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BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?

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GUEST,wdyat24 14 Nov 02 - 05:03 PM
katlaughing 14 Nov 02 - 05:09 PM
GUEST 14 Nov 02 - 06:02 PM
GUEST,wdyat24 14 Nov 02 - 06:33 PM
GUEST 14 Nov 02 - 08:17 PM
DougR 14 Nov 02 - 10:17 PM
michaelr 15 Nov 02 - 01:32 AM
GUEST 15 Nov 02 - 07:30 AM
Troll 15 Nov 02 - 09:01 AM
kendall 15 Nov 02 - 10:17 AM
katlaughing 15 Nov 02 - 10:23 AM
GUEST 15 Nov 02 - 12:52 PM
GUEST 15 Nov 02 - 12:54 PM
katlaughing 19 Nov 02 - 06:50 PM
Bobert 19 Nov 02 - 06:58 PM
DougR 19 Nov 02 - 07:34 PM
Joe Offer 19 Nov 02 - 08:19 PM
GUEST 20 Nov 02 - 11:32 AM

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Subject: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: GUEST,wdyat24
Date: 14 Nov 02 - 05:03 PM

Where's the thread on Homeland Security? I saw one here...I think. Now Bush is stripping unions of the right to strike with the passage of his all invasive Homeland Security Bill.

wdyat24


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Nov 02 - 05:09 PM

It's even worse than that, wdyat, check out the links in the Safire afraid of Poindexter thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Nov 02 - 06:02 PM

Sad day for 70 some yeras of the Labor Movement. Bottom line, more contract labor and out-sourcing which pretty much insures the same types of probelms experienced by folks who live in "Right-to-Work" states which are very popular as retirement places for the ruling class because stuff is cheaper. Why? Guess.

And where are the Dems. Oh, "just watching'. If ever there was an issue ripe for a filabuster this is it. Man, the Dems didn't learn a thing from the election. Normal.

Yeah, this ol' hillbilly ain't concerned at all about Osoma or Saddam but now Ridge and Ashcroft and Bush, they are different stories...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: GUEST,wdyat24
Date: 14 Nov 02 - 06:33 PM

Everyone of us now is under Homeland Security surveilance.

wdyat24


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Nov 02 - 08:17 PM

OK you guys - change the subject - WE are watching YOU.


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: DougR
Date: 14 Nov 02 - 10:17 PM

The concerns Safire wrote about: it will never happen.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: michaelr
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 01:32 AM

Tom Ridge erased the thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 07:30 AM

Living in a right-to-work state, we refer to it as a right-to-work for less state.

It's all about jobs, just ask those Republicans. Until you need one.


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: Troll
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 09:01 AM

How do you figure that things are cheaper in the Right-to-work states because the workers there are not required to belong to a union. Most of the stuff we buy comes from the manufacturing states which are completely unionized.
I can't speak for other states, but the reason folks, rich and poor, like to retire to Florida (other than the climate) is that there is no state income tax.
I worked for 30 years in a right to work state. No one in the place was required to belong to the union and some did not. Most did. The union bargained for everyone when contract time came around and represented anyone who had a grievance.
I joined the union as soon as I had passed my 90-day probationary period and eventually became a shop steward. I was never a supervisor or "boss" of any kind.
I tell you this so you will know that I'm not someone who is a theoretician regarding unions but someone who has been intimately acquainted with them,
I have seem abuses by both labor and managment. I have seen union membership denied someone because a union official had a personal grudge against that person. No union card, no job.
As far as not having the right to strike, the question simply goes to binding arbitration, which is where it would go anyway if the strike went on too long or if the business were listed as a "vital" industry.

troll


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: kendall
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 10:17 AM

Since when does a president hire, fire and transfer employees? It is obvious what he is up to; security people who are not civil servants, people who are grateful for his giving them a job (more political hacks like Sieglar at INS, Fitt and Webster) He wants people who will vote republican. If these people are civil servants, Bush is afraid they will vote democrat. Niether side really cares as much about security as they do about their friggin'politics!
If Bush has his way, and thanks to those gutless democrats he will, we are going to wind up with another batch of minimum wage incompetents just like the ones who let the bombers through before.
A pox on all of them!


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: katlaughing
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 10:23 AM

Reminds me of Ray-gun and the air traffic controllers...


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 12:52 PM

Here is the latest update on the newly introduced Homeland Security bill from ACLU:

ACLU Hails Victories In New Homeland Security Bill: Operation TIPS, National ID Rejected By Congress


November 13, 2002
Click here for the article, which has been deleted from Mudcat


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Nov 02 - 12:54 PM

And then this:

ACLU Calls on President Bush to Disavow New Cyber-Spying Scheme That Seeks to Put Every American Under Scrutiny


November 14, 2002
Click here for the article, which has been deleted from Mudcat


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: katlaughing
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 06:50 PM

And now this, the Senate has rejected an attempt by Democrats to remove an amendment from the Homeland Security bill which offers protecttion for pharmaceutical companies from lawsuits over the side effects of vaccines they create. The protections will be retroactive to lawsuits already in court.

The bill also includes liability protections for makers of airport screening equipment and airport security firms and weakens an amendment offered by the late Sen. Paul Wellstone, D-Minn., that would have barred companies that set up offshore tax havens from getting federal homeland security contracts.

Supposedly, Lott has promised they will be removed from the final version. Joh McCain voted with Democrats in an effort to dump this amendment. Ted Kennedy, IMO, needs to get his ass home; he was at a fashion tribute to Jackie Kennedy in Europe!

And, regarding internet and email privacy:

The bill also calls for greater legal protections for Internet providers, such as AOL or Microsoft Network, for giving government officials information about their subscribers during computer emergencies. If companies believe "in good faith" that there is risk of death or injury to any person, they can turn over details about customers - even their e-mails - without a warrant, under the bill.

Civil liberties groups, such as the Washington-based Electronic Privacy Information Center, contend the bill's language lets Internet providers reveal subscriber information to any government officials, not just investigators. Traditionally, U.S. companies have refused to act as agents for prosecutors without court-approved warrants, said Chris Hoofnagle, EPIC's legislative counsel.

The legislation requires government officials who obtain such information to report details to Attorney General John Ashcroft within 90 days. It also requires Ashcroft to report results to Congress after one year.

Another part of the Homeland Security bill gives U.S. authorities new power to trace e-mails and other Internet traffic during cyber attacks without first obtaining even perfunctory court approval. That could happen only during "an immediate threat to national security," or an attack against a "protected computer." Prosecutors would need to obtain a judge's approval within 48 hours.

Experts have noted that U.S. law considers as "protected" nearly any computer logged onto the Internet. And civil liberties groups have frequently complained that obtaining permission from a judge is too easy for this type of e-mail tracing; if an investigator merely attests that the information is relevant to an ongoing investigation, a judge cannot deny the request.


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 06:58 PM

Opps, sorry. I just started another thread by accident....

Real sorry.

Joe, if you can fix my screw up, please do so.....

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: DougR
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 07:34 PM

Yea! The bill passed today! It's going to need some tweeking during the new Congress, but despite the Democrats efforts to head if off at the pass, it finally passed pretty much in the form it passed in the House. It should have passed two months ago, but Daschle and his Democratic majority used it as a campaign tool thinking it would help them in the election. It didn't.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Nov 02 - 08:19 PM

Bobert's thread is here (click). It's too big to combine with others, so I crosslinked it. The unnamed Guests who posted lengthy copy-paste articles above are reminded that they are supposed to post a summary in their own words, plus a link to the original article. Excerpts may be posted if accompanied by a discussion in your own words, but most non-music copy-paste articles are deleted.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: BS: Where's the thread on Homeland Security?
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Nov 02 - 11:32 AM

Why? Has Sadam threatened to take our banjos?


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