Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafemuddy

Post to this Thread - Printer Friendly - Home
Page: [1] [2]


Help Choose 20 Most Popular Irish Songs

Related threads:
Favourite Irish song (116)
Lyr Req: Irish songs (lots of songs here) (64)
Trad Irish songs, rebel & other... help (30)
Tune Req: Prettiest Irish song (24)
20 Best Irish Trad Songs (17)


GUEST,ray 30 Oct 02 - 01:49 PM
David Ingerson 30 Oct 02 - 02:07 PM
greg stephens 30 Oct 02 - 02:13 PM
greg stephens 30 Oct 02 - 02:15 PM
Wolfgang 30 Oct 02 - 02:17 PM
greg stephens 30 Oct 02 - 02:17 PM
Wolfgang 30 Oct 02 - 02:18 PM
Wolfgang 30 Oct 02 - 02:20 PM
GUEST 30 Oct 02 - 02:23 PM
GUEST,Q 30 Oct 02 - 02:37 PM
Genie 30 Oct 02 - 02:38 PM
GUEST,Bill Kennedy 30 Oct 02 - 02:42 PM
greg stephens 30 Oct 02 - 02:48 PM
GUEST 30 Oct 02 - 02:53 PM
toadfrog 30 Oct 02 - 02:56 PM
Genie 30 Oct 02 - 03:06 PM
GUEST,Nigel, Yorkshire, U.K. 30 Oct 02 - 04:06 PM
Peter T. 30 Oct 02 - 06:32 PM
toadfrog 30 Oct 02 - 06:35 PM
Gareth 30 Oct 02 - 06:38 PM
Genie 30 Oct 02 - 10:48 PM
Malcolm Douglas 30 Oct 02 - 11:09 PM
GUEST,Keith A 31 Oct 02 - 04:21 AM
GUEST,Terry 31 Oct 02 - 05:18 AM
GUEST,allen woodpecker 31 Oct 02 - 05:36 AM
GUEST,Gareth 31 Oct 02 - 05:43 AM
Gareth 31 Oct 02 - 06:20 AM
GUEST,GerMan 31 Oct 02 - 07:31 AM
Gareth 31 Oct 02 - 08:01 AM
GUEST,Jason 31 Oct 02 - 09:33 AM
Declan 31 Oct 02 - 10:19 AM
HuwG 31 Oct 02 - 11:42 AM
Declan 31 Oct 02 - 11:46 AM
David Ingerson 31 Oct 02 - 02:06 PM
GUEST 31 Oct 02 - 03:04 PM
boglion 31 Oct 02 - 03:06 PM
GUEST,allen woodpecker 01 Nov 02 - 04:45 AM
Declan 01 Nov 02 - 05:13 AM
GUEST,allen woodpecker 01 Nov 02 - 05:37 AM
van lingle 01 Nov 02 - 05:48 AM
Declan 01 Nov 02 - 06:03 AM
Gurney 01 Nov 02 - 06:11 AM
Genie 01 Nov 02 - 07:25 AM
greg stephens 01 Nov 02 - 07:41 AM
Genie 01 Nov 02 - 04:21 PM
GUEST,ray 02 Nov 02 - 10:52 AM
GUEST,allen woodpecker 02 Nov 02 - 04:27 PM
wysiwyg 02 Nov 02 - 04:42 PM
Joe Offer 02 Nov 02 - 05:50 PM
The Pooka 02 Nov 02 - 06:43 PM
Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:









Subject: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,ray
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 01:49 PM

Hi There,

I am looking for help in choosing 20 of the most popular Irish Trad songs for a CD i am compiling. I have a list below.

Please suggest if i should add or remove songs from my list.


My list of Irish Trad songs are as follows

1 A JAR OF PORTER
2. Botany Bay
3. Dicey Riley
4. Home boys home
5. Raglan road
6. She moved through the fair
7. Take me up to Monto
8. The Galway shawl
9. The holy ground
10. The kerry recruit
11. The leavin' of liverpool
12. The Offaly rover
13. The parting glass
14. The raggle taggle gypsy
15. The snowy breasted pearl
16. The star of the county down
17. The wild rover
18. Whiskey on a Sunday
19. Whiskey in the jar
20. zooligical gardens.


Thanking you, slainte, Ray.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: David Ingerson
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:07 PM

You've set yourself quite a task. You include Raglan Road which is not strictly traditional--actually newly composed--and leave out another popular one, The Little Beggarman. It also depends on your audience. Some audiences would consider your list more folk and not so traditional.

Other than your ideas and our feedback, how are you deciding that one is more popular than another?

Good luck with your project!

David


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: greg stephens
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:13 PM

David Ingerson's previus post leaves me very mystified, as he thinks "folk" and "traditional" are two different incompatible categories. I've seen a million discussions of "meaning of folk" but I think this is the first time I've come across this distinction. Which items in the list are "folk" and which"traditional"? do explain.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: greg stephens
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:15 PM

An additional thought: I'm sure Amos posted to this thread earlier, but it's gone. I dont recall his contribution as being unduly offensive or anything.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Wolfgang
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:17 PM

Amos and alanabit (typical problem these days)

Wolfgang


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: greg stephens
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:17 PM

Sorry, I was confused, but who wouldnt be. There's an identical thread with a slighly different title.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Wolfgang
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:18 PM

Alanabit urged to include 'Spanish Lady', Amos was supportive without specific comment.

Wolfgang


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Wolfgang
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:20 PM

good explanation for the puzzle, greg, and I can see that I mixed up alinact and alanabit in myrecollection.

Wolfgang


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:23 PM

greg if you have read so many "what is folk" debates you must be aware that many people include modern singer-songwriter stuff as folk. I doubt they would consider it as traditional though.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:37 PM

Posted to your ten best list before I saw this one. I think it will be very difficult to select either; it will come down to you in the end since a vote can't be taken.
It will be interesting to see the selections made here, however.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Genie
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:38 PM

A few of my favorites which may or may not fit your category:
Roddy McCorley
Shule Aroon (or any of its various titles and tune variants)
Mo' Mary (Irish or Scots?)
Mick McGuire
Finnegan's Wake
Bridget O'Malley


"The Mountains O' Mourne" is a Percy French song (at least the lyrics are) but definitely one of my favorites.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:42 PM

you're saying MOST POPULAR, not best, or most trad., or anything, and no one's mentioned DANNY BOY? what is more 'popular' than that?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: greg stephens
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:48 PM

GUEST:re folk/traditional. Yes, I know loads of people put a lot of songs into the "folk" category which they don't consider "traditional", but that doesnt mean they consider the two as mutually incompatible categories. But Dave Ingerson seems to be saying that some songs are one, and some are the other, which is what I found puzzling.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:53 PM

greg, I take it this is your interpretation of "some audiences would consider your list more folk and not so traditional". I am reading this as "your list would be better labeled folk (as all fit that category) than traditional".


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: toadfrog
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 02:56 PM

Yeah. For "popular," How about Mother Machree and Brennan on the Moor and Kevin Barry? And then, there's Fields of Athenry. And how about Would God I Were the Tender Apple Blossom and/or When I think upon all those Endearing Young Charms? Or Peg O' My Heart? Or Galway Bay? Not necessarily favorites of mine, but unquestionably more "popular" than most of those above. Seems to me, "popular" means beloved by the people, not by cutting-edge revivalists of the younger generation!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Genie
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 03:06 PM

toadfrog, some "very popular Irish songs" (e.g., Galway Bay, Peg O' My Heart) are not "Irish" in the sense of having been written in Ireland or by a citizen of Ireland. The poem "Believe Me, If All Those Endearing Young Charms" was written by the Irish poet Thomas Moore, so I wouldn't classify the lyrics as "popular" in the usual sense; I don't recall where the tune is from. The tune to "Danny Boy" is Irish (isn't it?) but the words were written by an Englishman. (Lots of threads on the topic of 'faux' Irish songs here in the forum.)

I thought we were voting for our favorites, though. Did I misunderstand ray's initial post?

Genie


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Nigel, Yorkshire, U.K.
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 04:06 PM

If you were to include "spancil Hill" and "carrickfergus", you could
call your CD "The Dubliners" Greatest hits, volume LLLMXCCVVCXXLVXIVC.

Best regards, Nigel Goodwin..


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Peter T.
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 06:32 PM

"When Irish Eyes Are Smiling", "Molly Malone,", "Irish Washerwoman" would probably be the top three recognised by outsiders, so would probably be the most popular.

yours, Peter T.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: toadfrog
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 06:35 PM

Genie: No, it said "most popular." I'm not even going to say what my favorites are. But (1) The tune to Believe me if All Those Endearing [Etc.] is "Man You Don't Meet Every Day." I have always heard that one characterized as an "Irish narrative ballad."

Peg O' My Heart was composed by a German-American, so o.k., if that's the criterion, it isn't "Irish." However, Galway Bay was sure enough written and composed in Ireland by an Irishman, , Arthur Colahan. And seems every bit as "Traditional" as that "folk rock classic," She Moves Through the Fair.

Point: The labels "Irish," "traditional" "folk," and the like often get attached to songs for reasons that have more to do with the people who do the labelling than the content or origin of the song. Especially, songs of political protest are called "folk songs" even if they were written yesterday. But even an old standby which the folk has sung for 150 years will never be admitted to this Parnassus if folkies don't like their spirit or subject matter.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Gareth
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 06:38 PM

Mmmmm ! Irish Songs - or songs popular with ethnic Irish Populations. Seems to me that the original lists have more to do with the second rather than the first.

Mind you I'm only speaking as a Welshman, after all we remember the Irish stabbing us in the back when we were fighting the Normans 800 years or so ago !!!

Garydd ap Godfri ap (continued for several hundred ancestors) ;<))


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Genie
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 10:48 PM

toadfrog, I thought Colehan had emigrated to the US before writing "Galway Bay." Could've sworn I had read that. But maybe it just seemed like he was an expatriate because the song is sung from the vantagepoint of an exile.

Thanks for the corretion. ( Now I can tell all those "purists" who pooh-pooh that song that it really IS an Irish song.)

Now, if it's a list of what we think are the most popular Irish songs, wouldn't it probably be a different list in the UK, in the US, and in other parts of the world?

Here in the US, I think it's safe to say that the songs most requested of The Irish Tenors or on St. Patrick's Day would include songs such as:
Danny Boy
When Irish Eyes Are Smiling
MacNamara's Band
An Irish Lullaby (Too-Ra-Loo-Ra-Loo-Ral)
Molly Malone (Cockles and Mussels)
Peg O' My Heart
A Little Bit Of Heaven Fell
Who Threw The Overalls In Mistress Murphy's Chowder
The Minstrel Boy
It's A Long Way To Tipperary
The Wild Rover
I'll Take You Home Again, Kathleen
Mother Machree
Whiskey In The Jar (Gilgarra Mountain)
How Are Things In Glocca Morra?
Where The River Shannon Flows
(When You And I Were Young,) Maggie
The Same Old Shillelagh
Peggy O'Neill
The Wearin' O' The Green
The Irish Washerwoman
The Rose Of Tralee

Several of these were written by Irish Americans (e.g., Chauncey Olcott), and some (e.g.. "...Glocca Morra...") not even that, but Americans tend to think of them as "Irish songs."

Genie


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 30 Oct 02 - 11:09 PM

I seem to have made the mistake of posting to the first thread Ray started; naturally, this second one, started a few minutes later, is the one that everybody who didn't have their spectacles on immediately went for.

I asked one question, which I think is quite important: is this "CD compilation" for your own amusement only, or is it a commercial venture? If it's just a private hobby thing, then you don't really need to worry about whether or not the material is genuinely Irish, or about its copyright status. If you intend to sell the result, though, you need to do some careful background work, as others have already pointed out.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Keith A
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 04:21 AM

In which part of Ireland is Liverpool, as in leaving of?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Terry
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 05:18 AM

I would suggest "The Isle of Innisfree", some would say as popular as "Danny Boy". It is a truly beautiful song about Ireland and one which was written by an Irishman in 1949 so it would not be a traditional.

If you go to the thread "Isle of Innisfree" you will find a couple of great postings by Gerard Farrelly who is the son of the man who wrote "Innisfree".

PS There are two versions of "Galway Bay", one written by an Englishman which is the popular one as made famous by Bing Crosby and the more traditional "Galway Bay" which was written by a man from Kinvara in south galway, I cannot remember his name.

Love the site.

Terry


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,allen woodpecker
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 05:36 AM

Ray, in the name of all things holy, NO!!!! I beg you not to continue with this folly. There is absolutely no point in compiling the "most popular" Irish songs, coz those have all been done to death. That is what makes them (groan) popular and staples of the rent-a-mick pub band scene. Take this list you've got. Apart from being staggeringly unimaginitive (with all due respect), some of those songs are not Irish, trad or otherwise. Parting Glass has origins in Newcastle upon Tyne, Raggle Taggle has strong Scots links, Whiskey on a Sunday and Leaving of Liverpool are from, erm, Liverpool. As far as Wild Rover and Whiskey in the Jar go, just don't bother. These two old stagers should be allowed to rest in peace. The only songs from your list which deserve a place are Kerry Recruit (definitely) and Botany Bay (probably). Try Andy Irvine's "The Holy Ground", or trad songs like Roger O'Hehir, Edward in the Lowlands Low, or My Charming Edward Boyle.
I dunno who your compilation is for. If it's for you, try broadening your horizons a bit. If it's for friends or non-music types, do them a favour and leave out a lot of that crap - The wild rover was never much good anyhow, and forty years of drunken bellowing hasn't helped matters. I hope you'll take this in the spirit of constructive criticism, rather than as a total slagging. a.w.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Gareth
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 05:43 AM


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Gareth
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 06:20 AM

Sure and bejasus "Botonay Bay" Irish ???

That will be news for the poor souls cramming the hulks lying in those Irish rivers, Thames, and Medway.

Gareth


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,GerMan
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 07:31 AM

Although not Irish how about The Sash!!!!!!!!!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Gareth
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 08:01 AM

Yeeees ! definitely Irish, and popular !!!!

Gareth


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,Jason
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 09:33 AM

Thanks for that Terry. I went to Gerard Farrelly's postings on the "Isle of Innisfree" thread as you suggested and it's fantastic to get real history and facts about a great song, and one that I too had misconceptions about.

I also visited his website www.stoneandfarrelly.com and there's more about an album of his father's songs sung by Sinead Stone,a singer I haven't heard of before, sounds like a real treat, will be getting this one.

Regards Jason.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Declan
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 10:19 AM

I'm sure Orac will be along shortly to (yet again!) point out the Irishness or otherwise of many of the songs mentioned here.

The terms 'Trad' and 'Folk' although often used interchangably in most international contexts are used differently in this country and there is a third 'classification' known loosely as Ballads, which to many would be mutually exclusive with the other two. I know its all folk music in the broadest definition of the word, that many traditional songs are ballads and vice versa, but the distinction is made over here and a lot of people would be able to define the difference very well. There have been endless debates on the subject, which have been known to come to blows - those of us really interested in the music meanwhile are in the other part of the Pub playing and singing !

By the way in the 3 way classification system just mentioned the original 20 songs listed wouldlalmost all be classified as Ballads ads they form the basis of the repertoire of wqat are known as Ballad Groups - most notably The Dubliners as mentioned earlier - apart from A JAR OF PORTER which I don't even recognise, but it may be one I know under another name.

As others have said there are already huge numbers of CDs with track lists almost identical to Ray's first post, I'm not sure the world needs another one but if you want to then please call it something like "20 Folk Songs, Rightly or Wrongly assumed by some people, who may not know any better to be Irish" or else we'll all have to endure another bout of "Yes it is, No its not" type "debate" on this and other forums.

Sorry if this seems overly cynical. Besides anything else there are at least five or six of the songs listed that, granted may be popular, but would and do make most people I know who are interested in Irish Trad cringe on a regular basis.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: HuwG
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 11:42 AM

Declan, try this link: Jar of Porter, originally posted to the forum by Wolfgang.

It is on a Dubliners CD I have.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Declan
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 11:46 AM

Thanks Huw,

Funny enough I don't think I have ever heard this before, but it looks like a version or a Variant of The Jug of Punch.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: David Ingerson
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 02:06 PM

Greg,
Thanks for making me think carefully about the distinctions I make. In the first place, notice that I said "some audiences."   Second, I used the phrase "more folk and not so traditional." I see no hint of mutually exclusive categories there, rather a blending or merging of types. But you were mystified by the distinction. Here is my thinking.

I first came across that distinction during five summers spent in Ireland mostly with traditional musicians. I have not heard it here in the states. The difference is, I think, that here there are very few real traditionalists—singers who have learned most of their repertoire from relatives and neighbors. We American folkies are almost all revivalists. No so in Ireland. The folk revival of the 60's overran a small and scattered but vigorous tradition of singing that had gone back hundreds of years. Many singers did learn most of their songs from relatives and neighbors. Then the revival made some of the Irish song traditions (and there are many different Irish song traditions: sean nos, Anglo-Irish songs in the sean nos, classic ballads imported from England and Scotland, rebel songs, parlor songs, music hall songs, etc.) very popular and also produced a whole generation of revivalists of various stylistic persuasions.

My take on what happened is that some of those revivalists who fell in love with the sean nos and felt the old traditions were being overrun by more modern, more European, more American, more different (You pick 'em) styles of singing and accompanying songs, wanted to distinguish their "more traditional" (or some might say "purer") styles from those that were becoming more popular. So they called the newer styles "folk" (or sometimes worse).

I remember one session in which an obvious Yank tourist asked my Dublin friend if he could sing Little Beggarman. He replied that he didn't know it. When I asked him about it afterward, he admitted that, of course, he did know it, but didn't like singing that sort of "folk crap," especially during a session of "mighty" songs. Yes, toadfrog has it right when he says the categories have more to do with the categorizers than the songs themselves. Some of my Irish acquaintances would consider Ray's whole list to be basically folk. There is not a sean nos song among them.

Just to make sure I wasn't dreaming all this, I spent a little time with my library last night and found one sentence that seems to corroborate my distinction. Gearóid Ó hAllmhuráin writes in his A Pocket History of Irish Traditional Music (p. 138) about Clannad "It combined Irish traditional music and songs with jazz and contemporary folk."

Sorry to have been so long-winded but I hope it helps, Greg.

David


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 03:04 PM

In answer to the original question:

'Dirty Old Town'

;-)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: boglion
Date: 31 Oct 02 - 03:06 PM

With Reference to Galway Bay - the last verse speaks of "that dear land across the Irish Sea". This would suggest it was written in Great Britain.

I did not see any mention of "The Old Bog Road" or "Slievenamon" on the list.

I groaned when the topic of what is "Folk" and what is "Traditional" was raised. I spend loads of time in Kerry and the "tradition" is still alive there. Therefore, the term traditional becomes redundant. People don't sing songs because they are trad or folk but because they are bloody good. You only need to get into definitions like these to protect the tradition when it is dead or dying.

Get yourselves to Ireland and sing whatever strikes you as a good song!!!

Terry


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,allen woodpecker
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 04:45 AM

Dirty Old Town???!!!!! AAAARRRRGGGHHHH!
This is just the kind of ill informed paddy-whackery I was talking about before. Jesus save us! For the info of GUEST, that song was written by Ewan McColl about the town of Salford in Lancs, England. It's mainly due to pig ignorant, rent-a-mick, craic-águs-ceol, Oirish pub band a-holes that the world and his wife thinks the entire repertoire of Irish songs numbers about thirty. Bands and individual singers need to firstly promote the huge diversity of songs that we have through performing them, and secondly stop peddling all the same old kack. I know that in pubs, drunken punters always ask for the inevitable selections - coz I've done the pub band thing in the past -but both they and the performers would surely enjoy themselves more by being open to new and different material. The performers wouldn't feel like they're ploughing through the same old stuff week in, week out, and the lives of the punters would be enriched. Sorry, I've gone off on one, but this is one of my MAJOR pet hates. a.w.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Declan
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 05:13 AM

Allen,

There was a smilie at the end of 'Guest's' post. I think he may have known this already. Dirty Old Town was recorded by the Dubliners (and many other copy-cat bands since) and became popular in Ireland. It is therefore a song popular in Ireland but NOT obviously an Irish song.

In the 60s a number of very influential Irish singers (especially Luke Kelly and Christy Moore) spent a lot of time around the Folk clubs in England. They then came home and brought the material they had learned over there with them. Both Luke and Christy became involved in highly succesful groups which combined a mixture of these songs with some Irish Traditional songs and dance tunes. (In the unlikely event there'd be anyone on this forum who wouldn't know these were The Dubliners and Planxty). These were Irish groups singing with an Irish accent. They never made any secret of the fact that many of the songs they sang were English or Scotish, but not everyone listens to or remebers the song intros or reads the liner notes or song credits on an album or CD.

Then people (like Guest,Ray) who assume they are Irish put them out on an album called Popoular Irish Songs or into a song book (many Irish song books are compiled and published by people who are not Irish) and the assumption is promulgated to another set of people, some of whom assume its Irish, others don't know or care.

While I'm all for the proper accreditation of material to its rightful author or tradition at either a professional or acedemic, the vast majority of people out there don't give a Monkeys where the song is from. And for most practical purposes they're right not to.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: GUEST,allen woodpecker
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 05:37 AM

Thanks, Declan. Being quite new to the Mudcat and to internet chat in general I was unfamiliar with what a "smilie" is. I've only just worked out what ROTFLMAO means. Fair play to you. I stand by my point that stuff like the Wild Rover is a self perpetuating pain in the arse, chicken and egg scenario. Pub bands play it, punters think it's great irish music so request it the next week. The pub bands play it coz people request it (even if they hate it), so the punters continue to request it. Continuing requests lead to repeated performances and so it goes. If only Joe Heaney, Len Graham, Eddie Butcher and guys like that were as popularly accessible as The Dubs and the Clancys. It just bugs me how the same drunks always ask for the same songs, never get tired of them, and don't realise the embarrassment of riches we posess in our native songs. Big plate of humble pie for me, then. a.w.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: van lingle
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 05:48 AM

Jug of Punch, The Jolly Beggar, The Black Velvet Band and Wild Mountain Thyme (or is that a Scottish one, *g*. vl


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Declan
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 06:03 AM

Allen,

I'm in 100% agreement with what you say there.

However the thread is about Poplarity, not quality and there always seems to be a big difference. I used to be of the opinion that if people like that type of stuff, they'd really like the "good" stuff, particularly if it was marketed and pushed at them the way the other stuff is. Nowadays I'm not so sure. Taste's differ.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Gurney
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 06:11 AM

For the original post... Isn't it hard to define Irish and popular!
Popular where? Written by an Irish citizen? Sung by the Irish because THEY like it? Situated in Ireland? Most requested? Duuhhhhh...

Anyway, how about 'The Rocky Road to Dublin' and 'Lanagan's Ball'


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Genie
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 07:25 AM

Sorry about all that underscoring (as well as the SNAFU in the last line) in my post above, folks.


Terry The version of "Galway Bay" made popular by Bing Crosby was written by Dr. Arthur Colehan, who I thought was an Irish-American, but
who, it turns out, was Irish.
Millwall, the link to Dr. Colehan above has more information about him. The song was written as if the singer were an expatriate of some sort,
but that aspect of the song was autobiographical.

Genie


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: greg stephens
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 07:41 AM

David Ingerson: thanks very much for a thoughtful reply. I think I read more into your post than was there, and now I understand it clearly. It's an ongoing problem in discussions, with words like sean nos,ballad, folk, traditional etc being used freely in discussion when they mean totally different things to different people: or totally different things to the same person in consecutive sentences!!
   Back to the main thrust of the thread: Whisky in the Jar and the Wild Rover are fine down at Scruffy O'Hooligans theme bar on Friday night, but we probably dont need another CD with this sort of stuff (unless someone's come up with some seriously radical new treatments.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Genie
Date: 01 Nov 02 - 04:21 PM

Correction:
I meant to say "The song [Galway Bay] was written as if the singer were an expatriate of some sort, but that aspect of the song was NOT autobiographical."

Genie


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: help choose folksongs popular in Ireland
From: GUEST,ray
Date: 02 Nov 02 - 10:52 AM

Hi There once again.

Thank you all for your comments from my last request. My apologies for not relating what exactly i was looking for.

I am looking for help in choosing folksongs that are popular in Ireland. The songs that i am looking for are folksongs that have been Traditionally Arranged by some of Ireland's finest musicians including The Dubliners, The Clancy's, Christy Moore, The Wolfe Tones, Pual Brady, Donal Lunny etc etc. Once the folk song is popular in Ireland that will be fine even if the song might be an English, Scottish or Welsh origin is not an issue with me.

The reason why i am looking for the songs is because i am compiling a CD for some friends of mine and i want to give them the finest selection.

Please offer your suggestions.

Thanking you all once again, slainte, Ray.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: help choose folksongs popular in Ireland
From: GUEST,allen woodpecker
Date: 02 Nov 02 - 04:27 PM

Hi Ray. I know I've contributed to this thread already, but now it is obvious why you are doing this CD I would seriously urge you not to fill it with really awful, cheesy, hackneyed bullsh*t. There is a huge, really enormous volume of recorded songs out there, so you owe it to your friends to convey this to them. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the stuff you suggest is bad, just that it reinforces the stereotype of the "Oirish Ballad". Your friends would get an equally wrong impression of the diversity of Irish song if you recorded a CD consisting solely of Paddy Tunney and Geordie Hanna. Embrace the beauty of all types of song, not just the pub band repertoire which has had it's day. Good luck to you and your friends.
a.w.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: help choose folksongs popular in Ireland
From: wysiwyg
Date: 02 Nov 02 - 04:42 PM

Hey, one thread, OK? Keep posting in the old one, so it can all be found later when people search.

~S~


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Nov 02 - 05:50 PM

Hi, Ray - I moved your third thread over here to the second one. One thread should have been enough. When you split a discussion into many different parts, it gets too confusing. The first thread is here (click) - I would have combined it with the other, but it was already too long to combine easily. Please keep all this discussion confined to these two threads.

When I was in the West of Ireland last year, I got the impression that what was "popular" was an imitation of American country music, sung with a brogue. The leader of one band said, "I see we have some Americans in the audience. I guess we should sing some Irish songs."
Thanks.
-Joe Offer-


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: HELP CHOOSE 20 MOST POPULAR IRISH SONGS
From: The Pooka
Date: 02 Nov 02 - 06:43 PM

Oy. "Wut we got *heah* is, FAYLEyuh t' c'MYOON'cate." :)

Look, it's Definitional, is all. I think we know what we mean by Popular. Gosh darn it, people *like* it. But what do we mean by "Irish"? Haven't you guys heard of the scientific quest for the Theory of **Everything**? :) Ah weel. "...no other worthy opponents."

OKOK. I may have missed it above, but: how about "The Rising of the Moon" for a Popular Crossover? I.e., well-known, drunkenly-much-requested (or - not so??); and though not ancient, still actually Irish. *OKOKOK* not the *melody*!! (Geez!) But, the lyrics. The Content. (I'm assuming it's now more popularly known than "The Wearing of the Green".)

Up all the Authentic Irish, and all the John McCormack genre too, and the 33rd & 34th Counties Liverpool & Botany Bay; and even the bold Clancys of the far Tipperary, UK, sez I. :) Gimme Wolfetones and I don't care.

Oh, and Gareth: re that Norman business. It was just Business. It was never Personal. :)

Ducking & Running, Flopping & Hopping,
- Pook Mahone


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate
Next Page

  Share Thread:
More...

Reply to Thread
Subject:  Help
From:
Preview   Automatic Linebreaks   Make a link ("blue clicky")


Mudcat time: 25 June 8:12 AM EDT

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 1998 by the Mudcat Café Music Foundation, Inc. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.