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Help: Irish Homestead?

Bev and Jerry 18 Sep 02 - 12:26 AM
alison 18 Sep 02 - 01:49 AM
greg stephens 18 Sep 02 - 04:12 AM
Hrothgar 18 Sep 02 - 05:13 AM
Declan 18 Sep 02 - 08:45 AM
GUEST,Bill Kennedy 18 Sep 02 - 10:47 AM
Brakn 18 Sep 02 - 11:18 AM
greg stephens 18 Sep 02 - 11:21 AM
Big Tim 18 Sep 02 - 11:38 AM
Bev and Jerry 18 Sep 02 - 01:07 PM
Ironmule 19 Sep 02 - 01:52 AM
GUEST,JTT 19 Sep 02 - 07:12 AM
GUEST,Den 19 Sep 02 - 09:00 AM
GUEST,John 19 Sep 02 - 09:30 AM
GUEST,JimI 19 Sep 02 - 07:04 PM
wysiwyg 19 Sep 02 - 07:21 PM
GUEST 19 Sep 02 - 07:43 PM
Barry T 19 Sep 02 - 09:07 PM
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Subject: Irish Homestead?
From: Bev and Jerry
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 12:26 AM

We're writing a song and the story takes place in Ireland. The hero has reached manhood and is leaving home to start a life of his own. We have written the line "Leaving the homestead you drifted along".

The question is: Is homestead a word used in Ireland or is it just used in America? Would it be more appropriate to say "leaving the home place" or something else?

Bev and Jerry


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: alison
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 01:49 AM

we do use the word "homestead" but not often... how about "cottage" or "farmhouse"?

slainte

alison


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: greg stephens
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 04:12 AM

Dont think cottage or farmhouse has quite the feeling of homestead, which seems to imply the house and the land around it; leaving the homestead sounds the sadder thing to do, leavingthe cottage or farmhouse you might be just going out to buy a newspaper.. "Farm" has the right feeling, but not enough syllables.


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: Hrothgar
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 05:13 AM

"Farmstead?" - seriously.


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: Declan
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 08:45 AM

There's a gaelic word teaghlach (pr "tie-lough" approx.) which would scan and convey the meaning but would obviously need to be explained to people unfamiliar with the word. The word is used for both a house and a family but I think literally means hearth or hearthstone - the fireplace being a symbol for family life. Come to think of it hearthstone would scan as well - whether non-irish audiences would understand the meaning I'm not sure.

I don't think homestead would have been widely used in Ireland way back but it is widely used in Ireland now, particularly as it is a brand name for a chain of supermarkets and their associated products.


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 10:47 AM

I think something with just 'Home' would be better, like 'your true home', 'your first home' 'your boy's home' 'your loved home', 'your green home',

'your hearth and home' is probably the best

or 'your childhood', 'your family', 'your farm & fields, drifting along' homestead would not have been used


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: Brakn
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 11:18 AM

The old home?


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: greg stephens
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 11:21 AM

This is going to be a real folksong. It's got twelve variants already.


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: Big Tim
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 11:38 AM

Paul Brady used "the old homeplace"


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: Bev and Jerry
Date: 18 Sep 02 - 01:07 PM

Thanks for the advice. We should have added that the story told in the song is a fairly modern one. It is based loosely (in the Hollywood sense) on the life of someone who is still living. In fact, the part about "leaving the homestead" we completely made up but he would have left home around 1950 or so.

Even though we liked the word, we avoided "home place" because Paul Brady had already used it. We talked about the hearth in an earlier verse.

Although it may not be in common use, "homestead" is evidently a good choice because several of you picked up the exact feeling we were trying to convey, especially Greg and Declan.

Bev and Jerry


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: Ironmule
Date: 19 Sep 02 - 01:52 AM

What Declan said about leaving the "Hearth-stone" resonates well enough for me!

Jeff Smith


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 19 Sep 02 - 07:12 AM

Someone using this sense in Ireland would say "leaving the farm", or "leaving the land", or "leaving the old place".


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: GUEST,Den
Date: 19 Sep 02 - 09:00 AM

Leaving home or the home place. My father's land is also used. Or how about heart and home, as in I'll leave behind my heart and home.


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: GUEST,John
Date: 19 Sep 02 - 09:30 AM

Hi Homestead is a NONO for me I would suggest "native Home" "Dear native Land" etc. Regards John


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: GUEST,JimI
Date: 19 Sep 02 - 07:04 PM

How about 'townland'? This is the farm (and adjacent farms and the land around it. Also people in Ireland now and in the past both came, from and were referred to in connectoion with, a 'townland' e.g. the Cannings of Cornagher, the O'Rourkes of Annaghmaculleen etc.


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 19 Sep 02 - 07:21 PM

Home fire, stepstone, doorstep, home life, home days...

~S~


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Sep 02 - 07:43 PM

"Homestead in Britain goes back to 972 AD in print so is older than that. There would be nothing wrong in using homestead. It has lost some usage in the Isles, possibly because of its strong legal meaning in the USA becoming known over there.
"Farmstead" has also been used in print in the British Isles and Ireland since 1800 (OED), thus is probably older. It means the land plus all the buildings. Nothing wrong with its use as well.

JimI's suggestion of townland is the one that appeals to me. The term also goes back to 972 in print, and has been primarily Irish and Scottish in use.


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Subject: RE: Help: Irish Homestead?
From: Barry T
Date: 19 Sep 02 - 09:07 PM

I agree! Townland is what I used in a tune I wrote...

So we parted from townland with much weeping and pain
'Kissed the loved ones and the friends we would ne'er see again

The word works nicely because it has an element of antiquity in it.


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