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BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops

Beccy 19 Mar 03 - 10:46 AM
GUEST 19 Mar 03 - 11:24 AM
artbrooks 19 Mar 03 - 12:12 PM
Beccy 19 Mar 03 - 12:17 PM
Gareth 19 Mar 03 - 12:21 PM
Beccy 19 Mar 03 - 12:26 PM
mg 19 Mar 03 - 12:32 PM
Beccy 19 Mar 03 - 01:08 PM
*daylia* 19 Mar 03 - 01:42 PM
GUEST 19 Mar 03 - 02:12 PM
Beccy 19 Mar 03 - 02:18 PM
boglion 19 Mar 03 - 05:42 PM
toadfrog 19 Mar 03 - 06:06 PM
Beccy 19 Mar 03 - 06:13 PM
JedMarum 19 Mar 03 - 06:22 PM
Beccy 19 Mar 03 - 06:25 PM
Bobert 19 Mar 03 - 06:51 PM
InOBU 19 Mar 03 - 07:46 PM
michaelr 19 Mar 03 - 08:22 PM
Joe Offer 19 Mar 03 - 08:40 PM
robomatic 19 Mar 03 - 09:00 PM
Neighmond 19 Mar 03 - 09:07 PM
Lepus Rex 19 Mar 03 - 09:12 PM
Troll 19 Mar 03 - 10:33 PM
toadfrog 19 Mar 03 - 11:42 PM
InOBU 20 Mar 03 - 12:11 AM
DougR 20 Mar 03 - 12:55 AM
Joe Offer 20 Mar 03 - 02:23 AM
JudyR 20 Mar 03 - 02:24 AM
JudyR 20 Mar 03 - 02:48 AM
stevetheORC 20 Mar 03 - 03:10 AM
Lepus Rex 20 Mar 03 - 09:34 AM
Bagpuss 20 Mar 03 - 09:51 AM
Beccy 20 Mar 03 - 10:11 AM
InOBU 20 Mar 03 - 10:21 AM
GUEST,on the fence 20 Mar 03 - 10:23 AM
Beccy 20 Mar 03 - 10:32 AM
katlaughing 20 Mar 03 - 10:42 AM
Beccy 20 Mar 03 - 10:49 AM
Beccy 20 Mar 03 - 10:52 AM
Ireland 20 Mar 03 - 10:56 AM
katlaughing 20 Mar 03 - 11:00 AM
Beccy 20 Mar 03 - 11:13 AM
Ireland 20 Mar 03 - 11:26 AM
InOBU 20 Mar 03 - 11:46 AM
InOBU 20 Mar 03 - 11:47 AM
Beccy 20 Mar 03 - 01:27 PM
Don Firth 20 Mar 03 - 01:45 PM
Beccy 20 Mar 03 - 02:19 PM
JudyR 20 Mar 03 - 03:00 PM

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Subject: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 10:46 AM

Boy oh boy... I know I'll be laying myself open on this one, but I'd like to know if anyone plans on taking part in counter demonstrations to show support for the action in Iraq and/or support for the troops.

I'd be interested if there are any in Western New York (AKA NotHillaryLand...) :-)

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 11:24 AM

Yes -


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: artbrooks
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 12:12 PM

Beccy, the problem I've seen so far is that the demonstrations in my area (Albuquerque) are either "support the troops/we love Bush/if you don't doboth you are a Saddam-loving traitor" or "oppose the war/we hate Bush/legalize marijuana/anyone in the military is a war-loving murderer". I'd love to see, and would join, a demonstration for "oppose the war/support the troops/we love our country". Otherwise, I will stay home and object in my own quiet way.


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 12:17 PM

I'd do a support the troops, support the war, legalize marijuana, we love our country demonstration... But I don't suppose you'd be interested in that one :-)

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Gareth
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 12:21 PM

Count me in. - Some of us have principles.

Gareth


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 12:26 PM

Are any of you from Western New York? Can we organize something? Or shall we all seek out demos in our area and take part?

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: mg
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 12:32 PM

it should not be called a counter demonstration. People have always assembled on behalf of those going over. mg


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 01:08 PM

Semantics, mg... but you're right. I guess I meant to say counter demonstration in reference to those situations where the gathering would be juxtaposed against those protesting the war.


Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: *daylia*
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 01:42 PM

Beccy, I know we don't agree on this, but imo the best way to support your troops would be to

1. Stop brainwashing them.

2. Stop attempting to legitimize their role as illegal, dehumanized
    high-tech mercenaries at the beck and call of the mighty Western               
    imperialists. That ongoing farce makes the US the laughingstock of   
    the rest of the (thinking) world.

3. Bring them home.

4. Use them to clean up the deplorable political, social and   
    environmental conditions now existing in your own country.

I'm not trying to 'flame' you, just to present what I see as the unfortunate facts of the matter. I wish only the best for your family members stationed in Iraq, and all other victims of your government's propoganda machine.

daylia


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 02:12 PM

daylia - I don't see us as victims. Very proactive about resolving some of the world's problems. As far as your comments on US troops - Bugger off - Fuck off - whatever language works - stupid, just stupid, you and your ilk.


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 02:18 PM

daylia- I didn't comment about how misguided I thought the other protests were... I wish you'd extend the same respect to me.

You say you don't wish to flame me, but then you insult my country and my family members currently serving in the military (of whom I have two) and my friends serving (of whom I also have 2 stationed in the Gulf region.) That's like saying, "I don't want to hurt you" while throwing a sucker punch to my jaw. It doesn't compute. Please take your rant about the U.S. Military to another thread.

Thank you,

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: boglion
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 05:42 PM

Good luck to all the troops over there on both sides. No-one has yet admitted to a plausible cause of Gulf War Syndrome. The US Gulf War Veterans site reckon there are 207,000 US victims. If we are really running this again without a full understanding of what went wrong last time - God help them all!

Terry


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: toadfrog
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 06:06 PM

Ms. Beccy:
1. It is not an insult to MY country to say that its leaders' policies are wrong.
2. It is not an insult to servic epeople to say that they are being made to serve a wrong-headed cause. It is not even an insult to the U.S. military to say they are being misused. What you are saying, essentially, is that if any United States President attacks a foreign power, without a declaration of war as the Constitution requires, everyone must agree that he is right or else they are untrue to their country. Think about that. If that is so, any President can become a dictator just by starting more wars. Fascists did things like that.   Up to the time of World War I, or maybe even World War II, every declared war the U.S. was in had really lively domestic opposition. The Korean and Vietnam wars had lively domestic opponents. That's why we call the United States a democracy. And if you do not like the United States, Beccy, perhaps you should go back to Russia or China, or wherever it is you come from.
3. Have you ever contributed to a musical thread? Even once? Why are you here, anyway?


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 06:13 PM

Toad- apparently you don't read EVERYTHING on this forum or you would know for a fact that I have contributed to several musical threads. I am more on the mid-level area of musical ability and therefore use the musical threads to answer more of my own questions than educate others.

You are an obnoxious ass and if your goal was to irritate me consider it a job well done.

I started this thread for a specific purpose and when daylia said, "2. Stop attempting to legitimize their role as illegal, dehumanized
    high-tech mercenaries at the beck and call of the mighty Western               
    imperialists. That ongoing farce makes the US the laughingstock of   
    the rest of the (thinking) world." that insulted my country and my family members who serve.

Donc, take your self-righteous blithering elsewhere, please.

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: JedMarum
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 06:22 PM

How far west NY - would tha inlcude maybe, Dallas???


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 06:25 PM

Well, Jed... if you take the global village comment from one of the other threads, I guess so. :-)

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 06:51 PM

While it is no secret that I strongly oppose a foriegn policy that showcases military solutions over diplomatci ones, as a God loving and follower of Jesus Christ, my prayers are for the safety of all people whose lives are threatened by this war.

It is a shame that so mnay people are in harms way relative the very small number of people who are at the center of the conflict.

Fundamentalists rationalize this war by saying that God controls everything. Not my God, thank you. He, tonight, is looking upon these events with sorrowfull eyes but knowing He's got a lot of difficult work to do here.

But, yes, these service people have been and will continue to be very much in my thoughts and prayers. Same for the Iraqis.

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: InOBU
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 07:46 PM

Dear Beccy:
We who are life long peace activists, in the case of we Quakres, back to the 1620s or so, we have always warmly welcomed back the troups, when the government forgets them. Every day I stop and talk to Bobby, a silver star winner from the Viet Nam war, who is homeless and lives on my doorstep, as he knows most in the neighborhood call the cops to move him on. In every war, we are blamed for the treatment of the vets, while those who send them are the ones who deny them treatment, jobs and housig.
I salute your concern. Where and when you will be needed the most is when large numbers of vets join Bobby on the street. Every war since Viet Nam, presidents have promiced to take care of the vets, and say that unlike the Viet Nam vets, these vets wont be spit upon, then that same government spits them out onto our streets. Mr. Bush's father's war saw homeless vets on the streets of New York within six months. So, out there in the north west of our state, keep in touch. Every Christmas we Quakers pass thermal underwear out to folks living on the street, most of them are vets. So, keep in touch and lets work for the vets when they need it the most, when they return sad, lonely, and forgoten by the government that sent them.
I don't see why this war will be different that any other.
One more thought. Go and spend time visiting local pennitenturies, we do. Most of the inmates you will meet there are forgoten vets.
Your fellow citizen
Larry


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: michaelr
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 08:22 PM

I'm gonna stick my neck way out here and say this:

I don't want anyone to get maimed or killed, whether US or Iraqui citizens. (Or anyone else.)

But I do believe this "war" is morally wrong, evil, and indefensible.
Therefore I believe that those who wage this war are criminally wrong. That includes the grunts pulling the triggers as well as their leaders.

I support our troops as far as wanting them to come home unharmed. But I cannot support the activity they're engaged in.

It's a volunteer army. Nobody is forced to join up and go violate the commandment "thou shalt not kill". The soldiers have made a choice, and I cannot support that choice.

And no, I'm not going to spit on them when they return. But I believe that any member of the armed forces has a moral obligation to lay down their weapons and say "No, I am not going along with this. I will not let myself be used by an illegitimate administration to perform an illegal attack which will harm innocent people."

The attitude that "you may be against the war but now that the troops are there you have to support them" does not fly with me. In fact, it's another example of the pseudo-patriotic jingoism designed to silence the dissent this country was founded on.

Okay, now drop your daisycutters on me...

Cheers,
Michael


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 08:40 PM

Hi, Beccy - If you want to suppport George Bush, that's your right. If you do it around here, you're going to find a lot of people who disagree with you. Most of them will do it politely, but you can expect their opposition to be strong.
That's life.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: robomatic
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 09:00 PM

For the most part I've enjoyed my excursions in these BS waters. In Anchorage we have a large service presence and a lot of support for the service. I believe the overall consensus is pro-get Saddam out of there.

To me it's a no-brainer. Even the anti-American action concedes that Saddam is scum. Stalin is his role model. He has proven he's resistant to inspection, and he is a clear and present danger to the United States due to his wealth, his ability to finance another nuclear program if he so wishes, and the same with mass production of toxins.

It is no question a follow-on to 9/11, and probably not the last one.

I have been hearing there is a rally in downtown Anchorage on behalf of current policy on Saturday and I expect to be there.

(I will still listen to the Dixie Chicks, and I will still talk to my combative friends in the Mudcat BS lists and my friends and relatives who may somehow be so wrongheaded as to disagree with me).


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Neighmond
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 09:07 PM

Bobert,

I wish more people knew your God. This world would be a better place.

Chaz


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 09:12 PM

Fuck the troops. If they're stupid/evil enough to choose killing as their profession, maybe they shouldn't get the chance to breed. Besides, a few thousand US-soldier-kebabs roasting in the Iraqi desert might help to cure "us" of "our" imperialist disease.

---Lepus Rex

Brought to you as part of our ongoing effort to make Lepus the most beloved Mudcat member, ever. Thanks! ---The Lepus Rex is One Loveable Motherfucker Society of the Upper Midwest


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Troll
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 10:33 PM

Tell us daylia, what perfect planet do you live on that you feel you can instruct us in the way we should run our country?
Lepus, your attitude toward our troops is not nice. Do you feel the same way about those men and women who gave their lives in WWII so that you could have the right to spout your asinine drivel? I have known a few men who enjoyed killing but the vast majority of those who chose the military as a profession do so out of a sense of duty to their country. No one who has seen combat wants to see it again unless he's a nut-case and most soldiers would prefer to never have to fight and kill.
I don't really expect you to understand all this because your usual pattern in the past has been to ignore any point of view but your own. This is probably because you are only capable of dealing with one opinion. Your's.

troll


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: toadfrog
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 11:42 PM

Beccy: Maybe I am an "obnoxious ass." You, on the other hand, have made 341 posts in the forum, of which 14 arguably related to music, including 6 on home schooling children. Basically, you are only interested in the political threads. And aside from disagreeing with your point of view, I object to people who are constantly throwing slogans and invective rather than trying to discuss things rationally.
But attacking people's patriotism when they disagree with you is the cheapest kind of cheap shot. Arguments like that deserve no respect. If you can't live with being told it is a cheap shot, rough.


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: InOBU
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 12:11 AM

Hi Joe:
I, for one, said nothing about Beccy's support of Mr. Bush. I stand by my statement that the vets in real need, are generally looked after by the anti war folks who treat them on the streets and look after them in jail.
All the best
Everyone get home safe and stay safe on both sides
Larry


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: DougR
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 12:55 AM

Toad: spoken like the true gentleman I'm sure you are.

Joe: your admonition to Beccy surprised me a bit. As one of the officials of the Mudcat, I was surprised that part of your responsibilities, evidently, is to inform members that their political beliefs might not always be welcome on the mudcat. Any Mudcatter who posts to political threads can surely pick that up on their on after a few posts I would think. Any poster should expect civility, I would think from fellow Mudcatters, and in my opinion, Toad has gone over the line with Beccy. As I say, IMO.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Joe Offer
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 02:23 AM

Well, Doug, the political discussions get pretty heated around here. Generally, the practice has been "no holds barred." I'm not about to step in unless somebody really crosses the line. It seemed to me that Beccy ought to know that. Considering the political opinion of the majority of people here, she's better figure that she's in enemy territory.
Considering the political opinion of the majority of people in the area where I live, I figure I'm in hostile territory and take appropriate precautions. Since I value my car, I don't express my antiwar opinions on bumper stickers.
So, Doug, do you and Shambles think I don't have the right to say anything around here?

-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: JudyR
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 02:24 AM

The problem is that supporting the troops is not anaethema to the goals of the antiwar peace movement. You can support the troops by wanting them home and out of harm's way as soon as possible. This separation being made by so many Americans that you are either for war and for the troops, or against war and "against" our soldiers, needs to be addressed. It goes to the very heart of his argument that (as many have made on here), being in the peace movement means acting on the highest of democratic principles.

No wonder it gets we antiwar people up in flames!

For those who are antiwar and tired of having the flag coopted from you, there's apparantly a shift in strategy in the peace movement toward aiding and supporting the troops, now that the war is underway.

Here's one paragraph from an e-mail message I received: "As soon as the war begins, the Win Without War coalition, an umbrella group of more than 35 organizations, from the Sierra Club to the NAACP, plans to launch a fund-raising campaign, soliciting contributions for both Iraqi civilians and U.S. veterans. Arguing that the Bush administration is slashing medical benefits for veterans, the group hopes to raise money for families of reservists who have lost their paychecks and veterans returning from Iraq with disabilities."

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-war-antiwar19mar19,1,3694480.story?coll=la%2Dheadlines%2Dnation


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: JudyR
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 02:48 AM

Ah, just want to say -- it feels like such a relief to be in territory where I am not the enemy!

I have frequented another board or two where I am constantly called Commie and Pinko, "you leftie," "you libs," and I waste my breath sometimes just mustering up arguments against the attacks. Currently on one of those boards (a health board with a social forum), we were told by the moderator, a Canadian who is pro-Israel and presumably for war -- to basically "shut up" during war time, no war threads allowed. Except an evangelical Christian started a prayer thread for the troops -- that was allowed! I wanted to post on there about praying for the Iraqi people, too -- the child I read about who has been asking his mother, "Why do the Americans want to come here and hurt us, Mommy? Will the Americans come in my bedroom and kill me?" The kind of psychological scars that never go away.

Right now, like so many of you, I get angry whether or not someone agrees with me -- but I really don't mind preaching to the choir once in awhile.


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: stevetheORC
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 03:10 AM

I dont support this war at all, but hope that the Troops all come home safely with a minimum amount of casulties. There is nothing honrable or patriotic about a Body Bag with some poor squady in it and greaving folks at home. War is dirty, bloody it kills and maims without thought as to what country you are from, make no mistake about that.
Lepus Rex your comments are distastful to say the least. Beccy I wish you well with your support for the boys campaign and hope that all your loved ones come home relitivly untoched by what is going on. Please remember though that there are those who like me object to this war and that we have a right to do so and in our own way we to support our boys. to our friend INOBU what can I say except keep up the good work Bro, to some degree it's the same over here in the UK.

May whatever God you believe in protect you and yours.

Orc


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 09:34 AM

Oh, c'mon, Troll. Are you saying that most of the people in the military aren't stupid? That's usually why they chose the military: they have no other prospects, and they want free training or schooling. Which is cool. I'm all for free education. But agreeing to become an inhuman killing machine to get that makes you either 1.stupid, 2.evil, or 3.misguided. 95%, at least, of all soldiers I've met have been ignorant, brainwashed, conformist fucktards, who throw around phrases like "we gonna get them sand niggers" and "we gonna fuck up them dune coons." Low quality human beings, whose ancestors should have been exterminated after the Civil War. And, yeah, I know, that's not everyone. The remaining 5% are usually nice (misguided) people.

And no, I don't feel the same about WW2 vets. The majority of them were drafted, weren't they? Besides, that was a much different time, and involved a different generation. The young people in the military today were raised in what was to many (yeah, yeah, in part thanks to the efforts of veterans in decades past), a more enlightened time, and should know better. They should be, at most, only half as ignorant as their parents. But they're not. Which is why they shouldn't breed. :)

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Bagpuss
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 09:51 AM

Lepus, I don't know a huge number of people in the military, but those few that I do know were intelligent people. One has a degree and is in the RAF as an air traffic controller. My brother for a long time, also considered joining up - mainly because from a very young age he was fascinated by military aircraft and wanted to be a pilot. He was in the ATC as a kid and then the TA - paras. He has also always loved physical exercise and loved survival exercises. In the end he didn't join up mainly because it would have interfered too much with his hobby - rock climbing. He turned down a scholarship with the RAF because he realised it would tie him to that career and he hadnt completely made up his mind. He is now a firefighter (and has a degree from Oxford.

People join up for different reasons and they are by no means all stupid or ignorant. Knowing some of my brothers friends who did pursue service careers, I don't think he is in a 5% minority either.

Bagpuss


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:11 AM

You pompous bunch of insufferable self-righteous demagogs. I may be in "enemy territory" as Joe so succintly put it, but I assumed that people were still capable of civil discussion without resorting to being close-minded, and demagogic.


As for you, specifically, Toadfrog- I don't see what business it is of yours to which threads I post. You are a jerk of the first degree. If you are so fond of music threads, why don't you stick to them yourself? I couldn't help but notice that the preponderance of threads you post to are BS in nature, which I would venture to say is well in keeping to form. If it wasn't so cute, I'd tell you to kiss my a*s. And you talk about cheap shots? You seem to be pretty good at delivering them yourself... My homeschool thread was to ask advice in teaching music to homeschooled children- How is that NOT a music thread?

You have undoubtedly been posting to the 'Cat longer than I have... That does not make you a Saint nor does it make you superior to me. I assume that this is either your forum to take out your frustrations on anyone with a dissenting point of view or that you're a real-life jerk. Either way, I'm through with you.

I would like to make clear one other point. I NEVER said that Natalie Maines was unpatriotic. I said she was a COWARD for delivering her pronouncement from a stage NOT in the USA. There is a difference and I stick by that. Now- can we PLEASE get this thread back to where it started? If you have a counter-demonstration to talk about, please tell me about it. If you don't, then I humbly ask you just say that you don't like the idea of one and leave it at that.   I do not go onto the "protest in case of attack" threads and spew anger at you. I ask, once again, that you observe the same courtesy in regards to my thread.

Joe- I respect your opinion, but surely you can respect mine as well. I think that it is not too much to ask to start a discussion and ask that people not attack the content of my character for positing an opinion (from a computer in the USA, I might add...) There are PLENTY of other threads that were started for the sole purpose of opposing the action in Iraq. Please, please, please allow me the ability to discuss this calmly without having personal invectives directed at me.

Thank you to those who have expressed support to me either publically on this thread or through PMs.

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: InOBU
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:21 AM

Dear Beccy
"You pompous bunch of insufferable self-righteous demagogs. I may be in "enemy territory" as Joe so succintly put it, but I assumed that people were still capable of civil discussion without resorting to being close-minded, and demagogic.", may not be the best way to get both sides to speak to the issues rather than insult each other. There is alot of that on both sides here, but generally most of the folks are polite and well meaning. Fact is, Mudcat is the public commons for our little community and you have to stand up and put out what is on your mind, and take the good and the bad.
Now, I must say, I find it odd you don't address my invitation. I must say, I find few who call to support the troops are out here caring for the real MIAs in America, here on the streets of our cities, homeless and broken.
If you wish to call for respect for your point of view, which, by the way, I believe you deserve whatever you do, you deserve as part of our little community here, and we should all respect each other, but if you want to really demand more respect than that normal amount we give each other, do the hard work, not the easy public flag waving, do the real work advocating for ex-solidiers used and thrown away by our government.
Cheers, best wishes
Larry


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: GUEST,on the fence
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:23 AM

*lepus rex*

Have you ever discussed your theory of eugenics face to face with a soldier?


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:32 AM

Larry- I respect you, but I am endeavouring to pull this thread back to its original purpose. I'd happily discuss this with you elsewhere.

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: katlaughing
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:42 AM

Thank you, InOBU, for putting it so well. Beccy, long streams of invectives will not make thread conformists of any Mudcatters. Not even being really polite will get any to conform to an original intent of a thread. It has always been this way. The best way to get your thread back on track is to take a deep breath, ignore the nastiness, and keep posting on topic, yourself. (Besides which, all that venom the anger produces can't be good for the little ones you nurture.:-)

I do NOT agree with anything you've posted in this thread and I, too, find it curious that no one has responded to InOBU's call to support forgotten vets.

As an American, born and raised in a family with a long tradition of speaking our minds, I am proud to stand up and say I do not support this president nor the war. I will carry a sign of protest which says, "Support Our Troops...Bring Them Home, NOW."

kat


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:49 AM

kat- hasn't anyone ever gotten to you? Or a bunch of people loaded up on you and sent you over the edge? Surely you have a breaking point, too. I hit mine. Anger is not something to avoid at all times. Sometimes you need to let people know they crossed a line with you. Toad crossed it and others piled on.

Like I said, I'd LOVE to discuss vet's affairs with Larry, but as I have been attacked here because of thread creep, I'm trying to keep us on topic. I'd be happy to PM discuss this or move the idea of veteran's affairs elsewhere. I guess it doesn't matter that I volunteer regularly to help them, I have to shout about it, eh?

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:52 AM

One more thing, Kat... My little ones are not privy to what Mum discusses on the computer. They are blissfully unaware that I have just had an online temper tantrum. Heck- I'm Irish (at least my parents, are...) I'm allowed a temper. Long may technology roll! :=)


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Ireland
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:56 AM

What a disgraceful statement Lupus, I'm an ex soldier, QUB degree, with all perquisite qualifications for entering tertiary level education. Many in my platoon were educated to A level, and yes there were some real dim people but what they lacked in education they made up for in common sense.

Not one fitted the description you gave, that is not to say that there are no such people like that, may I point out you do not have to be wearing a uniform to hold such opinions.

Five years in the Army daily contact with military personnel, according to your figures I would be tripping over people like those you describe. In truth I only experienced four people like that, from another regiment, who were soon put in the proper frame of mind.

Being a bit melodramatic lupus don't you think?


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: katlaughing
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 11:00 AM

Beccy, if you look back at some of my very early posts you will find that I learned the lesson the hard way. My nickname, elsewhere, used to be "Irish" because of my temper. So, I was speaking from experience. Even Joe Offer and I tangled in a major way. Fortunately those types of "wars" are few and far between these days on the Mudcat. It was in the early days of Mudcat becoming more of a community, with more of the not always appreciated BS threads, etc.

(BTW, I was thinking more of the one you carry. I am sorry I said, anything, though. It doesn't seem seemly to talk about it here.)

kat


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 11:13 AM

Thanks for the apology, Kat... I appreciate you thinking of me and me wee bairn. Rest assured that I am a careful Mum. Besides- I've been nursing a couple sick ones this week and it got my blood going in a much needed way :-) There's only so much vomit a gal can look at without needing to vent a little spleen.

Now- my original point was to ask whether anyone knew of demonstrations that show support for the removal of Saddam Hussein from power and/or support for our troops. Does anyone know of any?

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Ireland
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 11:26 AM

Sorry,perquisite should be prerequisite.


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: InOBU
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 11:46 AM

I have heard that in respect to the new Security State regime, those in favor of the war ARE holding counter demonstrations, in small numbers within their homes.
Cheers
Larry


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: InOBU
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 11:47 AM

PS Being Irish myself... we have to keep a sense of humor in the face of this horror. Larry


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 01:27 PM

Alright, Larry... That WAS funny :-) Don't forget, though, that before gathering, everyone must go through a credit check...

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Don Firth
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 01:45 PM

Support the troops? Yes, I think this country should support its troops. And it can start by redressing the grievances of the soldiers who came back from Gulf War I with Gulf War Syndrome, which the government refuses to acknowledge even exists. They served their country, and then got dropped like a pregnant girl friend.

And Bush and his Merry Men are saying, "Encore! Encore!"

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: Beccy
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 02:19 PM

Piling on, Don, you're piling on... What is this, irritate the pregnant lady day? :-)

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: Counter demonstrations to support troops
From: JudyR
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 03:00 PM

Don, I agree. For that matter, just stop cutting the veterans budgets by billions while attempting to pass a tax cut for the wealthy during a war.


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