Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: GUEST Date: 21 Feb 03 - 07:43 AM It looks like the Jackson reply will be shon in the UK on Sky so I won't see it but have just read this. If nothing else it confirms my feelings about Bashir. Jon |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: katlaughing Date: 19 Feb 03 - 09:52 PM LOL!! I couldn't believe that was all the networks had on the other night. Reading what you all have said is much better than watching any of it, which I did not do; also makes me glad I didn't watch it! I can't stand that kind of crap. Who cares what he is or is not?! |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: catspaw49 Date: 19 Feb 03 - 09:45 PM We need a thread about old Vaudeville and Burlesque jokes and routines....... Traveling salesman comes into a town feeling really bad and realizes he's lost his voice. He has an important call to make in the morning so he seeks out the home and office of the local doctor. He goes up and knocks on the door and a beautiful woman dressed in a negligee answers. He hoarsely whispers, "Is the doctor home?" She leans forward and with a smile whispers back, "No....Come on in." Spaw |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Big Mick Date: 19 Feb 03 - 09:31 PM Jayzus keeeeeeeerrrrrriiiissstttteee, Spaw, laid it out there and no one said the obvious: Mick |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Jeri Date: 19 Feb 03 - 08:36 PM It's a Hennwei, Spaw. Mr Hennwei made the first steam-powered bicycle. The trend never caught on - especially after that unfortunate accident in which the coal box fell off and squashed a Pomeranian that was chasing it. Made all the papers. Well, until it got squashed. Anyway, these Hennweis are very rare collectors items. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: catspaw49 Date: 19 Feb 03 - 08:20 PM Gee Miz Bones, What's a Hennway? Spaw.....just to keep the Vaudeville routine going |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Jeri Date: 19 Feb 03 - 08:18 PM I heard he bought a Hennwei, too. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rick Fielding Date: 19 Feb 03 - 08:08 PM Apparently over a billion Jeri. Rick |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Jeri Date: 19 Feb 03 - 05:43 PM Urns. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rick Fielding Date: 19 Feb 03 - 11:49 AM Ahhhhh the vases.....surely to god he was joking for Bashir's sake? He was wasn't he? But he doesn't joke, does he? Rick |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Alba Date: 18 Feb 03 - 07:01 PM pleez............ the vases...all that money and nay taste....that's a crime! Brutal is the only word for the gear in his "favorite store" As for his guilt or innocence...I don't know,Ihope not. Bashir though.....nasty piece of manipulation there but hey that's what he gets paid for.......not for the truth Michael jackson is now a celebrity freak and a sad in my eyes but then I can't imagine being in his world for one minute. His life has never been "normal" so................I am totally on the outside looking in and it was way too far removed from my life for me to understand his. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Bill D Date: 18 Feb 03 - 06:42 PM you know...MJ was about all you could watch last night..ABC and NBC both had 2 hrs or more...NBC ran a documentary about his life that was in many ways scarier than the 'interview'..(I switched back & forth)... I have NO idea whether he had ever actually molested any kids (though one claimed so 10 years ago, and the detective who worked the case was NOT happy it got settled out of court)...but anyone who can lie so blatently about how much plastic surgery he has had, just 'might' strech the truth about other things..they had 2 or 3 plastic surgeons who said that the man has had so muck (much, but I kinda like that typo) work done that he is in real danger!...And no matter that his father & others made him so sensitive about his appearance, he has a serious problem with what his mind has done to his body. It makes me sorta sad...and if he weren't so damn rich, it would be even sadder! (anyone want to discuss his 'taste' in vases?) |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rick Fielding Date: 18 Feb 03 - 06:08 PM I dunno Mick. The graphic physical descriptions provided to the police, resulted in Michael's being photographed in detail. They were apparently totally accurate, and immediately afterwards, Michael's 'people' went for the multi-million dollar settlement. That whole thing may be terribly ugly, but it's all available on the net now. My question now....is HOW experienced was the kid? Was there a 'set up' going on? It gets sadder and sadder, but I'm starting to see some stuff I didn't before. Rick |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Big Mick Date: 17 Feb 03 - 12:19 PM I thought the interview was a load of aul shite. The guy did just as Jeri suggests, he tries to lead us to a conclusion that ain't so. Is Michael goofy? Yep. Does he appear to have some emotional problems? yep. Did I see anything that suggests he is a pedophile? Nope. I was molested by a scout leader as a child, so I have a jaundiced view of folks that try to get close to all kids. I watch them for signs very carefully. I didn't see that. Mick |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rick Fielding Date: 17 Feb 03 - 11:55 AM Ya know, I've watched it twice now...and I clicked into "minute detail mode" both times. I looked for reactions, body language, evidence of re-takes, facial expressions.....and I simply don't know (about him being dangerous). I've watched interviews where I was amazed at the sheer skill of the subject to lie convincingly (Bill Clinton). I've seen interviews, where the subject looked absolutely terrified (George Bush jr.) I watched a pretty good interview with Paula Jones (after having made fun of this poor creature for a couple of years) and suddenly realized that (despite being manipulated by the Republicans) she was telling the truth...completely. I simply don't think Michael is smart enough to be "That good". So....is he a paedophile? I don't think so......BUT....would I leave MY kids with him? No, No, No. Ya gotta admit, it was a fascinating program. Cheers Rick |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Jeri Date: 17 Feb 03 - 11:35 AM It's his fame that permits his activities to be viewed - period. It is my opinion that if it's the job of the makers of the show to create a sensational story, to include their comments as truth, it certainly is a dirty job. It would have been a strange enough story without the creative commentary. If it weren't for his fame and wealth, I doubt he would have ended up so weird in the first place. It seems to me he's trying to remain in a childhood he never had. Maybe I'm wrong, but my opinion of molesters is that they're usually into the power thing, the control. They don't see themselves as one of the kids but the one in charge. One of the things that struck me was that the only people who treated Jackson like a person were the kids. Fans acting wacky, paparazzi acting wacky, interviewer acting insincerely respectful simply to gain trust (IMO) and employees, but the kids just acted like normal kids around him. As far as who's in danger, let's face it, our opinions are based mostly on gossip, rumors, and television interview programs which augment the facts with opinions designed to get ratings. I wouldn't trust any of these things. "No favors are being done anyone at real risk" - from whom? From child molester or a mob? Who decides where the risk lies? The best thing that could happen for anyone at real risk would be if an attempt were made to portray truth as imparially as possible, and that did NOT happen. Maybe it's because I read this thread before I watched the show, but there was a very obvious gap between what I was observing and the assumptions and conclusions the interviewer voiced. Frankly, I don't trust anyone who tries to not-so-subtly guide my feelings about what I'm seeing. Maybe it's just me. I don't like Jerry Springer either. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: The Shambles Date: 17 Feb 03 - 02:10 AM It is not the nature of his fancy toys, unless you include other peoples children as that. It is MJ's fame, his need to feed on this and complete isolation from the constraints placed upon most of us, that permits this totally bizrre individual's activities, some of them very suspect, to be to be viewed as not only acceptable but as a even role model by some. This is dangerous in itself, as I sadly think we will find out, if at least his own children do mot receive some outside help. That he may not, or not have appeared to be in this show, to be as strange as the worst publications would have us beleive, is hardly the point. No favours are being done to anyone at real risk, by us turning on the makers of the show. And for what, doing their job, and feeding us? This is a dirty job and we are led to beleive, mainly by those that do it, that someone has to do it? |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Jeri Date: 16 Feb 03 - 10:26 PM My impression was that most of the interview wasn't that weird, but the interviewer sure tried hard to make it seem that way. The commentary added post-interview sounded like sensationalism. It didn't match what I saw: Jackson's behavior supposedly becoming more and more 'bizarre' - huh? He was walking down a street, waving at people! 'Complete humiliation' because Jackson missed a cue? Oh come on! Complete humiliation is when your trousers fall off. It was also quite obvious that last interview was the 'kill'. Did his damndest to get some sort of emotional reaction out of Jackson. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: harpgirl Date: 16 Feb 03 - 07:30 PM hmmmm...I have to disagree with those of you that believe he is not a pedophile. I believe he is. My opinion is that Mr. Jackson should not he be allowed to have any unsupervised contact with children under eighteen. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Jeri Date: 16 Feb 03 - 07:19 PM Shambles, I don't know that the key is money, even if he certainly can afford fancier toys. Maybe there are many other adults stuck in childhood fantasies, but they aren't famous and so their lives aren't fodder for our voyeuristic tendencies. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: The Shambles Date: 16 Feb 03 - 07:04 PM Is possible for a 40 year-old man to pretend to be a child, to believe he will live forever and still maintain to be a responsible single parent to three children? If you have enough money, the answer would appear to be yes. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: GUEST Date: 16 Feb 03 - 06:58 PM Wouldn't most people love to have a Tree to climb whenever you wanted to,...their own TRAIN....a recording studio en suite..... Rick, please could I have a tree house in the tree? And can I have one of those old fairground organs, and I want an old steam powered Merry-Go-Round (carousel) with the most fantastic horses you have ever seen, trains - I want "Oliver Cromwell" I remember standing in awe looking at that one at Bressingham when I was about 10) and "The Flying Scotsman" of course (I don't remember but I'm told Pip once picked me up to allow me to touch that one)... I'd like to think that somewhere we all do still have the child in us, Jon Pan |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: catspaw49 Date: 16 Feb 03 - 06:15 PM Also, Michael has his rebuttle show airing this Thursday on Fox. It usws the outtakes to show that he was portrayed badly.........I think he is naive, very childlike himself and a hundred other things, but I also do NOT think he's a pedophile. Confused and deep into the Peter Pan syndrome for sure, but I really don't think he's dangerous in the classic sense. Spaw |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Jeri Date: 16 Feb 03 - 05:45 PM For those in the US with cable, the interview is on VH1 at 8 tonight. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Kaleea Date: 16 Feb 03 - 12:38 PM Michael who . . .? |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Jeri Date: 16 Feb 03 - 11:13 AM Thread creep "Your version of 'Neverland' might make a good thread subject. Not the adult stuff - we've probably all heard enough of other people's sexual fantasies to the point where they're boring. I'm thinking about the childlike indulgences. Rick would probably do the Indiana 'Mojo' Jones and the Search for the Holy Grail of Guitars thing: build a nice castle (with no wallpaper) with rooms like "The Really Good Japanese Knock-Off Room," "Magnificent Marvelous Martins," "Gibsons That Don't Suck," "Perfectly Playable Plastic Things," and who knows what else. Me, I'd buy a house over a giant pit. It would have trap-door floors to make cleaning easier. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rick Fielding Date: 16 Feb 03 - 10:41 AM Leaving out the strangest stuff..... Wouldn't most people love to have a Tree to climb whenever you wanted to,...their own TRAIN....a recording studio en suite..... everything but Liz Taylor and Liza's new hubby showing up for dinner??!! Rick Pan |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: gnu Date: 15 Feb 03 - 05:44 PM I haven't read this thread. I wanted to see the show for myself first. I watched the MJ interviews this afternoon. I have the same take on this as I had when the "scandal" about him fucking young boys broke out. If MJ wanted to fuck young boys, he would have spent some of his over a billion dollars to go do it discreetly. Perhaps he is childish, even childlike, but I cannot believe he is stupid. And to make the jump to perverted is, to me, perverted. Only people who want to believe that he is a pervert will see him as a pervert. Overall, I must admit that his fantasy lifestyle is a bit outside what I would do if I had that kind of money, but, then again, I don't have that kind of money. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: fat B****rd Date: 15 Feb 03 - 04:16 PM A lot of people put up with MJ's eccentricities etc until the Jotdy Chandler situation. After that the whole question of child molestation has hung over him like the proverbial sword. Last week a couple of lads , The Baldy Brothers on Century Radio UK North East, raised the question of Chandler's parents and the huge pay off. I don't know if Americans are different but as Gary Baldy (yes, I know) pointed out, if anybody harmed or molested in any way the child(ren) of normal people in this country NO amount of money would compensate and the suspected molester would be on the recieving end of great violence. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: wysiwyg Date: 15 Feb 03 - 03:11 PM Now that we have seen the rise and fall of so many superstars, it's easy (from our view) to see the sickness the Jackson entourage enables and exploits.... from inside Neverland, all that seems to sick and perverse to us seems (by now) totally normal. Can't go on forever, eh? ~Susan |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: GUEST Date: 15 Feb 03 - 02:39 PM Well Rick I've already given most of my thoughts in previous posts to this thread. In biref, I thought more of Michael Jackson than I thought I would and ended up with a strong dislike of Martin Bashir. If you are meaning "do I think he's dangerous?" I can't KNOW any more than anyone else here. Michael Jackson's life is strange but the overall impression I got was that he is genuine in his "Peter Pan world" and has no sinister motive in his relationship with children. Jon |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rick Fielding Date: 15 Feb 03 - 11:32 AM You're absolutely right Roger, about "using the same language that dangerous people use..." Unfortunately I couldn't see between the lines enough to exonerate the guy in that area....I'm just not sure. BUT....the way he talked about his obvious cosmetic surgery (he says he's done absolutely "NOTHING", just a couple of things with the nose to "help him breathe better and hit high notes(!!) Awww shit. I simply don't know WHAT I think.....BUT....Bashir set him up again and again. That's a fact. AND..I was criticizing him (with my usual "jokey" approach) when I hadn't seen the film. So Jon, what DID ya think? Rick |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: The Shambles Date: 15 Feb 03 - 12:43 AM Look, yes, he's seriously weird, but I didn't get the feeling that he was dangerous (to kids or anyone). The whole "Peter Pan Child thing" IS legit...it really IS how he sees himself,- From just watching the show, I don't get the feeling that he is dangerous either, but he was using the same langauge that dangerous people use. And these people would also have you believe that they were not dangerous and they come across as very plausable too. This idea that they, (the adult) are subject to the wishes of the children is interesting. In MJ's case this was that it was the children who wished to sleep in his bed, in other cases many serious abuses are justisfied by the perpetrator in exactly the same way..... I am not in any way defending this industry or the damage that is caused by producing the images, but in the current climate where thoudsands of people are being charged for simply looking at these images of children on the net, many of those charged also being famous, we have to ask if our feeelings here and the actions of authorities are right..? Is it a double standard? |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: GUEST Date: 14 Feb 03 - 11:00 PM Glad you got to watch it Rick. I've never been a MJ fan (though I did like Billy Jean), had read about some of his strangeness and when Pip said to me "this is on the tv", I couldn't resist watching a little of it to see how obnoxious he really was... My reaction to the program was one I never could have predicted. Jon |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rick Fielding Date: 14 Feb 03 - 10:29 PM Lordy Lordy Lordy, did I go off half-cocked!! I shot my mouth off without seeing the documentary.....but now I HAVE seen it. Bashir set him up big time over the whole film. Michael is not a huge intellect, and I think he got raked unfairly about a number of things. Look, yes, he's seriously weird, but I didn't get the feeling that he was dangerous (to kids or anyone). The whole "Peter Pan Child thing" IS legit...it really IS how he sees himself, and I really think he DOESN'T understand that he's had all the plastic surgery.....but I also got a picture of a very disturbed, but kind creature, and I shouldn't have been giving opinions til I'd at least seen the damn film. Cheers Rick |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Bagpuss Date: 11 Feb 03 - 10:41 AM The main thing that disturbed me was that Jackson seemed to be suffering under the delusion that as long as he didn't let his children suffer in the way he suffered, then they couldn't come to any harm. Thus in his mind, as long as their faces were covered and they couldn't therefore be recognised, then he was doing fine. Even if he dangles a baby over a balcony to show to his adoring fans, or exposes his other children to a media scrum in which they were almost trampled underfoot. |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rick Fielding Date: 11 Feb 03 - 10:34 AM Oi vay! |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: fox4zero Date: 11 Feb 03 - 01:20 AM Rick I can understand sleeping with the cats, but sleeping with heather.... It isn't a native CT plant. Where do you pick it? In the "old Borsht-Belt days", the only one that slept with cats was Mrs. Katz! Larry |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: *daylia* Date: 10 Feb 03 - 10:26 AM Rustic I was responding to 'GUESTsomeonewhowon'tleavetheiraddy'. I thought s/he was referring to the silly picture of Michael with boobs that I posted above. My mistake? Always liked Michael Jackson - he's a creative phenomena. And a lot of the world's greatest artists were more than just a little 'unique'. (Sounds better than 'strange'). And that makes them 'bait' for the mud-slingers and the money-hungry instigators of civil suits. IMO anyway. daylia |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rustic Rebel Date: 09 Feb 03 - 11:25 PM Rosebrook- No offense intended to lesbians. I was using those examples based on the names MJ is called, for letting boys sleep in his bed. I suppose I could have used the term paedophile also. I was making a point. Just because he has slept with children, it does not prove he is, what he has been labeled. Taliesn- Guess what- there are many children raised by 'women for hire'. Call them babysitters, call them day care, call them nannies. What ever you call them those three Jackson kids aren't the only ones. Daylia- No need for cut and splice if you were referring to my posts, I can handle it! Peace, Rustic |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: jimlad Date: 09 Feb 03 - 10:49 AM Well said Shambles |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: *daylia* Date: 08 Feb 03 - 05:16 PM Cut'n splice maybe? ;-) daylia |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: GUEST,asabove@hotmail.com Date: 08 Feb 03 - 05:16 PM ie - she would be a pervert to sleep with someone in her family or underage and does the fact that she sleeps with another female cuddling etc. make her a lesbian! |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: GUEST,someonewhowontleavetheiraddy@hotmail.com Date: 08 Feb 03 - 05:11 PM Call me stupid but I thought that bit was easy - she's a woman dope head! |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: The Shambles Date: 08 Feb 03 - 05:06 PM I think the interviewer was trying very hard not to make his subject a cause for concern. It was also pretty obvious that his subject was a cause for concern who was not able to relate to others, his own children or the real world at all. The excuse is made that with his background and childhood, this is not surprising. No it is not surprising but those who make this excuse feed the dangerous idea that this has created a special human being, to whom special rules apply. I saw Elizabeth Taylor introduce him on his recorded 30th anniversary show which was also screened this week, as the next best thing to the Messiah. He is talented but this talent does not overide or excuse his basic shortcomings and the problems that less talented people do not exhibit. He is rich but this should not be able to blind those who do get close, to the care and guidance he should be receiving fom them. Rather than their unquestioning adulation added to that which fanatical strangers need to show and which Michael Jackson is so used to feeding off, like some vampire or junkie. He plainly thinks he is Peter Pan and will live forever, and this is generally seen as mildly amusing and not a barrier to raising his own children. Who he abuses, as plainly as his father abused him in exactly the same way (less the belt - so far). The masks? With other visiting children he plainly becomes one of them but does not see that they do see him as a child like them or that this pretence is an abdication of responsibilty that aldulthood places upon all adults. An identical individual behaving like this, less the wealth and private fairground, would be viewed with much suspicion by these same children and with even more by their parents. When it came to the 'cured' child, the hand holding and the adoring head on Michaels shoulder, the interviewer was still trying not to be concerned. He was forced to become concerned when the children were placed at real risk during the tour of Germany, which Michael seemed to see as a triumphant palm waving entrance to Jerusalem. Where every concern seemed to be secondary to obtaining a fix of adulation. The most revealing aspect of the bed sharing was that Michael Jackson, even after his wealth and his lawyers had previously saved him, was totally unaware of the implications or of the dangerous position he was openly placing himself it. At the end, I had the impression that the interviewer was like an angler who had caught so many big fish, with so little effort, he was embarrassingly trying to push them back in the water Michael needs help, I doubt if he will get it. I trust that his children will...... |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: Rosebrook Date: 08 Feb 03 - 04:34 PM From Rustic Rebel: (quote) (referring to her neice)"She is now fourteen years old and she still wants to sleep with me when she visits. We cuddle and talk and and talk and talk...(kid won't shut-up and go to sleep!) But does that make me a pervert or a lesbian? No way." I take umbrage at the use of the word "lesbian" as thrown into this scenario. It suggests the lesbian-baiting stereotype of women "recruiting" younger females "into the lifestyle". Or it is used interchangeably with the word "pervert". What was the intention behind the use of this word here? Rose |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: *daylia* Date: 08 Feb 03 - 01:42 PM Psssssssst .... wanna see just how nurturing Michael Jackson can be? click here :-) daylia |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: GUEST Date: 07 Feb 03 - 08:56 PM |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: GUEST,Jeep Man Date: 07 Feb 03 - 08:26 PM I saw the first half and my stomach became upset so I turned to Animal Planet. Much more credible. Thing about Michael Jackson is -Why Do We Give A Damn? Jim |
Subject: RE: BS: Michael Jackson-UK TV interview From: GUEST,Taliesn Date: 07 Feb 03 - 03:55 PM From Rustic Rebel: (quote) "Oh please. He said there were plenty of women around and himself to take care of the kids." Oh, puh-lease your own self. Yeah plenty of women "for hire" surrounding them , but not a one that has that "connection" and the day will come when they will question their Wacko sperm-doner of a father about whomtheir motrher is/was. One can only imagine telling them some fantasy story of how they miraculously came as a gift to him and then show them the "Non-disclosure Contract". I guess Rustic subscribes to the "It takes a *hired* village to raise a child pychology ". Hiring & firing of surogate mums should prove interesting. Yeah, then add in the wealth-fed "bubbleland" and the constant wearing of masks in public and you're really got the makings of some maladjusted lives mishapen by the wealth-fed self-indulgences and fantasies of a disturbed Peter Pan-manbo fixated upon his own image. Ferdinand Marcos comes to mind. Yeah I guess money "does" buy everything...including credability as a parent. This is just the type of wealth-prey that the Raelians prey upon promising a perect clone so you can life forever. Give me an 'f-ing" break. |