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Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron

DigiTrad:
C'EST L'AVIRON


Related thread:
C'est L'aviron by a native (12)


GUEST,Jeanene 26 Sep 02 - 02:24 PM
GUEST,Jeanene 26 Sep 02 - 02:29 PM
GUEST,Jeanene 26 Sep 02 - 02:38 PM
GUEST 26 Sep 02 - 02:58 PM
GUEST,Jeanene 26 Sep 02 - 03:19 PM
GUEST 26 Sep 02 - 04:46 PM
GUEST 26 Sep 02 - 04:54 PM
GUEST,Jeanene 26 Sep 02 - 08:19 PM
Malcolm Douglas 26 Sep 02 - 11:50 PM
Jon Bartlett 27 Sep 02 - 01:51 AM
GUEST,Jeanene 27 Sep 02 - 04:42 AM
Malcolm Douglas 27 Sep 02 - 10:38 AM
Naemanson 27 Sep 02 - 05:46 PM
GUEST,Jeanene 30 Sep 02 - 12:09 AM
Genie 03 Sep 09 - 01:39 PM
Richard Bridge 03 Sep 09 - 04:37 PM
GUEST,Frances Griffin 02 Jan 11 - 12:14 AM
GUEST,Grishka 02 Jan 11 - 06:11 AM
GUEST 21 Mar 11 - 07:36 PM
Joe Offer 19 Nov 15 - 10:30 PM
Joe Offer 19 Nov 15 - 10:39 PM
GUEST,leeneia 20 Nov 15 - 10:07 AM
GUEST,leeneia 20 Nov 15 - 10:21 AM
Richard Mellish 20 Nov 15 - 05:20 PM
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Subject: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,Jeanene
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 02:24 PM

This song is in the DT, but there are  a couple of spelling errors  (e.g., "lieus" instead of "lieux"), missing accent marks, etc., and I am unable to access any of the three tunes via the hyperlinks for them in the DT.

First, can someone fix the tune links?  I know one tune, which I learned from Bonnie Dobson back in the 1960s, but I'd like to hear the others.

Second, would any of you folks who are more fluent writers of French than I please correct any of my errors in spelling or accent marks.  Then maybe at some point the version in the DT can be corrected, too, along with new MIDIs.

I have also included a bit more of the translated story.  Again, you Quebec folks, please correct me if I did not translate the idiom properly.  E.g., I was thinking the phrase "C'est l'aviron qui nous mene en haut"  meant, literally, "It is the oar which we pull (guide) up," but upon re-reading it, it would seem to mean "It is the oar that leads us up high."  (It's been a few years since I took or had much chance to speak French- much less, Quebec French.)  I would really like to know how to translate the refrain idiomatically correctly.

C'Est L'Aviron      Tradtional French-Canadian rowing song
(Third line of previous verse becomes first line of next.  Second line is a "response" to the "call" of  the first line.)

         C                                          F  C
1)  M'en revenant  / de la jolie Rochel-le* (x2)
         C          F       C     C  F   C  F  C   G7
2)   J'ai recontré /  trois jolies demoisell-es.

Refrain:
 C                       G7
C'est l'aviron qui men-e, qui nous men-e
  C                                G7          C
C'est l'aviron qui nous mene en haut.

2)  J'ai recontré /  trois jolies demoisell-es. (x2)
3) J'ai point choisi,  / mais j'ai pris la plus belle.

Refrain

3) J'ai point choisi,  / mais j'ai pris la plus bell-e. (x2)

4) J'l'y fis monter   / derrier' moi, sur ma selle.

5)  J'y fis cent lieux   / sans parler avec ell-e.

6)  Au bout d'cent lieux,  / elle me d'mandit à boîr-e.

7)  Je l'ai menee   / auprès de la fontain-e.

8)  Quand ell' fût la,   / elle ne voulût point boîr-e.

9)  Je l'ai menee   / au logis de son pèr-e.

10) Quand elle fût la,   / elle buvait à pleins ver-res.

11) Á la sante   / de son père et sa mer-e.

12) Á  la sante   / de ses soeurs et ses frèr-es

13) Á  la sante   / de celui que son coeur aim-e.

*  Final vowel sounds which would be silent in speech are often voiced in song for the sake of meter and rhyme.   E.g., "demoiselles" would be "duh-mwah-zel" if spoken but is sung as "duh-mwa-zel-leh" here.  Hence the hyphenation.

Nutshell translation:     As I was returning to beautiful Rochelle, I met three pretty young ladies.  It was hard to choose but I chose the most beautiful and put her behind me on my saddle.  We went a hundred places without talking, then she asked for something to drink.  I took her to a fountain but she didn't want to drink (the water).  I took her to her father's house [where she toasted] to the health of her father, mother, sisters, brothers, and the one her heart loves.


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,Jeanene
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 02:29 PM

I forgot to hyphenate "selle" and "belle" at the end of a couple of verses above. All the vowel sounds at the ends of the verse lines are voiced.

J


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,Jeanene
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 02:38 PM

Forgot to translate part of the 10th line of the story.

Lines 8 thru 13 mean: "When she got there, she didn't want to drink any. I took her to her father's house [where] she drank full glasses, to the health of her father and her mother, to the health of her sisters and brothers, and to the health of the one her heart loves."

J


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 02:58 PM

Midi and words at acadian.org/aviron.html. C'est l'aviron


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,Jeanene
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 03:19 PM

Thanks for the link, guest. That's pretty much the tune I know. Still need to put it back into the DT.

Also, glad to pinpoint the song's geographic roots (Acadian).

I see that "m쳌ne" has an "accent grave," which is missing in the DT and in my post above.

I'm curious about "lieus" (DT) or "lieues" (your link) in lieu (pun intended) of "lieux." I always thought the line was about going "a hundred places," but maybe I'm wrong. Is this a different word or just an Acadian spelling variant?

Also, the site you linked to says "...sans porter avec elle," instead of "...sans parler avec elle." Another idiom? A typo in the lyrics posted at that site? Bonnie Dobson sang "parler." I'm familiar with "porter" meaning "to carry" or "to wear" (as clothing), but what does "porter avec" someone mean?

Doesn't "aupr쳌s" (near) have an "accent grave?"

"SantŽ" should have an acute accent, which I omitted."

Jeanene


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 04:46 PM

Jeanene, this is what I found in "Canadian Folk Songs: A Centennial Collection (1967).
"C'est L'aviron - This is another fine example of how a traditional folk song of France was made into an excellent worksong by Canadian "voyageurs" and woodsmen, who fitted a rather curious medieval tale to a rousing tune and tacked on a "paddling" refrain to suit their needs. The story the song tells is about a young man who is riding along the road when he meets three pretty girls. He chooses the prettiest of them, lifts her up on his horse and rides off with her. No word is spoken until she asks for a drink, but when he stops at a brooklet, she refuses to drink. So he decides to take her to her home, and once there, she drinks "one glass after another" to toast her parents, her sisters, her brothers, and finally, her lover."

I know the site calls it Acadian, but this song is more Quebecois-Méis.
I can't help with the language; I am in western Canada and French might as well be Sanscrit. But you are, I think correct with parler. Lieux-s I don't know; the text was cut and pasted from a Canadian song site in British Columbia, which could have errors.

auprès; mèe; santé
Note- I don't know what system you are using for accents; they print out as a rectangle. Use the html system (& followed by # followed by 233 followed by ; equals é
A grave è is 232


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 04:54 PM

Oops! Just read what I wrote. Left out letters in Métis and mène.


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,Jeanene
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 08:19 PM

Funny how things get screwed up when posted from one system and read at the other end by another. I use Mac, the accents look right on my screen. I recently tested the acute accent with çine here at Mudcat, and the ones that looked OK to me she said looked fine to her. Occasionally, both my own posts and those of others come out with silly things like the ª sign for an apostrophe, but I thought for the most part they worked fine. I have three choices for making the diacritical marks: cut and paste from previous posts within the mudcat thread; insert the accented letters from the symbol command at Word 5; or use the Mac keyboard commands for the various accents (the commands for Word 5 for Mac also work -- at least on this end -- for posting on the net.

Anyway, if the posts didn't come out with the proper marks, perhaps a clone can fix them -- or maybe I can tomorrow, from down San Diego way.

Genie


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 11:50 PM

You need to use .html codes to ensure that accents reproduce reliably here. Names are easier to remember than numerical values.

à makes à
è makes è
é makes é
ê makes ê
ë makes ë
ç makes ç
Ç makes Ç

...and so on.


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: Jon Bartlett
Date: 27 Sep 02 - 01:51 AM

Yes, I agree the song is more Quebecois than Acadien; it's a padding (voyageur) song and very widely known. The "lieues" I've always taken to be "leagues" (i.e. a long way). The "en haut" (lit. up high) is a common reference in paddling songs. It refers to the country upriver, away from the city: and thus takes on all the other overtones it shares with the Australian "outback" and north American "bush". "Le pays d'en haut" is the land of work and nature: "Le pays bas" the land of pleasure and culture. This concept has been written about by several folk, including Francois Brassard ("Fais dodo, l'enfant de la cage" in the Canadian Folk Music Journal Vol 4 (1976), but is not unique to French language cultures: it is commonly found to in drovers' and shearers' songs in Australia, logging/lumbering songs in Canada, cowboy songs in the US and also sea songs and shanties. "Parler" is surely meant instead of "porter".

Jon Bartlett


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,Jeanene
Date: 27 Sep 02 - 04:42 AM

Malcolm, when I format my text using the methods I described above and then paste the formatted text into Netscape Composer, it produces exactly the html code you described. I then copy the "Source" (the text with the html code) and paste that into the thread. Seems like it should work, since the html code I see before me as I am hitting "Submit Message" is just as you have specified.

John B., thanks for the additional eluciation.

J


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 27 Sep 02 - 10:38 AM

If you're using Composer along the way, it should work, yes. I actually find it easier to type the codes than to remember where to find special characters on a keyboard!


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: Naemanson
Date: 27 Sep 02 - 05:46 PM

Mudcatter Dahlin and my friend Nor are working on this for performance in concert. They have a continuing light hearted argument about the words because one of them knows European French and the other knows Canadian French. Apparently it makes a difference.

Whatever it is, I haven't heard them get through the song yet without breakng up over one missed pronunciation or another.


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,Jeanene
Date: 30 Sep 02 - 12:09 AM

Malcolm and guest, I'm reading this thread from a Windows computer now, and I see that it is only within one of my posts that the accent marks morphed into something else. In the top post, where I put the lyrics, I left out some accents, but the ones I put in came out just the way they looked on my Powerbook screen. Whatever the source of the glitch, I don't think it's the Mac vs. Windows thing or the method I normally use for diacritical marks. Something weird happened in that post, either because of a multiple-stage process of composing, copying, and pasting, or because of something outside of my control.

Jeanene


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: Genie
Date: 03 Sep 09 - 01:39 PM

YouTube has some videos where you can hear the tune and pronunciation.


C'Est L'Aviron w sing-along lyrics

rather operatic sounding version of C'Est L'Aviron


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Sep 09 - 04:37 PM

It is on one of Pint and Dale's CDs


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,Frances Griffin
Date: 02 Jan 11 - 12:14 AM

In the version above

sante is missing an accent aigu on the last e
mene is missing an accent grave on the first e
lieux should probably be lieues
a lieue in this context almost certainly means an Canadian measure of distance equivalent to three miles
but Larousse says that "cent lieues" can mean simply a long distance


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 02 Jan 11 - 06:11 AM

Nowadays, it is not difficult to find the correct spelling of such a popular song. Search "M'en revenant de la jolie Rochelle", and from the resulting 2350 sites inspect several of those that are completely in French, and not designed by foreign teachers. The corresponding rule applies to most other languages.

At the risk of provoking another national conflict, I may mention that most sites seem to place the origin of that song in France, La Rochelle being a city near the Atlantic coast of France. Let's call it "Atlantic" ;-)

Accents on capital letters are omitted in modern French, but if you want to use them, it should be À la santé ....

A votre santé! To your Santa!


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Mar 11 - 07:36 PM

health not Santa


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Nov 15 - 10:30 PM

Here's an email from Monique:

Hi Joe,

Can lyrics in the DT be fixed? http://mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=1126 Because…



M'en revenant de la jolie Rochelle
M'en revenant de la jolie Rochelle
J'ai rencontré trois jolies demoiselles
C'est l'aviron qui mène, qui nous mène
C'est l'aviron qui nous mène en haut.

(third line of previous verse becomes first (and second) line of next)

2) J'ai point choisi, mais j'ai pris la plus belle.
3) J' l'y fis monter derrièr' moi, sur ma selle.
4) J'y fis cent lieues sans parler avec elle.
5) Au bout d' cent lieues, ell' me d'mandit à boire.
6) Je l'ai menée auprès d'une fontaine.
7) Quand ell' fut là, ell' ne voulut point boire.
8) Je l'ai menée au logis de son père.
9) Quand ell' fut là ell' buvait à pleins verres.
10) À la santé de son père et sa mère.
11) À la santé de ses sœurs et ses frères
12) À la santé d' celui que son cœur aime.





Notes: besides adding the missing accents, I've added missing spaces as we "stick" a word with an apostrophe with the following word only when the following word begins with a vowel and the word with the apostrophe is a determiner or the preposition "de" (of, from…). Besides in this thread http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=51864 they comment the spelling of "lieus" vs" lieux" vs "lieues", the correct word is "lieues" = "leagues" which measurement varied depending on the countries and time. Now we round it up to 4km (~2.5mi). You can find the more or less same line about sailing/riding 100 leagues in the different versions to "Isabeau/La belle/Marion se/s'y promène" such as this one by Malicorne https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_mpKZOwd2o

Then "m'en revenant de la jolie Rochelle" there's no reason why there'd be an apostrophe here and not in "trois jolies demoiselles" or in "Je l'ai menée". It indeed "told" that the "e" shouldn't be pronounced in a time when it was pronounced or it would lengthen the preceding vowel but now, they're not pronounced at all and if it must –usually at the end of a line to match the tune or/and the rhyme, we add a hyphen.



Voilà. It's all for tonight. Sensible people are sleeping!



Monique
...and the version in the Digital Tradition:


C'EST L'AVIRON

M'en revenant de la joli' Rochelle
M'en revenant de la joli' Rochelle
J'ai recontre/ trois jolies demoiselles
C'est l'aviron qui me\ne, qui nous me\ne
C'est l'aviron qui nous me\ne en haut.

(third line of previous verse becomes first (and second) line of next)

2) J'ai point choisi, mais j'ai pris la plus belle.
3) J'l'y fis monter derrie\r' moi, sur ma selle.
4) J'y fis cent lieus sans parler avec elle.
5) Au bout d'cent lieus, ell' me d'mandit a\ boire.
6) Je l'ai mene/e supre\s d'une fontaine.
7) Quand ell' fut la\, ell' ne voulut point boire.
8) Je l'ai mene/e au logis de son pe\re.
9) Quand ell' fut la\ ell' buvait a\ pleins verres.
10) A la sante/ de son pe\re et sa me\re.
11) A la sante/ de ses soeurs et ses fre\res
12) A la sante/ d'celui que son coeur aime.

The first tune is the more usual one found in several anthologies, e.g.
Fowke ansd Richard Johnston, Chansons de Quebec. Gagnon gives the second
one. The situation in the song--hero picks up girl, something is proposed
but place disputed, she is taken to her home, etc. MS

@Canada @French
filename[ LAVIRON
TUNE FILE: LAVIRON.1
CLICK TO PLAY
TUNE FILE: LAVIRON.2
CLICK TO PLAY
TUNE FILE: LAVIRON.3
CLICK TO PLAY
RG
APR99








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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Nov 15 - 10:39 PM

Here's the Traditional Ballad Index entry on this song:

C'est L'Aviron (Pull on the Oars)

DESCRIPTION: French: "C'est l'aviron, qui nous mene, qui nous mene, c'est l'aviron qui nous mene en haut." A young man goes riding, picks up a pretty girl, and takes her home to get a drink. Once home, "turning to me, she toasted her own lover"
AUTHOR: unknown
EARLIEST DATE: 1865
KEYWORDS: courting drink family foreignlanguage
FOUND IN: Canada(Newf,Que)
REFERENCES (4 citations):
Fowke/Johnston, pp. 58-59, "C'est L'aviron (Pull on the Oars)" (1 text, 1 tune)
Fowke/MacMillan 49, "C'est L'Aviron" (1 English and 1 French text, 1 tune)
Peacock, p. 517, "En Revenant de la Jolie Rochelle" (1 text, 1 tune)
ADDITIONAL: Edith Fowke and Richard Johnston, _Folk Songs of Quebec (Chansons de Quebec)_, Waterloo Music Company, 1957, pp. 72-73, "C'est L'aviron (Pull on the Oars)" (1 French text plus English translation, 1 tune)

ST FJ058 (Partial)
RECORDINGS:
Mme Josephine Costard, "En Revenant de la Jolie Rochelle" (on PeacockCDROM) [one verse only]
ALTERNATE TITLES:
It's the Oars
NOTES: "Over the years, more than ninety variants of this song have been written down or recorded on cylinders, discs, or tapes in French Canada. A few variants have also been found in the northeastern United States and France." [from] "'M'en, revenant de la Joli'Rochelle'::A song from c/ 1500 in the current French-Canadian repertoire" by Jay Rahn in Canadian Journal for Traditional Music, vol 16, 1988. See archives of the site for the Canadian Journal for Traditional Music. - BS
Last updated in version 3.1
File: FJ058

Go to the Ballad Search form
Go to the Ballad Index Song List

Go to the Ballad Index Instructions
Go to the Ballad Index Bibliography or Discography

The Ballad Index Copyright 2015 by Robert B. Waltz and David G. Engle.


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 20 Nov 15 - 10:07 AM

Here's a good video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUHmPPPWlgY


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 20 Nov 15 - 10:21 AM

and if you go to abcnotation.com and search for c'est l'aviron, the first tune they bring up is the very tune being played on the above video.


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Subject: RE: Lyr/Tune Correction: C'Est L'Aviron
From: Richard Mellish
Date: 20 Nov 15 - 05:20 PM

I heard a snatch of this song on a radio programme years ago, to much the same tune as in the video linked to by Leeneia, but at about twice that speed. I MAY have it on tape.


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