Michael Collins Memorial CD

Subject: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Fiolar
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 06:39 AM

'Catters may be interested in the following news item in a recent issue of the Southern Star which is published in Skibereen.
"COLLINS CD - As part of the fund-raising drive to erect the National Michael Collins Memorial in Clonakilty in August, the organising committee recently released a promotional CD entitled ? "The Michael Collins Scoraíocht ? An Evening of Sing, Poetry and History associated with the Life and Times of The Big Fella". The CD, recorded at the official launch of the project at Kilmainham Jail in February and at a special 103FM Scoraíocht at the Argideen Heritage Park near Clonakilty in early March features contributions by Taoiseach Bertie Ahern, Mr. Tim Pat Coogan, who wrote a Michael Collins biography; Cllr. Jer White, Mayor of Clonakilty, and Mrs. Elizabeth O? Sullivan, grandniece of Michael Collins. Also featured on the CD are Tim Crowley and Traolach O Donnabháin of the Memorial Committee and local singers, songwriters and poets. All of the content relates directly to Michael Collins and his life and the turbulent times in which he lived, most notably from the 1916 Rising to his death in 1922. The CD, which was produced and arranged by Mr. Bob Jennings, is a valuable memento of the National Michael Collins Memorial Project. The committee says that plans are now well in train to have the monument erected and unveiled officially on August 22 next, the 80th anniversary of the tragic death of West Cork?s most famous son. The CD is available at usual outlets in the Clonakilty area, but if you have difficulty attaining it, or wish to make a donation to the fund, contact Traolach O Donnabháin (023-34167) or Tim Crowley (023-46107)."
By "sing" I presume the writer means "song." "Scoraíocht" by the way means " a social evening" which usually took place in houses at one time.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST,anyone
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 07:25 AM

You are joking.?

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST,SeanN
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 07:57 AM

Sounds awful.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST,SeanN
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 07:58 AM

In a "Faith of Our Fathers" sort of way.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Hillheader
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 05:00 PM

Never forget your history boys, lest history forgets you. Collins' role in the establishment of the current Republic of Ireland is important. He was a soldier shafted by politicians and it now seems the country is ready to make amends.

Davebhoy

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: michaelr
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 08:27 PM

What does "Cllr" stand for? There's a mudcatter who uses that handle.

Michael

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 08:35 PM

Short for councillor, Michael. The madcatter who uses that handle is obviously very proud of himself.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big John
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 08:44 PM

Cllr stands for Councillor (ah sure maybe it's Counciller) but it makes no difference, he does'nt council anybody. He (or She) is a member of a County Council whose main function seems to be voting on the re-zoning of land from agricultural to some other status which vastly increases it's resale value. It is normal (and widely accepted) practice that some henchman of the Councillor (or Counciller) will have acquired the land (at agricultural price) immediately before the re-zoning vote.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big John
Date: 04 Jun 02 - 08:51 PM

A Councillor is an elected official, who, in order to be elected will tell the electorate that his grandfather, or father-in-law, or second cousin twice removed, was in the convoy with Michael Collins at Bael na Blath, so there's continuity for you. Go on you boy ya.!!

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big Tim
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 02:18 AM

Sounds like a very interesting CD, to me, wish I could lay my hands on a copy. You guys know the song "Michael Collins" as recorded by "Cormac O'Moore"? (Not his real name).

"Returning then to London town, who will take the blame, the Treaty lies before him, Michael Collins adds his name, there's a darker time upon the land, who will bear the load, but an awkward hero in an armoured car, on an Irish county road.

Chorus: Hang out your brightest colour, his memory now recall, each one wants a part of him, no one wants it all".

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Janice in NJ
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 06:52 AM

Before the Michael Collins movie came out a few years back, my brother Warren used to sing what he used to call the Michael Collins song: Take It Down from the Mast, Irish Traitors! It looks like times have changed since then. Or at least sentiments have.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 07:57 AM

SeanN,

Well, Mudcat is a "Faith of our Fathers" sort of place.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: JedMarum
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 08:08 AM

what's "Faith of our Fathers" ????

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 08:11 AM

If you have to ask...

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 09:11 AM

Faith of our Fathers video:

http://www.wienerworld.com/faith_of_our_fathers.html

Was of the concert at the Point in Dublin. The album was a runaway success for this sort of a Catholic nationalist t'ing. Which lead to this:

http://www.dustintheturkey.20m.com/schedule.html

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Fiolar
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 09:25 AM

Another item, this time from the Irish Examiner (formerly The Cork Examiner) which may put to rest the meaning of the place where Michael Collins was killed. It is definitely not a place where flowers grow at least not when I visited it several years ago.

"August 24,2001
Béalnabláth is correct name
NOW that Michael Collins' commemoration has come round once again, I do wish journalists would try to get the name of the ambush area right.
It is not Béal na mBláth but Béalnabláth and derives not from "bláth" meaning a flower, but from "Blagha" meaning a ravine.
The name itself means "the crossing of the ravine" which is situated at the present village and was used by carriages in the old days. It is about a kilometre from where Collins was killed.
The "mouth of the flowers" translation is a mistake which has been repeated and repeated ever since it was first wrongly used by an English journalist on Wednesday August 23,1922, the day after Collins had died.

Rev Patrick J Twohig, PP,
Parochial House,
Churchtown,
Mallow,
Co Cork."
And there speaks a man with some authority.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 09:29 AM

They don't buy all the Collins stories in Glenties, y'know.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Fiolar
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 09:47 AM

Do they buy anything there?

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 09:50 AM

The Republic's freedom.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST,Martin Ryan
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 09:53 AM

Oddly enough, "Faith of our Fathers" was written by a Protestant, if I remember correctly.

Regards

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 10:13 AM

I have this site, which details the "story" about the lyric by Frederick Faber, the tune by Henri F. Hemy:

http://www.stpaulmerced.com/Site_Music/Faith_of_Our_Fathers/faith_of_our_fathers.html

It has this to say about the lyrics (and I note that anything which refers to Catholic martyrs makes certain culchie types go into an ecstatic trance):

"The "faith of our fathers" referred to in this hymn, however, is the faith of the martyred leaders of the Roman Catholic Church during the sixteenth century. The author of this text, Frederick William Faber, born June 28, 1814, in Calverley, Yorkshire, England, was raised as a strict Calvinist by a father who was an English clergyman. After young Faber's graduation from the renowned Oxford University in 1843, he became a minister in the Anglican Church at a small parish at Elten, England.

In his younger days Faber was strongly opposed to the teachings and practices of the Roman Church. However, this was the time when a movement known as the Oxford or Tractarian Movement was strongly influencing the Anglican Church. Whereas the Wesleys and their evangelical followers preached a message of personal conversion easily grasped by even the illiterate man, leaders of the more sophisticated Oxford Movement were of the persuasion that a meaningful religious experience could only be gained through better liturgical and ceremonial church services. From about 1833 to 1850 the Oxford Movement tenaciously directed religious England, during which time many of the Anglican Church's leaders either joined the Roman Church or developed a rejuvenated high church party known as Anglo-Catholics."

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST,An Pluiméir Ceolm
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 06:39 PM

Mudcat does it again!

Thanks fiolar for solving the mystery of the missing "m" which has had me mystified for nearly forty years

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: GUEST,APC, cont'd
Date: 05 Jun 02 - 06:44 PM

Davebhoy, describing Collins as a soldier shafted by politicians is a bit simplistic. In the IRB I think he was probably a more astute politician than even Dev, and he was also quite an administrator, but above all he was a realist. We had to wait decades till the combined forces of Lemass and Whitaker had anything like the same impact on real-world problems.

Hope I haven't relaunched the Civil War on Mudcat...

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: PeteBoom
Date: 06 Jun 02 - 08:24 AM

Relaunch the Civil War? Nah, Plumber, there's just a bunch of folks who think Dev could walk on water.

Pete

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: greg stephens
Date: 06 Jun 02 - 08:56 AM

I know the English are responsible for everything bad in the world: mistranslating Bealnablath is a new dastardly deed to add to my list. Anybody for a pint in the Four-Alls?Be a good spot for a Mudcat get-together.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 06 Jun 02 - 09:48 AM

Here's a link to a picture of the Liam Lynch memorial.

Maybe they'll make a film about him some day.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big Tim
Date: 07 Jun 02 - 04:30 AM

The OS map gives the placename as: "Beal Atha na Blaiche". My Irish dictionary gives "blaiche" as = "blach" = "blathach" , meaning, 1."Buttermilk" = 2."floral, flowering". Any ideas?

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: greg stephens
Date: 07 Jun 02 - 05:37 AM

My idea is that in Ireland, England or anywhere else, placename have been around a long time, and change in a different way to the language: because with familiar use they lose meaning and so get pronounced differently. so you cant alwys work out what they originally meant. But what fun it is trying to work it out!

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Janice in NJ
Date: 07 Jun 02 - 07:01 AM

If that Liam Lynch memorial is any indication of Republican manhood, it's enough to get even the most ardent Unionist gal to start screaming "Up the RA!" :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big Tim
Date: 07 Jun 02 - 08:43 AM

Naughty, naughty, but I doubt it!

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Fiolar
Date: 07 Jun 02 - 08:54 AM

One of the best songs about Michael Collins is "The Ballad of Michael Collins" written and sung by former athlete Brendan O'Reilly who reached the Irish charts with it. Sadly Brendan himself died last year age 71.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big Tim
Date: 07 Jun 02 - 03:43 PM

Fiolar; would you mind posting the lyrics of that song, please? Is the other song "Michael Collins" by the Wolfetones, which I note you mentioned on another thread some time back, the same song as "Michael Collins" of which I posted a verse of above. (I never listen to the Wolfetones, can't stand them, sorry, and the sort of rebel compilations that I do listen to never give composer credits).

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Fiolar
Date: 08 Jun 02 - 05:29 AM

Big Tim: There are apparently two songs entitled "The Ballad of Michael Collins." When I got your request, I checked the Brendan O'Reilly recording which I had made many years ago and sadly the tape's condition has deteriorated so that the sound is very poor. but I have taken steps to get another recording of it and as soon as I have it I will post the words. In the meantime here is another one with the same name but with completely different words.
THE BALLAD OF MICHAEL COLLINS

(Tune:Lord Lovell)

Mick Collins he cursed as soldiers curse
And he drank as soldiers drink,
And he fought the fight that soldiers fight
And then he sat down to think, think, think,
And then he sat down to think.

Now where are you going, Mick Collins? they said,
Now where are you going? said they.
I am going to Cork to settle this war
That is leading this country astray,-stray-stray,
That is leading this country astray.

Then take a convoy of lorries, they said,
And a Crosley-tender so fast
And a scout to search for Republican men
Who will ambush you as you go past,past,past,
Who will ambush you as you go past.

A scout and a lorry behind
And a Crossley-tender between
They sheltered him safely to Cork it is true
But returning they weren't any screen,screen,screen,
But returning they weren't any screen,screen,screen.

There were six men waiting at Beál-na-Blath
Well furnished with rifles and lead
Oh who is the officer fallen and pale/
'Tis Mick Collins that no one wished dead,dead,dead
'Tis Mick Collins that no one wished dead'dead,dead.

They took him up and carried him home
And he lies in a Soldier's plot,
And men who fought each other deplore
The hour that Mick Collins was shot,shot,shot,
The hour that Mick Collins was shot.

(By Donagh MacDonagh)

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big Tim
Date: 08 Jun 02 - 12:08 PM

Fiolar: thank you. I said elsewhere "Of the major rebel leaders, Michael Collins must be one of the least celebrated in song". That's now at least three and counting, I guess I was wrong.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: greg stephens
Date: 08 Jun 02 - 04:18 PM

Brendan Behan wrote one, I dont think that's been mentioned (might be wrong, my brain's addled). Think it was called "They shot my laughing boy" or something similar.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big Tim
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 03:53 AM

Ther's a line in the song "Michael Collins" quoted above "the laughing boy smiles at the Castle, it's a smile to cause alarm". I'll post the whole song later, when I get a chance to transcribe it from the CD. (I'm reading two biogs of Behan at present, among other things, (!), one by his brother Brian, and the "definitive" one by Michael O'Sullivan, so I'll keep an eye open for any MC references!)

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: greg stephens
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 04:41 AM

The "Laughing Boy" song I am trying to remember(but can't) was I think in Behan's IRA play "The Hostage".

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Fiolar
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 06:05 AM

Big Tim: As promised the words to the second (or rather first in my opinion)ballad of Michael Collins.

THE BALLAD OF MICHAEL COLLINS
By
BRENDAN O'REILLY
1.
An old man whispered in my ear; 'twas the saddest thing he knew;
When Ireland's proudest son was shot at the age of thirty-two.
He held my hand; his eyes held tears and my eyes filled up too,
With the power of full emotion for a man I never knew.

2.
Michael Collins, fearless son, you touched the nation's soul.
Ten thousand pounds upon your head; you still achieved your goal.
'Twas thus behind the barricades you fought the last gunfight.
You beat the enemy at their game;you undermined their might.

3.
'Twas in the crowded banquet hall, the old man meek and mild,
A simple man from off the land with the blue eyes of a child;
For the memory that an Irishman shot down the rebel son;
And Ireland lost Her Laughing Boy before his work was done.

4.
Michael Collins, Fearless Son, you touched the nation's soul;
Ten thousand pounds upon your head; you still achieved your goal.
You knew the Orange and the Green would keep us Gaels apart,
But the dream of Ireland one and free was the dream that filled your heart.

5.
And an old man in a banquet hall some fifty years gone by,
Held a sadness that would never pass, in his blue eyes still to cry
With the memory that an Irishman shot down the Fearless Son;
And Ireland lost Her Laughing Boy before his work was done.

6.
Michael Collins,Fearless Son, you touched the nation's soul.
Ten thousand pounds upon your head; you still achieved your goal.
'Twas thus behind the barricades, you fought the one time fight.
You beat the enemy at their game; you undermined their might.
You beat the enemy at their game; you undermined their might.

In a few places the background music blurs the words somewhat, but I am sure that most if not all the above is correct. If any 'catter spots any mistakes please feel free to make them known. In passing, Johnny McEvoy also recorded a song called "Michael" which is another tribute the Big Fella.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: greg stephens
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 09:35 AM

It's the makers of the songs, rather than the memories of the man, that count. Lack of good songs about Nelson in England is often commented, considering the affection and esteem he aroused. In fact "Up went Nelson in old Dublin " is his best musical memorial!. The factis, Sean South and Kevin Barry get sung about because they are bloody good songs, nothing to do with there positions in history.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big Tim
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 12:08 PM

Fiolar,thanks again. Greg, I agree (mostly!).

"THE LAUGHING BOY" by Brendan Behan (From "The Hostage"[play]1958.

Twas on an August morning, all in the morning hours, I went to take the warming air, all in the month of flowers, and there I saw a maiden and heard her mournful cry, Oh what will mend my broken heart, I've lost my laughing boy.

So strong, so wide and brave he was, I'll mourn his loss too sore, when thinking that we'll hear the laugh or springing step no more, ah, curse the time, and sad my heart to crucify, that an Irish son, with a rebel gun, shot down my laughing boy.

Oh had he died by Pearse's side or in the GPO, killed by an English bullet from the rifle of a foe, Or forcibly fed while Ashe lay dead in the dungeons of Mountjoy, I'd have cried with pride at the way he died, my own dear laughing boy.

My princely love, can ageless love do more than tell you, "Go raibe mile maith Agath", for all you tried to do, for all you did and would have done, my enemies to destroy, I'll praise your name and guard you fame, my own dear laughing boy.

Note: Thomas Ashe (1885-1917), died being force-fed while on hunger strike in Mountjoy Jail, Dublin. His men had killed c.12 policemen in the Ashbourne Raid during the Easter Rising. Jailed for making seditious speech.

Song taken from: "The Mother of All the Behans" by Brian Behan. 1984.

(In the above book Brian Behan wrote, "when Kathleen was pregnant with Brendan she met Michael Collins on O'Connell Street Bridge[Dublin]...he pressed a ten pound note into her hand". Brian Behan wrote in "The Brothers Behan" (1998)- "even though Brendan wrote a song about Michael Collins he never sang it 'because I can never remember anything I write myself' ". In the same book he wrote of the £10 "donation" - "it was as if Collins had given the tenner to him personally".

MICHAEL COLLINS (author unknown - as recorded by "Cormac O'Moore" on "A Rebel's Heart: A Collection of Ireland's Most Popular Rebel Songs", 1998. (Purchased in Dublin, Feb 2002).

The bark of a dog breaks the silence, like a bitter last hurrah, and a raven spreads its wings for flight, over fields near Bealnablath, with a rifle clasped to his breast, but hanging low his head, a black August day[22nd] in the County Cork, Michael Collins is dead.

Chorus: Hang out your brightest colours(s), his memory now recall, each one wants a part of him, no one wants it all.

Working over in London town, when he joined the IRB, swore to use most deadly force his native land to free, his "squad" is ready and willing to strike, he is loved for his ruthless charm, the laughing boy smiles at the Casstle, it's a smile to cause alarm.

A British intelligence agent is working from a Dublin room, Michael Collins adds his name to a list that will take men to the tomb, a spy slowly rises from his chair, walks across the floor, a man with a Parabellum is knocking at the door.

Returning then to London town, who will take the blame, the Treaty lies before him, Michael Collins adds his name, there's a darker time upon the land, who will bear the load, an awkward hero in an armoured car, on an Irish country road.

Repeat first verse. Notes: IRB = Irish Republican Brotherhood (founded 1858). "Parabellum" = a gun of Italian manufacture.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: greg stephens
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 12:18 PM

Big Tim, thanks very much for digging out the Behan words.Iheard it years ago, and couldnt remember much, except that it was good. Looks the best ofthe bunch that has turned up on this thread. It seems to capture what a lot of people always felt about Collins, even his most implacable opponents, Irish or British. What you would expect from a Behan, of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big Tim
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 02:06 PM

Yes Greg; I think the Behan song is kind of symptomatic of the ambivalence of many people towards MC. After all, Behan joined the IRA in the 30s, basically to fight against the Treaty that MC signed, yet he wrote this moving tribute to him. Incidentally, I have just learned from the "definitive" Behan biog quoted above that there was in fact no such person as Brendan Behan! He was christened Francis Behan.

No harm in adding that Donagh MacDonagh (1912-68), author of one of the above songs, was the son of the executed 1916 revolutionary Thomas MacDonagh.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: The Pooka
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 02:37 PM

This Yank is so glad to learn of the Memorial Project. Hopefully all Irish, and Irish-descended, people can come to accept that Collins *does* belong high up on the roll-call of Ireland's heroes----regardless of which side you or I may feel we would have taken in the civil war.

I think the Big Fella did his very best for his beloved country. And, romantic absolutist visions aside, I suspect his best was better than anybody else could have done, given the realities of the time. For this he paid with his life.

Thanks for the great songs, too. God bless the Mudcat.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: michaelr
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 03:04 PM

Could "Cormac O'Moore" be our auld friend Christy? It would be obvious hearing the recording, which I haven't, but the words sure sound like something he'd come up with.

Slainte,
Michael

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Big Tim
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 05:08 PM

Re "Cormac",no, definitely not CM, great Irish voice though, pure Irish soul.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Mickey191
Date: 09 Jun 02 - 06:13 PM

Can anyone tell me the Gaelic spelling of Michael? Thank you in advance.

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: An Pluiméir Ceolmhar
Date: 10 Jun 02 - 04:32 AM

Mícheál

Pronounced "Mee-haul"

Subject: RE: BS: Michael Collins Memorial
From: Fiolar
Date: 10 Jun 02 - 05:18 AM

A couple of points - The actor Gregory Peck is I believe a distant relation of Thomas Ashe. Regarding the Michael Collins Memorial, any one who is interested can get a copy of the CD by contacting 00353-23-34167 (dialling from the UK). The price is ten Euros about £8.00 sterling.