Tech: Good, cheap omni-directional mike

Subject: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: wilco
Date: 26 Feb 03 - 02:47 PM

I need to buy a mic for our group of four to seven to use. What is your recvommendation for an omni-directional mike that will pick everyone up. Individuals can step-up to the mic for their breaks. We use a 30 AMP Crate portable amp.

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: Cluin
Date: 26 Feb 03 - 02:49 PM

A Mister Microphone?

"Hey good-lookin', We'll be back to pick you up later!"

Seriously, how cheap do you want to go?
You probably want a condenser type of mic.

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: NicoleC
Date: 26 Feb 03 - 03:56 PM

If it's for live use, don't go omni-directional. Unless you like feedback and miking the audience, that is.

What's your budget?

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: wilco
Date: 26 Feb 03 - 04:47 PM

Budget $250.00

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 26 Feb 03 - 05:48 PM

You didn't mention whether or not you have a mic stand or if you needed vocals, but for $250 this is what I would do:

1. Do not get an omni for the very reasons that Nicole mentions. With a small amp behind you, you're sure to get feedback from an omni.

2. Get a Shure 58 for the vocals (around $99 with discount) and a Shure 57 for the instruments (around $77 with discount). Also pick up a stand adapter which clamps to the side of the mic stand and mounts the second mic at waist height (around $15). Remember to add in the cost of mic cables ($10 for 25 footers). You may want a small 6" gooseneck to top off your mic stand, for the vocal mic (or use a small boom). The Crate 30 has two inputs, but I can't remember if both inputs are XLR or not. If not, get an XLR(F) to a 1/4"(M) adapter for the second input ($10).

3. Remember that, in any case, you will need to stand behind the amp or again have feedback problems. (Put it on a low stand in front or just to the side of you, but in front of the mics). When you step up for your cut, you will have a vocal at mouth height with an instrument mic at the waist.

And you'll be under your $250 limit.

If you are really on a budget, get a mic stand top adapter for 2-3 mics, then get two Radio Shack 3001s (about $35 on sale) and mount them in a 45 degree arc, again behind the amp. These are actually very good mics (made by Shure) and come with a 15 foot XLR to 1/4 adapter cord which will go directly into any of the inputs on your amp.

But if your group is any good, and you're not playing cowboy bar mitzvahs, you're going to have to think about geting a better sound system than this. Good luck!

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: NicoleC
Date: 26 Feb 03 - 05:56 PM

No mic is going to really pick everyone up in a live situation that isn't going to be a headache to control, except a hemispherical PZM, which needs a flat, acoustically reflective surface and isn't going to sound great but will pick up a wide area more or less evenly. It won't be useful for highlighting breaks, though.

That having been said, you may be happy with the way a single mic picks up a bit on the fringes and highlights your breaks.

Vocals and vocal range instruments, like guitars, mandos, fiddles, etc? AKG C-3000 (used or *really* on sale, new is $300-ish), or the C-2000 comes in a bit cheaper in the $200-ish range. Remember, you need phantom power for a condensor mic.

There are numerous inexpensive dynamic mics in the $100 range that may work for you just fine. Before buying a more expensive mic, I'd see if I could borrow someone's SM58 (or similar) and a pair of ears in the audience and see how well it works for you. Or if your amp supports it, buy two and you'll cover more area on stage and have two mics available for breaks.

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: GUEST,Al
Date: 27 Feb 03 - 12:58 AM

Audio Technica 4033. But, it is cardioid, not omni. You don't want omni. Why would you want it to pick up the audience? You will have difficulty using monitor speakers due to feedback. But if not using monitors, you'll be ok. I like dynamics better for stage use. Been there, done both. Al

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: BTMP
Date: 27 Feb 03 - 12:54 PM

I agree with Nicole - the AKG C3000 is a good mic. We have a Bluegrass band and use only the AKG, and no monitors - it works great, a very warm sound. If you really want omni, I have the Oktava MC012 which comes with 3 heads: directional, super cardioid, and omni. We used the Oktava before we got the AKG. The neat thing about the omni head was for practice - we all grouped around the mic with headphones! The Oktava will run you about $250 via MusiciansFriend.com.

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: Cluin
Date: 27 Feb 03 - 02:24 PM

Didn't Radio Shack turn out a fairly good piezo for a pretty low price?

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: TIA
Date: 27 Feb 03 - 02:34 PM

Okay - everyone, don't laugh (allright go ahead and laugh 'cause the audience will). Here's the dirt cheap version: a Radio Shack electret (omni-directional, surprisingly good mic for ~$25 US), packed with cotton batting (~ $0.50 US) in a kitchen funnel (~$2.00). This setup was invented in an emergency for recording bird sounds in Costa Rica, but it worked darn well in a subsequent musical emergency.

Subject: RE: Good, cheap omni-directional mike
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 27 Feb 03 - 05:52 PM

Nicole, I don't think the Crate amps deliver phantom power, and the condensers deliver more than the amp can reproduce. And the PZMs (I use the Crown PCC 160s and 170s) really load up with more than a couple of musicians playing at one time, and there's no cut in the mix. The idea of the two Shures on two stands is OK, but they've got to get the amp out front. (Two mic stands make the amp placement critical, where as one stand-two mics provides less chance for the big F.

Lets combine the ideas and suggest that they take the amp to a Radio Shack and try both the 3001s and or the electret on the actual amp... My bet, with the bother of batteries on the electret, the feedback potential of a cotten stuffed omni (live ain't recording birds) and the ready-to-go cords of the 3001s into the amp on both channels, they'll go with the 3001s and not the battery powered electret.

Going with an expensive mike into a 30 watt guitar amp is like eating a good steak through a strainer (IMO).