PBS: Off the Charts documentary

Subject: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Kim C
Date: 12 Feb 03 - 04:39 PM

Has anyone seen this documentary on PBS lately? It's about people who send in poems and lyrics to have them made into songs. There's probably something on the PBS website, but there's a good story right here:

Hartford Advocate

It was a well-made documentary, but I found it pretty sad. These are the people who bring the movie Ishtar to life.

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Ebbie
Date: 12 Feb 03 - 06:08 PM

I saw it too. I went the gamut of emotions from pity to disgust to a certain grudging admiration.

Like everyone else, I've seen those "Songs Wanted, Royalties Paid" ads in the back of magazines. It hadn't occurred to me that anyone actually submitted something to them. Or if it had, I know I never realized that there is someone in a studio somewhere who does a full production of any bit of lyrics they receive. Frankly I was astonished. It also astonished me that people actually write things so excruciatingly bad, but the part I admired them for was the pleasure they took in hearing the recording made of their 'song'. The dreams - I just hope they never wake up.


It struck me that those in the studio were in the same boat as those who sent in their painstakingly crafted songs- they too had had their dreams. Surely it had never occurred to them they would end up as they have.

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Kim C
Date: 12 Feb 03 - 07:14 PM

The thing that struck me most was the man and his son who sang at the teeny festival. They were so awful. And he was talking to his wife on the phone, saying, people were coming and talking to us and telling us we did a great job.

And I thought........ do people tell me that just to be nice? Probably some of them do. It's the way people are.

The little old man in Tennessee, I thought wasn't such a bad writer.

I used to sing in a trio with a friend of mine, and we shared so many writers nights with people not unlike those in this program. If I never do another writers night again, unless it's with people I know, I'll be happy.

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 12 Feb 03 - 09:51 PM

I saw most of it last night. Can you imagine having a collection of all those albums like that one guy did? And he loved them.
Some of those lyrics were crazy! Like my guru bicycle (or something like that),and how about the one called "The Thing". There was some good humor to this program, I forgot the names of the people singing but one guy sang a song that was awful and so bizarre it was funny as hell. Later in the program he said it was his worst.
Who would have thought people actually make a living doing this? All in all I thought it was a very entertaining show.
Peace. Rustic

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Bobert
Date: 12 Feb 03 - 10:12 PM

No, I haven't seen the documentary but I've been writing songs for over 30 years now and hooked up with a childhood friend who writes at such a hih level that her lyrics blow me away. I put a dozen or so of her first songs to music and, well, they are darned good. She saves up and goes to Nashville two ot three times a year and has done all the right stuff and talked to all the right people and so is sooooo so good but to date... not one song sold. Hmmmmm? This thing is like a lottery.

It's just like musicans. There is so much talent out there that it does come down to breaks, luck and forces beyond ones control.

Point in fact: Anyone ever hear of Austin Cunningham? Didn't think so. He wrote Martina McBride's "From the Ashes" and does the song ten times better than she... but like who knows his name? Nobody. Point is that he's at least as good as Martina but no one will ever hear him. Except me and a few of my friends since he played my house one night....

Bobert

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 12 Feb 03 - 10:33 PM

I have magazines from the 1910s-1920s advertizing these song publishing services. I wonder if some of these printings being laughed at contain material useful to folk song collectors.

The printers who will publish your book if you pay have a long history, probably going back to the beginning of mass printing. The printer would promise royalties on copies sold, but of course none was ever sold. The author would end up with a few boxes full of his books and short of a piece of his savings.
Another ploy was, for a fee, to place your brief biography and photo in the back of state or provincial history books that were peddled door-to-door; a compendium of "Notable Citizens of Our Great State." I have histories of this sort from 1890-1920 from my state and the province where I now live. These books have become important to researchers and historians and some command a pretty good price.

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Art Thieme
Date: 12 Feb 03 - 11:10 PM

Didn't see it. From what you are saying it sounds like a politically correct answer to the Chuck Bareass show of a few decades ago called THE GONG SHOW-------People being allowed to humiliate themselves in public for TV ratings. Is that at all accurate or fair of me to say?

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Alice
Date: 12 Feb 03 - 11:24 PM

I saw it last night. Pitiful, cringingly painful. I felt sorry mostly for the excellent professional studio musicians whose careers had become a daily routine of recording those things. At the end of the show PBS invited people to send their "song poems" to the web site.
www.pbs.org

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Alice
Date: 12 Feb 03 - 11:29 PM

You can see more about "Off the Charts, The Song Poem Story" and enter the song poem contest at http://www.pbs.org/independentlens/offthecharts/

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Ebbie
Date: 13 Feb 03 - 03:09 AM

Frankly, I almost couldn't bear to watch Forney- I heard his song, 'Chicken Insurrection' that he sang for the 'festival'- I wonder- had he and his nephew even practiced? He began alone, and his nephew played catchup all the way, then he stopped at an indeterminate point. Even the audience didn't seem to know he had finished.

These songs given on the show were WAY different from the run of the mill mediocre song. (I got plenty of those) These were so bad that any normal studio would pitch them after reading not more than three words.

On the other hand, somehow this particular studio is evidently filling a need. The writers, it appears, do not feel condescended to, because the studio singers record the songs straight- there's no guffawing or snickering or over the top instrumental whine on the recording. They appear to treat the songs respectfully and the people who sent them in apparently love the treatment they get back. So there does not seem to be any humiliation. (Probably there are people who are NOT happy with the arrangement/tune/treatment- but the show didn't feature any of them.)

Wonder, however, what the writers' friends and families think of the masterpieces? Surely somewhere along the way, someone is honest about it?

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Kim C
Date: 13 Feb 03 - 10:31 AM

I dunno Art.... it was an independent film, and sometimes those get a little wacky. The people on it were honest about what they were doing, and no judgments were passed. That was left up to the viewer. So I don't particularly think it was a sensational thing to get ratings. I could be wrong, though.

It was interesting to see the process, from the poem to the musicians, and then to hear the outcome.

Bobert, your friends just need to put out their own recordings. It's easier and cheaper now than it ever has been, and I believe it's the only way to go for an independent artist.

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Mudlark
Date: 13 Feb 03 - 01:10 PM

Like the best of Indie films this program was quirky, weird and compelling. True, there's no denying the original material was simply, for the most part, without redemption. But it was written by people compelled, driven to get it out there, with enough guts to take responsibility for it. (Of course, having zero judgement helps.)

And I was fascinated by the workmanlike way the studio musicians handled their day job...and the incredible speed with which they turned this dreck, read cold, into bad, but at least recognizable, music. It seemed there was an inherent respect for the writer, if not for the writing.

I found it more interesting that a lot of what is on PBS any more.

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: M.Ted
Date: 13 Feb 03 - 03:07 PM

I am a big fan of this kind of music--and am looking forward to the documentary(none of the PBS stations in my area have shown it)--the acknowleged master of this sort of music was the late Rod Keith--it is truly an experience to listen to this kind of stuff, because there is something wonderful and breathtaking about anything that goes way over the edge--

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Feb 03 - 08:17 AM

What a depressing place Nashville is, musically. I was in a bar listening to an unknown country band who was playing songs as good as anything on the country music charts today. The guitarist is playing rings around anything I'll ever be able to do in a thousand years. You could tell he was working on developing his chops - not trying to play something contextually related to the song. He must've been one of those guys written about in that song "Nashville Cats."

Anyway, at the end of their 45 minute set, the band passed around the jar to the thirty of us that were in there on an early Monday night, garnering perhaps $25 to be split among four people.

Subject: RE: PBS: Off the Charts documentary
From: Kim C
Date: 14 Feb 03 - 10:49 AM

Sure, tell me about Nashville. I've lived here nearly all my life. I have friends in the music business and personally, I want to stay as far away from it as I can! I may never get rich doing it on my own, but at least I'll be able to write what I want and wear what I want.

There are lots of really good musicians in Nashville. So many of them, in fact, that there just aren't enough juicy gigs to go around. Although - there are some who manage to make a reasonably comfortable living.