BS: You Brits have gone too far

Subject: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 12:45 AM

I'm a great fan of mystery stories - they're my great escape. Over the years, I have started to note and "collect" ugly British names for food. For example: bangers and mash, toad in the hole, train smash (tomatoes and sausage) and the ever-controversial bubble-and-squeak.

Of course, we all know why they do it. It's to show they are Not French.

However, here is an actual sentence from "Skeleton in the Closet" by M.C. Beaton, a Scottish-born dweller in the Cotswolds.

"They strolled into a tea shop of the olde English variety, beams and horse brasses, and cakes that most of the world had forgotten about - Eiffel towers, congress cake, fly cemetaries, empire biscuits."

FLY CEMETARIES!? This has gone too far.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:02 AM

Garibaldi?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Jimmy C
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:11 AM

FLY CEMETARIES are probably some sort of bisquit with currants, but it's not their food you should worry about, check this out

Diets & Dying

The Japanese eat very little fat, and suffer fewer heart attacks than the British or Americans.

The French eat a lot of fat, and also suffer fewer heart attacks than the British or Americans.

The Japanese drink very little red wine and suffer fewer heart attacks than the British or Americans.

The Italians drink excessive amounts of red wine, and also suffer fewer heart attacks than the British or Americans.

CONCLUSION:

Eat and drink what you like. Speaking English is apparently what kills you

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:11 AM

Come on - its got to be ironic that the English give their food unappetizing names...

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:13 AM

John from Hull: what's wrong with Garibaldi? I used to live right near a bar with that noble name.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:16 AM

Blackcatter, I'm not sure I understand your remark about irony.

However, it's midnight now, and I'll to catch up with y'all later.

Who else knows any ugly British names for food?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Jimmy C
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:26 AM

Leenia,

they have a dish called SPOTTED DICK , but I am not too sure just what it is ?.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:48 AM

Spotted dick, or spotted dog, a Royal Navy dish from Nelson's time. It's a sort of bread pudding of bread crumbs, beef drippings, raisins (which gave it the "spots") and a few other ingredients. Could have spices such as nutmeg.

Chanteyranger

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Mudlark
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:58 AM

I have a little Devon book with a recipe for Rock Cakes that is absolutely marvelous. It's a very dry kind of sweet biscuit mix, which gives the little cakes a very craggy look...

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Gurney
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 03:44 AM

How about the famous 'Boiled Baby,' which is a pudding boiled in a stocking. Pink and starchy, served with jam or treacle. Tastes best when the stocking is washed first. Gurney.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 04:02 AM

I cannot believe that M C Beaton would have mis-spelled "cemetery" as "cemetary".

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: RoyH (Burl)
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 04:31 AM

What is wrong with those names?. They are folk expressions. And the food tastes good too.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 04:55 AM

Eiffel Towers :- A Tall [3" aprox] cylindrical sponge cake covered with jam, and then rolled in dessicated coconut
Flie's Cemetery :- Can be either a Garibaldi biscuit [Cookie],or a currant slice.
Empire biscuits :- Two round shortcake biscuits with jam in between, iced on top with plain icing, then half a glace cherry stuck on top. They used to be called German biscuits, but the name was changed due to a small conflict around 1918.
Spotted Dick :- This is a steamed pudding, made with flour, suet, sugar, and currants mainly. Recipe available if required.
Boiled babies heads :- A small steak and kidney pudding. This differs from a steak and kidney pie inasmuch as the pudding is encased in suet pastry, wrapped in a cloth and boiled, whereas the the pie is baked, usually with a puff pastry topping.
Anyway all this food talk makes me peckish.
Heading for the kitchen.....Giok

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: alanabit
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 04:55 AM

For bad taste names, I always liked Magenta and Solferino soup. They are both tomato soups, of course, and take their names from bloody battles during the Italian War of Independence. An anecdote which comes to mind concerns one of the above named delicacies. The then junior agriculture Minister, Edwina Currie was visiting a school. She complained of feeling cold. One of the school cooks (unfortunately male) told her kindly, "Don't worry Edwina. You'll feel better with some of my spotted dick inside you."

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Roughyed
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 05:58 AM

On Oldham market I spotted a new type of biscuit called 'Gary Baldy's'

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 06:03 AM

G'day leeneia,

I'm not sure where you are (nationally) ... and I did grow up hearing a lot of those British food names (they survived well in the Scouts and the Services) but I just stumbled on a yellowing clipping (all right - it is less that a year old ... but newsprint yellows quickly, these days ... almost as fast of the statements of the politicians it reports) describing two American culinary favourites of the camping and picnic set.

These have perfectly acceptable names: "Monte Christo (well, the rogue 'h' is a worry ...) and the cryptic "s'more (short for: some more). I won't give the gastronomic details yet ... I'm hoping to be reassured by some American that they are not quite the "coronary occlusions waiting to happen" that the Sydney Morning Herald's correspondent describes!

Regard(les)s,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: harvey andrews
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 06:20 AM

I've never heard of fly cemetary biscuits, but near here in the Black Country they have a delicacy called "Grorty Dick".

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Ewan McVicar
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 06:35 AM

Sigh. This is the kind of mutually patronising semi-insulting, framed as humour, that means that anytime I start visiting Mudcat I last a week or so then quit. Bye bye. See you in a few months.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Ewan McVicar
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 06:37 AM

Oh, I should have added, look out for heavy patronising insults from someone else contributing here - which drove me off another list.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 07:02 AM

Up around these parts a steak pudding was a 'babbies yed'. We had a name for a black pudding as well but it is to non-pc to repeat here...;-) (Figure it out yersen)

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John Routledge
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 07:38 AM

Ewan - At least we Brits are still considered worth insulting :0)

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 07:50 AM

Fly cemetaries are also known as squashed fly biscuits, or barigaldis.

Lardy cake was one we always watched out for.... made with beef fat (lard) instead of butter, it was a bit claggier (heavier and stickier) than ordinary cake.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Shonagh
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 08:58 AM

I used to work in a bakers every saturday before the urge to go to festivals got too much! Fly cemetaries can either be garibaldi biscuits or sumtimes they are two garibaldi biscuity things with some sort of rasiny/curranty/datey kinda mixture in the middle. Kinda like a sandwich. Ive never had them, its probably the name that puts me off but my gran loves them!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 09:39 AM

Yellow matty custard
Green snot pie
Mix it all together with a dead dog's eye
Slap it in a butty, nice and thick
Then drink it down with a cup of cold sick

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: lady penelope
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 09:52 AM

Fly cemetaries = Eccles cakes!!! A sort of pastry filled with currants in a syrupy sauce. Blech!

My mother still makes clootie dumpling, a large amount of suet and dried fruit which is then boiled. Once it has sat cold for a while ( leftovers the next day sort of thing ) you then slice it up, fry it and eat it with your breakfast......blech!

You can tell I don't like dried fruit.

For those who would like to "bulk out" or raise your blood pressure, there's always tablet. No, not small bits of stone, but essentially 2lbs of sugar, a large can of condensed milk and a couple of drops of vanilla essence. Boil for twenty minutes whilst stirring, pour into tray to set & then eat. It's kind of like very hard fudge. We used to live on it. ( Why was I not fat when I was a kid? )

TTFN M'lady P.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Pooka
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 10:34 AM

Haugh haugh haugh///Ohhhh, God Bless England is my prayer. Hurrah for fair Albion's haute cuisine, sez I.

So Fare thee well, Guest McVicar, fare thee well for a while...but a good-natured sense of self-deprecating humor can be beneficial, fair Ewan son of Clergyperson; so y'all come back, heeah? (I'm sick of all this talk about deprecation. Not even the English would name a dish in honor of deprecating. That's just a crock. Hmmrph?? Oh. Nevermind.)

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 10:42 AM

FER CHRISSAKES WHY CAN NOBODY ON THIS THREAD SPELL "CEMETERY" CORRECTLY ????????????

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Coyote Breath
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 10:54 AM

Though I fear 'twould add insult to young Ewan's injury, I remember a "definition" of Hell: "A place where the waiters are German and the cooks are British." Perhaps there is a connection. I think that Leeneia may be right about the Brtish penchant for giving their food unappealing names (to "prove they are not French"). On the other hand do we USAer's name our food plainly just to prove we're not British? Personally, saying 'bangers' or 'sausages' is of no consequence since they are tasty with either name and I think that the British idea of having a great buffet of food for breakfast is very civilized. Of course I'm writing this before breakfast. I think I'll go have some orange juice, toast, grits and coffee. (grits?) Say I wouldn't mind a couple of eggs (over easy) and biscuits and sausage gravy and slabs of melting butter and perhaps some Canadian bacon and a pair of piping hot blueberry muffins and a stack of flapjacks dripping with Vermont maple syrup.

Oh alright, grits it is.

CB

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Pooka
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 10:54 AM

A relevent point, MurrayMac. We should all be grounded, as it were. Or at least sent back to our dictioneries.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Celtic Soul
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 11:05 AM

While the States does not sport as many strange names for food, our very own Southern cooking does have one of the weirdest concoctions, and it is aptly named:

The "Montecrisco"

A ham and cheese sandwich, deep fried and sprinkled with powdered sugar, then covered with grape jelly.

Can't you just you hear your arteries hardening just by listening to the description?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 11:25 AM

Murray, I suggest you re-read my thread, you will find I did not commit the grave mistake you mention!!
Anyway never mind crazy English/British names for food, what about a Croque Monsieur, where do they get that from?
Failte....Giok

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 11:32 AM

Re: "FER CHRISSAKES WHY CAN NOBODY ON THIS THREAD SPELL "CEMETERY" CORRECTLY ????????????"

1.I ask why someone has to take Christ's name in vain and to start shouting and to waste precious resources such as question marks over the simple and natural tendency to spell something the way it's pronounced.

2. Thanks for the contributions. I had forgotten spotted dick, and I'd never heard of boiled babies. Clearly people are proud of these names.

A verbal collection like this, derived from language, is a good kind to have when you live in a small place. It only takes up room in your mind.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: SINSULL
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 11:49 AM

S'Mores are a Girl Scout invention. Toast a marshmallow in the campfire; place a square of Hershey's chocolate on a graham cracker; add the hot marshmallow; cover with another graham cracker;
Supposedly, you have a taste treat so wonderful you just have to have SOMEMORE!
I would worry more about my teeth than my arteries with this one.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Walrus
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 11:58 AM

I'm with Lady P on "Fly's graveyard"[1], it's an Eccles cake.
What about "Frog Spawn" = Semolina (Cream of Wheat for 'merkins?).
Then there's "Corned Dog" or "Fanny Adams", both old (service) names for Corned Beef (oh and "Choke dog" for hard tack biscuits)
As for the French "Croque Monsieur", there is a similar "Croque Madame" (this one has cream and eggs added to the mix, I believe).

Regards

Walrus

[1] I can't spell cemetery either.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 12:08 PM

We have family recipe for "Spion Kop Cake" So called after the house name of the lady who invented it. The house itself was obviously named in honour of the Boer War battle. Funny name for a cake though!!
Failte.....Giok

P.S. Goodbye Ewan, please feel free to come back when you can't stay so long.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bill D
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 12:35 PM

ah, poor Ewan....I wish he had stayed long enough for me to assure him that tweaking and taking little pot-shots is a healthy sign of respect!..*grin*...it shows ME that we care!..Some cultural differences will always be there, and in the joking and smart-alec fun-poking, we LEARN!

We have an expatriot Brit or two here who sing about "Spotted Dick"...and we laugh and tease and come away knowing more...*grin*

I could go find all the threads where Brits, Aussies and Canadians have poked and teased about we poor Americans and our eccentric ways...but...*smile*..they will all come back anyway in time.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: DMcG
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 12:43 PM

Ewan: I'm a Brit and I don't feel patronised. Are you calling me insensitive???? :-)

(This reminds me of the Stan&Ollie joke where Ollie throws every insult he can think of at Stan with no effect then eventually fades out with "You ... You" - at which point Stan is insulted - "Don't call me a Youyou")

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 12:51 PM

Recently ate so called French cuisine on a French owned ship. Thank the Gods the final destination was Belgium.... the chicken resembled a cold, boiled tennis shoe, the frites were equally cold and the mayonnaise lay there like a blob of something you deposit in a tissue. If I was that sort of girl I'd be able to tell you if it tasted the same as it looked....

In Belgium the mayonnaise was creamy butter yellow and so garlicky it practically ate the steaming hot frites for you!

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:04 PM

Still on the same diet as me then Liz? *BG* ;-{)>

Some hae meat but cannae eat
Some wid eat but want it
We hae meat, an' we can eat
Sae let the Lord be thankit.

Failte.....Giok

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Hippie Chick
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:40 PM

Some hae meat.....Robert Burns, ja?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Jim McLean
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:52 PM

The Selkirk Grace
Robert Burns
Some ha'e meat, and canna eat
And some wad eat that want it:
But we ha'e meat and we can eat,
And sae the Lord be thankit.

When Burns was on a visit to St. Mary's Isle, the Earl of Selkirk requested him to say grace. He obeyed in the above words. Jim McLean

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 01:52 PM

Ach zo

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Rara Avis
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 02:05 PM

"What about "Frog Spawn" = Semolina (Cream of Wheat for 'merkins?)." Walrus, cooked cereal for a pubic wig? Surely not! (merkin = pubic wig) One of the most unappetizing names I've ever heard was "Dump Cake". Apparently, all sorts of fattening ingredients are "dumped" in the baking pan, mixed together, and popped in the oven. It wasn't too bad - in a prepared cake mix sort of way - but the name needs improving.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 02:07 PM

Touchy touchy, there Ewan! Jeez, lighten up!

I watch a fair amount of British television, courtesy of PBS (Masterpiece Theatre, various Britcoms, etc.) and, for me, the imaginative and intriguingly descriptive names of various foods has created a real interest in British cuisine (or is that an oxymoron?).

Anybody got a good recipe for shepherd's pie?

Don Firth (despite the derivation of my last name, I think I'd have to sneak up on haggis. . . .)

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: DMcG
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 02:07 PM

Robert Burns was German??? Mudcat is a mine of information :-)

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,sorefingers
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 02:08 PM

Inviting the Vicar to Tea on a Wensday is one thing, but then offering the nice fellow a plate of breaded roasted bangers and calling that Spotted Dick must be British secret communication - sorta like Masonic hand signs ... well vaguely like.

Perhaps the British use food names as a secret means of sorting out who next to invade?

If so Americans better watch out I see some very strange names being applied to the Mc Donalds gobsmacker.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 03:00 PM

Shepherd's pie. First peel two shepherds.....

Seriously, it's minced lamb with gravy and peas with a mashed potato topping. Cottage pie is the same but with beef mince and carrots. Don't know if there is a minced pork equivalent... probably Cottage Sty.

Our school did a good line in spunk pud and period.... tapioca with a blob of strawberry or raspberry jam in it. Revolting, disgusting name to go with a revolting, disgusting dessert.

Well you did ask!!

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 03:22 PM

As Celtic Soul mentioned, we have a few dishes in the U.S. with names worthy of this thread. "Shoo-fly pie" comes to mind. Names of Yorkshire ales and beers might have to be a whole 'nother thread. But...first prize in my book goes to "Bishop's Vomit."

Chanteyranger

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 03:32 PM

elucidate please Chantey.....

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Jim McLean
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 04:09 PM

Shepherd's pie in Scotland is know as Tatties an' Mince! Jim mcLean

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: specky
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 04:17 PM

the dogs bollocks = yucky ale

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 05:32 PM

Well, living two miles from the birthplace of the (in)famous Eccles cake I can honestly say I have never heard it called a fly cemitury (CORRECT spelling). There is a rumour of a tunnel between the original Eccles cake bakery and the church - running right under the churchyard. Now there's a thing!) Now then, Chorley cake (15 miles from Swinton), that's a whole different kettle of insect resting places...

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Jock Morris
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 05:34 PM

Don't forget the Royal Navy speciality "shit on a raft", for devilled kidneys on toast.

Scott

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 05:36 PM

I did a google search for shepherd's pie recipes and I think I get the general idea. I always thought it was supposed to be fairly simple fare, but some of the recipes seem to go absolutely berzerk! A lot of them use hamburger instead of minced lamb, some say use any old kind of meat (lamb makes sense to me--shepherd's pie, after all), and some go in for all kinds of exotic spices (probably a bit hard to find in the average shepherds panty). They don't seem to draw any distinction between shepherd's pie and cottage pie, they call them all the same. I, however, am devoted to the pursuit of authenticity.

But my vegan friends notwithstanding, I'll draw the line at "shepherd's pie" made with tofu!!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Roughyed
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 05:40 PM

Eccles cakes are definitely not known as fly cemeteries, and originating from Eccles, I should know. The Eccles cake is in fact a delicate and sensitive creature which nests in small holes on the banks of the Manchester Ship Canal. Unfortunately some cruel people still hunt them and when I was a child it was not unusual to see piles of their pathetic steaming little corpses being paraded up Church Street towards Parker and Bradburns cakeshop.

As a founder member of the Eccles Cake Hunt Saboteurs I am proud that our actions led to their nesting grounds being now protected and whilst there is limited culling, the mass slaughter is a thing of the past.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Walrus
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 05:43 PM

Ewan,
If you are still reading, lighten up. Certainly there is a bit of good natured sniping, but nobody gets hurt and everybody ends up in the barrel at some point, so it all evens out.

Rara,
"...cooked cereal for a pubic wig? Surely not! (merkin = pubic wig)..."
Ah, but merkin also = Citizen of the USA as in "My fellow 'merkins..."

Regards

Walrus

By the bye: British food names are bad?
Who was it invented the name "Shit on a shingle"?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 06:50 PM

In America, there is a snack with the brand name POPPYCOCK®. The English word poppycock, meaning nonsense, comes from the Dutch word pappekak, meaning "soft shit."

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 06:59 PM

Are you still in the area then, Swan? Do you frequent the hallowed halls of the White Lion? Make yourself known and we will join forces in the ECHS ranks.

Stand fast against the ways of the evil Bath bun though...

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: artbrooks
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 07:14 PM

In the States, "shit on a shingle", or SOS, means chipped beef on toast...a mainstay of Army cooks. Kidneys are one of the parts that generally goes directly to the dog-food factory.

BTW, herself ran across a cookbook linked to the Patrick O'Brian sea story series that apparently has receipes for many of these things, but now we can't find it agaain. Anyone have the title?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 07:17 PM

"Kidneys are one of the parts that generally goes directly to the dog-food factory."

Why on earth is this horror allowed to go on???

Them dogs are lucky buggers. Kidneys are reet gradely fare!

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: firínne
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 07:55 PM

You've all forgotten bubble and squeak! Also, the Irish are as bad with odd-sounding names - take colcannon, gubeens and coddle for example!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: robomatic
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 07:57 PM

HEAVEN and HELL EUROPEAN STYLE

HEAVEN is where:

The French are the cooks

The Germans are the mechanics

The English are the policemen

The Italians are the lovers

And the Swiss are the organizers

HELL is where:

The English are the cooks

The French are the mechanics

The Germans are the policemen

The Swiss are the lovers

And the Italians are the organizers

I've told this to hundreds of Europeans, and the only people who disagree with the above are the Swiss......

MEN!

robo

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: andymac
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 08:08 PM

I hope Ewan won't be too insulted. He's probably still chuffed at being called "the young Ewan"! As for odd food names, well what about the Danish "baby-heads soup" a clear consomme style soup with small dumplings floating around. PS I can spell semetery (sic) correctly swo there!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 08:40 PM

Swan, thank you for that edifying explanation of the Eccles cake. I had no idea they nested along the Manchester Ship Canal. Are they pretty, blue birds or cute little rodents?

Serious nature news: we had a birding High Alert today. Three hummingbirds are taking a rest in our mid-city back yard. This only occurs this time of year, as they head south from their nesting grounds, and it has only occurred four times in 25 years. Last night, after the first one was spotted ("Are you sure it wasn't a hawk moth?" we washed and set up the feeder, and today they are our honored guests, helping themselves to the sugar water like pro's.

Don Firth: ground lamb for Shepherd's Pie may make sense etymologically speaking (see, I can spell), but it is so fatty. Ground beef is more healthful.

Have you ever read the part of Bridget Jone's Diary where she tries to make Shepherd's Pie? It's funny.

I admit that Americans have come up with some ugly names too. Shoofly pie and dump cake. Also Mississippi Mud cake, which I believe contains every known form of chocolate.

However, "shit on a shingle" is military. Soldiers, while still humans, are in a different class.

The British "frog spawn" sets some kind of record, however. It's so ugly, but creative, too. That's the beauty of it.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Peg
Date: 18 Aug 02 - 11:57 PM

the version of that joke I have heard:

In Heaven:

British = Police, Italians = Cooks, French = Lovers, everything run/organized by the Germans.

In Hell:

French = Police, British = Cooks, Germans = Lovers and everything run/organized by the Italians...

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 12:07 AM

Spelling made easy---Where I come from they are known as flies graveyards.Currants raisins and apple between two thin pieces of short pastry.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Coyote Breath
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 12:18 AM

Oh boy, I'd forgotton (thank God) about SOS. Had enough of that. Imagine it being served on a troop ship with 3,500 very seasick GI's, crossing the Atlantic in the middle of January (1957, actually). I discovered that no matter what else I acquired in life, I had me "sea legs". No one else did. Saw the cliffs of Dover, awsome!

The Cowboy Cafe, in DuBois, Wyoming serves the best shepard's pie I have ever et, I think they make it with bison.

CB

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bert
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 12:19 AM

Squeaks! you're horrible! spunk pud and period.... indeed!

I just can't imagine what kind of school you went to. The worst we had at school was Stodge (bread pudding) *grin*

Yer right Bill D, it's all good natured fun.

And Americans have some good names too. Pigs in a blanket, corn dogs and poke salad to name a few.

Back to England though we seem to have missed out Starry Gazey Pie and Figgy 'obbin. The Cornish catters must be asleep or something.

And we don't want to get into the Army name for dried apricots.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Jimmy C
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 01:11 AM

I had never heard of Fly Cemeteries but I know about Eccles Cakes. In fact I got some a few weeks back in a Scottish bakery here in Canada, and I like them, also Fern Cakes etc.
After reading Ewan's post I have to ask myself " Did I miss something ?", A lighthearted thread about names of food and he gets offended ?. can't figure that one out.

On one episode of the TV series "The Sopranos" had the definition of Hell as an Irish Pub that played Danny Boy all day long, where the Irish dealer always came up with the winning hand in Poker?, Sure sounds more like hell to me than any of the other definitions - and I am Irish?.

slan.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 02:36 AM

"average shepherds panty." Well, my great grandfather was a shepherd and he never kept spices of any sort, but then he didn't wear panties... as far as I know, he was a traditional commando and Y front sort of man (well he was born in 1882).

I went to an all girls school, spunk pud was pretty tame compared with some of them... the jam roly poly was called something you REALLY don't want to know.....

Whilst in Belgium I picked up a box of cookies (or kocken as it said on the box - presumably Flemish for cookie), called Plop. They're rather nice but the name (and the distressingly Smurf like creature with pants on its head that appears on the labels) is a tad offputting but I think Plop Kocken could be a medical term...

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Trevor
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 04:35 AM

Anybody ever had four and twenty blackbirds baked in a pie?

We used to call Eccles cakes Flies Graveyards as well.

Anyway you flat-capped whippet chasers, you gave the world Uncle Joe's Mint Balls (give 'em to yer grannie)! Now there's something to be proud of.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: HuwG
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 05:05 AM

In all the military names for shipboard or field rations, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned "Train smash".

This is food prepared in the rain by cursing Quartermaster-Sergeants and unwilling assistants at 0500 hours (more commonly referred to as "Oh-f*** hundred", or perhaps 0600, otherwise "Oh-s*** hundred") for four score or more soldiers to eat in a hurry.

The ingredients are: fried eggs (runny), fried tomatoes (red and very runny) and baked beans, all served in one mess tin. Two unbuttered slices of bread were provided to mop up.

If this sort of catering wasn't available, the alternatives came from "rat-packs" (ration packs). Bacon-burgers (about 50% grease or fat), dog biscuits (otherwise known as oatmeal blocks), "cheese posessed" (processed cheese) are some of the delicacies I remember.

PS I can spell "cemetery" - G-R-A-V-E-Y-A-R-D. Easy.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: IanC
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 05:09 AM

Fly Cemetery (aka "Dead Fly Pie") is a fruit slice - pastry top and bottom and a general mishmash of dried fruit and goo in the middle (currants, raisins, etc. usually glued together with apple gunge).

It's available in one form or another in most bakeries or teashops in England (and in The Ulster Museum in Belfast), but I've only really heard it called that regularly by Cambridgeshire people (where I was brought up).

:-)
Ian

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: gnomad
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 07:05 AM

Resurection Pie = any old leftover meat, topped with mash in the manner of shepherds pie.

Fly cemetery = currants&sugar turned into a fruit slice with pastry top&bottom.

Squashed fly biscuit = Garibaldi

Dog in a blanket = sultanas/raisins given the fly cemetery treatment.

Bangers & train smash = sausage & tinned (canned) tomato or spaghetti in tomato sauce.

All these were common names in my upbringing, they tasted none the worse for the strange names.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Snuffy
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 09:19 AM

It's only Shepherd's Pie if you use what the EU refers to as "Sheepmeat". If you use any other meat, then it's Cottage Pie.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Pete
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 10:49 AM

Lets get the French involved.Do they still sell a fizzy drink called Pshitt.Not sure about the spelling but absolutely certain about the pronunciation

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 12:08 PM

When I was just a tad, in the late 30s and early 40s, what we called "creamed dried beef on toast" was a great favorite at our house. Salty, salty, salty! I learned later that some called it "Shit on a shingle".

Fast forward to the 50s, in the army. What the mess cooks (adjective accurately assigned) produced, in army language "shit on a shingle", was not the same. It was merely ground beef in a white sauce on bread, or maybe toast, and had essentially no flavor, salty or otherwise. Not really BAD, but not good either.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,sorefingers
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 12:59 PM

Hot Cross Buns..

Bert I like the stodge - sounds nice - btw Poke SalaT not Salad.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 05:05 PM

Black bun

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Crane Driver
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 05:35 PM

BTW - is it true that in the States you can get prosecuted for selling hamburgers that aren't made with ham, despite the name coming from the German city of Hamburg, where the recipe originated? Presumably your frankfurters contain real franks? I don't want to know about your spagetti bolognaise!

Andrew (who can't spell cemitury ither)

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,John from ull
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 05:53 PM

I used to live oppersit a cemetry, but i moved.john

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Just Amy
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 06:35 PM

The way we make a Monte Cristo is ham, turkey and swiss cheese in white bread covered with milk and egg and deep fat fried (like French Toast) and served with strawberry preserves on top. They make the best ones at the restaurant in Disneyland that is next to Pirates of the Caribbean.

The definition of S'Mores above is right on except they are the best tasting dessert in the world.

We always had shephard's pie on Monday because it was the leftovers from Sunday dinner: Lamb, peas, carrots, and gravy covered over with smashed potatoes on top and baked in the oven.

Shoo fly pie even has a song written about it - "Shoo fly pie and apple pan dowdy make your eyes light up, your tummy say howdy."

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: artbrooks
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 06:43 PM

In the States, hamburger is, by definition, made from 100% ground beef. The derivation is supposed to be the city in Germany, not the similar sounding pig byproduct. Frankfurters (more commonly known as hot dogs) contain neither franks or dogs...beef and pork are most common, with turkey and/or chicken available for the health-conscious.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Lanfranc
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 07:16 PM

To follow on from LtS's earlier contribution, at my school (which shall be nameless!), jam roly poly was often referred to as "Dr White's Pudding". Nuff said!

"Say what you will, school dinners make you ill
Davy Crockett died of shepherds pie
Lumpy custard, yellow mustard
Dead dog's eye."

(I've often wondered whether that last bit inspired the similar lines in the Beatles "I am the Walrus")

Come to think about it, that little doggerel is as dating as a bristle cone pine!

Alan

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 07:24 PM

Substitute Dr Whites for Tampax and you have it.....

What pleasant creatures teenaged girls are.....

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Lanfranc
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 07:34 PM

I hear that teenaged boys can be pleasant, too, Liz, though I've never tried one!

Alan

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: robomatic
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 08:22 PM

Military addenda from the Civil War (U.S.)

'hardtack' a kind of dry hard biscuit for ship service and distribution to the embattled ranks. A more tender version survives and is popular in the here & now in 'laska as 'Pilot Bread':

Pvt. Right: "Drat and Tarnation, I just took a bite out of my hardtack and I found a soft spot!"

Pvt. Left: "What was it, a worm?"

Pvt. Right: "No, dammit, a &*^%%#@ nail!"

robo

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: dodgy bird
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 08:38 PM

my experience is that if your from yorkshire then shepherds pie is made with minced beef anywhere else it is made with lamb although as stated earlier it is correct that shepherds pie is traditionally lamb and cottage pie is beef!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Yorkshire Tony
Date: 19 Aug 02 - 11:19 PM

The shepherd's pie I remember was always made with leftover roast lamb (or mutton). I remember a part of a rhyme from my grandmother:

Roast on Sunday, cold on Monday, shepherd's pie Tuesday..

Does anyone know the rest?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Gurney
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 07:53 AM

I just remembered another staunch Pommie food whose title should amuse Americans. Faggots. Balls of highly spiced sausagemeat. Wassail.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: harvey andrews
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 08:28 AM

Ah, faggots and peas..another great Black Country delicacy to follow the grorty dick!!! There's a Black Country pub that does Desperate Dan pies, complete with cowhorns on the pastry crust. They're huge and if you manage to finish one you get a special badge. I took three friends along and we emerged badgeless, but heavier.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Walrus at work
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 08:46 AM

Lanfranc,

"...Say what you will, school dinners make you ill
Davy Crockett died of shepherds pie
Lumpy custard, yellow mustard
Dead dog's eye...."

The version in my school ran along the lines:

Say what you will, school dinners make you ill
Davy Crockett died of shepherds pie
All school "din-dins"
Come from Pig bins
Out of town

There was some more but it's slipped into the black hole of memory.
The tuine was that of the theme tune to the TV series "Out of Town" (Jack Hargreves IIRC)

artbrooks,

".... Frankfurters (more commonly known as hot dogs) contain neither franks or dogs...beef and pork are most common..."
Weeeell yes and no! How do you think they got the name hotdogs?
Sausages were, at one time, nicknamed "Barkers", as people were dubious about the origin of the meat used. I suggest that "hotdog" might have the same origin.

regards

Walrus

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: AggieD
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 10:43 AM

Ok you all you from the other side of the pond, what about Hush Puppies? I thought they were a brand of shoes until I visited North Carolina. In my humble opinion French 'cuisine' leaves much to be desired. On our recent trip to Paris we ate more Italian food than French (better food, friendlier service with a smile...etc.)

AggieD

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: RolyH
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 10:44 AM

Stargazy Pie

A pie made from pilchards,herrings or sardines with the heads left on, looking out from under the crust.Its too sad to eat.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,nobby
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 11:39 AM

yeah your are right we went too far when we crossed the Atlantic. But the sensible ones came back.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: MudGuard
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 11:54 AM

What is the problem?

Worse than giving horrible names to food stuff is
what is done in the United States:

there horrible stuff is called food (e.g. whatever comes out of McDonalds, Burger King, ...)

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 01:34 PM

What do you mean by asking what's the problem, MudGuard? There is no problem. There doesn't always have to be a problem, you know. Here people are just sharing jokes and memories. ----------------------- I have been ruminating on the spelling of cemetery. It occurs to me that it is spelled wrong in the dictionary. After all, dictionary makers are not infallible.

If you want to keep the last e, then it ought to have two r's. Like this: cemeterry. This would be analogous to derry, ferry, Kerry, Terry, etc.

Anyway, the cemetery spelling obviously isn't right. Consider the following list: forgery, Margery, debauchery, cemetery. Clearly "cemetery" doesn't fit.

No doubt someone will post a post saying that cemetery is derived from the Medieval Latin "cemetererere," meaning to put someone under the cement, but I'm not buying that. The Medieval Latins are long dead, and their spelling was never reliable, anyway. ---------------- Thanks, everybody, for protecting me, who started this thread, from people like Ewan who wanted to turn it into a flaming situation.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: DMcG
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 02:11 PM

"Consider the following list: forgery, Margery, debauchery, cemetery".

This is a little known parable in minimal form. After committing forgery you become very attractive to certain types of females (the gold-digger kind) personified here by Margery. Debauchery and the cemetery are, I am afraid, the consequence. And cemetery fits perfectly.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Hawker
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 02:45 PM

From Cornwall there is also the beloved 'Tiddy Oggie' - known to non-locals as the Pasty!
Nobody has been brave enough to mention tripe and cow heel yet, and what about lights and sweetmeats?
For Christmas, one could always feast on the Boards Headand one of my favourite potato dishes is Pan Haggelty (haggerty and various other speellinks depending on where yas comin from)
Cheers, Lucy

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Mr Red
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 02:52 PM

Sorry to by-pass all the drift and mention
missionary cake.
maids of honour?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Gareth
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 03:45 PM

I am surprised that no one has mentioned "Toad in the Hole" - Sauseges baked in an open dish surrounded by a batter mix Yorkshire podding.

Gareth

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: MudGuard
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 03:50 PM

Gareth, you must be drunk!

Toad in the hole was mentioned in the starting post of this thread... ;-)
Greetings to Wales!
MudGuard/Andy

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Souter
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 04:41 PM

Sorry, walrus. but you're wrong. It's fairly well established that the name "hot dog" came from a cartoon on the subject in the early years of the last century. Most people called them Red Hots. A man drew a cartoon with the Red Hot as a Dauschund, and the caption "Get your red hot dacuschund dogs!". The name Hot Dog stuck.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 05:20 PM

Devils on horseback. Upside down cake. Yorkshire curd tart, forever known in my house as turd cart. Death by chocolate?
Calories, twas only for calories
Our belts were broken
And bellies are worn so low
I never used to have mammeries
But now they've appeared on me
With every sweet bite, she has given to me.

Cholesterol! what cholesterol?......Giok

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Yorkshire Tony
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 07:14 PM

One thing I miss since moving to the antipodes is real cheese. Does anyone know if the shop at the back of Keighley market still sells the strong Lancashire which could kill a mammoth at twenty paces?

We had a few favourite names based on what could be done to a blackboard menu in the Uni refectory. Apple harlots and stewed teak are all I can think of at the moment.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: artbrooks
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 08:12 PM

GUEST,leeneia, are you somehow under the delusion that English language spelling makes sense or that it follows its own rules?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bert
Date: 20 Aug 02 - 10:28 PM

I'm surprised that Kendall hasn't contributed with Moose Turd Pie!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 01:17 AM

Lucy: I like the sound of Pan Haggelty. How is it made?

Artbrooks: No, I am not under the delusion that English spelling makes sense. Only that people do, or usually do.

Today I cooked a sort of tart for dessert. I combined a fussy French recipe with one remembered from a magazine. I sliced up two nectarines and mixed in some apricot butter. Then I rolled out some nice, buttery pastry dough (that was the French part.) I plopped the nectarines onto the dough and flipped whatever pastry didn't go under onto the top of the them. Note that the pastry didn't have to be round or tidy in shape. (That was the part from the magazine.) Then I baked it, first at 375 for 25 minutes, and when it didn't look done enough, at 400 for 10 more.

Now I'm searching for a name for it. Flippant tart? Nonchalant tart? Slap-a-daisy?

It was good.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Mr Happy
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 03:41 AM

'then they ordered their bottles'o beer and pints o'sherry, which carried them off to the cemetery, and that is where they are all buried, when peculiar ale was new me boys, when peculiar ale was new'

kipper family

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Trevor
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 05:46 AM

I've had a few giggles at Greek menus over the years.

Frigid Squid (frozen I think)
Lamp Cutlets
Orgy Wine (your guess is as good as mine!)
and the best yet, for roast goat
KIDDIE ON A SPIT

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Lanfranc at the orifice
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 06:28 AM

The tune "Out of Town", mentioned in the context of the "School Dinner Song", was also a hit for Max Bygraves in the 50s and was featured in a film called Charlie something-or-other which I remember vaguely from the same era. (Just to bring a musical note to these epicurean discussions)

I have often wondered about the US aversion to eating offal. I once had a very senior Californian banker walk out on a business lunch when calves liver was served!

Silly fellow! It was delicious, as are sauteed sweetbreads (lamb's pancreas), devilled kidneys and heart curry.

Alan

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Gill Moulding
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 08:41 AM

In Northumberland we have the delights of Singing Hinnies so called because they sing as they are cooked on a girdle on top of the cooker (or fire originally) and yes it is called a girdle not a griddle. The other delicacy is Stotty Bread - a falt round loaf cooked on the bottom shelf of the oven. Both delicious

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Gill Moulding
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 08:44 AM

That should read flat - i have a typing problem!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 10:17 AM

"I have often wondered about the US aversion to eating offal." What's to wonder?

No, seriously, we all like to eat what's familiar. Consider the Australian aborigines, who eat (or used to eat) giant earthworms. How many of us could do that?

I do wonder how many cocktails that senior California banker had had before the luncheon. Walking out on someone's hospitality is inexcusable. Anyway, everybody knows that vegetables are there to hid pieces of liver under.

I am still waiting to hear how to make Pan Haggelty from Cornwall.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Don Firth
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 01:44 PM

Once years ago, while rummaging around an hors d'oeuvre tray one evening, I went through a whole tin of fried grasshoppers before I found out what they were.

(I really must learn to proof-read more carefully. That should read "pantry." But then, who really knows where a shepherd keeps his spices?)

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 09:04 PM

Trevor, I liked your list of Greek dishes. The names are "so near and yet so far."

Don, too bad about the grasshoppers.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Coyote Breath
Date: 21 Aug 02 - 09:28 PM

Being of Cornish descent (on mom's side, from Gweek and near the Tolvan Cross) I have had many a pasty. In fact just had one tonight made with venison and peas and no rutabegas (sp?) potato instead, prefer them to rotarooters, my sister lives up in the Grass Valley, Nevada City area of California, many old hard rock miners from Cornwall set the areas kitchens aright with home style cooking but Pan Haggelty I've never heard of. My mom used to have a saying: "By tre, pol or penn, shall ye know the Cornishmen" her name was Moyle, they were either plantationed out of Ireland or were "soupers" cause she came from a long line of Methodists.

CB

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 01:21 AM

Hi all,

Cemetary seems to be a fairly new "alternate" spelling. I operate cemetery tours in Orlando, FL and several people have actually tried to correct my spelling. I looked in a new unabridged disctionary, and the spelling with an "a" is not in there.

I think it's odd that Americans don't like kidneys but usually consider liver ok - at least we used to. Seeing that a kidney just stores waste material prior, while a live actually collects bad stuff and holds on to it.

Art - don't forget about "not" dogs - tofu hot dogs.

Also - early on I mentioned that it was ironic that English food is the one cuisine I know of that has unappetising names - I assume that after 117 posts that most will understand the souce of that irony - English food has a reputation to be bland and not very good. I do not hold to this position - the best bowl (4 actually) of soup I have ever had was a cream of broccoli in a pub in the town of Broadway south of Stratford. There are few gastronomic events I have had that compare with how good that soup was. And it cost 1 pound for each bowl and came with as much homemade bread as I could eat. I had a Icelandic lobster bisque that was remarkable too, but the richness of lobster is almost unfair to compare to the humble broccoli.

pax yall, I'm going to go eat.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 01:58 AM

Whoever says English cuisine is bland has never tried mediaeval English cuisine. Neither have they been eating in the right restaurants!

As wth many things, the English cuisine depends on subtlety and contrast rather than all out grab you by the throat and overload your senses.... One of the best fragrances in the world is the smell of a good thick juicy stew simmering on the stove at the end of a long cold day.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Trevor
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 08:46 AM

Yeah, but swede and parsnips...........'scuse me while I heave at the thought of it (as mentioned on another thread)

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Moleskin Joe
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 09:29 AM

If you come to Glasgow you will be able to get a really offensive delicacy - a darkie's walloper.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 22 Aug 02 - 11:48 PM

Sure, there's good English food, just as there's good American food. Just don't expect it at a fast food place or a John Menzies which is geared to getting people recharged and on their way promptly.

This thread didn't start talking about food per se, but food names.

After supper I was looking at a book of Scottish recipes. How does "bloater paste" grab you? Of course, I don't suppose it was meant to be ironic, like some names, but nonetheless...

By the way, what's a dog's breakfast?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Jimmy C
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 01:46 AM

Moleskin Joe, I hear they deep fry pizza slices and also Mars bars in Glasgow - is this true ?. If so what are they called ?.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 04:42 AM

I have not yet heard of the creative imagination being applied to the two delicacies you mention. Perhaps there is a challenge here?

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Raedwulf
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 05:41 AM

A Bloater is a salted & lightly smoked herring. Hence bloater paste is fish paste (much like pate, etc, only different... ;) ).

As to to cemetery (since someone sort of asked!), it derives via MidEng & Latin from the Greek for 'dormitory', itself derived from a word meaning 'put to sleep'. My OED is of the opinion that cemetery is more often used for a graveyard not attached to a church.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 05:51 AM

Liz, I never elucidate in public.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Trevor
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 09:46 AM

A dog's breakfast where I come from is any kind of mess, tangle or disorganisation. Dog's bo****ks, on the other hand (if you see what I mean!) for some reason means the best, the zenith, the absolutely absolutely, erm, dogs bo****ks!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Greyeyes
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 03:07 PM

Cullen Skink. Don't know the actual meaning or derivation, but it's a delicious smoked haddock & potato soup.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 11:38 PM

Hi all,

Cemetery was first used in the 14th century by Greek Christian writers. In comes via the late Latin coemeterium from the Greek koimeterion which oroginally meant dormitory (as said above). It was a derivative of the verb koiman 'put to sleep'. The Greek Christian writers used it to mean burial ground, but in a euphimisic sense. It is probably tied to the Book of Revelations discussion of the dead rising from their graves (sort of sleeping). In the early 19th century, when the modern cemeteries in Paris and London were being established - large areas, with meadows, streams, etc. the term began being used for them. It later became part of the official terms used by the developing funeral industry. Other words: "funeral director" instead of undertaker (although today many of them like the term "grief counselor" as well, "casket" instead of coffin, "Client" instead of cadaver or corpse, "cremains" instead of ashes - cremated + remains = cremains.

pax yall

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 09:39 AM

Ah, British dog's breakfast = American mishmash.

I knew that someone would have to give the derivation of cemetery. It just wouldn't be the Mudcat without it.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 10:09 AM

Cullen Skink Recipe

Ingredients
12oz smoked haddock
1 onion, peeled and chopped
1.5pt boiling water
1pt milk
1.5lb potatoes, peeled and chopped
0.5oz butter
salt
pepper
finely chopped parsley for garnish

Method
Place the haddock in a large pan and pour the boiling water over it. Bring back to the boil and add the chopped onion. Cover and simmer until the haddock is tender. Allow to cool a little. Drain off and keep the liquid. Carefully remove and discard any bones in the fish. Put the fish onto a plate and put into the fridge. Add the milk to the fish liquid, cover and simmer for an hour. Meanwhile, cook the potatoes in a separate saucepan until soft. Drain and mash. Remove the fish and milk liquid from the heat and add the potatoes and flaked fish (check again for bones). stir the soup with a wooden spoon and season to taste. Add the butter and reheat gently.
Garnish with parsley.

Cullen is a small fishing village in the north east of Scotland. I have no idea of the etymology of skink though.
With regard to Bloaters, these are English in origin, we Scots have our own superior version called an Arbroath Smokie. This is a hot smoked haddock, and is delicious eaten hot or cold.
Failte.....Giok

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 04:57 PM

I've only just caught up with this, and have read carefully through, and seen the names of several dishes that I remember from school dinners. But, amazingly, no mention of spam fritters. Luckily I'm too young to remember Woolton pie.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: RolyH
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 05:35 PM

I was in Cullen earlier this week (working!)and had Cullen Skink

It is nectar from the Gods!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: RolyH
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 05:42 PM

The road signs say

'Welcome to Cullen , Home of "Cullen Skink" '

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 06:06 PM

Dead Man's Leg is another one.

Going to the other extreme, there are Nice Biscuits.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 08:19 PM

Hi Kitty, welcome along to the gourmet thread. Are you sure about the Woolton pie remark? *BG* Myself I'm too young to remember lots of things, like "what did I go upstairs for?" You know what the TOGS sweater says; "Do I come here often?"
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 09:49 PM

Artbrooks: the gastronomic companion to Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey/Maturin novels is "Lobscouse & Spotted Dog," authored by Anned Grossman and Lisa Thomas (W.W. Norton & Company 1997). This fine cookbook lists such wonders as Pig's Fry, Sucking Pig, Frumenty, Jam Roly-Poly, Bashed Neeps (or Neeps Hackit with Balmagowry), not to mention Treacle Dowdy and Figgy Dowdy, there's also Plum-Duff, Dog's Nose, Floating Archipelago, Whipt Syllabub, and the ever tasty Forcemeat Balls ...
Surprised nobody has mentioned Jam, Chip, or mushy pea butties ...
and for us 'Mericans ... Moon Pies ...
Meanwhile back to dessert and Goosebery Fool or Quaking Pudding ...
Cheers,
Brian

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Wotcha
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 09:54 PM

sorry, forgot to reset the cookie ... Guest ... Wotcha.
Cheers,
Brian

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Wavestar
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 01:47 AM

Jimmy C - In St Andrews, across the country, they do indeed deep fat fry both Mars Bars and pizza, including haggis pizza. Just come on down the the Kinness Fry Bar...

-J

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: zonahobo
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 04:26 AM

Here's a good ol merican one. Rocky Mountain Oysters .. course there's no oysters near the Rockies .. had a meal of calve lights in Austria recently and was quite enjoying it when I asked the waiter what it was and he sort of coughed and struck his chest .. I asked again and got roughly the same response .. Finally he said something like lunge .. oh .. lungs .. gulp ..

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Walrus
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 05:09 AM

Go back in time and some of the names get worse.
I seem to recall that Grosse[1] mentions the "Four Turd" supper, consisting pig's trotter, pig's nose and pork chittlings - the name comes from "tread turd" (trotters), "stir turd" (snout), "hold turd" (chittlings) and mus-turd.

Walrus

[1] I can't confirm, because I STILL can't find my copy.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: artbrooks
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 10:32 AM

Thanks for the book reference, Wotcha.

Rocky Mountain Oysters are, of course, what's left over when you make a male calf into a steer. Not bad, with lots of hot sauce, and they go well with a main course of grilled fillet of rattlesnake.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: artbrooks
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 12:37 PM

This is Jenn, called "herself" by Art (what airs!). I don't get to use the computer much, but I have really enjoyed reading this thread (from the get-go). On the American side, how about "hangtown fry"? And we ate a lot of slumgullion when we were younger and poorer. And there was Finnan Haddie--some kind of smoked fish, not easy to find here--it was poached and eaten absolutely drowned in melted butter--yumm.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 11:18 PM

This time I had to look up a derivation. I was sure "slumgullion" would be a corruption of an Irish or perhaps Indian word, but no. There is no derivation, which must mean that somebody just made it up. And, it originally referred to insipid drink, such as weak tea.

Just goes to show how strongly people felt about their tea.

As for "skink", it's either a kind of lizard which lives in warm, sandy regions or a verb meaning "to draw, pour out or serve." Either sense seems baffling.

Maybe somebody should inform Cullen that "Cullen" comes from the Gaelic for holly.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Roughyed
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 07:15 PM

In Oldham where I now live a muffin is a dense white bread barmcake/roll cooked on the oven bottom which forms an integral part of the local delicacy, a chip muffin. The most encouraging thing I have seen for a long while is the food available in a local asian takeaway which is a samosa muffin. Multiculturalism is here whether you like it or not!

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 10:49 PM

That must be why our church's latest cookbook had a recipe for Tex-Mex Won Ton.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 11:21 PM

Surprised no one has mentioned dingle berry pie

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 12:00 AM

Did you hear about the South-East Asian bar? Thai-One-On

The Mexican soul food joint? Nacho Mama's

How about the Buddhist Hamburger Stand where they can make you one with everything.

Not food names (or info about cemetery either), but It's my bedtime...

pax yall

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Walrus at work
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 08:36 AM

Swan,

A local Indian owned corner shop near me was, at one time, selling "Bread Pakora"

Blackcatter,

If you try one of those Buddhist Hamburgers, make sure you have the right money, because the propriator doesn't give change after all "...all change must come from within..."

Walrus

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Mr Happy
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 01:03 PM

'just give i boiled parsnips, an' a gerrt dish o' taties, an' a lump o' fatty bacon, an' a pint o' good ale!!'

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 08:04 PM

Liz, round our way your tapioca with a lump of jam in the middle was called 'dead man's eye'. And Leeneia, round our way, 'cemetery'is a three-syllable word with the accent on the first syllable.

BJ

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 11:10 PM

"round our way, 'cemetery'is a three-syllable word with the accent on the first syllable."

Is it pronnounced differently in other places? I've been trying, but it's pretty difficult to knock it down to just two syllables. Certainly, it can be done, but it doesn't sound that much different.

Walrus - too true, too true.

And lest you all think I'm brilliant, the Buddhist Hamburger line comes from Spider Robinson an SF writer of whom I've had the fortune to get drunk in the presence (or something like that....)

I still haven;t been aboe to think of weird American names for food. The only thing that comes to mind is "diner speak" the alternate terms for meals used at the great American diner. "Adam & Eve on a raft & wreck 'em" would mean scrambled eggs on toast.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Blackcatter
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 11:32 PM

Diner Counter Lingo Glossary (albeit incomplete)

Adam and Eve on a raft Two poached eggs on toast.
Adam and Eve on a raft & wreck 'em Two scrambled eggs on toast.
Adam's ale Plain water.
axle grease or skid grease Butter.
baby, moo juice, Sweet Alice or cow juice Milk.
belch water Seltzer or soda water.
birdseed Cereal.
blue-plate special A dish of meat, potato, and vegetable served on a plate (usually blue).
Bossy in a bowl Beef stew, so called because "Bossy" was a common name for a cow.
bowl of red A bowl of chili con carne, so called for its deep red color.
bowwow A hot dog.
breath An onion.
bridge or bridge party Four of anything, so called from the card-game Bridge.
bullets Also called "whistleberries" or "Saturday nights." Baked beans, so called because of the flatulence they cause.
bun pup A hot dog.
burn one Put a hamburger on the grill.
burn the British A toasted English muffin.
cat's eyes or fish eyes Tapioca.
China Rice pudding.
chopper A table knife.
city juice Water.
clean up the kitchen Hash or hamburger.
Coney Island chicken or Coney Island A hot dog, so called because hot dogs were popularly associated with the Coney Island stands at which they were sold.
cowboy A western omelet or sandwich.
cow feed A salad
creep Draft beer.
crowd Three of anything (From the old saying, "Two's company, three's a crowd").
deadeye Poached egg.
dog and maggot Cracker and cheese.
dog biscuit Cracker.
dog's body A pudding of pea soup and flour or hardtack. dough well done with cow to cover Buttered toast.
draw one Coffee.
eighty-six (86) "Do not sell to that customer" or "The kitchen is out of the item ordered." Perhaps from the practice at Chumley's Restaurant in New York City of throwing rowdy customers out the back door, which is No. 86 Bedford Street. The term certainly predates its first appearance in print circa 1967.
Eve with a lid on Apple pie, referring to the biblical Eve's tempting apple and to the crust that covers it.
fifty-five A glass of root beer.
first lady Spareribs, a pun on Eve's being made from Adam's spare rib.
fly cake or roach cake A raisin cake or huckleberry pie.
Frenchman's delight Pea soup.
GAC Grilled American cheese sandwich. This was also called "jack" (from the pronunciation of "GAC"); a "Jack Benny" (after a radio comedian) was cheese with bacon.
gentleman will take a chance Hash.
go for a walk An order to be packed and taken out.
gravel train Sugar bowl.
graveyard stew Milk toast.
groundhog Hot dog.
hemorrhage Ketchup.
high and dry A plain sandwich without butter, mayonnaise, or lettuce.
houseboat A banana split, made with ice cream and bananas.
in the alley Serve as a side dish.
Irish turkey Corned beef and cabbage.
java or joe Coffee.
looseners Prunes, so called because of their laxative effect.
lumber A toothpick.
maiden's delight Cherries
Mike and Ike or the twins Salt and pepper shakers.
Mud or murk Black coffee.
Murphy Potatoes, so called because of their association with the Irish.
Noah's boy A slice of ham, because Ham was Noah's second son.
no cow Without milk.
on the hoof Meat done rare.
on wheels An order to be packed and taken out.
pair of drawers Two cups of coffee.
Pittsburgh Toast or something burning, so called because of the smokestacks evident in Pittsburgh, a coal-producing and steel-mill city. In meat cookery, this refers to a piece of meat charred on the outside while still red within.
put out the lights and cry Liver and onions.
radio A tuna-fish-salad sandwich on toast punning on "tuna down," which sounds like "turn it down," as one would the radio knob.
sand Sugar.
sea dust Salt.
sinkers and suds Doughnuts and coffee.
Vermont Maple syrup, because maple syrup comes primarily from Vermont.
warts Olives.
wreath Cabbage.
wreck 'em Scramble the eggs.
yum-yum Sugar.
zeppelins in a fog Sausages in mashed potatoes.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 28 Aug 02 - 03:20 AM

Dead man's eye was semolina in our school... the tapioca had a different consistency, so got it's name.....

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 28 Aug 02 - 09:36 AM

That's three syllables as opposed to four, Blackcatter, cem-e-terr-y, which seems to be the way some of our friends above want to pronounce it.

BJ

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 12:11 AM

So, Bullfrog, how do you tell "cemetery" from "symmetry?"

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 05:57 AM

Cemeteries are rarely symmetrical, many gravestones having a pronounced list (pronounced 'l-i-s-t').
BJ

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 06:31 AM

My favourite food quote was from a French gastronome, who said "To eat well in England, Have breakfast three times a day". I must say I agree.

Nigel

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Greyeyes
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 02:44 PM

Alternatively, to eat well in England, learn to cook.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Penny S.
Date: 29 Aug 02 - 05:38 PM

Shepherd's pie, in my Mum's way - ie authentic. When the roast (beef or lamb or mutton - remeber mutton?) has got down to a quantity that, minced, will half fill your pie dish, mince it, and toss in seasoned flour. Chop and brown a middling onion. Add the mince. Also add some gravy, made, in our house, with an Oxo cube. Add it a bit at a time, to give the right sort of texture - there should be runny stuff between the meat, thickened with the flour, but not too much. It should not be thick like a pudding. Put it in the pie dish.

Meanwhile, you need to have boiled enough potatoes that, when mashed, they will fill the top of the pie dish. Or more, if you want to save them for bubble and squeak, or frying for breakfast. They need to be a floury potato, not waxy. When cooked, break them up so there are no lumps, and mix in a good lump of butter. A bit of pepper would be good, too. (The cooking water should have been salted, so salt isn't necessary at this point. Add a little milk, and mix to a good texture - not too stiff and not too runny. Top the meat with it. Then use a fork to make a rough ridged pattern on top.

Bake for about half an hour - about 180 C, I think.

You can modify this any way you like. Use fresh mince instead of left over. Add assorted vegetables. Our school used baked beans, so the tomato sauce contributed the thickening. Marks and Spencer did a variation with mint in with a fresh lamb mince base, topped with a potato and fresh pea mash, which was scrumptious, and has been discontinued. It is a folk recipe, so the way you develop of doing it will be authentic. For you.

If you only have waxy potatoes, you slice them after cooking, and then arrange them on the meat like roof tiles or shingles. That is not shepherd's pie. That was what my Mum called cottage pie. She came from the Wealden part of East Sussex, and cooked after the manner of her mother.

In the Depression, she told me, her mother served up what she called "hasty pudding" - there are other versions of what follows. Boil water with some flour and sugar in a saucepan. This is improved by using milk, or not using it at all.

In our school, tapioca was frogspawn. We also had facecream pudding, which was cornflour pudding (aka custard), thick and lumpy, coloured a delicate underwear or face cream pink, and flavoured with.....something. Not horrendously unpleasant, but not something one would seek out from specialist shops in later life. We also had dry fly pie. A pastry case filled with currants, coconut and syrup, and topped with more pastry.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Penny S.
Date: 30 Aug 02 - 05:17 AM

Health and safety update. If using fresh meat, it must be fully cooked first, with the onions and the gravy. Beef takes longer than lamb.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: The Walrus at work
Date: 30 Aug 02 - 08:29 AM

Penny,

"...We also had facecream pudding, which was cornflour pudding (aka custard), thick and lumpy, coloured a delicate underwear or face cream pink, and flavoured with.....something..."

When we were served the same stuff at school, the kitchen staff called it "blancmange" - we just called it "pink sick" (the falvouring was supposed to be strawberry or raspberry - or something similar).

Walrus

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 30 Aug 02 - 11:50 PM

Thanks for the recipes, Penny S. I'm going to print them out and cook them.

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 02 Sep 02 - 11:42 PM

G'day leeneia,

So, Bullfrog, how do you tell "cemetery" from "symmetry?"

Err ... (since Bullfrog has not given the obvious answer) ... by the pronunciation ... ? (Unless you happen to come from New Zealand!)

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,patjoe
Date: 03 Sep 02 - 02:41 PM

Nigel

I can just imagine having All Day Breakfast three times a day.

For those that don't know, HP sells a concoction of beans chopped scrambled eggs, fried bread, tomatoes and bacon in a tin called All Day Breakfast. Yummy!

Pat

Subject: RE: BS: You Brits have gone too far
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 03 Sep 02 - 03:42 PM

They should include a few fly cemeteries in the All Day Breakfast so that one can tell the morning meal from the evening.