Origins: Sean South of Garryowen (Sean Costelloe)

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Bron-yr-Aur
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 03:17 PM

Malachy McCourt refers to this song in his book "A Monk Swimming." On page 127, he reveals that the author of the song, Sean Costelloe, was in fact his next door neighbour. Malachy had a party at his Mother's (Angela, of "Angela's Ashes") Limerick Council House where a few friends, including Ger South, who was Sean South's brother, were.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,al
Date: 11 Oct 10 - 08:59 PM

Hi all,
just to let every one know sean south wasnt from garryown but the oconnell ave henry st area of limerick,garryown was only used for the song as it was easier to rhyme,my late grand father also fought along side sean and his uniform was in his family home until information he recieved that the gardai (irish police) were going to raid his home it was then moved to clare st at the edge of garryowen,i would like to find its where abouts now so if any could help i would be grateful thanks.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Joseph Mc Mahon
Date: 15 Sep 10 - 09:20 PM

The writer of this son sean costelloe is my father's uncle. his sister agnes costelloe was my father's mother who married john mc mahon!

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: MartinRyan
Date: 08 Oct 08 - 04:35 PM

Thank you for that, GUEST. Good luck with the project - don't believe everything you read in books!

Regards

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Oct 08 - 04:26 PM

im doing my project on sean sabhat now for school....he was actually quite a selfless man.... ye should all read ''séan south'' by des fogarty and get yer facts ironed out! some of ye are talkin absolute shite.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: MartinRyan
Date: 16 Jun 08 - 09:59 AM

Terence

Is maith is cuimhin liom an sult a bhaineas as scríobhnóireacht d'athair agus mé im óige! Beir bua!

Regards

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Terence Saunders
Date: 16 Jun 08 - 09:37 AM

Having just visited this site for the first time I am interested in the debate on origin of "Sean South of Garryowen" and the claim of 5th December 2002 that this may in someway be connected to Cathal Ó Sándair seems to be adequately challenged. I knew Cathal ó Sándair well and proud to say I am his eldest son so why wouldn't I ? Cathal was indeed a wonderful father and very gifted writer though I doubt if he would even claim the remotest credit for a connection with this song. I believe I am aware of most or all of my late father's writing endeavours - if anyone has any further "pearls of wisdom" to offer me about my Dad or his writings I would be happy to hear ! Terence Saunders (Moscow)

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: trevek
Date: 29 May 08 - 07:44 AM

weelittle drummer, on the matter of wearing uniforms to go home, when I was in the army in 1980's the Irish lads who were due leave used to get permission to grow their hair longer than regulation length so as not to show they were squaddies.

An earlier post asked about a book "Glasgow Gangs Remembered". I haven't read that one but I used to have a recent one "Tongs Ya Bas!".

Interesting info but writtn in an incredibly stupid manner which kind of negated a lot of the positive aspects.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Angie South
Date: 28 May 08 - 05:56 PM

Hello, I came across your post while doing research for a paper that I'm writing on, Sean South. I am a direct decendant of Seans'. My Father is named after him, Sean South. We live in the United States, however, my Father goes to Ireland once a year and is highly regarded as the Great-Great Nephew of Sean South of Garryowen.

I would like to know more about my Great-Great-Great Uncle. Should anyone have additional information, I would surely appreciate knowing.
You may send it directly to my e-mail address: [e-mail]

Thank you.....

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: gnu
Date: 22 Dec 07 - 11:41 AM

Yes, indeed. Please do.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 22 Dec 07 - 05:11 AM

Very interesting Ger. Woud you like to tell us a little about the man who wrote this famous song, and maybe the feelings that inspired it? I have heard various stories. One was about the train being honoured carrying the bodies, and there being a memorial service outside the GPO in Dublin.

On the other hand I know several people who were living in Dublin at the time and they all say they can't remember anything about it particularly.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 21 Dec 07 - 11:44 AM

Further to Robin on 7th Dec five years ago; the fish that never swam, bell that never rand and bird that never flew;

these all appear on the Coat of Arms of Glasgow; a wee bird perched atop a tree, this tree having an open book in its branches on one side and a bell hingin' on the other, with below it a salmon wi' a gowd ring in its mooth. This last alludes to Kentigern's finding some princess' lost ring in the salmon he caught in the Clyde, or maybe Molendinar (this kind of story is found everywhere).

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Ger Costelloe
Date: 21 Dec 07 - 09:58 AM

Just to clear up one aspect of this discussion.
My Father Sean Costelloe did in fact write the lyrics for the song.
And is the published writer of the works.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,kevin mcgowan
Date: 03 Nov 07 - 10:22 PM

THE RAIDING PARTY   THAT ATTACKED BROOKBOROUGH R U C BARRACKS    IN JANUARY 1957   WAS NOT AMBUSHED OR INFORMED ON.       THEY PARKED THEIR BEDFORD TRUCK ON THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF THE STREET FROM THE BARRACKS   WITH THE ARMED GUNMEN IN THE BACK AND SET UP TWO BOMBS AGAINST THE BARRACK WALL.   WITH THE HOPE OF DEMOLISHING THE BUILDING AND KILLING ALL INSIDE,      IT WAS ONLY AFTER THIS GREAT BALLSUP OCCURED THAT THE STATION SARGENT DISCOVERED WHAT WAS HAPPENING .    A BRENGUN HAD BEEN ADDED TO THE   RUC ARMS A FEW DAYS EARLIER.   THE REST IS HISTORY.    WHAT A TRAGIC LOSS OF YOUNG IRISH LIVES, RED HEADED SOUTH   AND HIS MATE O'HANLON.          GIVE PEACE IN IRELAND A GO AND PUT THE PAST BEHIND US

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,terry
Date: 29 Oct 06 - 03:48 AM

sean south was killed on new years eve not first of jan

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jul 06 - 12:49 PM

Guest of 21st july, I wouldn`t be too sure, you could tryagain.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jul 06 - 12:30 PM

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 01:15 PM

any time

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Chris B (Born Again Scouser)
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 09:04 AM

weelittledrummer,

Ah well. If Christy says it it must be right. Thanks for putting me straight. And there's me wasting all this time reading books.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 09:02 AM

well said

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 08:31 AM

As a Republican myself I may not honour those Irishmen that fought in two World Wars, but I still respect them. Everyone is entitled to their traditions and respect should be given to all. My fathers two brothers were both officers in the Air Force during the last war, they held their view as I hold mine.Regarding Jim Magennis, even Unionists here in Belfast acknowledge the fact he wasn't honoured in the city until two years ago was Sectarian. Jimmy Magennis never had a problem with this himself, he had grown up with it.On the other hand, Blair Mayne another Ulsterman who won the D.S.O.and several bars to it in World War two was held in very high esteem, until he killed himself whilst drunk at the wheel of his car.Had he won the V.C. I imagine he would of been a public figure.So as it was then, lets hope it's to become history.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 07:49 AM

No ones arguing with the facts, just the wisdom of dragging them up.

And let's face it, we know those who are judgemental are thick as shite.

Christy Moore sang:-

Only the very safe, can talk about wrong and right
Of those who are forced to choose, some will choose to fight.

Judging by that, I think we have been infiltrated by the Provisional Wing of the Tumbridge Wells (very safe) Young Conservatives, and they want to break the current uneasy ceasefire on Mudcat.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: jonsul
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 07:11 AM

Ian you take it anyway you like, after 800 years its hard to be non judgemental of a particular race.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Chris B (Born Again Scouser)
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 06:30 AM

Mind you, Divis, De Valera may also have turned Churchill down because he simply didn't trust him. I probably wouldn't have in Dev's position.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Chris B (Born Again Scouser)
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 05:55 AM

Weelittledrummer,

Check out your history and then tell me I'm wrong. Have you looked at the link I suggested? Perhaps you should do so before you waste my time.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 05:21 AM

Chris if you were not a born again scouser, but a natural heir to this devils brew of religious nonsense - you would not be stirring it!

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Chris B (Born Again Scouser)
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 05:10 AM

Divis,

Very true. And De Valera turned Churchill down because he didn't want a million protestants in his precious catholic republic.

Talking about Irishmen who fought in the British forces during World War 2, here's an interesting link about James Magennis, a catholic from West Belfast who was Northern Ireland's only VC of the war:

http://www.victoriacross.net/forum_topic.asp?topics=30&tid=1736

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 05:05 AM

I wrote that a while back. I wasn't trying to dis the IRA or the republican movement. They're entitled to their heroes.

I was just saying something about the Irishmen who fought with my Dad. they did something good for the world (including Ireland) when they helped to see off Hitler - whatever uniform they were wearing at the time.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: IanC
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 04:54 AM

Jonsul

I see you're new here. Was your comment in the nature of a sweeping racist statement or did you have acloser definition of what you mean by "Brits"?

Just asking
Ian

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 04:32 AM

Very true, Winston Churchill offered Eamon De Valera Irish unity behind the backs of the Unionists if he joined him in the fight against the German forces !

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Chris B (Born Again Scouser)
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 04:17 AM

Weelittledrummer,

Well said. I think that the many thousands of Irish men and women (including those from the Republic) who fought against Nazi Germany did more for Irish freedom than a thousand Sean Souths (or Bobby Sands' or Gerry Adamses). Are they honoured or remembered in Ireland?

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: jonsul
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 04:11 AM

Isn't that so typical of the Brits and their lackeys in our country. And with the situation as it is we can include some big name politicians in that.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 30 Nov 05 - 02:18 AM

Regarding that slur on the name of Volunteer Sean Sabhat. Sean remained faithful to his childhood sweetheart Catherine Gallagher.The stone barn in which both he and Volunteer O'Hanlon died was razed by the British Army in 1985 the night before a planned anniversary.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Guest, Big Tim
Date: 29 Nov 05 - 04:16 AM

Susanne, I got a new PC about six months ago and chose not to transfer my Mudcat membership on to it. So, I haven't seen any PMs since then. If any have been sent, they must be floating around somewhere in cyberspace!

btw Hugh Jordan's book is available on Amazon (UK).

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 28 Nov 05 - 05:26 PM

Hi John, what do you mean, lapsed? Seems the PM got through all right! Thanks for looking in on us anyway :-)

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Guest, Big Tim
Date: 28 Nov 05 - 06:33 AM

My Mudcat membership has lapsed. My book can be obtained direct from the publisher's website: Beyond the Pale Publications. Cost incl p+p = 11.99 sterling.

The Feargal O'Hanlon song is on various "rebel" compilations. Availability will depend on what part of the world you are in. I got mine in Tower in Glasgow many years ago. The tune is "Teddy O'Neill", so you can sing it yourself!

I haven't checked, but I'd be amazed if Hugh Jordan's book isn't available on Amazon. Used copies should also be readily and cheaply available on the ABE site.

(Hi Susanne).

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Nuala
Date: 27 Nov 05 - 12:07 PM

Hi, I have been searching for a recording of the Ballad of Fergal O'Hanlon which Big Tim wrote out the words of in this thread. Does anyone know where I can get this and also a copy of the book Milestones in Murder by Hugh Jordan?

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Nov 05 - 05:31 AM

Thanks for that Suzanne..I'll join now.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 08:14 PM

Jonsul, if you became a member of Mudcat (at no cost) you could send Big Tim a personal message. I'm not sure the book is available through booksellers, but it's well worth buying.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,jonsul
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 07:26 AM

By the way I got Seoige's book in the local library and can do a chapter by chapter synopsis (in English) for anyone who's interested.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,jonsul
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 05:10 AM

Big Tim you say you published the names in your book..How do I get the book?

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Guest, Big Tim
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 01:20 PM

The only biography of Sean South is "Maraíodh Sean Sabhat Aréir" (Sean South Died Last Night?) by Mainchín Seoighe (Mannix Joyce), born in 1920, still alive but frail. Published in 1964. It's never been translated. Still available occasionally second-hand. It includes many interesting photos including one of the barn where Sean South died.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,sean og
Date: 25 Aug 05 - 12:31 PM

just a good tune

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,James
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 12:28 AM

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 04:34 PM

My father served in the Irish Guards during the 39-45 unpleasantness. he was in the guards armoured division driving a tank . He died in February this year and he always had nightmares about the stuff he went through as a tank driver. His regiment went into action 2 days after D-Day and he would never discuss what he saw and did, but he always said that only way to describe it was wholesale slaughter.

I suppose he would have been described in modern parlance as homophobic. I think it very unlikely he would have been happy in a gang of homosexuals - even as Isherwood would have said - homosexual for commercial reasons: and he had a great affection for his old regiment - even to my mother's horror (she was a Quaker) thinking it would be an okay place for me to serve when I was about four. Still I'm glad Blunt got lucky one night at least.

he did say that none of Irish comrades dared go home in uniform when they had a furlough - not wearing an English uniform. And from the Enniskillen bombing at the memorial, I suppose that attitude must still prevail in places. I think those men who fought against Hitler did their nation a favour. Hitler wouldn't have been any nicer to the Celtic nations than he was to the Slavic ones.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: MartinRyan
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 05:06 AM

BigTim

With that opening line, I would have expected "Bard of Armagh" as the tune! Haven't heard the song.

Regards

p.s. Never did get to Hughes' that night - you still owe me a drink!

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,elvis
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 11:35 PM

hello
My name is elvis. I am an american film student. I have heard the song Patriot Game and was very intreaged by the srory. I do not want to affend anyone but for such a good song to be written there must be a good story behind it. Please do not get upset with me. I don't know the irish history but I have to admit that one song has prompted me to learn more. Is'nt that what it's all about? If anyone can give a history leason on O'hannlon I would be forever thankful.

Elvis

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Sean MacDiarmada
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 10:17 PM

Thanks Big Tim but that's not the extra verse I'm thinking of. I have heard that one before. I'll have to try to dredge up a few words of the one I'm thinking of.
Sean

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: Big Tim
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 03:50 PM

No Seamus: no idea. These things are, understandably, kept quiet to outsiders, unfortunately for historians. I found it on an anon "rebel" compilation. Sounds like Declan Hunt singing it. Thanks for confirming the melody, my musical ear is not very good.

Subject: RE: Origins: Sean South of Garryowen
From: GUEST,Seamus Brogan
Date: 06 Apr 04 - 01:41 PM

Big Tim: That's the song as I know it word for word. It's sung to the air of Teddy O Neill. Do you know who wrote it.