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Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna

In Mudcat MIDIs:
Seoladh na nGamhan
seoladh na nGamhan (2)


GUEST,Philippa 07 Nov 02 - 12:07 PM
David Ingerson 07 Nov 02 - 06:49 PM
GUEST,Philippa 08 Nov 02 - 08:44 AM
GUEST,Philippa 08 Nov 02 - 08:45 AM
GUEST,Philippa 08 Nov 02 - 08:02 PM
MMario 12 Nov 02 - 02:44 PM
MMario 12 Nov 02 - 03:06 PM
GUEST,Philippa 13 Nov 02 - 05:29 AM
GUEST,Angun 13 Nov 02 - 04:33 PM
GUEST,Philippa 14 Nov 02 - 11:47 AM
GUEST,Philippa 15 Nov 02 - 06:02 AM
GUEST,Philippa 15 Nov 02 - 08:01 AM
GUEST,Angun 15 Nov 02 - 06:22 PM
GUEST 19 Nov 02 - 06:17 AM
MMario 22 Jan 03 - 11:09 AM
GUEST,Philippa 23 Jan 03 - 11:45 AM
MMario 16 May 03 - 09:55 AM
Felipa 17 May 03 - 05:53 AM
Felipa 17 May 03 - 11:25 AM
GUEST,Angun 18 May 03 - 01:01 PM
GUEST,Philippa 26 May 03 - 09:08 AM
GUEST,Sarah 08 Jul 08 - 03:34 PM
keberoxu 16 Jun 16 - 08:58 PM
Jim Carroll 17 Jun 16 - 02:52 AM
GUEST,keberoxu 17 Jun 16 - 02:29 PM
keberoxu 17 Jun 16 - 05:47 PM
GUEST,keberoxu 18 Jun 16 - 02:43 PM
keberoxu 18 Jun 16 - 05:01 PM
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Subject: Lyr Add: GAMHNA GEALA
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 07 Nov 02 - 12:07 PM

I referred to this song, Na Gamhna Geala, on two threads about Aililliú na nGamhna.

Seoladh na nGamhna also has some similarities and I will add that song to the thread later.

Na Gamhna Geala is the song of a woman who regrets marrying for riches and misses her life herding the calves.



GAMHNA GEALA
as collected from Néilí Ní Dhomhnaill and recorded by her niece Tríona Ní Dhomhnaill

Ó siad, mo cuid gamhna, na gamhna geala
Itheann siad a' féar, agus ní ólann siad a' bainne
Tá siad anonn agus anall ar a' bhaine
'S ní fear leo 'n trá ná barr lán a mhara.

[chorus]
Ó ím bím bó, 's é mo bhrónsa na gamhna
Maililileo, 's iad mo rúnsa na gamhna
Ó ím bím bó 's é[iad?] mo bhrónsa na gamhna
Maidín ciúin sa tsamhradh 'gus na gamhna agam á seoladh.

Ó ní rómhór mo dhúil 'sna mugaí ná i gcartaí
Fuinneogaí gloine nó seomraí bána,
Míle uair ab' fhearr liomsa cró beag ins a' tsamhradh
Poll a bheith ar a' scraith 's mé bheith buachailleacht na ngamhna.

Ó níorbh fhearr liomsa ribín tharam ná buarach
Ó níorbh fhearr liomsa locais faoim ná'n luachaire,
Píobairí na cruinne 's bíodh a' seinm i mo chluasa,
'S go bhfearr liomsa géimneach na ngamhna insa' bhuaillí.

(Lilis Ó Laoire and Brian Mullan also sing this song)


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: David Ingerson
Date: 07 Nov 02 - 06:49 PM

Thanks, Philippa, for your tireless work and significant contributions to the collective knowledge of those of us who love sean nos.

Keep it up. Please!

David


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Subject: Lyr Add: NA GAMHNA GEALA
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 08:44 AM

Thug tú ómós mór dom, a Dhaithí (David)!

Ciarili sent me this slightly different version of the lyrics. I hope she will tell us who this version is from.

NA GAMHNA GEALA

'S iad mo chuid gamhna, na gamhna geala,
D'ith siad an féar ach chan ólann siad aon bhainne,
Snámhann siad anonn is anall ar an Bhanna,
Ach char bhfearr leo an lomtrá acu ná an lán mara

Dá mbeadh siad agam, meadar is buarach,
Cuinneoga maithe fairsing a cheapfadh an t-uachtar,
Bheinn ag dul eatarthu, eadar na bó-tuaraí,
Ag seoladh na ngamhna go h-ailteán na luachra

Is beag mo dhúil i gcupaí nó i gcartaí,
Fuinneoga gloine agus rúmaí bána;
Ba mhíle b'fhearr liom bheith i gcró beag sa tsamhradh
Poll bheith ar a scraith is mé ag éad ar na gamhna

Híoma bíoma bó, 's é mo ghrá-sa na gamhna,
Mailleliú, mailleleol, 's iad mo bhrón-sa na gamhna,
Mailleliú, mailleleol, 's iad chrá-sa na gamhna
Maidin chiúin sa tsamhradh is gan na gamhna agam á seoladh


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Subject: Lyr Add: SEOLADH NA NGAMHNA
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 08:45 AM

from Mícheál Ó hEidhin, Cas Amhrán. The notation is published and I trust Mario will add the abc when he has time. The singer comes across a young woman inwho doesn't sound so happy to be herding , lonely away from parents and lover.

SEOLADH NA NGAMHNA

Siál (ú) na coille seo go huaigneach Dé Céadaoin
Casadh orm ógbhean (in)sa bhfásach,
' Toraíocht na ngamhna sea (óir) a cuireadh mé,
Is ceann (ó) ní bhfaighidh mé go lá 'cu.

Bheirim mo mhallacht do mhaoir na coille seo,
'S iad a d'fhag anseo le fán mé
M'athair 'mo mo mháthair go brónach sa bhaile,
'S gan gaire agaam teacht ina láthair.

Anois, a stóirín, ó tá tú ag imeacht uaim
'S a tharla nach tú 't á i ndán dom
Seo duit-se póigín ar bharr mo chuid méar(a),
'S, a stóirín, mo chúig céad slán leat


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Subject: Lyr Add: SEOLADH NA NGABHNA
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 08:02 PM

Here is the rather different version of Seolodh na nGamhna & translation published in Micheál Bowles' "Claisceadal 1". Dún Laoghaire, Co. Dublin: Glendale Press, 1985

SEOLADH NA NGABHNA

Tráthnóinín aoibhinn ar fiar an ghleanna
Is mé ag seoladh na ngamhan fén bhfásach,
'Sea do dhearcas-sa taobh liom spéirbhean chailce,
Chiúin, tais, bhanúil, náireach.
D'fhiosraíos féin go séimh den ainnir
Arbh aoinne í thar lear do tháinig:
"Ar lorg na ngamhan 'sea d'fhágas an baile,
Is ceann ní bhfaighfead go lá díobh."

"Tá crainnín cumhra i lúib na coille
Is ragham araon go lá ann,
Mar a mbíonn ceol na n-éan dár síorchur a chodladh
Is geobhaimid na gamhna amárach.
Gabhaim cead saor ó mhaor na coille
Féar a thabhairt go lá dóibh.
Le fáinne an lae béam araon 'nár seasamh
Is ag seoladh na ngamhan fén bhfásach."

Cois farraige siar mar a gcónaím sealad
Mar a ngabhann gach maith le fánaidh;
Breac mear lúfar is maighreáin slaite
Agus fonsa is feac na rámhainne;
Cailíní óga, gleoite, deasa
Chiúin, tais, banúil, náireach,
A sláinte dhá ól ar bord i dtigh leanna
Agus cé ná tabharfadh grá doibh?

translation:
One fine evening aslant the glen
While grazing the calves on the common,
I saw close by a fairy-woman, pale
Quiet, gentle, womanly, shy.
I enquired softly of the young girl
Was she someone come over the sea.
"Seeking the calves brought me from home
And not one will I find until day!"

"There's a fragrant bush back in the wood
And we'll both go there until day comes,
Where there is birdsong to bring on sleep,
and we'll find the calves tomorrow.
The woodman will readily permit us
To give them grass until day.
With the dawm of day we'll both be afoot
Seeking the calves on the common."

Back near the sea, where I'm living awhile
Where every good thing is easily got;
Nervy, lively trout and slender grilse,
And the grip and thrust of the spade;
Young girls, bright, pretty
Quiet, gentle, womanly, shy,
Their health being drunk at the tavern
And who would not have love for them?

Bowles' notes:
"There are several versions of this widely known song. One of them describes the betrayal of the incautious young woman by a heartless landlord, encouraged and abetted by his agent. Another indicates maternal complaisance in spite of paternal anger.

"In the version given here, the dramatic situation and the protagonists are economically but clearly set out in the first two verses. The third verse, which comes by courtesy of Aindrias Ó Muimhneacháin, outlines the social background and the attitude of our hero.

"Sung slowly as in this song, the melody evokes a plaintive, indeed a painfully tragic impression. Sung quickly and matially, it is associated with three songs whose interest is political and not musical. These are (1) Native Swords (Spirit of the Nation, 1845), (2) Rosc Catha na Mumhan: Battle Hymn of Munster, written as a sort of counterblast to (3) The Battle of the Boyne

"The chorus of Native Swords is:
    And now, thank God!
   Our Native sod
   Has Native Swords to guard it.

"The chorus of The Battle of the Boyne is
    We'll get a hempen rope;
    We'll hang the bloody Pope,
    And he'll never cross the Boyne Water.

"Betrayal in love; pollitical mindlessness; this splendid melody is seemingly unfortunate in its associations."

I'm afraid that this thread is now liable to go off in a tangent far from cattle-herding songs. but is my memory correct that "Loyal Orange Heroes of Comber" is also set to the marching variant of this air?

Nioclás Tóibín and Áine Uí Cheallaigh have both recorded a Waterford version of this song on Gael-Linn albums. I understand that Áine has lyrics on the sleevenotes of the "Idir Dá Chomhairle/ In Two Minds" CD, but they are not given with the cassette, which I have. Her first verse is almost the same as given by Bowles and her last verse has several of the lines of his second verse. The tune is the same. Here are Áine's notes on 'Seoladh na nGamhna':
"Aspects of the genre known as the 'Pastorelle' are to be found widely in Irish folk songs. This literary convention unsually describes a young man strolling through the fields where he meets a young country girl. He plies her with promises of love but she refuses him. There are several versions of this popular song, Nioclás Tóibín from Ring being the source of this particular one. The Petrie Collection has two airs of this name taken down in Clare in 1864."


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Subject: Tune Add: SEOLADH NA NGAMHNA
From: MMario
Date: 12 Nov 02 - 02:44 PM

This matches up with the lyrics in Philippa's post of Nov 8th - 8:45

X:1
T:SEOLADH NA NGAMHNA
I:'Cas Amhran' Meicheal O hEidhin
M:6/8
L:1/8
K:D
D2D2D|F2G (A B) c|d3e2c|(d2c) (A2A)|
w:Siál (ú) na coill-e seo_ go huaig-neach Dé Céad_-aoin_
D2D F2G|A2B c2A|(d3d2c)|A3-A3|
w:Cas-adh or-m óg-bhean (in)-sa bhfá__-sach,_
d3e2c|(d2c) (A2G)|(F2F) G2E|C2C D2E|
w:'To-raíocht na ngamh_-na_ sea_ (óir) a cuir-eadh mé,Is
F3G2E|A2G E2C|D3-D3|D3-D3
w:ceann (ó) ní bhfaigh-idh mé go lá_ 'cu._


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Subject: Tune Add: SEOLADH NA NGAMHNA (2)
From: MMario
Date: 12 Nov 02 - 03:06 PM

X:1
T:SEOLADH NA NGAMHNA (2)
N:tif from philippa
I:Micheál Bowles,"Claisceadal 1"
M:4/4
L:1/8
K:C
z6zC|D2(E G) A2d d|
w:Tráth-nóin-ín_ aoibh-inn ar
(A G E) D C D2E|F2E D C2E2|D4D2C C|
w: fiar__ an ghleann-a~Ismé~ag seol-adh na ngamhan fén bhfás-ach,'Sea do
D2E G A2d2|(A G) (E D) C (D2E)|F2(F D) C2E2|
w:dhearc-as-sa taobh liom spéir_-bhean_ chail-ce,_Chiúin, tais,_ bhan-úil,
D4D4| (3A2B2c2d2e2|(d2c) A G G2G|
w:náir-each.D'fhios-raí-os féin go séimh_ den ain-nir Arbh
A2d (c d) e|d2-d c A2B B|c2A2(d2c) A|
w:aoinn-e í_ thar lear_ do tháin-ig:"Ar lorg na ngamhan_ 'sea
G2E D C D2E|F2E D (A2G) E|D4D4
w:d'fhág-as an bail-e,Is ceann ní_ bhfaighfead_ go lá díobh


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 13 Nov 02 - 05:29 AM

thanks MMario. I hope it's clear to everyone that the tunes are posted in the same order as the two sets of lyrics for "seoladh na nGamhna; i.e. version from "Cas Amhrán" first and version from "An Claisceadal" second. The second one is the tune Áine Uí Cheallaigh sings.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,Angun
Date: 13 Nov 02 - 04:33 PM

I once saw a 5 verses version of Seoladh na ngamhna, like the version Áine Uí Cheallaigh sings, where some of the verses seem to be from the father of the girl point of view. I can not remember what book this was in. Is there anyone who knows anything about this?

Angun


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Subject: RE: Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 14 Nov 02 - 11:47 AM

Perhaps it was in a songbook by Nóirín Ní Riain, one of a number of people who have recorded Seoladh na nGamhna. I don't recall what version she has.

A listing for a recording by Nóirín Ní Riain describes the song thus: "A song with mystical love, about a man that sees his lover as he drives cattle through the pasture. They spend a night together and he leaves her with this final blessing; 'Here's a little kiss for you on the tip of my fingers, and O my Love, My five hundred blessings be with you!'"

Susan McKeown's lyrics of Seoladh na nGamhna and real-audio are on the web. McKeown writes, "I recently rediscovered Mary O'Hara on a Rykodisc re-release of a 1960 recording [Down by the Glenside: Songs of Ireland], and through her this haunting song. Mary got the song from Liam Clancy, whose translation this is*. The song comes from Mahonbridge in County Waterford."

*trans. by Liam Clancy:
Late one evening by the glenside and I driving the cattle to pasture
I saw beside me a beautiful woman, chalk-white, gentle and modest
I gently asked the beautiful maiden "What brought you here?"
"Looking for the calves I left home, and not a one have I found"

"There's a fragrant tree in the angle of the wood, and let us go there
Where the music of the birds will put us to sleep
And we'll get the calves tomorrow
I'll get permission from the keeper of the wood
To give them a day's portion of grass."

Seoladh na nGamhna lyrics, not all identical, are also to be found at http://www.angelfire.com/ri/domhan/clars09.html
as recorded by Birkin Tree
http://www.acronet.net/~robokopp/eire/seoladh.htm
Liam Harte's Gaelic song pages


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 06:02 AM

Angun, there is a line in the first version I gave (from "Cas Amhrán") mentioning that father and mother are left sad at home. In that case, it sounds like they are sad because their daughter is away herding the cattle on the mountains.

In the verse which you can see at the webpage referred to in the links above as "as recorded by Birkin Tree"[sic], the it seems the cattle went astray and that is why the parents are worried.

"Ag seoladh na ngamhn' sea d'fhág mé an baile
'Gus ceann ní bhfaighidh mé go lá dhíobh
Tá m'athair gan chéill im' dhiadh sa bhaile
'S mo mháithrín buartha cráite".
"Gheobham cead saor ó mhaor na coille
Féar a thabhairt go lá dhóibh
'S le fáinne an lae beam araon 'nár seasamh
Ag seoladh na ngamhn' fé'n bhfásach".

"I was driving the calves when I left home and I won't find one of them until morning. My father is beside himself at home and my mother is distressed and distraught. We will get permission from the overseer of the wood to give them grass until morning and with the dawning of the day we will both be up and driving the calves to pasture."

Are those the lines you had in mind?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 08:01 AM

audio of Tríona Ní Dhomhnaill, including na Gamhna Geala, is available at http://shopping.yahoo.com/shop?d=product&id=1921080700
saw MP3 weblisting at www.artistdirect.com/music/artist/ songs/0,,398135,00.html
lyrics also at Angelfire


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,Angun
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 06:22 PM

Philippa,
If I understood the line you wrote correctly, this is the daughter singing? The version I saw was with one or two verses from the fathers voice. I went to the library and tried to find the book again, but it was not there at the moment. I think the book was a collection of folklore from somewhere in Co. Kerry. I also heard some of he story behind the version from Ring in Waterford, and I'll try to find that as well. I belive it was a tragical story.

Angun


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 06:17 AM

correcting a link http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=53365&messages=13


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: MMario
Date: 22 Jan 03 - 11:09 AM

X:1
T:Na Gamhna Geala
N:Seoirse Ó Dochartaigh sings na Gamhna Geala to this tune
N:from Phillippa
I:abc2nwc
M:4/4
L:1/8
K:D
D2D D D D- D2|zD F A B2A2|
w:'S~iad mo chuid gamh-na,_ na gamh-na gea-la,
zD F A d2B d|c B A F B2A2|
w:D'ith siad an féar ach chan ó-lann siad aon bhain-ne,
zD F A d2B d|(c B) A F B2A F/2 E/2|
w:Snámhann siad an-onn is a-nall_ ar an Bhan-na,Ach char
D2D3/2 E/2 F3/2 E/2 D3/2 A,/2|D3/2 E/2 (F3/2 D/2) E2D2
w:bhfearr leo an lom-trá a-cu ná an lán_ ma-ra


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 23 Jan 03 - 11:45 AM

my source for the above tune of Na Gamhna Geala is Mánus Ó Baoill, "Ceolta Gael2". Cork: Mercier, 1986. I didn't transcribe it myself, just sent a scan to MMario. gracie, MMario

The version at the top of the thread goes to a different tune.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: MMario
Date: 16 May 03 - 09:55 AM

X:1
T:Na Gamhna Geala
T:The Lovely Calves
T:The White Calf
N:'Bunting's Ancient Music of Ireland'
N:edited from the original mss. by Donal o' Sullivan & Micheal O Suilleabhoun
I:abc2nwc
M:4/4
L:1/8
K:Eb
z4G2A B|c2c d e2e f|e2G ze2d c|B2A G G c B d|
c2c zE F G A|B2A G e2d c|B2G E {c}B A B c|
G2G F E zD2|C3D E F G A|B2A G e2d c|
{c}B2G E B A B c|G2G F E2D2|(C2C) zz4|]


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: Felipa
Date: 17 May 03 - 05:53 AM

maybe akin to what Angun was writing about, there is a song called "Iarraidh na nGamhna" in Donal O'Sullivan's Songs of the Irish in which the father laments that his daughter's step mother sent her looking for cows in the woods, where she was set upon and raped (or at least seduced/led astray -- I'm not 100% sure of the interpretation)


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Subject: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala
From: Felipa
Date: 17 May 03 - 11:25 AM

This version of Na Gamhna Geala is very similar to the ones above, but has no chorus. Here are the lyrics for the latest tune posted by MMario, from the 19th c. Edward Bunting collection, edited from the manuscripts by Donal O' Sullivan and Mícheál Ó Súilleabháin (University of Cork, 1983):

Ó siad, mo cuid gamhna, na gamhna geala
Itheann siad a' féar, 'us ní ólann siad a' bainne
Gabhann siad anonn agus anall ar a' mBanna
'S ní fear leo 'n tráigh aca ná an lán mara.

Is beag mo bheinn ar thigheach ceann-slátaigh
Ar fhuinneóga gloine nó ar leapacha árda,
Ceólta na cruinne 's iad dá seinm i mo chluasa -
Ba bhinne liom-sa géimneach na ngamhna sa' mbuailligh.

Bheirim mo mhallacht don tsagart a phós mé,
Nó don té a d'ordaigh na bailte móra.
Ba míle b' fhearr liom-sa bothóg lá samhraidh
Poll bheith ar a' sgraith 's mé ag amharc ar na ngamhna.

Níor bhfhearr liom clúmhach fúm na luachair
'S níor bhfhearr liom raibhí orm ná buarach
Níor bhfhearr liom ar hallaibh is iad a bheith buailte
Nó poll a bheith ar an lantaoir 's mé ag amharc ar a' mbuailligh.

(a couple of differences are simply spelling : sgraith = scraith , buailligh - buallí)

translation from O'Sullivan & Ó Súilleabháin:

'Tis my own calves are the lovely calves, They eat the grass and they don't drink the milk, They go to and from on the River Bann, And they don't prefer the strand to the full tide.

'Tis little I care for houses with slated roofs, For glass windows or for beds off the floor, If the melodies of the world were ringing in my ears, Sweeter to me would be the lowing of the calves in the milking field.

I send my curse to the priest who married me, Or to the man who arranged for the large towns, I would rather a thousand times a cottage on a summer's day, With a hole in the green sods [of the wall] and I looking at the calves. I would not prefer down feathers under me to rushes, I would nor prefer a ribbon to a spancel, I would not prefer a ... (?) To a hole in the lantern for me to watch the calves.

Collected at Deel Castle, Ballina [County Mayo, I suppose] in 1792

"In the published tune, Bunting raises the note B flat occasionally, presumbably for harmonic reasons. This has been corrected in the above copy and the tune is restored to its original aeolian mode. Bunting repreatd the last phrase in the tune and this presents a problem when setting the words. There is either a two line chorus missing from the words of else Bunting himselfe repeated the last phrase of the tune merely for effet. There may be a relationship between this song and 'Alliliú na nGamhna" in Walshe's Ceol Ár Sinsear..."

Could it not have been the source-singer who decided to repeat the last phrase?

I left out a the second verse of the Ní Dhomhnaill version. It begins like verse 3 of the Bunting version.

Ó, bheirim-se mo mhallacht don tsagart a phós mé,
'S an darna mallacht do na bailte móra.
Siadsan nár chleacht mé riamh i dtús m'óige,
Ach mé ag rinnce ins a' tsamhradh 'gus na gamhna liom a' seoladh.

(my curse on the priest that married me, and my second curse on the big towns. That's not how I spent my youth, but dancing in the summer and herding the calves)

According to the notes on Tríona's album (prepared by Cathal Goan and Aodh Ó Duibheannaigh), it is said that the cattle in the song represented the "Wild Geese" (who were human!) and that the singer is lonely left behind after the flight of the earls. To me it is genuinely the song of a woman from the country who is unhappy in her married life in the town.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,Angun
Date: 18 May 03 - 01:01 PM

Thank you Felipa! I'll see if I can find "songs of the Irish" at the library.

Angun


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 26 May 03 - 09:08 AM

There is a Scottish Gaelic song also called Gamhna Geala, which starts with a verse very like the Irish song, but is otherwise different. See www.physik.uni-freiburg.de/~golecki/lyrics/gamhna.html, and also "Runrig" lyrics sites


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,Sarah
Date: 08 Jul 08 - 03:34 PM

Does anyone know the Gaelic lyrics for the Hothouse Flowers version of "Seoladh Na Ngamhna"? All I can find is the English translation.

Thank you and much appreciated!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: keberoxu
Date: 16 Jun 16 - 08:58 PM

After listening to Máire Ní Scolaí sing "Seoladh na nGamhna", unaccompanied, on one of her recordings for radio broadcast (collection published by Gael Linn, vinyl LP only), I came to this thread to see if the lyrics were already available here. This recording gives only three verses.

The November 2002 posts from Philippa give more than one version of this song lyric. The closest match to the Gael Linn/Ní Scolaí recording is the version that Philippa credits to the "Cas Amhrán." The only problem is that some eight stanzas are available for this version; Philippa's post gives verses 1, 3, and 4, while Ní Scolaí recorded verses 1, 2, and 4. A future post may complete the "Cas Amhrán" entry with the remaining five verses, as edited by Eileen Costello in the collection "Amhráin Mhuighe Seóla" for the Irish Folk-Song Society in the 1920's.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 Jun 16 - 02:52 AM

Two versions given by Mrs Costello
Jim Carroll

Driving the Calves to the Pasture sung by Mrs Bridget Forde, Sylane, Tuam

TRANSLATION.
1 As I walked through this wood last Wednesday,
A young maiden met mein the waste-land,
Searching for the calves I was, such was my errand,
And one of them I would not find till morning.

2. A little quicken tree there is, at the end of this wood,
And we will be together till the day comes.
It's up we will be, with the bright peep of the morning,
And you will find the calves in the waste-land.

3. I give my malediction to the herds of this wood,
It was they that left me here a wandering.
My father and my mother sorrowful at home,
And I without a chance of coming to them.

4. So now, my darling, since you are going from me,
And that it is not you who are destined for me,
Here is a little kiss from the top of my fingers,
And five hundred farewells to my treasure.

5. I am a young maid born with a fortune,
But alas ! I am not fated to enjoy it. In this town, while yet young,
I was brought into disgrace,
And all through the son of O'Malley.

6. To have been hanged I would very much prefer,
Or to have been burned in a bone fire,
Than to give the satisfaction to any mother's son,
That I'd rear for one year his offspring.

7. My girl was put standing before the congregation,
And into her hand was put the Bible
She had to undertake to make due reparation,
Else from the place she'd have been banished.

8. Oh, Shane O'Malley, come you home with me;
Oh, come to me and have no shyness;
And never again will you go across the sea,
When you see your own baby and its mother.

For a variant of this song see " Irish Popular Songs," p. 51, by Edward Walsh.
Petrie has two airs of this name, Nos. 1529 and 1530, taken down by him in Clare in 1864.

The following version of the words were written down for me by Mr. Michael Diskin, 1ST. T., Milltown, from Simon Steed ; but I was unable to get the air :—


TRANSLATION.

1 As I walked out one morning in the spring,
And rambled through the wood quite carelessly,
Whom should I meet but a comely young maid,
Whose mouth was finely formed and a-smiling.

I (myself) asked her whereto did she belong,
Or what blessed country did she come from.
And searching for the calves 'twas there I sent my girl,
But one of them she didn't find till morning.

3. There's a little quicken tree at the angle of the wood,
And you'll come along with me there till day dawns.
The sweet song of the birds will lull us there to sleep,
And the foliage of the trees will be a shade for us.

4. We have the kind consent of the keepers of the wood
To get from them the grass until the morning.
With the bright peep of dawn we'll be up and on our way,
And we'll drive the calves out in the pasture.

5. Now the old rake is secure in his wood,
And my opinion is that he's revengeful;
But searching for the calves 'twas there I sent my girl,
And one of them she didn't find till morning.

6. The old rake is now secure in his wood,
And for a year he has pursued my girl,
But if justice can be had in the place in which we are,        
From his bones I will exact reparation.

7. My malediction I give to the herds of the wood        
Who left me to suffer cold and hardship.
My daddy and my mammy grieving sore at home,
And I without a chance of coming near them.

8. Ah! bright love of my bosom, do not be dismayed,
You've done only what your mother did before you ;
And since it was your own will, return home, my treasure.
See, I salute you from the top of my five fingers. |

9. Were I only now as I was a year ago,
That is just a year from the present time,
I would sit down and rest on the stock of your bed,
And would drink a bottle of wine with you, my girl.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: GUEST,keberoxu
Date: 17 Jun 16 - 02:29 PM

Guest Angun, in the earlier posts on this thread, was making much of some verses from the point of view of the girl's father. Jim Carroll's post with the English translation seems to fulfill Angun's request, especially the first of the two versions, in Verse 7.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Gamhna Geala & Seoladh na nGamhna
From: keberoxu
Date: 17 Jun 16 - 05:47 PM

Jim Carroll's recent post gives translations, from Mrs. Costello's "Amhráin Mhuighe Seóla," for two versions of "Seoladh na nGamhna." Separated as they are by many years and several other posts, it is easy to miss that one of the originals for one of these two translations, has already been posted to this thread, although the Gaelic version has many verses missing. To clarify:

Jim Carroll's post is dated 17 June 2016. In it, his very first English translation corresponds to the Gaelic tune and verses that are found on pages 19 and 20, "Seoladh na nGamhna 'sa Bhfásach," in the printed music book Amhráin Mhuighe Seóla: Traditional Folk-Songs from Galway and Mayo (publisher/reprint: Cló Iar-Chonnachta).

Message no. 4 on this same thread, dated 8 November 2002, is from Philippa. The three Gaelic verses posted in this thread essentially duplicate what is printed, in full, in Eileen Costello's Amhráin Mhuighe Seóla on page 19. In her post, Philippa states that she refers to a different printed source: the printed music book "Cas Amhrán," edited by Micheál Ó hEidhin, and also a reprint from Cló Iar-Chonnachta. (Anglicized: ?Michael Hynes?)   Philippa's post gives three Gaelic verses, presumably that is the total available from Cas Amhrán.

Readers, pardon my repetition, redundancy, and sounding pedantic with the details; I simply want to be certain that anyone reading this thread can cross-reference material in separate posts which is closely related.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Seoladh na nGamhna 'sa Bhfasach
From: GUEST,keberoxu
Date: 18 Jun 16 - 02:43 PM

Gaelic original matched to English translation: Seoladh na nGamhna 'sa Bhfásach

Verse 1. English translation, first line: As I walked through this wood last Wednesday
         Gaelic original, first line: Siubhal ó na coilleadh seo go h-uiagneach Dia Céaddaoin

Verse 2. English, first line: A little quicken tree there is

the second verse in Gaelic, from Amhráin Mhuighe Seóla:
                              Tá crainnín caorthainn faoi bhun ó na coilleadh seo
                              A's béidhmuid le chéile go lá bán ann
                              Béidhmuid 'n ár suidhe le bánadh geal na maidne
                              'S gheobhaidh tú na gamhna ins a' bhfásach


Verse 3. English, first line: I give my malediction to the herds of this wood

         Gaelic, first line: Bheirim mo mhallacht dho mhaoraibh na coilleadh seo

Verse 4. English, first line: So now, my darling, since you are going from me
          Gaelic, first line: Anois a stóirín, ó tá tú ag imtheacht uaim

This covers all the verses contributed by the 8 November 2002 post (Philippa) in the original Irish/Gaelic, matched with their respective English translations in the 17 June 2016 post from Jim Carroll.
A future post to this thread will complete the eight verses of this particular song, matching the Gaelic to Jim Carroll's contribution of the English translation.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Seoladh na nGamhna 'sa Bhfasach
From: keberoxu
Date: 18 Jun 16 - 05:01 PM

conclusion from previous post. Resuming with Verse 5. The Gaelic is printed in
Amhráin Mhuighe Seóla: Traditional Folk-Songs of Galway and Mayo

Verse 5. English translation, first line: I am a young maid born with a fortune
          Gaelic original:
                                          Cailín óg mé a rugadh leis a' bhfortún
                                          Acht fairíor nach raibh sé i ndán dam
                                          Fuair mé scannail go h-óg ins an mbaile seo
                                          Mar gheall ar mhac Uí Mháille

Verse 6. English, first line: To have been hanged I would very much prefer
         Gaelic original:    B'fheárr liom go mór-mhór a bheith crochta
                              Nó dóighte i dteinnte cnámha
                              Ná go dtiubhrainn le sásamh do aon mhac máthar
                              Go n-oilfinn bliadhain dó páiste

Verse 7. English, first line: My girl was put standing before the congregation
         Gaelic original:    Cuireadh mo chailín 'na seasamh ins a bpobal
                              Agus tugadh an leabhar i n-a láimh dí
                              B'éigean dí tabhart faoi shásamh thabhairt
                              Le faitchíos go gcuirfidhe as an áit í

Verse 8. English, first line: Shane O'Malley, come you home with me
         Gaelic original:    A Sheagháin uí Mhaille, tar thusa a bhaile liom
                              Ná bíodh cúthaileacht ort teacht in mo láthair
                              'S go deo deo arís ní rachaidh tú thar sáile
                              Nuair a fheifeas tú do leanbh 'gus a mháthair


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