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Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)

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GUEST,Grace 07 Sep 02 - 12:57 PM
Joe Offer 07 Sep 02 - 01:57 PM
GUEST,Grace 07 Sep 02 - 08:35 PM
Joe Offer 08 Sep 02 - 01:08 AM
The Walrus 08 Sep 02 - 02:35 AM
GUEST,Grace 10 Sep 02 - 09:37 PM
Dave Bryant 11 Sep 02 - 05:19 AM
IanC 11 Sep 02 - 05:40 AM
George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca 11 Sep 02 - 11:05 AM
George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca 11 Sep 02 - 11:06 AM
Tiger 12 Sep 02 - 07:58 AM
GUEST,Bill Kennedy 12 Sep 02 - 09:35 AM
GUEST,Bill Kennedy 12 Sep 02 - 09:43 AM
GUEST,Bill Kennedy 12 Sep 02 - 09:55 AM
GUEST,Bill Kennedy 12 Sep 02 - 10:09 AM
GUEST,Bill Kennedy 12 Sep 02 - 10:11 AM
Orac 12 Sep 02 - 10:56 AM
GUEST,Grace 13 Sep 02 - 07:59 AM
Orac 13 Sep 02 - 09:11 AM
GUEST,Bill Kennedy 13 Sep 02 - 09:41 AM
GUEST,Grace 14 Sep 02 - 06:16 PM
Jim Dixon 11 Dec 13 - 08:58 PM
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Subject: Help - music/dance hall music
From: GUEST,Grace
Date: 07 Sep 02 - 12:57 PM

Hi All:

I am writing a stage play based during world war one. I need some upbeat songs or poems that soldiers would have known and enjoyed singing and hearing during the early phase of the war.

One song should be upbeat, funny/humourous, and easily played with little to no instruments.

The other needs to be music they would have heard at a pub or music hall/vaudeville, and a guitar will accompany the music. Again upbeat is the key.

Any suggestions, copy of the lyric please email me at wildgrace@hotmail.com

Thanks, Grace


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07 Sep 02 - 01:57 PM

Hi, Grace - I did This Google Search (click) and came up with this fascinating site (click), Kingwood College Library A Chronological Subject Guide To AMERICAN POPULAR MUSIC.

I'll send to an e-mail to tell you this. However because of the nature of your request, you may get a number of responses. I think it would be better to monitor this thread yourself, rather than expecting e-mail responses.

-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Grace
Date: 07 Sep 02 - 08:35 PM

Hi Joe and All:

I checked out the google search it was good, came up with some places I did not find on my own web search. I cannot wait to see what others have to suggest.

Something just came to me as a good way to end my stage play. I was hoping this too the music lovers could help me out.

In the late nineties, I believe Garth Brook released a song about Christman Eve truce in 1914 World War One called Bowden Hills [Belleau Wood]. It only ever heard it played on the radio that one year. I am pretty sure it was country and western but perhaps the performer was not Garth Brooks.

Anyone know the name of the song for sure, who owns the rights to it, and the lyrics would be nice too.

All the help and suggestions would be much appreciated, I am a lost fish when it comes to music.

Thanks, Grace


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 08 Sep 02 - 01:08 AM

Hi, Grace - the Garth Brooks song is called Belleau Wood (click for lyrics). It's related to a John McCutcheon song called Christmas in the Trenches and another one about the same story called Christmas 1914.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: The Walrus
Date: 08 Sep 02 - 02:35 AM

Grace,

I'm assuming British Army Am I right in assuming that by "early war" (and from your comment about ending with a Christmas Truce song[1]), you mean pre-December 1914? If so, you are better off with music hall songs ("It's a Long, Long Way to Tipperary", "Who Were You With Last Night?", "Hello! Hello! Who's Your Lady Friend?", "Hold Your Hand Out, Naughty Boy", "Hitchy Koo" etc.) or, as a war usually start using the songs of the last one (or thereabouts), the odd Boer War tune (including some of the Boer ones) otherwise you may have to be more specific (there were an awful number of songs which had become, almost, regiment specific), otherwise, you could try "Never Trust a Sailor" [Don't Never Trust a Sailor?] or "Christmas Day in the Workhouse"

Regards

Walrus

[1] btw, the truce was Christmas Day, not Eve (and in some sectors, for several days later).


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Grace
Date: 10 Sep 02 - 09:37 PM

Thanks Joe and Walrus:

The story takes place on Christmas Day 1914. The two sides German and Allied get together and bond over the evening. They sing a little, play a little, talk a little and then they go back to war the next day. Anyways, trying to find the songs they would have loved, sung and listened too during that time period.

Thanks for the info on Belleau Wood Joe. I have truly enjoyed that song since I heard it. But until now did not know the correct title.

Grace


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 05:19 AM

You could do worse than get the CD or Score of "Oh what a lovely war" - your local library will probably have both.


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: IanC
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 05:40 AM

"Annie Laurie" would be excellent.


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 11:05 AM

I believe Irving BErlin's song comes from the first world war, but that may be too late in the war for you.


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: 11 Sep 02 - 11:06 AM

Same for George M Cohan's patriotic songs from that era.


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: Tiger
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 07:58 AM

Cohan's "The Yankee Doodle Boy" is from 1904. "Mary's a Grand Old Name" is 1905. Both would fit, I think.

Other possibles:

Last, but not least, perhaps the most popular song of the era (at least in the soldier context), but at the end of the war:


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:35 AM

obviously, and from reading I have done (Robert Graves, Siegfired Sassoon, et. al.) they were singing Christmas & New Years songs, Stille Nacht/SIlent Night, O Tannenbaum songs they could share in German and English, Auld Lang Syne, etc. The Music Hall songs listed above seem a bit too 'old' more common would have been Long Way to Tipperary, Mademoiselle from Armentières, etc. though they may be a bit later thatn 1914. THe Idea of adding the Belleau Wood song seems entirely out of keeping with the evening, unless it was added as a codao, or somehow introduced the events, I would stick to the songs that were actually sung, and there are many diaries, memoirs etc. that discuss the event and give titles. A little more research, I'll see what I can dig up.


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:43 AM

you should check out this site: Coope Boyes & Simpson and Wak Maar Proper, The Christmas Truce 1914: Kerstbestand No Masters NMCD14

http://fp.acappella3.f9.co.uk/the_christmas_truce_1914_-_kerstbestand.htm

a recording project of just the same thing, new music composed for the a capella choir, but beginning with songs documented as having been sung, and as I said in previous post, they were primarily carols. here's a review:

This CD has its basis in two significant events which took place near Ypres. One is the famous Christmas Truce which occurred in the Ploegsteert area in 1914 as well as other places nearby and the other is more recent - the launch of the Passchendaele Peace Concerts. As a result of the concerts, the English a capella trio Coope, Boyes and Simpson began a tradition of their own, performing with Belgian musicians to produce what I would call Musical Acts of Remembrance. Visitors to the "In Flanders Fields" museum in Ypres will have heard recordings (as part of the displays) of the two groups who contributed to this recording, the second being Wak Maar Proper, a local choir of about 60 people who take their music very seriously, both in terms of musicianship and in terms of the what the songs say.

This is not just a collection of Christmas Carols, although there are carols on the CD. There are songs about the Christmas Truce, too, but the CD isn't just about that either. The performers explore and comment upon, through song, the real legend of the Christmas Truce - how people who were enemies one day can become friends the next and enemies again the day after, and what they learned (and what there is for us to learn) from it. The songs explore exactly what it is that makes people enemies and often concludes that while the enmity might be real enough when it comes, the underlying cause may be trivial. Wak Maar Proper call themselves a "Wereldkoor" - a "World Choir" and their repertoire encompasses songs from many countries. It seems quite apt, therefore, to hear them sing "Senzenina," a Black African protest song. The people who created it were, like the British battalions and German Regiments around Ploegsteert in 1914, ordinary people caught up in extraordinary events which they did not themselves bring about.

Anyone familiar with the distinctive Coope Boyes and Simpson treatment of songs won't be disappointed. I specially liked "The Christmas Truce" written by Jim Boyes and the enthusiastic sound which the "whole company" produces in "While Shepherds Watched" which is sung to the tune "Pentonville." Because of the precision required to sing the tune, the carol can begin to sound dirge-like but the power of the Wak Maar Proper voices keeps it gloriously buoyant. It immediately became my favourite recording of this version of the carol!

Christmas Truce 1914 is produced by No Masters Co-operative Ltd.

The CD's number is NMCD14

It can be ordered direct from No Masters Co-operative using this email link.


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 09:55 AM

well, I guess I may have been right about Long Way to Tipperary at least, this from a witness to the events:

(Probably) the most well-known Account Captain Sir Edward Hulse, Bart., 2nd Scots Guards

"...

On my return at 10.00 a.m. I was surprised to hear a hell of a din going on, and not a single man in my trenches; they were completely denuded (against my orders) and nothing lived. I head strains of "Tipperary" floating down the breeze, swiftly follwed by a tremendous burst of "Deutschland Uber Alles," and, as I got to my own Company HQ dugout, I saw, to my amazement, not only a crowd of about 150 British and Germans, at the halfway house which I had appointed opposite my lines, but six or seven such crowds, all the way down our lines, extending towards the 8th Division on our right. "


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 10:09 AM

here's a site

http://www.firstworldwar.com/audio/index.htm

that is pretty authoratative re: the history of the war, & with mp3s of songs of the war, dated when recorded. 'Land of Hope and Glory' stands out from 1912, would certainly have been known to the troops in 1914, (Pack Up Your Troubles in Your Old Kit Bag and) Smile, Smile, Smile! is 1915, from all accounts of the event other songs were sung, but they began with carols and ended with Auld Lang Syne. Another recent song is John McCutcheon's 'Christmas Truce of 1914' [Christmas in the Trenches] recorded in 1984. I am amazed by how often this idea of yours seems to have been done, from Canada to Lancashire, etc. there are websites recounting sing alongs and theatrical productions based on this event


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 10:11 AM

not to take up too much space here, but to remind Joe Offer et al that the US was nowhere near the war in 1914, and songs popular in the US at that time are not really relevant to this story


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: Orac
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 10:56 AM

Whilst the song about the trouce in the 1st WW is a good song don't you think its rather recent. I thought that Grace was asking for songs contemporary to the period that the soldiers would have known. Its no good giving her stuff written at the back end of the 20th Cent.... Songs like "Goodbye, Dolly Gray are more appropriate even though that was an old song at the time is was very popular during that war.


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Grace
Date: 13 Sep 02 - 07:59 AM

Hi All:

Thanks for all the suggestions. It has been helpful. I wanted songs that were full of fun or sentimental and reflective. They could come from 1850 or 1950 as long as they seem to fit the time and the era of 1914.

I am not looking for historical accuracy. It is a stage play based/inspired about the actual event. There is music, and I thought music was important since music is often a way we communicate and bond. The only Christmas carols are the ones sung by the Germans at the beginning the music after that is all upbeat. Except for the last song.

The war has started again. One of the soldiers was killed, and the camaraderie of the night before shattered. Captain Anderson the leader of the Allied forces is sitting in the battlefield, feeling worn and battered by all that has occurred in the last twenty four hours. He is alone. He picks up his guitar (note in reality I truly doubt a soldier would be carrying around a guitar through the war) and plays Belleau Wood and as the last strains of the song are heard the curtain comes down.

I have thought of many songs to end the play, Christmas in the Trenches, Belleau Wood, Christmas 1914. My brother suggested Give Peace a Chance or Imagine by John Lennon. In the end the choice will be decided later, and will all depend on copyright.

I am looking for ideas of songs to fill my stage play with. I am very grateful to all of you for the help you have offered. I will continue to check in on this thread to see if anything has been added.

Thank you much, Grace


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: Orac
Date: 13 Sep 02 - 09:11 AM

I think personally if I was watching it I would prefer the music to be more contemporary to the period. You can still have nice music with a bit of realism. Otherwise Its a bit like watching a film where Henry IIIX is wearing a wrist watch. Ok.. so I'm a pinickerty old sod but thats me.


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 13 Sep 02 - 09:41 AM

I'm with Orac here, and I guess I'm sorry I wasted my time responding, don't see much reason to muddy the waters with 'happy' songs, but it's your play, good luck to you, but I wouldn't be interested in seeing it.


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Subject: RE: Help - music/dance hall music (World War I)
From: GUEST,Grace
Date: 14 Sep 02 - 06:16 PM

Hi All:

Thanks for all your help. There was no way I could have collected so many good suggestions and thoughts on my own. I am sorry that some of you feel you have wasted your time. But you have saved me much research.

I appreciate all your thoughts and suggestions.

Grace


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Subject: Lyr Add: IN MY MERRY OLDSMOBILE (Bryan/Edwards)
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 11 Dec 13 - 08:58 PM

Tiger mentioned this back on 12 Sep 02 - 07:58 AM:

From the sheet music at UCLA Archive of Popular Music:

IN MY MERRY OLDSMOBILE
Words by Vincent Bryan, music by Gus Edwards
New York: M. Witmark & Sons, 1905.

1. Young Johnnie Steele has an Oldsmobile.
He loves a dear little girl.
She is the queen of his gas machine.
She has his heart in a whirl,
Now when they go for a spin, you know,
She tries to learn the auto, so
He lets her steer while he gets her ear
And whispers soft and low:

CHORUS: Come away with me, Lucile,
In my merry Oldsmobile.
Down the road of life we'll fly,
Automobubbling, you and I.
To the church we'll swiftly steal,
Then our wedding bells will peal.
You can go as far as you like with me
In my merry Oldsmobile.

2. They love to spark in the dark old park
As they go flying along.
She says she knows why the motor goes:
The sparker's awfully strong.
Each day they spoon to the engine's tune.
Their honeymoon will happen soon.
He'll win Lucile with his Oldsmobile,
And then he'll fondly croon: CHORUS


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