Mike Batt sued for plagiarising silence?

Subject: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: Mr Red
Date: 16 Jul 02 - 08:29 PM

I heard today that Mike (Wombles) Batt is to conduct a comparison rendition to compare his 1 minute electronic silence with a full orchestral version of John Cages 4 Minutes 23 seconds of Silence.
If they can't decide amicably then the estate of John Cage will claim 25% of royalties of one track of the classical pop group he produces.
If I refuse to say any more on this, will I be "quoting" "copying" borrowing, parodying, mimicing or just plain cynical?

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Jul 02 - 08:33 PM

We discussed this a couple of weeks ago.

See

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Jul 02 - 08:34 PM

Oops

I meant, see this thread

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 05:43 AM

Wasn't it Andre Previn who fell out with John Cage when he asked if he really needed a world class pianist to perform 4' 23", or would his local pub pianist sound just as good.

If Mr Cage wanted, he could probably claim royalties for all the blank bits on recordings - even if they weren't the right length he could claim that they were extracts or that the piece had been played at the wrong tempo !

And would about all the profoundly deaf people who hear his composition continuously !

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: greg stephens
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 05:49 AM

Mr Red and Dave Bryant. You're being unfair to john Cage, the guy had more stamina than you give him credit for. It was 4'33", not 23". the last 10 seconds was the best bit, when everyone used to join in.

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 06:08 AM

Going to a related folky question - Didn't Mike Batt have something to do with Steeleye Span once?

Yeah! Just looked it up - he produced "All around my hat". Then started Wombling??? Was that a career progression do you think?

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: Watson
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 06:31 AM

Dave,
Mike Batt was wombling long before he produced Steeleye.

Did you know that Rick Kemp, Nigel Pegrum and Peter Knight were inside the Wombles costumes on Top of the Pops?

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 08:19 AM

Greg, I play it at a faster tempo than John Cage wrote it ! I can actually manage it must faster - without leaving out a single note !

Subject: Wombling and the Wombles
From: SharonA
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 08:51 AM

Wombling? What is wombling? Who are the Wombles? (Google.com hasn't been very helpful to me this time.) Please explain!

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: C-flat
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 08:57 AM

The Official Wombles website should explain SharonA.
It made Mike Batt a wealthy man!

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: GUEST,Bagpuss
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 08:58 AM

The Wombles are strange small bear-like creatures who live on Wimbledon Common and tidy up the mess other people leave behind. There is a documentary series about their activities, made in the 70's (by Mike Batt) and a follow up series has more recently been on screens.

For more info, see:

http://www.tidybag.co.uk/

Bagpuss

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: Watson
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 08:59 AM

Sharon - trade in your Google for one that works - enter "Wombles", and the first hit is the official Wombles web site.

Subject: RE: Wombling and the Wombles
From: SharonA
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 09:22 AM

Thanks, guys, for clearing that up for me. So wombling is not a variation of Morris Dancing, eh? (ducking and running...)

Watson, my mistake was in entering "wombling" in my Google search; in addition to the Mike Batt album hits, I was bringing up hits about civil disobedience ("instructions for wombling"), so I was getting VERY confused!

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: C-flat
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 09:36 AM

Elisabeth Berseford created the "Wombles" in 1968, long before recycling became in "issue" here in the U.K.
So I suppose these little furry objects were at the forefront of the "green" movement!

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagurising silence?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 02:08 PM

Well, well, well! I didn't know that, Watson. It should have been elementary for me to look it up but fingers work faster than brains in this old Gnomes home.

Not sure if I believe the last bit though. You'll tell us Madame Cholet was really Maddy Prior next...;-)

Thanks for the info and for putting me right!

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagiarising silence?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 06:28 PM

The Official Wombles website should explain SharonA. It made Mike Batt a wealthy man!

Not that wealthy - It's public knowledge that his company has been in serious difficulties in the last couple of years.... crappy accountants and court cases have taken up all the money... what he's earning from all the publicity on this little stunt is either going to make him, or if it does go to court and he loses, will squish him out completely.....

LTS

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagiarising silence?
From: C-flat
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 06:43 PM

Well Liz, I guess it's one thing to make it, and another thing to keep it!

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagiarising silence?
From: GUEST,DW at work
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 06:47 PM

Jeez, only you Brits could come up with a civil disobedience rap and make a kids show out of it!

DW

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagiarising silence?
From: Ed.
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 07:28 PM

DW,

The children's series came first

I'd never heard of the 'anti capitalist' 'pro violent protest' Wombles before reading this thread. I don't think that they're a major movement...

Subject: RE: Mike Batt sued for plagiarising silence?
From: Mr Red
Date: 17 Jul 02 - 08:07 PM

Anyone heard the rsults of the comparison rendition.
AND didn't Paul Simon get the idea for his "sound of ..........." I'll get my coat and go qietly