 10:12 PM

Doug Dillard has a new banjo book out that has the "Darling" tunes in it and more.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: 53
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 10:21 PM

WE watch it on TVLand all the time. It's still one of the best choices there is.

Bob and Glenda


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 10:34 PM

Am I the only one who was bothered by the fact that Mayberry, Andy's idyllic town in North Carolina, never had one African American person in it? In all the years it was on television, not one African American actor had even a bit role.

This show was filmed at the height of the civil rights era in the American South. The Andy Griffith show could have helped to make a difference. However, Griffith chose to ignore the fact that African Americans even existed in the South.

Oh yeah, one of the best shows ever on TV.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: khandu
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 10:43 PM

I love the program. The shows featuring the "Darlings" were entertaining, but not my favorites. I did not like the "Darling" girl. (I forget her name.)

Did not like Ernest T.

I watched it when it was new, and I have watched it ever since. And I will continue to watch as time allows. Great program.

khandu


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 11:07 PM

Guest, you are being naive if you think that television as it existed in the early 1960's would have allowed Griffith to tackle the issue. It is easy to be a Monday morning quarterback and blame Griffith but that wouldn't be right. Television still had some growing up to do, as did the country.

Politics and social conscious aside, it was a great show. It is nice to watch the old episodes and see how folk music would often sneak into the soundtrack. The Dillards were only one aspect. Griffith would often be seen strumming a folk tune on the guitar. The humor could easily have taken the Beverly Hillbillies approach making fun of southern culture, but instead it presented a warm picture of the citizens of Mayberry - poking fun at individual traits instead of cultural stereotypes.

As an aside, I was under the weather with a virus a few weeks ago and spent a few hours watching Andy Griffith on TVLand. I felt I was transported back in the 1960's when a sick day from school would be spent in front of the old Motorola black and white watching Andy Griffith. All I needed was an interuption for coverage of a Mercury or Gemini launch and it would have been a perfect reproduction. I could picture my mother bringing me a glass of gingerale and some saltines, and maybe a Pop-tart when my stomach was well enough to handle it! You can go home again, all it takes is a TV show to bring you there!


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: X
Date: 21 Apr 02 - 11:52 PM

I can recall one African American in one show and only one show, Garret Morris. He later became a regular on the TV show "Mission Impossible".


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: CarolC
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 12:33 AM

Actually, I believe that the Andy Griffith Show was the first television show in the US to have a character on it who was black. I don't know if that was a one time only thing, but I think they were a groundbreaking show in that respect.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: X
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 12:39 AM

Ah...That was Gary Morris. Sorry.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: DougR
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:23 AM

Come to think of it, I don't think I saw a Tibetan on that show either. Shoot.

DougR


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 03:00 AM

Wha?


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST,jonesey
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 07:16 AM

Ahh...wrong again the name is Greg Morris.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: kendall
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 07:19 AM

GREG Morris.

I read somewhere that this was the most popular series in history. Wonder if Sienfeld will be around 40 years from now.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: kendall
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 07:20 AM

They had an Englishman once; does that count?


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST,BIll Kennedy
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 09:19 AM

maybe the best all around 'sitcom' ever made for TV, pathos, bathos, humour, everything, AND music. The best feature of the show, which has been cut in all of its syndication, that I have seen, was the last part after the last commercial break. Andy sitting on the front porch with his guitar, Opie, Aunty Bee, and maybe some character who had been over the house, all singing old songs together. I would love for whoever is syndicating the show to restore those moments to it, or run an entire show of just those 2-3 minute musical moments.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: 53
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 10:02 AM

This show was the medicine that everyone needed during that time.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: X
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 10:09 AM

Did I get the "Mission Impossible" thing correct?


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Lynn
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 10:32 AM

Did you know you can whistle the Andy Griffith theme as a break between verses in "The Gypsy Rover"?


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: alinact
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 10:36 AM

The citizens of Mayberry were a very likable mob. The chatacters in Seinfeld would have to be the most un-likable bunch of misfits I would ever hate to meet.

Allan


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 10:41 AM

According to CarolC there was a black character on the Andy Griffith Show.

According to The Banjoest, that black character was olayed by Garret, no, Greg Morris (a natural mistake, they're both black).

If you go to

http://us.imdb.com/Name?Morris,+Greg+(I)#guest

you will find a list of every TV guest appearance that Greg Morris made since his debut in 1959. No mention of The Andy Griffith Show.

Then, if you go to

http://www.tvland.com/shows/griffith/episode_index.jhtml

you will find a synopsis, with the names of guest stars, for every episode of The Andy Griffith Show. No mention of Greg Morris.

Why don't CarolC and The Banjoest just do a Google search and find out the facts before making things up?


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 11:01 AM

I can't even sit through a single episode of this show. How could anyone enjoy something so nauseatingly sincere? All I can think while watching it is: "Please, TV Gods, throw in a wise-cracking serial killer, or maybe just make Opie gay." If it weren't for "I Love Lucy" sucking ass up in the #1 spot, this would be my least-favourite sitcom, ever. :)

---Lepus Rex (I hate this show)


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: SharonA
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 11:19 AM

The GUEST who posted on 22-Apr-02 - 10:41 AM said: "If you go to http://us.imdb.com/Name?Morris,+Greg+(I)#guest you will find a list of every TV guest appearance that Greg Morris made since his debut in 1959."

That is incorrect. The heading in that list clearly states "Notable TV guest appearances", so not every guest appearance is listed. If Morris did appear on the Andy Griffith Show, IMDb must not have considered it worthy of note.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: SharonA
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 11:31 AM

Perhaps the "Morris" confusion stems from the fact that there was a recurring role on the program performed by Howard Morris (who was not African-American). He played mountain man Ernest T. Bass, according to this page: http://www.tvland.com/shows/griffith/show_index07.jhtml


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 11:49 AM

...great story about how the Dillards got the Andy Griffith gig, as told by one of the Dillards himself:

It seems as though they had only been in Los Angeles a few weeks, playing local gigs and generally starving to death when one of them found out about the Griffith audition and figured, "why not?"

Griffith listened to them play for about 30 seconds, then stood up and said, "That's it, I've heard enough."

The Dillards figured they had been rejected again (they originally came out to California to land a record deal, and eventually wound up on Electra, which was better known for signing groups like The Doors, not The Dillards).

Griffith said, "You guys are perfect. You all look as dumb as rocks." The rest, as they say, is history.

In hindsight there was some resentment at the show playing up to some typical Southern stereotypes. The "boys" were so dumb they couldn't even say "Howdy."

But the other side of that coin is, when you can play that good, you can let your music do your talking for you.

The Dillards made up for their lack of social graces by opening up a great big can of whup-ass every time they tore into a song like "Dooley." The underlying theme was, they were able to redeem themselves through music.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: SharonA
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 12:11 PM

Ron Olesko says, "...you are being naive if you think that television as it existed in the early 1960's would have allowed Griffith to tackle the [African-American actor] issue. It is easy to be a Monday morning quarterback and blame Griffith but that wouldn't be right. Television still had some growing up to do, as did the country."

I agree, but I want to point out that if the show and the network had not chosen to "ignore the fact that African Americans even existed in the South", and instead had created roles for black actors that reflected the way blacks were treated at that time in the South, the result would most likely have been shamefully demeaning.

Don't forget that most roles written for African -Americans at that time were for servants such as butlers or maids, or for poor or vagrant persons. Breakthrough roles such as Bill Cosby's in "I Spy", Greg Morris's in "Mission: Impossible", Diahann Carroll's in "Julia" and Nichelle Nichols's in "Star Trek" were very controversial. Advertisers don't like controversy unless it increases viewership, and advertisers fuel the TV industry.

For all we know, the writers of "The Andy Griffith Show" may have attempted to introduce a black character as a respected member of the community, but the advertisers or the network may have nixed it because of a fear of ratings drop-off. If so, perhaps the absence of black actors on "Andy Griffith" was the result of a conscious choice on the part of the writers NOT to create an African-American character at all if they weren't allowed to create a character that was not a demeaning caricature of a human being.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 12:40 PM

The Beverly Hillbillies may have portrayed southerners as bumpkins, but remember...the main plots nearly always showed the Clampetts getting the best of the urbane sophisticates around them. I liked the show where Mr Drysdale thought that the Clampetts had an ongoing feud with a family called "the Greens", while Jed was talking about Collard Greens. "Yep," said Jed, "by the end of April we had Greens planted all over the property. You couldn't walk five feet without steppin' on one. Then the big rains came and washed all them greens out of the ground and down into the crick."

The Andy Griffith Show was great, I thought. Yeah, it was chock full of homespun American rural values, but it nearly always used good humor and hilarious characters to demonstrate them. It had a great cast of characters : Barney Phyfe was a classic of the self-important bumbler. Otis, Floyd, Gomer, Aunt Bee, Ernest T (whom I can thank for a persistent nickname in High School), and Opie were all well drawn and well acted.

Now if you want a real sickener of a sitcom, Lepus, how about Green Acres? Watching that show gave me a tangible feeling of wasting my time, and was nearly claustrophobia-inducing with its obnoxious characters, corny humor, and two-dimensional sets. Petticoat Junction was nearly as bad, except for old, cynical, cantankerous Uncle Joe who kept things relatively interesting.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: CarolC
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:04 PM

Why don't CarolC and The Banjoest just do a Google search and find out the facts before making things up?

I never said the character was played by Greg Morris.

But I was wrong about the Andy Griffith show being the first to have a black character. Aparently there were a limited number of shows that had black characters who were typical of the prevailing US stereotypes of black people at that time.

However, not too long ago I saw a show that was a retrospective about the Andy Griffith Show on which I'm pretty sure I remember it being shown that there was a black character on at least one episode (and I guess they felt it was groundbreaking because the character wasn't a stereotype). It's possible that my memory is faulty about this. I don't have any problem with being wrong. But I don't think you can prove me wrong just by doing the kind of search you did in this case.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Ron Olesko
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:10 PM

Sharon,

It should also be noted that the breakthrough roles that you mention came in the latter half of the decade. In 1960 when Andy Griffith debuted (originally as a spin-off from the Danny Thomas show). Griffith left the series in 1968, just as those breakthrough roles were changing television. It would have been interesting to see what Griffith would have done with the series if he stayed.

Lepus,

We talking Mayberry, not Fargo! What were you expecting from 1960's TV????? Sounds like your TV changer needs to be repaired if you are forced to watch Andy Griffith to the point where you become nauseous! Good luck!! :)

Ron


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:15 PM

Of course, Amos and Andy featured an all-black cast years before the Griffith Show, although few would call it ground-breaking. Stereotypical as it was, it may have been less insulting to African Americans than the standard fare on Def Comedy Jam. Was the principle objection because it was the work of white writers perpetuating stereotypes, rather than black ones?


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: kendall
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:29 PM

Except for the background music(which really sucked) Barney Miller is the best sit com ever. NYPD Blue is the best dramatic series, but, alas, again all that pounding makes me go for the mute button.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Steve-o
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:29 PM

Back to the music-related stuff of this subject: "Electra, which was better known for signing groups like The Doors, not The Dillards..."- Boy, are you ever a youngster- Electra was a major label for FOLK MUSIC long before the Doors existed. And BTW, the Dillards were blown out of the water when the Country Boys (later to be Kentucky Colonels) played Andy Griffith!


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:43 PM

...so when Electra signed The Dillards back in nineteen-sixty-something how many bluegrass/folk acts were on that label, compared to acts like The Doors?

The Dillards themselves were surprised that they wound up on Electra, given the label's roster at the time.

(whistling "Forever Young")


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST,Jac Holzman
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 01:59 PM

We signed The Dillards to Elektra in 1962 and released their first album in 1963. Elektra was almost exclusively a folk music label at that time.

The Doors were the first rock band we signed to Elektra. That was in 1966. We put out their first album in 1967.

Jac Holzman Founder of Elektra Records


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 02:06 PM

Hi Jac. When was the band Ars Nova signed, and was that an attempt to cultivate an "art rock" niche for Elektra?


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST,Jac Holzman
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 02:42 PM

Ars Nova was signed in 1968. They did one album for us that tanked. They did a second album for Atlantic in 1969 and it tanked too.

I don't know that we were trying to cultivate anything other than record sales. The folk music scene, our bread and butter since 1955, was in serious decline and we tried a number of different acts. The Doors, obviously, worked for us. Ars Nova didn't.

That's it for today. I've got a golf game with Maynard Solomon to get to.

Jac Holzman


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 02:50 PM

Thanks Jac. Hit 'em long and straight.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: 53
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 09:53 PM

I really love all the history you guys are sharing, keep it up.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 09:58 PM

Ugh, Green Acres, Petticoat Junction. Hate those too. Wanna know the sick part, though? I LOVE the Beverly Hillbillies. :(

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: 53
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 10:00 PM

Beverly Hillbillies had some good picking on those shows by Flatt and Scruggs.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Lynn
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 10:03 PM

Boy, for a thread that was supposed to be fun, this one got mighty serious!!


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 22 Apr 02 - 10:03 PM

If Jac comes back to this thread, I wonder if he would share some thoughts about the amazing transition in music that happened from 1960 to 1970. Being a period of almost unlimited experimentation and an increasing diversity of tastes, it must have been extremely difficult for the folks at Elektra to anticipate what would be marketable. I would also love to hear Jac's take on how the record business has changed from the inception of Elektra to the present day.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 10:06 AM

I know it's called thread creep, but I've been trying to find the answer to this question for a long while and have asked on ohter threads, but since Jac may come back to this thread after a round of golf or two here goes.

Did Elektra ever release the promised childrens' album of Susan Reed? and if so, where can I find a copy?


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Mooh
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 10:23 AM

I generally agree with folks as to the quality of Green Acres and Pettycoat Junction, particularly as compared to The Andy Griffith Show, but I think one of the best and poorly disguised jokes is the name "Hooterville". In a time when young boys like myself had little on TV to drool over, those hooters were mighty fine! Three pair in a little out of the way hotel made for some fine school boy fantasies...Boy, that takes me back!

(Drool). Mooh.


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: DougR
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 04:34 PM

I don't understand why many of you feel that the purpose for a television sitcom is to educate. It's not! (my opinion only of course) It is to entertain. When it ceases to be entertaining, it ceases to be.

The fact that the Andy Griffith Show had no Black characters is beside the point. It is conceivable that Mayberry had no Black citizens. I never saw a Chinese actor on the show either, or an Afghanstan, or a Japanese. Would it have made the show more entertaining? Maybe. It would depend on the plot of that particular show.

I think actors want to be thought of as actors, not as Blacks, Japanese, Chinese, or anything else. As ridiculous as I thought Halle Berry's "performance" was after she accepted her "Oscar," I think that was the point she was trying to make.

DougR


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: kendall
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 04:40 PM

Call the "Home" !! Doug is beginning to make sense! LOL


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Subject: RE: Andy Griffith Show
From: Steve-o
Date: 23 Apr 02 - 05:04 PM

Wow, I unearthed Jac Holzman (quite possibly he was here all the time)- how about the magic of this here medium? Jac, betcha there's 75% of your catalogue on vinyl in my back closet. Elektra gave me countless hours of enraptured listening and LEARNING. Thank you, thank you..


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