BS: How the FBI missed 9-11

Subject: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: Bobert
Date: 03 Jun 02 - 11:18 AM

Well, from what Iz reading right here in this morning's Washington Post ("New Orleans Brothel Made a Federal Case" p A3) looks like the FBI has been more interested in what goes on between consenting adults that tracking down real criminals and potential terrorists. Seems we've been using tax dollars to pay FBI agents to sit and listen in to thousands of hours of phone taped conversations of a brothel in New Orleans owned by Jeanette Maier and netted after 13 months and who knows how much out the taxpayer's dough, ahhhh (drum roll please) yes, netted on misdemeanor charge. Hmmmmmm? I told you all that John Ashcroft is more interested in what goes on between consenting adults than just about anything else on the horizon. Yep, that pervert and the rest of them holier than thou-ist won't be happy until there is a camera in every bedroom, backseat of your dad's Oldsmobile and hay barn in America... Give this poor ol' hillbilly a break....

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 03 Jun 02 - 12:02 PM

Well, Bobert, not sure that this case (or any other) prevented the FBI from missing 9-11, but for sure it proves that an awful lot of time and resources is put into some dubious priority by the budget holders.

There are similar tales here in the UK. For example, the police seem to spend most of their time and money chasing and/or photographing speeding motorists "in the interests of public safety" because there are some 3,000 or so deaths on the roads per annum. Of course, the fact that far many more women and men routinely die of breast/prostate cancer each year seems to pass without a similarly enthusiastic response from the Govt. Can't deny that detection and therapy for both are getting better, but it doesn't stop me from wondering what the f*ck's going on sometimes...

Pete

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jun 02 - 11:49 PM

The "agents" don't speak/read Arabic/Ganistan

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: Sorcha
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 12:30 AM

So, are we Cop Bashing??? (not that this CopWife doesn't think the FeebiesAll don't need to be bashed--personal opinion is that all the feebies are more or less idiots and always have been......)

Please note that my Personal Opinion is not necessarily my Public Opinon due to paycheck options.........and I truly hate that kind of political shit. I have indeed voiced my Personal Opinion to the Chief more than once but it never does any good.

I suppose I should be glad we're in a small town instead of a gigantic one......I wouldn't even be able to see the Chief of Police in Chicago......

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: DonMeixner
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 12:44 AM

In my opinion hind site is twenty twenty. As a nation we became a little insular over here. It couldn'y happen here until it did. Did the FBI drop the ball? Probably, same with the CIA. And then they have their turf wars as well. They won't help the other out for fear of losing the collar and the press. Now they will be more cooperative and diligent for awhile.

I am less worried that the CIA/FBI won't do their jobs than I am about John Ashcroft. His type of religion/politics scare me no end. He is the reason to separate church and state. I think it's good we have become a little more conservative as a nation. It won't hurt us to be more self reliant as individuals and each take more of a hand in determining our destiny. I'd hate like hell to think we went down the tubes as a nation because we gave the power away to a Richard Nixon or a Bill Clinton and left them in charge.

But politics and religion should have no interplay between them. If Ashcroft can't leave his cchurch at the door to his office he should be tossed out. If he is more concerned about an aluminum bust's bust than he is of whether the CIA/FBI are doing their jobs then he isn't the man for his.

Just an opinion.

Don

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: sledge
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 03:58 AM

Peter,

Maybe its not such a bad thing that speeding and resulting road death and injury should be reduced. I've been in on duty in casualty when RTA victims have come in and they are not a very pretty sight, assuming they survive long enough to get to hospital.

Two stories to help illustrate where my view point is coming from, A couple of years ago, a friend of mine, a newly qualified police officer was first on scene at a town cwntre RTA, the driver had a substantial part of his left side displaced into his chest cavity and did not survive long, his passenger lost several parts of his anatomy and died soon after in hospital, it took several days to find the missing body parts. closed casket funerals all round. My friend was affected so badly he nearly quit the force and took some time to get over it.

Last year I attended a course on RTA victim/casualty extraction, one of my fellow attendees, the year before had lost his wife in an RTA due to another driver going a little too fast, he had to wait in the wreckage of his car as the fire crew and paramedics tried to save his wife, he heard it all from the first call of the firemen to the call for the defibrillator to her being pronounced dead at the scene.

Given that many cars on the road are now quite small compacts less able to protect their passengers from serious high speed impacts surely the boy racers and arrogant need to be controlled. Would you wish either of the above to happen to any of your family and friends, I doubt it.

And we may have 3000 road deaths, but how many more are seriously injured such that prolonged hospitalisation is required and so on with less serious inuries that still require prolonged convelescence.

Sledge

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 07:01 AM

Sledge, you skewed my point. I wasn't knocking road safety measures nor condoning speeding, I was questioning the priorities of public fund usage, which is Bobert's original point.

And there is no way that the people in charge of police governance in this country are getting their priorities right. They are transfixed by motorists / immoralilty (again, see Bobert's original post), and they are running scared of political correctness, so-called racism and the press.

They have totally lost the plot, as witnessed by the current "we can't police it, so let's legalise it" stance on drugs.

This isn't cop-bashing, it's wrong-priorities-and-ducking-the-real-issues-bashing.

(And Pleeeeeese don't call me Peter, I hate it).

Pete

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: sledge
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 08:36 AM

Peter,

I felt your initial post was so broad based as to require a response, what has police policy to do with cancer, I've also seen more of that than I wish.

But you are right about this Government and their predecessors bowing too much to so called public pressure (the press), St Tony has a long way to go before he convinces me he's not just a closet Tory who wears a red tie.

cheers

Stuart

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: Devilmaster
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 08:57 AM

Hindsight is ALWAYS 20/20.

Lets be really honest here. Nobody ever believed that would happen. Foreign terrorist incidents had, up until that point, been limited here in the Americas. And although the devastation of 9/11 was major, terrorist incidents are still somewhat limited here. We have had more incidents in the United States perpetrated by, as Danny Coulson put it, Bubbas, which are the home-grown yahoos who read 'the turner diaries' and such.

I honestly don't believe that the information was there, to accurately tell authorities, 100%. Oh sure, someone in the Capitol thinks so, but remember, any senator or congressman is a politician, and their first and foremost desire is to get recognized. I am a politician, and the first thing you have to say to yourself, when you see a politician standing up for something, is what is the angle?

Its been almost a year since the attacks, and because of the talk about did they know, or did they not, just proves to me that Washington is closer than ever to getting back to normal.

Steve

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 10:03 PM

Sorcha: Please know that the intent of thid posr was not to bash cops, but their bosses. I mean, there is way to much emphasis on "victimless crime", such as drug use and prostitution. Meanwhile the bad folks are getting awat with murder. This ain't got nuthin to do with cops. It has a lot to do with the John Ashcroft's of the world, who are more concerned in coralling the law abiding folks who may not perform sex the way John and his wife (and possible mistresses) they way that he and his partners do. And meanwhile, while he's directing the FBI to focus their attention--- 13 months worth and thousands of hours--- some bad folks get away with one. I know I'm preachin to the choir, but, hey this really about sops at all. I like cops. I know every cop in my town on a first name basis and they are some of my best friends...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: Stephen L. Rich
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 03:24 AM

There is no question that the FBI dropped the ball this time. To thier credit, it is one of the few times that i can recall that any law enforcement agency has admitted it (and without sliding into that lame, passive voice "mistakes were made" routine)and is taking steps to prevent it in the future.

Whether or not this is uncharacteristic honesty of just a grab for more power is another discussion (and another thread in this forum). Either way it was nice to hear the FBI admit that they goofed.

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: Mrrzy
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 11:57 AM

Where devilmaster says "Nobody ever believed that would happen" - sorry, those of us who've already had family killed by terrorists at any time since the 1979 takeover of the Teheran embassy knew it would happen, inevitably, someday. It's just the GOVERNMENT who didn't think anybody would dare. Quels cons.

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: katlaughing
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 12:42 PM

Dondarlin'...I don't think we are conservative in that we are keeping some of our rights. Since the Shrub took office it seems he and his cadre have been intent on taking away a lot of our rights, without our having a say...witness the FBI deciding it could now go into churches...they didn't even have to go through Congress for that.

I agree, Ashcroft and his ilk are of much more concern to me, too, though. What really worries me is that is it him or Rumveldt(sp) who has such a high approval rating and there's been talk of whichever it is to run for prez? THAT is scary because he will continue the Shrub's campaign to do all they can to go to the far right, eroding once and for all the separtaion between church and state.

Right now, what I am seeing is a society, in general, which seems content to let the gov. run roughshod over us all in the name of the great FEAR which Bush shoves down the mass consciousness throat on a daily basis. 9-11 was the best thing that could've happened for his presidency, although he is starting to sound like a one-note Johnny...:-)

Odd thought, anyone thought of how this would've played had we done our dates the way you all do across the pond? 11-9 instead? Doesn't have quite the ring/connotations here, does it?

kat

Subject: RE: BS: How the FBI missed 9-11
From: Sorcha
Date: 06 Jun 02 - 06:28 PM

OK, Bobert, I see now. Sorry, wasn't slamming you at all. I agree totally with your comments. Feebies are just plain weird. Always have been, IMO. Sorry if you thought I was upset with you.