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Nick Drake Profile - BBC4

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songs2play 23 Oct 02 - 08:05 AM
songs2play 23 Oct 02 - 04:43 PM
Ed. 23 Oct 02 - 04:50 PM
RolyH 23 Oct 02 - 04:56 PM
songs2play 25 Oct 02 - 02:31 AM
songs2play 25 Oct 02 - 01:50 PM
Ed. 25 Oct 02 - 03:55 PM
McGrath of Harlow 25 Oct 02 - 04:50 PM
Murray MacLeod 25 Oct 02 - 05:20 PM
Ed. 25 Oct 02 - 05:34 PM
Murray MacLeod 25 Oct 02 - 05:50 PM
RolyH 25 Oct 02 - 05:59 PM
Ed. 25 Oct 02 - 06:02 PM
Ed. 25 Oct 02 - 06:14 PM
McGrath of Harlow 25 Oct 02 - 06:38 PM
Murray MacLeod 25 Oct 02 - 06:38 PM
Ed. 25 Oct 02 - 07:05 PM
McGrath of Harlow 25 Oct 02 - 07:15 PM
RolyH 25 Oct 02 - 07:17 PM
Ed. 25 Oct 02 - 07:22 PM
Lepus Rex 25 Oct 02 - 07:31 PM
RolyH 25 Oct 02 - 07:48 PM
McGrath of Harlow 25 Oct 02 - 07:50 PM
Ed. 25 Oct 02 - 08:04 PM
Murray MacLeod 26 Oct 02 - 06:06 PM
Murray MacLeod 26 Oct 02 - 07:22 PM
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Subject: BS: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: songs2play
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 08:05 AM

I don't know if anyone else has added a thread about the BBC4 programme on Nick Drake - see BBC4
on Friday 25th October at 9:00pm, but I thought a reminder would be called for.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: songs2play
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 04:43 PM

refresh


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Subject: RE: BS: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Ed.
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 04:50 PM

Thanks, songs2play

Looking forward to watching it


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Subject: RE: BS: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: RolyH
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 04:56 PM

Thanks

Will be there


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: songs2play
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 02:31 AM

Don't forget tonight.


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: songs2play
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 01:50 PM

Last one.


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Ed.
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 03:55 PM

On in ten minutes

Heck, I do believe I'm actually going to remember to watch a TV programme!


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 04:50 PM

Bugger - I've only just seen this thread and it's virtually over.


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 05:20 PM

As always, I hate to be judgmental, and particularly so when the person in question is deceased, but having watched the program I cannot help feeling that Nick Drake's current (and growing) status of cult icon rests on very shaky foundations.

Hid voice was very weak, his songs are to say the least, mediocre, and riddled with the songwriting cliches so prevalent in the 70's. The people who really made it from that amazingly fruitful era of songwriting, people such as Don MacLean, Jim Croce, Paul Simon, James Taylor et al, were those who didn't succumb to the cliche temptation.

His guitar-playing? On what I heard tonight, he was a competent enough finger-picker by seventies standards, but surely nothing exceptional?

Maybe the program makers didn't play his best stuff, maybe he did record songs which would make me go "wow", but if so we didn't hear it tonight.

The program was, however, sensitively and competently produced, and left me with a kind of wistful sad feeling. I had no idea that Gabrielle Drake was Nick Drake's sister. It is always a pleasure to see her on screen, and I thought she expressed herself beautifully throughout.

Murray


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Ed.
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 05:34 PM

I thought that it was a fabulous programme, and will certainly record the repeat.

I don't want to get into an arguement with Murray, and of course each to their own.

Whilst there is a deal of truth in the fact that dying young is a great career move in terms of posthumous appreciation, I will say one thing:

Nick Drake = Wonderful guitar, voice and music.
James Taylor = Really dull crap.

If you like dull crap, Murray, then I guess that's your choice.

Ed


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 05:50 PM

Ed, out or respect for the dead, I deliberately refrained in my last posting from mentioning the comments by Joe Boyd, the recording engineer, but I am afraid you have forced my hand.

Boyd's comments were to the effect that after Nick Drake recorded his first album, he abandoned his first tour halfway through because "he couldn't get people to stop talking while he was playing".

Correct me if I am wrong, but as far as I am aware, that has never been a problem for James Taylor.

"You've Got a Friend" ? "Fire and Rain" ? Not dull crap in my book,Ed, but as you say, chacun a son gout ...

Murray


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: RolyH
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 05:59 PM

Yeah,the program was well filmed and with a good soundtrack.Missed some of his better tracks (Time Has Told Me etc)but I assume that anyone who watched has them all.

It is repeated on BBC4 at 1115 on Saturday night.


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Ed.
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 06:02 PM

Murray,

As I said, I don't want to start to argue, but admit that my post got close.

Personally, I find "You've Got a Friend" to be about the worst and dreariest song that I've ever heard. It's one of the few songs that I actively hate.

But you like it, that's fine. Each to their own, as I said.

The programme didn't showcase my favourite Nick Drake songs, but it gave a fair selection.

If you didn't like anything you heard, you probably wouldn't like anything else that I might recommend.

For me, the 'weak' voice is why I like him so much.

Ed


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Ed.
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 06:14 PM

One other thing, Murray,

If you think that James Taylor is somehow 'better' because touring doesn't fuck his head up, you are missing the point by a long way...


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 06:38 PM

Why do some people who like one singer seem to see it as important or relevant to say how they don't like some other singer?


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 06:38 PM

Ed, I was going to call it a draw. However ....

My impression of Nick Drake, (and this is based purely on what I watched tonight) is as follows.

He was a kid with a moderate amount of talent, who, because of his privileged background, was able to indulge, up to a point, his dreams of becoming a star. My guess is that his first album was financed out of his own pocket. Maybe the other two were as well?

When it came to the harsh reality of presenting his music live, he just couldn't hack it. Now, was this because he was "too sensitive", or was it because his songs were no good? Or was it a combination of both? I go back to what Joe Boyd said, "people wouldn't stop talking while he was playing". One has to ask oneself why they wouldn't listen to his songs?

If we continue this discussion much further I shall be forced to go out and buy his records ...

Murray


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Ed.
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 07:05 PM

I'll ignore McGrath's irrelevant comment, and concentrate on Nick Drake.

Assumimg that you watched a majority of the programme, you'll have noticed that Nick was, to use a non-medical term 'a bit screwed up'

Suggesting that his live performances were a disaster because he had no talent, misses the point.

The nascent Beatles got turned down numerous times, were routinely booed etc, but they had thicker skins.

The first time that I saw Martin Carthy, I walked out. I thought that he was awful.

Experience has shown me that I was wrong, and not his performance


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 07:15 PM

"concentrate on Nick Drake" - but you didn't Ed, but tore into James Taylor instead; which was the relevance of my comment.

I got the last five minutes and the last song. Nick Drake was pretty good, and if he'd lived and continued to grow he'd have been better than good.

And if, at that same stage of his development, James Taylor had killed himself I'd have said the same; and I'd have been right.


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: RolyH
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 07:17 PM

Can't see the comparison.Nick Drake/James Taylor totally different type of singers/songwriters


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Ed.
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 07:22 PM

McGrath: I really don't see it that way, aka I think you're talking crap.

RolyH has a better idea


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 07:31 PM

You need to work on your social skills, Ed.

I really need to move to the UK... You guys have good TV.

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: RolyH
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 07:48 PM

.... and don't forget the programme was called "A Skin Too Thin"


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 07:50 PM

Some of it is, Lepus, but an awful lot isn't, and as the number of channels grows, the proportion of good stuff gets smaller, and harder to find. That's the rule everywhere.

As Rollo said, Nick Drake and James Taylor were/are both very different singers. Both pretty good in their different ways, and it's a shame Nick Drake didn't stick around.


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Ed.
Date: 25 Oct 02 - 08:04 PM

Thank you, Lepus

Please impart some of your great wisdom to a lesser mortal


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 26 Oct 02 - 06:06 PM

The program is being repeated shortly, at 12.20 am Sunday morning. I shall watch it again, just in case .

Murray


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Subject: RE: Nick Drake Profile - BBC4
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 26 Oct 02 - 07:22 PM

just about to start ...

Murray


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