Most excessive hard rock band ever....

Subject: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Little Hawk
Date: 27 Jul 02 - 11:09 PM

The "worst cover" thread got me thinking about this...who would be the most excessive hard rock band of all time?

It's a stiff competition. Think of all those incredibly loud bands that have assaulted our collective ears ever since the late 60's and the psychedelic era. Think of those bands that have 3 to 6 guys with incredibly long hair, incredibly idiotic stage clothing, and utterly no sense of good taste or decency whatsoever.

Think of lurid album covers, indecent exposure charges, late nights, rafts of groupies, dressing rooms that stink of stale beer and assorted body odours, dirty jokes, raging egos, and one night stands that fade into the oblivion of a drug-ravaged memory that barely knows its own name, let alone what day of the week it is...

Think of Blind DRunk in Blind River's idea of heaven.

Think...Aerosmith. They're my nomination. Read all about 'em in whatzername's tell-all autobiography, and weep for humanity.

ROCK ON!!!! Blauggrrghh..jieghe!!! (retch!)

- LH

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Celtic Soul
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 12:02 AM

Disaster Area, with Hotblack Desiato.

Just don't panic.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 12:02 AM

LH, Aerosmith are a good choice, but musically I would pick Rush, offstage antics The Who. It seems now that John Entwistle's death of a heart attack was brought on by Cocaine use. Keith Moon was only 32 when he died.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Bobert
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 12:08 AM

Okay, Little Hawk, this is a toughie. I was thinkin' of Black Sabbath. No, make it Ten Years After. No, the Iron Butterfly... Oh, I don't have a clue... Warrent, Cimderella, AC/DC. Heck, I don't know...

Bobert

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: khandu
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 12:19 AM

Freddie and the Dreamers have the epitome of excess! Think of that shameless vulgar exhibition called "The Freddie"! Can you not remember the hard core lust that surged through your loins when you saw that debacle actually shown on TV?

And they had the gall to actually name a song after it! "Do The Freddie". We all knew they were singing euphemistically. We knew what "The Freddie" was!

And remember the contemptuous sneer on his face as he sang "I Don't Love You Anymore"? Surely, it was a slap in the face of Buddy Holly (and every young American) everytime he sang that. Truly, this was the FIRST anarchistic band, and look at the floodgates they opened.

The world began its downward spiral the moment this dastardly group was unleashed upon society. We still reap the fruits of seeds sown by the bastards!

khandu

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: rangeroger
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 01:32 AM

Oasis.

Hey,Mbo.You still out there?

rr

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: alanabit
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 09:28 AM

Aerosmith are worth a mention, but they are disqualified from winning the title here because they have a modicum of wit and self irony. There was a time when I thought that Guns and Roses might make it. Their silly antics reminded me of a phase I went through at the age of six or seven when I would take down my trousers to shock the babysitter with my BARE BOTTOM! You know, the "Look how bad I am!" syndrome. Black Sabbath and Rush are weighty contenders, of course, but I feel that the most deserving candidates are elsewhere. It has to be one of those bunches of nice middle class boys from somewhere near Sheffield in the early eighties. They had long hair, enormous amplifiers and clothes which looked like the result of a failed experiment in a paint laboratory. The tuneless noise they made would have gratified a good many rappers. However, what distinguished them as truly remarkable cretins, (which is what we're looking for here), was their ability to shout and scream with great passion about the fate of the Zorgots of Thambostria - or some other sc-fi sounding pople which they had made up. You won't believe all this Little Hawk - but believe me - it really happened.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Art Thieme
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 11:33 AM

Please, I am not trying to be offensive. I do truly think this discussion has nothing to do with this web site and ought not be here.

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 12:32 PM

Art,

I respect your opinion as always, but like the movie "This Is Spinal Tap" this thread allows a lot of us to look back laughingly at a lot of stuff that we once liked before finding the music that we like now, Blues, Folk. etc.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 01:15 PM

I'd like to argue, that by it's very definition, a ROCK band cannot possibly ever be EXCESSIVE...

Isn't that the whole point?

;-)

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Art Thieme
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 01:44 PM

Just my mental gas escaping. It's too easy to click and post ;-)

Art

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Brakn
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 02:09 PM

Someone was asked to play a heavy rock song. "Would 'The Stone Outside Dan Murphy's Door' be heavy enough?" was the reply.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 08:22 PM

Most excessive Rock band, The Who! All of the above, indecent exposure, Wrecked hotel rooms including bombs in toilets Motorcycles in pools, two members dead from drug abuse, smashed instruments, Every kind of sexual proclivity, and the Guiness record as the loudest band in the world. Can't argue with Guiness.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Little Hawk
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 10:29 PM

Oh, man...MAJOR CONTENDERS here, dudes! Totally DECENT!!!

It just might be the Who, all right. Were they not the ones who started the "destroy your instruments and amps onstage" routine? Or was it Jerry Lee Lewis? I remember when he set the grand piano on fire. What a jerk. It worked, though, he outdid Chuck Berry as most memorable act of the night. Then there was Hendrix setting his guitar on fire at the Monterey Pop Festival. I regard this kind of behaviour as a truly contemptible and decadent act. A musician who doesn't respect his instruments is lower than a snake.

Freddy and the Dreamers are an interesting nomination, khandu...gotta think about that some.

Guns 'n Roses made a heroic effort for the crown too, but I think they lose by a whisker...

Nice contributions, people. Keep 'em coming.

- LH

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Kim C
Date: 29 Jul 02 - 12:46 PM

Does anyone besides me remember a short-lived heavy-metal band called Wasp?

I'm not sure what qualifies Rush as excessive, unless it's sheer loudness. I don't recall them ever being in the rock rags for public misbehavior.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Pied Piper
Date: 29 Jul 02 - 01:13 PM

I once went to see a band called "Judas Priest". As I remember they were excessively loud and not very good. As to "Oasis" they were very excessive in the plagiarism department. PP

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Mountain Dog
Date: 29 Jul 02 - 02:05 PM

Yes, Da 'Oo are certainly finalists in the race and bid fair to take it all...

By the way, Khandu, I agree with you about Freddy and the Dreamers, but I contend it was their cover of "A Windmill in Old Amsterdam" that really put the skids under modern western culture...Whatcha think?

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: alanabit
Date: 29 Jul 02 - 03:03 PM

The Who would be weighty contenders if it was down to drug abuse, mayhem and shagging. However, I contend that although they can live with most on grounds of excess - and indefensible excess at that - it was part of the genuine energy which made their music exciting. Their songs contained too much intelligence and their playing was exemplary, so although they satisy the criteria of excess, they fall short of genuine moronity. Nobody has yet mentioned Van Halen or Iron Maiden - and anyone who licks them is going to be a class act in the moronity stakes. I think we need some help from 'Spaw on this thread - and where is mbo when we need him?

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Kim C
Date: 29 Jul 02 - 05:03 PM

What about Alice Cooper and his band?

I saw Iron Maiden once, a long, LONG time ago. Not particularly my kind of music, but I have to give them credit for playing their instruments well.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Jul 02 - 05:12 PM

I'm not sure if Alice Cooper counts, cos he KNEW it was stupid, and just did it for the money...

Alanit - Dead right. Nothing could persuade me to lick either Van Halen or Iron Maiden! :-)

- LH

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Kim C
Date: 29 Jul 02 - 05:17 PM

Aerosmith may not count either, 'cause they're all cleaned up now.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Jul 02 - 05:21 PM

Guns N' Roses?

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: John O'L
Date: 29 Jul 02 - 06:52 PM

I don't know about offstage antics, but for excessive guitars, vocals and lyrics it would be hard to go past The Birthday Party, but I, to be honest, always liked them.
I always thought of the singer, Nick Cave, as a sort of a demented Jim Morrison.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Jul 02 - 12:45 AM

You mean more demented, don't you?

- LH

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 30 Jul 02 - 12:22 PM

Without a doubt, the Sex Pistols. Loud, obnoxious, grating noise, simplistic lyrics shouted in a Cockney accent, blowing their noses and spitting on the audience.

Of course, their 1977 album Never Mind the Bollocks! Here's the Sex Pistols! was one of the most influential of the seventies.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Jul 02 - 12:52 PM

Motley Crue, perhaps. Singer Vince Neil killed someone while drunk/drugged and driving. A gaggle of Hollywood lawyers worked an O.J. on the judge and although he was convicted of vehicular manslaughter, a serious crime, he got only 30 days, a fine, and some community service.

Bassist Nikki Sixx nearly died of a heroin overdose and claims to have had an out-of-body experience. Evidently he didn't learn anything. By his own account, on the day he got out of the hospital he went home and cooked up the biggest shot he'd ever taken. He woke up two days later with the needle still dangling from the vein in his arm.

Drummer Tommy Lee, he of the excessive tattoos, was too impatient to anesthetize himself by merely drinking Jack Daniels - he'd much rather shoot it into his veins for the quicker buzz. And he has a nasty temper, throwing punches at actress Pamela Anderson, who, aside from the moral, ethical and legal reasons, looks too damn good to be slapping around.

The most sedate member of the band seems to be guitarist Mick Mars. He's only spent one night in jail as a result of being wrongly accused of public nudity.

Not to mention their atrocious, cliched, sexist, unimaginitive, cock-rock hair-band industry standard corporate sound....

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 30 Jul 02 - 01:06 PM

Somebody's been watching VH1's Behind the Music.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 30 Jul 02 - 02:32 PM

"wrongly accused of public nudity"

LOL!!!!

You know your pants are too tight when...

;-)

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: alanabit
Date: 30 Jul 02 - 03:02 PM

I think our guest is on to something here. This sounds like a serious contender, well qualified on all fronts for the dubious distinction which we are about to bestow upon somebody.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Jul 02 - 04:31 PM

...thing is, if you've seen one VH1 Behind The Music, you've seen them all. They rerun the same themes: decadence, drugs, depravity, and death (or near death). Only the names change.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 30 Jul 02 - 07:38 PM

Here's one right outta left field..... are you ready for this...... The Eagles. No, don't laugh! Listen to this ---Glenn Frey had to have his nose rebuilt, not once but twice, the second time with a teflon septum... Joe Walsh used to take a chainsaw on the road with him for the express purpose of redecorating hotel rooms...Don Henley's seduction technique was known as "Love 'em and Lear 'em" from his habit of sending his private jet to pick up his girlfriends...the whole band took a mid-tour break to fly down to the Bahamas just to stage a two-day card game...their idea of family values was a mother-and-daughter groupie scenario... and as for their manager (Irv Azoff) who encouraged and covered up all this excess, to quote Henley "He may be Satan, but he's OUR Satan".
All this AND three-part harmonies? No contest.
@@ (~~)

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Little Hawk
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 12:04 AM

Bro...ther. We've got some major contenders showing up. It's the Eagles versus Motley Crue in the depravity sweepstakes!

By the way, dontcha love the way those heavy metal bands (and rappers, etc) deliberately misspell certain words when they name the band so as to sound cool, vicious, and crude...as in Motley Crue, for example....or Korn. Putting the umlaut and other symbols above vowels is also considered very cool...remember when Opus and Bill the Cat were in the group "Deathtongue" (with the 2 dots over the "o")? One of the songs was: "U Stink But I Luv U"

Then if it's a rap group, it can have a name with numbers in it like: "2 Dum 2 Liv, 2 Sic 2 Die" or something along that line...

- LH

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Venthony
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 12:06 AM

As for the Eagles, I demur. I'm not a huge fan of theirs, but Bernie Leadon was an authentic bluegrass voice on the band's early records -- and quite good records they were too.

Yeah, sure, they had that awful backbeat on everything, but so did Newgrass Revival, a unit with better licks but less integrity -- in my own humble estimation.

As for "most excessive," who can forget (a record club sent me their CD by mistake a number of years ago) the inimitable and thankfully forgotten Whitesnake.

Def Leopard is a very close second. Unless, of course, you count "Let It Be."

Cheers, Tony

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 12:40 AM

I got it on good authority that when the Eagles had their Mid-Nineties "Comeback" tour that they had two fulltime body guards to keep Joe Walsh straight enough to play.

I don't think anyone has mentioned Motorhead.

The Sex Pistols should almost be automatic. But I loved them & The Ramones, could never understand the fuss over The Clash.

BTW, when Fielding writes his autobiography you might here some tales that will rival this lot.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 12:43 AM

I know that the Lethbridge Holiday Inn refused to rent any rooms to Folk Musicians for many years after Fielding completely disassembled the hotel bar there using his Dremel Tool.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 05:06 AM

Venthony -- why do you think Bernie Leadon was forced out of The Eagles? He wouldn't join in the fun & games!
BJ

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: alanabit
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 06:00 AM

You're right Steve. How could we possibly overlook Motorhead? I recall Lemmy ("Lemme a fiver till Friday") once saying in an interview, "We are the dirtiest band in the world. If we moved next door to you, your garden would die." Come to think of it, aren't Kiss in with a fighting chance?

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 08:00 AM

yeah, kinda thought about Kiss when the Motley Crue thing was posted. Crue must've been cut from the same bolt of cloth ... but the Kiss costumes dismiss them from serious contention, don't you think? It's hard to take a band or its music seriously when their clothes are something right out of a comic book. Anyway, it seems that the boys were for the most part just into the sex part of "sex, drugs, and (bad) rock 'n' roll."

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 08:31 AM

Gotta go with Guest on this one. Kiss were the Back Street Boys of hard rock, completely fabricated, laughing all the way to the bank.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: alanabit
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 09:37 AM

Does this mean Steve, that the successful candidate for our dubious award will have to both satisfy our demanding standard of atrocity AND take themselves seriously?

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Kim C
Date: 31 Jul 02 - 06:01 PM

Did anybody mention the Red Hot Chili Peppers? I don't really know a whole lot about them, except that they have been known to appear naked on stage except for some strategically placed socks (not on their feet), the lead singer has some great tattoos, and their bass player (Flea) is actually pretty talented as a musician, and has appeared in several movies.

I sold a down comforter to Bernie Leadon once. I worked in a futon store in Nashville and sold all manner of furniture and accessories to famous people, all of whom were very pleasant. It was a nice shop until the original owner sold it to an immature dolt who didn't know what he was doing. It's closed now.

Bernie Leadon was also one of the Burns Brothers of Run C&W notoriety.

Guns-n-Roses would be a pretty good bet. Axl Rose wasn't too bad of a hard-rock singer - but where is he now?

How come nobody's mentioned the Rolling Stones? Some of their exploits are pretty astounding.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: alanabit
Date: 01 Aug 02 - 11:17 AM

The Stones don't really make it Kim, because they don't meet our demanding standard of sustained moronity. I know every Stones album has a song about ladies with black boots and whips, but with the passing years, they have become a bunch of likeably eccentric grandads. Keith Richard's much talked about history of drug abuse is really about a quarter of a century out of date. Bare bottoms don't shock many of us any more - although the Red Hot Chilli Peppers may have other claims to our title. I would say that for the time being, Motley Crue or Motorhead look like the front runners.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 Aug 02 - 01:39 PM

Exactly. The Stones have a few redeeming qualities...like some actually good songwriting, and a modicum of intelligence. We are looking for bands who are not only totally moronic, but also take themselves quite seriously...a devastating combination, most aptly depicted in the movie "Spinal Tap". Rock on, eh?

- LH

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 01 Aug 02 - 05:11 PM

I still say the Who, they were most excessive and they kicked ass. To me that earns them some rock and rool respect. And they were doing it well before it became fashionable. Other bands learn these things from the Who. they learned these things from Keith Moon! Because without Keith Moon, the Who would have been middle of the road excessive.

Keith Moon Was more excessive than all of Motley Crue, ON HIS OWN!!

Motley Crue, perhaps. Singer Vince Neil killed someone while drunk/drugged and driving. A gaggle of Hollywood lawyers worked an O.J. on the judge and although he was convicted of vehicular manslaughter, a serious crime, he got only 30 days, a fine, and some community service.

Keith Moon Ran over and killed his own body guard with his Rolls Royce.

Bassist Nikki Sixx nearly died of a heroin overdose and claims to have had an out-of-body experience. Evidently he didn't learn anything. By his own account, on the day he got out of the hospital he went home and cooked up the biggest shot he'd ever taken. He woke up two days later with the needle still dangling from the vein in his arm.

I Still think Moon was more excessive in drugs. He lasted quite a while and pissed away more money (preinflation) than Motley crew has ever seen! He wasn't suicidal but he burned up his internal organs. He was visited several time by paramedics before his heart finally gave out.

Drummer Tommy Lee, he of the excessive tattoos, was too impatient to anesthetize himself by merely drinking Jack Daniels - he'd much rather shoot it into his veins for the quicker buzz. And he has a nasty temper, throwing punches at actress Pamela Anderson, who, aside from the moral, ethical and legal reasons, looks too damn good to be slapping around.

Keith Moon was visited but the Bobbys more than once for domestic abuse and both of his wives were better looking than Pamela.

The most sedate member of the band seems to be guitarist Mick Mars. He's only spent one night in jail as a result of being wrongly accused of public nudity.

Keith Moon was arrest in Australia for simulated nudity, He was wearing "surgical pink" (flesh coloured clothing)

Not to mention their atrocious, cliched, sexist, unimaginitive, cock-rock hair-band industry standard corporate sound....

There you got me. But isn't a corporate sound by definition NOT excessive? THe suits don't want a band to live on the edge. And the Who were also quite excessive in breaking new ground. The soundtrack for the Mod Movement, the first "Rock Opera" (Excessive and pretentious, If they handn't got away with it)The Who's sound was original imaginative and excessively energetic. They were excessively loud and they smashed thier instruments. One time Moon busted one of Townsends eardrums by using too big a bomb to blow up his drumkit! Then there was the wild sex of every sort. Townsend saying publically that he wanted to F**K Mick Jagger.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: YOR
Date: 01 Aug 02 - 06:56 PM

Reminds me of the movie "Rock Star".

I gotta go with "The Who", Keith Moon actually had the limo turn around and go back to the hotel because he forgot to trash the TV.

Second place goes to "Kiss". The police show up because Ace is having a party in this room and the guests are throwing his hotel furniture out the window, and Paul is having sex in the next room with an underage girl.

Well I guess there are many many other stories for these two bands and all the others too!

Go figure!

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Aug 02 - 10:36 PM

been out of town, so did not get to second Art Thieme's post immediately....

*sigh*...'mentioning' rock music in passing is one thing--starting entire threads about it is simply bad form here.

I can't stop it, but I can say what I think.....and the title of this one was like a kick in the stomach. (Yes, threads on "how to make biscuits" are WAY more appropriate than threads on Rock music..(OR opera!)

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 01 Aug 02 - 11:08 PM

"a kick in the stomach."

Is that a joke?

Bad form?

You really need to lighten up.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Aug 02 - 11:52 PM

I'm usually much lighter..*grin*...I used to protest a lot, now I seldom do--that one just got to me.

Why is it worse to complain about OT postings than to MAKE them, Jack?

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: GUEST,Bunger Mulkin
Date: 02 Aug 02 - 03:27 AM

OK, off the deep end - when I (80's) worked at a college radio station, I tried to listen to at least a little of everything. One day a CD came in from a group called, I believe, Cannibal Corpse. Musically and lyrically, they lived up to their name. EVERY song was about either eating, having sex with, or both, rotten dead bodies, with lots of graphic detail and medical terminology. If they wrote from experience, I nominate them as most excessive...but then I discovered in a couple different music (mucus?) magazines that they weren't unique, but represented a whole sub-genre of music...

anyways, it doesn't matter - whatever comes up as most excessive, someone will read, say 'we can top THAT!', and start a band.

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: alanabit
Date: 02 Aug 02 - 03:54 AM

Jack, that's a mighty argument for the excess, but I'm afraid that the excess stemmed mainly from Keith Moon, who departed in 1976. The problem is, that any group who released songs like "Substitute", "Behind Blue Eyes", "Won't Get Fooled Again" and the magnificent "The Seeker" hardly qualifies as moronic. I get your drift though. I am very glad that Keith Moon was not my neighbour!

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 02 Aug 02 - 12:11 PM

I know alanabit. But that's my point. The Who didn't have to lean on their excesses, and their excesses didn't make them moronic, they were the genuine article.

I read the biography called "Moon" I believe that Keith saw that as part of his contribution to the band. It certainly helped them to sell records.

Bill, Don't get me wrong, I don't mind one bit if you complain. I just thought that your choice of words was ....well..... excessive ;-)

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Aug 02 - 01:20 PM

ok...you win, it was excessive. Jet lag and a STRONG beer contributed....strike "kick in the stomach" insert "fart in the phone booth" or "graffiti on the da Vinci" depending on your esthetic proclivities. ;.0

Subject: RE: Most excessive hard rock band ever....
From: alanabit
Date: 02 Aug 02 - 03:46 PM

Jack, if only the music was as moronic as Moon's excesses, you'd have it I guess. But I'll go along with LH's criteria that the music has to be down to the standard of the band's behaviour...well nearly...