Gibson 'Street 12' 1935?

Subject: Gibson 'Street 12' 1935?
From: GUEST,Richard Bridge (cookie and format C)
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 07:58 AM

A friend of mine says he might still have one of these in his mother's loft. Been there since the 60s.

He says it is in poor condition, and he thinks it dates from about 1935.

A 12-string, tuned to "C" (standard intervals) in stead of the modern "E".

I asume it is a flat-top because he did not say it was an archtop or F-hole. I assume also it is not a taipiece guitar because that's the sort of thing you mention too.

He says you can't get strings for it.

Any information? Ought he to be prepared to spend a fortune on it to get it restored? I am puzzled because I thought Gibson did not make flattops until later than 1935.

Subject: RE: Gibson 'Street 12' 1935?
From: Willie-O
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 08:18 AM

They certainly did make flattops earlier. I used to have a 1928 Gibson LO flat top--little black job. Punchy sound.

Poor condition meaning what? Does he know anything about guitars?
I doubt he does if he thinks he "can't get strings for it". Of course he can. Way better ones than were ever on it before.

A 12 that's been strung but ignored for that long may have trashed the neck by now. But if it was tuned to C, I think there's hope, since that's really low-tension.

No doubt he could spend a lot of money on it. There's no way we can guess whether it would be a worthwhile investment, since even you haven't seen it. Take it to a repair shop, preferably a vintage specialist (meaning more generally, a highly-experienced-with acoustic guitars repairperson.)

If you tell us your general location, I'm sure we can recommend someone.

Willie-O

Subject: RE: Gibson 'Street 12' 1935?
From: GUEST,Richard Bridge (cookie and format C)
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 10:03 AM

He knows guitars - he's a semi-pro folk musician and has been since the 60s.

I gather from his description that it is twisted - and I thought he conveyed the body was distorted as well as the neck.

I think the strings were longer than standard scale length (like the "D" Ovations) and also thicker than standard heavies - and its a twelve.

Location - North Kent, England (about 40 miles from London).

Do you know if there was a thing officially called a "Street 12"?

Subject: RE: Gibson 'Street 12' 1935?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 12:09 PM

Looks like an interesting thread in the making Richard. If your friend is pretty knowledgable then we may be dealing with some kind of custom instrument. Gibson made many flat tops prior to 1935, but to the best of my knowledge, no 12 strings until Erik Darling ordered two of them in 1960 for he and Bill Svanoe (remember "Walk Right In")

The "C" tuning would be consistent with how most players tuned their Stellas from 1910 to 1950 (big with blues guys, but mostly used in Mexican music) and tuning it up to pitch is a pretty modern concept (as you mentioned)..however you can get ANY kind and guage of string these days so if the neck isn't a total write-off it shouldn't be hard to put the instrument back in shape.

Cheers

Rick

Subject: RE: Gibson 'Street 12' 1935?
From: GUEST,Richard Bridge (cookie and format C)
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 04:04 PM

We are trying to get the instrument from the loft....

The muso is a bit casual and tends to refer to his Sigma that I have on loan a the moment as a Martin, so we'll see what we find.

I remember "Walk Right In". Was it played on a conventionally tuned 12? As far as my ears take me back, I would have guessed possibly a tuning lower than E and maybe even unison courses on the lower strings not octave pairs.

Subject: RE: Gibson 'Street 12' 1935?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 06:14 PM

Hi Richard. One of the great joys of the internet for me has been getting in touch with my heroes of days gone by. I've been coresponding with Erik Darling for four years now, and we even got together to do some pickin' together in Cleveland a couple of years ago. I believe the two twelve strings ehe ordered from gibson were tuned D to D and the stringing was normal (with the octaves etc.).....but fortunately I can now check with the man himself.

Your friend refers to a Sigma as a Martin???? Hmmmmmmm this 'rare find' may not end up being as rare as we're hoping, ha ha!

Cheers

Rick

Subject: RE: Gibson 'Street 12' 1935?
From: GUEST,Richard Bridge (cookie and format C)
Date: 26 Nov 02 - 04:46 AM

Well, yes and no.

A Sigma is a licence built authorised budget Martin.

But until recently when Gibson took over Epiphone I am not aware of there being any equivalent budget Gibson - so if it isn't a real Gibson it might be even rarer...