folk song carriers

Subject: folk song carriers
From: debils
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 07:27 AM

i have for the past nine years been researching my family history. whilst in the process of this i came across a certain folk song collector, in the process of things it turned out that my ggg grandfather was a carrier of these songs and the collector took down these songs for my ggg grandad has any one else got ancestor song carriers?

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Deckman
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 07:43 AM

A very interesting question. What do you mean by the term, "folk song carrier?" CHEERS, Bob

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: debils
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 08:01 AM

i mean that my ggg grandad knew folk songs and the collector took them down so that they would never be forgotten

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 10:27 AM

Which collector was that? It would be interesting to know. Sabine Baring Gould did a lot of collecting in the area of Devon where my paternal Grandmother's family lived, and I've always wondered if any of his sources might be (distant, by now!) relatives. Mudcatter "kytrad" (Jean Ritchie) is the expert on such things round here; she and her family have been "collected" rather a lot, and she herself also has a lot of experience on the other side, so to speak, of the notebook.

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Deckman
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 10:40 AM

The closest that "collecting" came to my family, as far as I know, was my great great GrandFather, G.W. Murray. He fought in the American Civil War, was captured and imprisoned in the infamous Andersonville Prison. After his release at the end of the war, he published a small book of his experiences. The prologue to his book contained a poem about Andersoville Prison. I always suspected that it was a song and that he wrote it. I recently found out, through MUDCAT, that it was a very populiar ballad of the time. CHEERS, Bob

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 11:00 AM

From Webster's On-line

CARRIER: 5 a : a bearer and transmitter of a causative agent of an infectious disease; especially : one who carries the causative agent of a disease (as typhoid fever) systemically but is immune to it b : an individual (as one heterozygous for a recessive) having a specified gene that is not expressed or only weakly expressed in its phenotype

debils: No doubt your ggg. infected many othres and also passed the "folk gene" through the generations in your family.

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 11:05 AM

Joke for British naval types:

"Doctor, doctor, I think I've got Hermes:"
"Don't you mean 'Herpes' ?" "No, I think I'm a carrier"

Nigel

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: debils
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 09:38 AM

the collectors of my ggg granddads songs were firstly sabine baring-gould and secondly frederick bussell between then it is reckoned they collected more than 148

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: katlaughing
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 02:17 PM

Wow, debils, that is exciting, esp. that you found it through your genealogy searches! Welcome to the Mudcat and thanks for sharing this with us.

It would be fun to know some of the song titles to, if you feel like posting them.

My dad has passed down some songs from his granddad, but they were not originals, mostly from known songs of the day. Though, our old fiddle-maker did tell me the versions of some of the fiddle tunes we know are indigenous to our part of Colorado; slight variations not heard elsewhere.

Great thread!

kat

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: pattyClink
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 09:54 PM

We had 'carrier' pigeons who got 'collected' in our family, too.

Had any luck getting your hands on copies of the recordings or transcriptions of your 'folks'?

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Art Thieme
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 12:54 AM

Debils,

Those of us who have been striving to sing and pass on the traditional folksongs we've collected (plus a few others) know exactly what your question means and is about in spite of facetious posts here in your good thread. Please don't be offended or put off. Be proud!

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: debils
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 08:25 AM

i'll list a few sons here one of my favourites is Frog and Mouse which my ggg granddads mother used to sing to him when he was a small child another is called the Death of Parker, the Little Girl down the Road, The Gipsy Countess, Farewell To Kingsbridge, Gosport Beach, The Little Bonny Boy, Don't you go a-rushing,The Bold Trooper The Undutiful Daughter, High Germany, The Cuckold's Song, When Joans Ale was new this is just a few of his many songs i haven't been able to find any here but perhaps they are under a different title. I have seen all the song manuscripts for my ggg granddads songs they are held in Plymouth City Library where Baring-Gould sent copies of everything he had written i was also given some cd's with my ggg granddads songs on, and i was very lucky to find this out while i was researching, it was all because i had been told by a friend that they had seen my surname written in a biography of Baring-Gould when i read the book for myself i realised that the man they were taking about was my ggg granddad. Myself and my family past and present have always had a great love of music.

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 11:08 AM

What was his name?

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 12:33 PM

Thanks, again, debils, for sharing even more with us. This is exciting to read about such a direct connection. Please feel free to tell us more as there are many of us on here, as Art Thieme demonstrates, who welcome these stories and are honoured by your sharing.

Thanks for some of the titles, too.

kat

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Harry Basnett
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 12:57 PM

Hi, debils.....

Would your ggg grandfather have been one Mr. Samuel Fone of Mary Tavy?

Yours inquisitively...............Harry Basnett.

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 05:13 PM

debils, yours is a wonderful story, and it is good to learn that some of your ggg grandfather's songs are still being sung in your family (if I've understood you correctly).

Marin Graebe has been doing extensive research on the collecting activities of Sabine Baring-Gould over the past decade or so, and he has published some information on his website which may be of interest Martin Graebe on Baring-Gould

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From:
Date: 26 Aug 02 - 06:22 PM

Debils, congratulations on having a source in your family tree. I hope you are appropriately proud of them.

Source is the more common term, but like Art says, most of us know exactly what you meant.

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: debils
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 05:49 PM

Hello all yes my ggggranddad was the one Mr Samuel John Wilkins Fone of Blackdown Mary Tavy and i am very proud of my entire family and we do sing his songs

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Crane Driver
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 06:30 PM

That's great, debils - any songs that have come down through that many "g"s deserve to be sung. I recognise most of the titles, but to have them as a family heritage is tremendous. My only connection with the real tradition is by adoption, as it were - I live in the village once home to Phil Tanner, aka "the Gower Nightingale", right opposite his local pub. I'm still waiting for the effect to show in my singing!

Andrew

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 08:04 PM

I'm sorry to keep asking questions, but you are rather trickling out the information! Have your family always sung Sam Fone's songs, or is that just since you found out about him?

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 27 Aug 02 - 08:20 PM

debils, this is really interesting, and I think that you and your family should feel very proud of your ggg grandfather.
Sam Fone had a wonderful version of 'The Death of Queen Jane' which Baring-Gould collected from him. The text and tune are given on Martin Graebe's website here The Death of Queen Jane Child also quotes this as a variant of Ballad 170 in his collection where it is noted as being communicated to Child by the Rev Sabine Baring-Gould from the recitation of Samuel Force (which must be a transcription mispelling of your ggg grandfather's name.)

I would be more than delightd to know whether anyone in your family still sings this particular song.

Subject: RE: folk song carriers
From: debils
Date: 28 Aug 02 - 08:28 PM

In answer to your question i have heard The Death of Queen Jane and could sing it if i wanted to, unfortunatly the last family memeber i recall singing it died about six months ago. But songs have come down through the gen's we are a musical family (there's that gene again i say good old hardworking and honest Sam) he is a role model to all of us!

For any of you out there who wonder about him he was a very sensitive and gentle man who loved his family (and gardening "that rubs of too") he had many misfotunes in his life, but i believe his faith his family and his singing kept him going.

we are all proud of him