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Outlaw songs - not in English

CET 19 Mar 03 - 09:27 PM
SINSULL 19 Mar 03 - 09:34 PM
toadfrog 20 Mar 03 - 12:40 AM
mack/misophist 20 Mar 03 - 12:50 AM
masato sakurai 20 Mar 03 - 01:14 AM
Wolfgang 20 Mar 03 - 06:17 AM
GUEST,jfm 20 Mar 03 - 07:41 AM
CET 20 Mar 03 - 10:33 AM
Wolfgang 20 Mar 03 - 10:40 AM
Wolfgang 20 Mar 03 - 10:43 AM
greg stephens 20 Mar 03 - 10:47 AM
George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca 20 Mar 03 - 10:49 AM
Wolfgang 20 Mar 03 - 10:50 AM
Wolfgang 20 Mar 03 - 10:57 AM
John MacKenzie 20 Mar 03 - 11:38 AM
toadfrog 20 Mar 03 - 02:17 PM
toadfrog 20 Mar 03 - 02:24 PM
CET 20 Mar 03 - 02:30 PM
Anglo 20 Mar 03 - 10:27 PM
GUEST,JTT 21 Mar 03 - 08:08 AM
Allan C. 21 Mar 03 - 08:17 AM
CET 21 Mar 03 - 11:35 AM
toadfrog 21 Mar 03 - 02:07 PM
CET 21 Mar 03 - 05:52 PM
Malcolm Douglas 21 Mar 03 - 06:26 PM
CET 22 Mar 03 - 02:04 PM
Amos 22 Mar 03 - 02:39 PM
Malcolm Douglas 22 Mar 03 - 03:06 PM
John MacKenzie 22 Mar 03 - 03:50 PM
CET 22 Mar 03 - 04:59 PM
Wolfgang 24 Mar 03 - 07:57 AM
Wilfried Schaum 26 Mar 03 - 03:02 AM
GUEST,Laurent 26 Mar 03 - 06:25 AM
GUEST,Laurent 26 Mar 03 - 10:24 AM
CET 26 Mar 03 - 11:03 AM
MMario 26 Mar 03 - 11:03 AM
CET 08 Apr 03 - 10:20 PM
Joe Offer 09 Apr 03 - 03:37 AM
Wolfgang 09 Apr 03 - 09:04 AM
GUEST,A visitor on this site 15 Nov 05 - 05:30 AM
GUEST,Gerry 16 Nov 05 - 12:47 AM
GUEST 16 Nov 05 - 05:57 AM
CET 17 Nov 05 - 07:37 PM
CET 19 Nov 05 - 04:43 PM
GUEST,A visitor on this site 09 Jan 06 - 03:34 PM
open mike 09 Jan 06 - 08:15 PM
open mike 09 Jan 06 - 10:56 PM
GUEST,Bob Coltman 10 Jan 06 - 02:33 PM
GUEST,A visitor on this site 11 Jan 06 - 10:15 AM
GUEST,A visitor on this site 22 Jan 06 - 07:34 AM
CET 09 Mar 06 - 08:49 PM
GUEST,A visitor on this site 02 Feb 07 - 02:51 PM
Bob the Postman 02 Feb 07 - 05:18 PM
Wilfried Schaum 06 Feb 07 - 04:27 AM
Gulliver 06 Feb 07 - 08:12 AM
Acorn4 21 Mar 12 - 08:57 AM
Jack Campin 21 Mar 12 - 02:54 PM
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Subject: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 09:27 PM

I seem to be drawn to songs about thieves and murderers and outlaws of various kinds. I also like singing in French and German. Your challenge, should you choose to accept it, is to name your favourite outlaw/bad guy/bad woman songs in languages other than English.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: SINSULL
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 09:34 PM

El Preso Numero Nueve
Joan Baez recorded it in the 60s. A murderer confesses his crime to a priest but refuses to be sorry for it. The man was in the arms of his wife.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: toadfrog
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 12:40 AM

This is my favorite. The story is an actual incident in Prussia in (I think) the 1890's, where a poor old clerk had been imprisoned, was released and could not find work. So he assembled a Captain's uniform, found a squad of soldiers on the street and marched them to City Hall, where he cleaned out the treasury and made off with it. The moral being, the Prussians were so steeped in military discipline that a man in officer's uniform could get by with almost anything. The story is subject of a play by Arnold Zweig, which I would swear was made into a film I saw back in the 1950's. Suzanne does not believe there was such a film, and as a non-German I will defer to her on that point.

The lyrics are extremely clever. Since I believe our software will automatically translate, I won't even try my hand; a decent job would take all day.


DER RÄUBERHAUPTMANN VON KÖPENICK
(Otto Reuter)
Ihr Leute höret die geschicht, die ich aus Köpenick bericht'.
Sehr kluge Leute woh'n darin, den Köpenick liegt bei Berlin.
Was dort vor Kurzem ist gescheh'n, das hat die Welt noch nicht geseh'n.
Was rennt das Volk, was wälzt sich dort die langen Gassen brausend fort?
Voran die Grenadiere, des Königs Grenadiere,
auf jeder Seite viere und der Gefreite vorn.

Ja zeigt sich wo ein blanker Knopp, nickt man vor Ehrfurcht mt dem Kopp,
Das Köpenicken, das bringt Glück. Daher der Name Köpenick...
Die Grenadiere stellen sich vors Rathaus - es war fürchterlich -
Die Leute standen auf dem Damm - Die Grenadiere standen stramm.
Dann kam der Herre Hauptmann, der Hauptmann, der Hauptmann.
Ja, was der sagt, das glaubt man, "Der Hauptmann hat's gesagt"!

Der Hauptmann zog in's Rathaus ein und dort gehorcht ihm Gross und Klein.
Die Polizei von Köpenick hielt selbst das Publikup zurück.
Der Hauptmann zählt den ganzen Kitt, er nahm sogar die Pfennige mit
Doch vorher wurde der Rendant sur neuen Wache hingesandt -
und dann der Bürgermeister, der Meister, der Meister -
Der klügste aller Geister, ein kluger Langerhans.

Als alles nun geschehen dort und als der Hauptmann lange fort,
Da wurde erst den leuten klar, dass er ein Räuberhauptmann war.
Jetzt sucht man, wo der Schwindler steckt. Die Mütze hat man schon entdeckt.
Den Säbel bracht man auch herbei und fröhlch ruft die Polizei;
"Jetzt hab'n wir auch die Hose, die Hose, die Hose -
Doch's Pech is bei der Chose: Der Hauptmann ist nicht drin."

Und die Moral von der Geschicht: Die Hauptsach' ist der Hauptmann nicht!
Die Uniform verschafft Respect, ganz gleich, wer auch darinnen steckt.
Wo eine Uniform sich zeigt, da wird man ängstlich und man schweigt.
Da wird nur noch "hurrah" geschrie'n. Ja, eine solche Disziplin,
Die hab'n wir noch in Preussen, in Preussen, in Preussen,
Wenn alle stränge reissen - Stramm hält die Disziplin!

From "Ich hatt' einen Kameraden" (1999 ConBrio Verlagsgesellschaft)/


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: mack/misophist
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 12:50 AM

Check out Die Dreigroschenoper bu Brecht/Weil. There are several good ones there.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: masato sakurai
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 01:14 AM

See this thread too: GREGORIO CORTEZ.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Wolfgang
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 06:17 AM

I had read 'outlaw' in the thread title as a verb and thought it was about some insane political move in Britain or the USA. I'm glad I was mistaken.

My personal favourite in German is

Schinderhannes

Toadfrog, you are right about the film: Hauptmann von Köpenick was a German movie starring Heiz Rühmann in 1956 and was among the nominations for the Academy Award in 1957.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,jfm
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 07:41 AM

I think the Irish (Gaelic) song called 'Na Connerys' from the 1820s might qualify. Its about the three Connery brothers of County Waterford who had a feud with their landlord's agent and were convicted of attempted murder. They escaped from jail and were helped by their local community while on the run. They planned to stow away on a ship to America, only to be caught at last while attempting to make their farewells and were finally transported to New South Wales. There have been several threads on this song in its several versions which are still sung by traditional singers in the Gaeltacht areas of Munster.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:33 AM

Thanks, all.

Wolfgang, do you know where I could find the tune for Schinderhannes? I can see why you like this song. It has the same atmosphere as the great broadside ballads.

Thanks for all the links.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Wolfgang
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:40 AM

Edmund,

(1) I could sing it to you on the phone
(2) you buy this recording
(3) I think Susanne has this recording (I don't) and she could send you a tape
(4) I might have scores at home (but can't tell you before Tuesday)

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Wolfgang
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:43 AM

I'm an idiot: The recording I have linked to happens to be a recording of German Outlaw ballads. So that's exactly what you need (and I too, I think)

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: greg stephens
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:47 AM

Mack the Knife in the original German. Or the cajun/Creole "Les flammes d'enfer" in French. Both great songs about baddies.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:49 AM

There would be probably a number of them in Scottish or Irish Gaelics.


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Subject: ADD: Das Jennerwein Lied
From: Wolfgang
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:50 AM

I think I'll paste and copy the two best known (in my eyes) from that site:

DAS JENNERWEIN LIED


1. Es war ein Schütz in seinen schönsten Jahren
Er wurde weggeputzt von dieser Erd
Man fand ihn erst am neunten Tage
Bei Tegernsee am Peißenberg

2. Auf den Bergen ist die Freiheit
Auf den Bergen ist es schön
Doch auf solche schlechte Weise
Mußte Jennerwein zugrunde gehn

3. Auf hartem Stein hat er sein Blut vergossen
Auf dem Bauche liegend fand man ihn
Von hinten war er feig erschossen
Zersplittert war sein Unterkinn

4. Du feiger Jäger, das ist eine Schande
So erwirbt man sich kein Ehrenkreuz
Er fiel nicht mit dir im offnen Kampfe
Weil's der Schuß von hinten her beweist

5. Man bettet ihn auf einen Wagen
Bei der Nacht noch ging es heimlich fort
Begleitet von den Kameraden
Nach Schliersee, seinem Lieblingsort

6. Dort ruht er sanft so wie ein jeder
Bis an den großen Jüngsten Tag
Dann zeigt uns Jennerwein den Jäger
Der von hinten ihn erschossen hat

7. Und an jenem allerjüngsten Tage
Putzt ein jeder sein Gewissen unds Gewehr
Dann marschiern die Jäger samt den Förstern
Auf ins Gamsgebirg zum Luzifer

8. Ihr Jäger, laßt euch nur ermahnen
Daß keiner mehr von hinten zielt
Denn auf den Bergen gilt die Freiheit
Auf den Bergen schießen wir das Wild

Poacher Georg Jennerwein has been shot from behind 6. Nov. 1877 by forester Pfederl at the Schliersee (Lake of Schlier). There are rumours that jealousy has been the real reason for the shooting and not the call of duty.

Wolfgang


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Subject: ADD: Schinderhannes
From: Wolfgang
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:57 AM

SCHINDERHANNES


1. Ich bin schon weit in der Welt rumkommen
Im tiefsten Wald nahm man mich gefangen
Man führt mich in die Stadt hinein
Wo ich sollt gehangen sein

2. Und auf das Rathaus tät man mich führen
Wohl zwei- dreimal zum Examinieren
Man schreibt mir jedes Wörtlein auf
Und führt mich in den Turm hinauf

3. Im finstern Turm hab ich gesessen
Schlechte Speisen mußte ich essen
Bis endlich kam heran die Stund
Zu der ich nichts mehr essen kunnt

4. Ach, was wird meine Mutter wohl sagen
Wenn sie wird hörn die harten Plagen
Daß ich in meinen jungen Jahrn
Schon so viel Böses hab getan

5. Johannes Bückler ist mein Name
Und zweiundzwanzig sind meine Jahre
Zwei Tag, zwei Nächt vor meinem End
Empfing ich noch das Sakrament

6. Und das Gerüst muß ich nun betreten
Fünf Vaterunser die soll ich noch beten
Fünf Vaterunser die bet ich nicht
Ich seh dem Tod ins Angesicht

7. Ade lieb Vater, ade lieb Mutter
Ade lieb Schwester, ade lieb Bruder
Wascht eure Hände in meinem Blut
Damit ihr wißt, wie weh das tut

Schinderhannes alias Johannes Bückler, son of a skinner (Schinder=skinner), is the prototype of the romanticized German outlaw. During the French occupation of the West bank of the Rhine between 1797 and 1802 he roamed Hunsrück Mountain. on 21. Nov. 1803 he and 19 comrades have been beheaded by guillotine in Mainz. He was a much less nice character than the ballad and other stories pretend.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 11:38 AM

Que bonita Bandera
Hey Jalisco ??
Der schwei Grenadieren
Please excuse crap spellings.
Giok


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: toadfrog
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 02:17 PM

My above post contains misinformation. The incident was in 1906, not "the 1890's," and was the subject of a work by Carl Zuckmayer, not "Arnold Zweig." And I am embarassed.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: toadfrog
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 02:24 PM

Edmund: I have a recording of Schinderhannes (generously sent by Suzanne) and if you are in the U.S. I can tape it and send it to you. If your in the U.K., you are better off with talking with the German mudcats.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 02:30 PM

Wolfgang:

We are definitely going to have to meet one day and trade some songs, although I expect you will have more to teach me than vice versa.

That's a great link to the German outlaw ballad recording. I'll see if I can get it through Amazon.de. Interesting information about Johannes Bueckler. He sounds like Dick Turpin, the famous highwayman, also a lot nastier than his PR would you believe.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Anglo
Date: 20 Mar 03 - 10:27 PM

I once heard Suzanne Szasz sing Laslo Feher in the original Hungarian, which would be fun if you could manage to track it down. (It's normally known in A.L. Lloyd's English translation as sung many years ago by Julie Felix in the UK and, I think, Judy Collins in the States).


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 21 Mar 03 - 08:08 AM

Don't know if it counts as *criminal* exactly, but my mother used to sing a song with a gallopy, cheery tune and the chorus:

Quatre-vingt, quatre-vingt, quatre-vingt chasseurs

Dans le lit de la Marqui-i-se!

I've never been able to find the rest of the song, alas.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Allan C.
Date: 21 Mar 03 - 08:17 AM

Versions of "Hangman" are sung in just about any language you might care to name. Unfortunately, I don't have any other than the English language version at hand. Perhaps someone else knows one in another language.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 21 Mar 03 - 11:35 AM

I want that song about the ninety hunters in bed with the Marquise! That is just too good to pass up. Any ideas?

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: toadfrog
Date: 21 Mar 03 - 02:07 PM

CET: Alas, I fear it was only eighty!


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 21 Mar 03 - 05:52 PM

Oh, no there's my degree in French wasted!

Thanks for the correction.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 21 Mar 03 - 06:26 PM

There's some interesting background, and texts, at Quatre-vingts chasseurs. It hasn't got anything to do with outlaws, though.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 22 Mar 03 - 02:04 PM

Well, it was a bit of a thread creep. Thanks so much.

CET


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Amos
Date: 22 Mar 03 - 02:39 PM

Well, again only marginally outlaw is the better known "Monsieur le President":

M'sieu le President
Je vous ecrie une lettre
Que vous liriez, peut-etre
Si vous avez le temps.

Je vien de recevoir
Mes papiers militaire
Pour partir pour le guerre
Avant Mercredi soir.

Mon decision est fait
Je ne vais pas le faire
Je n'irais pas au guerre
Pour tuer les enfants

Et si vous me pursuivez,
Dites a vos endarmes,
J n'aurais pas des armes,
Et qu'ils pouraient tirer.

I also know a really improper song about the King and Queen Victoria, which goes by the title of "Les Bouchees A La Reine", also the name of a meat pastry-shell tidbit.

But it's not ILLEGAL....


A


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 22 Mar 03 - 03:06 PM

Boris Vian's fairly modern song is in the DT: LE D+SERTEUR, and has been posted a couple of times subsequently as well. French tradition has plenty of songs about lawbreakers on the run, but I can't think of any about outlaws as such just at the moment.

Central and Eastern Europe, however, has plenty, often of epic length; there was more scope there, geographically, for outlaw bands. A. L. Lloyd recorded quite a few in Bulgaria and Albania; the older ones tended to be about the Haiduks, who, like Robin Hood, lived in the forests; chiefly resisting the Ottoman Empire, while the later ones dealt with the wartime partisans who resisted the Nazi and Fascist invaders. He also found one, Zenel Kadrija, written in the traditional form, about a fight with postwar American saboteurs parachuted into Albania by the OSS in an abortive attempt to blow up the Pukë hydroelectric dam.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 22 Mar 03 - 03:50 PM

If we're talking thread creep here, I may as well fling in one of my favourite, foreign language songs, "Les Chevaliers de la table Ronde". It may not be about outlaws, but it is about drinking, and that I can identify with.
Giok


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 22 Mar 03 - 04:59 PM

I'm not just partial to outlaw songs. I like criminals of all kinds.

I have a place in my heart for "Chevaliers de la table ronde". It earned me several free beers when I sang it in a very crowded bar outside Parc des Princes after the Wales-France Rugby International in 1979. There were lots of Welsh supporters singing, but I was the only one who sang anything in French.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Wolfgang
Date: 24 Mar 03 - 07:57 AM

Maybe one day, Edmund. I'd be pleased.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 03:02 AM

Hi Edmund,

a fine book is:
Räuber- und Landsknechtslieder : Texte und Noten mit Begleit-Akkorden / hrsg., übers. und erl. von Walter Scherf
   Frankfurt am Main : Fischer-Taschenbuch-Verl., 1981
(Fischer-Taschenbücher ; 2963)
ISBN 3-596-22963-4

This collection contains German, Slawic and English songs about famous robbers and historical songs of lansquenets (soldiers of fortune, about 1500 till the end of the 30-years war), with tunes.
It is out of print, but it can be bought at the German branch of Amazon, used, from € 2,50 on. Here you'll find the songs referred to by our German mudcatters

Sing and enjoy
Wilfried


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,Laurent
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 06:25 AM

CET
Here is the song you are looking for.

Les 80 chasseurs

A l'ouverture de la chasse
Dans un château riche en gibier
Riche en gibier
Une marquis' sans héritiers
Invita des chasserus en masse
Alors vit-on plus d'un chasseur
Accouru sans qu'on lui dise
At à la chasse de la marquise

Chorus:
Nous étions 80 chasseurs
80, 80, 80, 80 chasseurs
80, 80, 80, 80 chasseurs
Qui n'avions pas peur!

Encouragés par nore belle
Nous abattions plus d'un faisan
Lorsqu'un sanglier effrayant
Tout à coup s'élança sur elle
Malgré sa force et sa vigueur
Nous le forçâm' à lâcher prise
Et pour défendre la marquise,

chorus

"Allons chasseurs vite en capagne"
Dit la marquise, "Il faut partie
Il suffit pas de se réjouir
Il faut encore manger et boire"
Au milieu des chants et des cris
La table fut aussitôt mise
Et à la tabl' de la marquise

chorus

Lorsqu'on nous servit le champagne
Les coeurs se dispos'nt à l'amour
Chacun voulut plaire à son tour
A notre illustre compagne
Chacun d'elle obtint un' faveur
Si bien que la dame était prise
Et dans le lit de la marquise

chorus

Pour fêter ce jour mémorable
La marquise neuf mois plus tard
Mis au monde un jeune bâtard
Qui aujourd'hui est redoutrable
De sa force ignorant l'auteur
Il voulut que l'on l'en instruise
"Tu es, dit la marquise


last chorus:
L'enfant des 80 chasseurs
80, 80, 80, 80 chasseurs
80, 80, 80, 80 chasseurs
Qui n'avaient pas peur!


To find other bawdy songs, try Chansons paillardes

Laurent


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,Laurent
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 10:24 AM

This one is about a famous highwayman and smuggler Louis Mandrin (1724-1755), the French 'Robin Hood. He was broken on the wheel in Valence.

COMPLAINTE DE MANDRIN

1
Nous étions vingt ou trente
Brigands dans une bande,
Tous habillés de blanc
A la mode des, vous m'entendez,
Tous habillés de blanc
A la mode des marchands.
2
La première volerie
Que je fis dans ma vie,
C'est d'avoir goupillé
La bourse d'un, vous m'entendez,
C'est d'avoir goupillé
La bourse d'un curé.
3
J'entrai dedans sa chambre,
Mon Dieu, qu'elle était grande,
J'y trouvai mille écus,
Je mis la main, vous m'entendez,
J'y trouvai mille écus,
Je mis la main dessus.
4
J'entrai dedans une autre
Mon Dieu, qu'elle était haute,
De robes et de manteaux
J'en chargeai trois, vous m'entendez,
De robes et de manteaux
J'en chargeai trois chariots.
5
Je les portai pour vendre
A la foire de Hollande
J'les vendis bon marché
Ils m'avaient rien, vous m'entendez,
J'les vendis bon marché
Ils m'avaient rien coûté.
6
Ces messieurs de Grenoble
Avec leurs longues robes
Et leurs bonnets carrés
M'eurent bientôt, vous m'entendez,
Et leurs bonnets carrés
M'eurent bientôt jugé.
7
Ils m'ont jugé à pendre,
Que c'est dur à entendre
A pendre et étrangler
Sur la place du, vous m'entendez,
A pendre et étrangler
Sur la place du marché.
8
Monté sur la potence
Je regardai la France
Je vis mes compagnons
A l'ombre d'un, vous m'entendez,
Je vis mes compagnons
A l'ombre d'un buisson.
9
Compagnons de misère
Allez dire à ma mère
Qu'elle ne m'reverra plus
J' suis un enfant, vous m'entendez,
Qu'elle ne m'reverra plus
J'suis un enfant perdu.

You can find a midi file of this song (and lyrics of many others) here.

The next one is about another French highwayman, Louis-Dominique Bourguignon aka Cartouche (1693-1721. He was broken on a wheel in Paris. I found the on-line lyrics on this german http://home.t-online.de/home/pheld/2france.htm. There's a midi file too.

LA COMPLAINTE DE CARTOUCHE

1. Enfin Cartouche est pris, avecque sa maîtresse; on dit qu'il s'est enfui par un tour de souplesse. Un chien l'a fait repincer dès le matin.

2. On l'a mis au cachot avec un fort bon drille; sans couteau, ni ciseaux, ni marteau, ni faucille, leurs mains ont fait un trou chez le voisin.

3. Il dit à la question: "Je ne suis pas Cartouche, je suis Jean Bourguignon; je ne crains point vos douches, je suis Lorrain de nation, je suis Lorrain."

4. On le mena jeudi al la place de Grève; tout y était si rempli que tout le monde y crève. Puis on l'a fait sortir de sa prison.

5. En montant l'escalier de l'hôtel de ville, il dit au gonfalier: "Ami, je suis débile. Donne-moi un verre de vin, mon cher ami."

6. On dit qu'il accusa grand nombre de personnes; des pays étrangers, des femmes aussi des hommes, il fut exécuté le vendredi.


Laurent


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 11:03 AM

Thanks, everybody. Apparently, Amazon.de doesn't deliver used books overseas, which surprises me since I've already bought Uli Otto's collection of German soldier songs from them. However, I'll try one of the used book websites.

Laurent, that's a great site. I've bookmarked it and I am looking forward to learning some of the songs.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: MMario
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 11:03 AM

Excellent site Laurent - thank you


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 08 Apr 03 - 10:20 PM

I received the Leipziger Folk Session CD with Schinderhannes yesterday. This is a fine album, not a dud song on it. Schinderhannes is a really beautiful song. The only draw back for me was the lead singer's voice. It's definitely an acquired taste for me. However, I would still recommend the CD. Thanks for pointing me to it, Wolfgang.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Joe Offer
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 03:37 AM

I think my favorite non-English outlaw song might be Anathea, except that I haven't heard in in a language other than English. In the other thread, Lanfranc says Anathea is a translation by A L Lloyd of a Hungarian song collected by Bela Bartok. I've looked, but haven't been able to find a recording or transcript of the original Hungarian song.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Wolfgang
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 09:04 AM

Edmund, I've got another CD by this group and I agree with your assessment of the voice. He has a fitting voice for a certain type of songs which doesn't include Schinderhannes. I wish they had other singers for some of their songs.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,A visitor on this site
Date: 15 Nov 05 - 05:30 AM

I've got two songs for you. One is called "La complainte des galériens" or "La chaîne" It's a very ironic song, sung by the convict's in the french galleys, in the 19th century.
Text:
Refrain:
La chaîne,
C'est la gêne
Mais c'est égal
Ça n'fait pas d'mal

Nos habits sont écarlates
Nous portons au lieu de chapeaux
Des bonnets mais point d'cravatte
Ça fait brosse pour les jabots
Nous aurions tort de nous plaindre
Nous sommes des enfants gâtés
Et c'est crainte de nous perdre
Que l'on nous tient enchaînés.
Refrain
Nous f'rons de belles ouvrages
En paille ainsi qu'en cocos
Dont nous ferons étalage
Sans qu'nos boutiques pay' d'impôts
Ceux qui visit'nt le bagne
N's'en vont jamais sans acheter
Avec ce produit de l'aubaine
Nous nous arrosons l'gosier
Refrain
Quand vient l'heure de s'bourrer l'ventre
En avant les haricots
Ça n'est pas bon, mais ça entre
Tout comm' le meilleur fricot
Notr' guignon eût été père
Si, comm' des jolies cadets
On nous eût fait raccourcire
À l'abbaye du Mont-à-R'gret

"L'abbaye de Mont-à -Regret" is a word from french argot, meaning the scaffold.
There are two recordings of french folk songs availible, where this song's a part of. They're called: "Anthologie de la chanson française traditionnelle" and "L'air du temps et la vie quotidienne". They're availible on the french amazon, but quite expensive. For the tune of this song, it's enough to listen to the samples on the site. If you put the two together, you get the complete tune.
Same thing goes for the second song. It's called "Le galérien"or "Quand j'entris dans Marseille". It's another song from the galleys. Here's the text:
Quand j'entris dans Marseille, je fus bien étonné
De voir tant de forçaires deux à deux enchaînés.
Et moi, fort effrayé, me pensant reculer
A grands coups de gourdin, on me fit avancer.

Quand j'entris en galère, je vis un argousin
Tout empli de colère, plus traître que Caïn,
Un rasoir à la main, pour raser mes cheveux.
Je ne fais que languir, de vivre je ne peux.

Quand ce méchant perfide la tête m'eut rasé
Je n'étais plus en vie, mais j'étais tout pâmé.
Encore me dit-il : » vilain, déshabille-toi;
Prend les habits du Roy, car les tiens sont à moi. «

Les habits qu'on me donne de grosse toile étaient,
De grosse laine rouge aussi est le bonnet.
Une chaîne à mes pieds, pour expier mes péchés
J'endure autant de mal que les pauvres damnés.

Qui qu'a fait chansonnette ? C'est Pierre de Blassy
Qui est originaire de Cahors en Quercy
Lequel est accusé, à son corps défendant,
De tuer un écolier et se dit innocent.

Hope you like them.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 16 Nov 05 - 12:47 AM

There's a Muzsikas-with-Marta-Sebestyen album called Prisoner's Song.
I think some of the tracks other than the title track are about outlaws.
Of course, it's all in Hungarian.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Nov 05 - 05:57 AM

There are quite a few Australian songs ( well it's not really english), but most are actually Irish/ English.

Stringybark Creek I think is genuinely Australian


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 17 Nov 05 - 07:37 PM

Thanks for the French songs. I'll look them up.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 19 Nov 05 - 04:43 PM

"Anthologie de la chanson francaise traditionnelle" looks like a screaming deal at about 63 Euros for a 10 CD set. "L'air du temps" is unavailable, alas.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,A visitor on this site
Date: 09 Jan 06 - 03:34 PM

If australian songs count here, I know another song. It's called "Botany Bay", one of the many ballads about the australian penal colony. YOu can find tune and text on this site: www.contemplator.com Go to "Songs of the sea". At the bottom of the site is "Other songs related to the sea and life on water". There are two different songs called "Botany Bay". Personally, I prefer the first. Oh, before I forget it: For the first version, there are two verses missing. Here they are:
It was on the 28th of may
From England we did steer
And everything being safe on board
We sail'd down the river clear
And every ship that we pass'd by
We heard the sailor's say:
"There goes a ship of clever hands
And they're boung for Botany Bay"

There is a girl in Manchester
A girl I know full well
And if I ever get my liberty
Along with her I'll dwell
Oh, then I mean to marry her
And no more go astray
I'll shun all evil company
Bid adieu to Botany Bay


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: open mike
Date: 09 Jan 06 - 08:15 PM

Muzsikas-with-Marta-Sebestyen were featured on a Link T.v. special which aired last night and has several oather showings scheduled in the near future called Boyond the Forest. It is filled with songs and tunes from the villages near Romania, Hungary and Transylvania. Marta sings one called the Outlaw Song which speaks of leaving the village, and blessing the one who trained the person's horse. There are sub-titles in the documentary. It is a bit less than an hour long, and Link T.V. is on channel 375 on Direct t.v. and also airs on Dish network.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: open mike
Date: 09 Jan 06 - 10:56 PM

Here are the lyrics (translated) of

The Outlaw's Song


Turn my noble horse towards the sunset

For we are never coming back again

I'm going into exile to a faraway land

Never again will I see

My beautiful mother land

Blow away good wind blow the dust on the long road

The dust of the long road and the footmarks of my horse

It was a good horse

God bless the person who trained it

In a foreign town, foreign people

I walk the streets, I don't know anyone

I would speak to them, but they don't understand me

This saddens my heart


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,Bob Coltman
Date: 10 Jan 06 - 02:33 PM

Wrong language, I know, but I can't resist mentioning Greek rembetica. This song genre is full of outlaw songs, songs of criminals, dope, sex, and so on. As with many other genres, the best rembetika, hands down, was recorded pre-1940.

The "Greek Archives" series produced more than a dozen great anthologies on CD (present availability unknown).

No excuse for mentioning this, of course, since I can't sing Greek either. But these songs FEEL low down, stressed out and downright criminal...and they're beautiful. They're sometimes called the "Greek Blues." I recommend 'em.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,A visitor on this site
Date: 11 Jan 06 - 10:15 AM

It may not count as outlaw songs: Those songs were song by the soldiers in the military prisons. They're all on the same music. The most ancient one is from the 19th century, sung in Tatouine and Biribi. In those two cities were the most famous french military prisons. As they were in Africa, your chances to survive were not the best. The second one dates from a bit later. It was sung in the Bat d'Af (Bataillon d'Afrique), a part of the army in Africa, where punished soldiers were sent to.
You can find all of the songs on: http://homepages.ulb.ac.be/~xhubaut/chorale/texte.htm
There are two newer versions of this song also on this site, but they won't count as Outlaw songs. See for yourself. On this site, there are also notes for four voices (melody is in the soprano voice). If that isn't enough try: www.netmarine.net/tradi/chants/index
And look for "La marche des sous-mariniers" or "Le sous-marinier". There's the music two one of the newer versions of this song.
There is also a fifth version. It is very rarely known. Judging by the texts, it would have been sung in the galleys in Toulon, but it's possible, that the texts were written later. Here they are
Refrain:
Mais après tout
Qu'est-ce qu'on s'en fout?
Qu'est-ce qu'on s'en fout? Tralalala
So tu n'cours pas assez rapide
Tu cesseras de vivre
Au large des côtes,
Au fond des mers
Ce sera ton cimétière

Il sont dans cette maudite ville
Des pauvres gars, nous les forçats, nous les forçats
Attendant chaque jour la fin d'le vie
Garde-chiourme, tous sont présent, oui, tous sont là
Pour faire partie de cette élite
Il faut savoir bien goupiner, bien goupiner
On n'est pas certain de vivre
Et on n'peut pas en profiter
Refrain
Mais comme on n'a jamais eu de veine
En flagrant délit on nous prendra, on nous prendra
Au bout de huit jours plus d'une semaine
Dans les journaux on trouvera, on trouvera
Encore un bonnet rouge de plus
Qui s'en va galérer au pré, gal'rer au pré
Qui a un beau jour quitté sa mère
Avec l'espoir d'encore rentrer, d'encore rentrer
Refrain
Mais si un jour la vie s'arrête
Ta fiancée n'en mourra pas, n'en mourra pas
Au bout de six mois, plus d'un semestre
Un autre gars elle trouvera, elle trouvera
Et ta pauvre mère ignorante
A tout ce mal qui l'a comblée, qui l'a comblée
A la messe ira le dimanche
Se recueillir et pour prier, et pour pleurer.
Refrain
Mais notre sort est bien injuste
Beaucoup de nous sont innocent, sont innocent
Et même si l'on sera coupable
Faut-il punir par ce tourment, par ce tourment?
Nous sommes de repris de justice
La société, elle nous renvoit, elle nous renvoit
Et même, si on en sort vivant
Personne n'voudra jamais de toi, jamais de toi
Refrain
Oui, on n'aura jamais de veine
Il faut, qu'un jour tu crèveras, tu crèveras
Sur cette putain d'terre toulonaise
C'est dans la mer qu'on t'enterra, qu'on t'enterra
Avec ni croix ni autre chose
Dans la mer on t'fera tomber, fera tomber
Qui voulez-vous qui nous regrette
Puisqu'on est tous de reprouvés, des reprouvés?
Refrain
Vous qui du haut de vos fenêtres,
Bourgeois nous regardez passer, r'gardez passer
Vous tremblez toute votre graisse
Car oui c'est nous les réprouvés, les réprouvés
Mais gardez bien vos femm's, canailles,
Car un jour nous vous les prendrons, vous les prendrons
Et ce jour là vaille que vaille
C'est vous qui irez en prison, oui en prison!
Refrain

As said before, this is either the first of all those songs, or it was written long after the galleys had closed. I don't know


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,A visitor on this site
Date: 22 Jan 06 - 07:34 AM

I just realised that I forgot the fourth couplet of the song. Here goes:
J'ai vu mourir un pauvre gosse
Un pauvre gosse de dix-huit ans, de dix-huit ans
Tué par une bastonnade féroce
Il est mort en criant maman, criant maman.
Je lui ai fermé les paupières
Recueilli son dernier soupir, dernier soupir
On n'en a informé personne
C'était qu'un forcat d'plus à mourir, oui à mourir


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: CET
Date: 09 Mar 06 - 08:49 PM

I ordered the "Anthologie de la chanson francaise" from Amazon.fr and it was worth every penny. My favourite song - "Les enfants de Pontoise", not exactly an outlaw song, but one about an execution. The lyrics are deceptively simple, and very grim and chilling, particularly as sung by Marc Robine, one of the best trad singers I have ever heard.

Thanks for pointing me in this direction.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: GUEST,A visitor on this site
Date: 02 Feb 07 - 02:51 PM

I've found another french song: It's called "Chant de galères" (Galley song), sung by "Les quatres barbus". You can find the CD on amazon.fr. Unluckily, I only know the refrain: "Timaloumisaine, Timoulamison" If anybody finds out the rest, I'd really be interested.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Bob the Postman
Date: 02 Feb 07 - 05:18 PM

The Mexican ballad/polka genre known as "narcocorrido" consists entirely of true stories of real-life modern-day outlaws. Some sound samples from proto-narco-corridos (try saying that three times real fast after a bong hit) can be heard here.

Back to German, though. Giok referred to a song called "Zwei Grenadieren" which I'm thinking must be the same poem I memorised back in high school (by Heine?). Can anyone point me toward a recording?


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 06 Feb 07 - 04:27 AM

Die beiden Grenadiere
By Heinrich Heine (1797-1856), set in the original German by Robert Alexander Schumann (1810-1856), Op. 49, Nr.1

At ingeb.org

But they are no outlaws, but soldiers brave and true.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Gulliver
Date: 06 Feb 07 - 08:12 AM

I like the Brazilian O Cangaceiro (Mulher Rendeira), composed by Zé do Norte, referring to Lampião, a famous outlaw from the northeast region of Brazil.

This has been recorded in different versions in Spanish and English (including a version by Cliff Richard). There are a few modern Brazilian and Italian songs with the same name but they seem to bear no relation to the original Brazilian song.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Acorn4
Date: 21 Mar 12 - 08:57 AM

I just ran across this when researching a local history topic and was a bit puzzled how you'd actually sing/perform it with its lack of rhyme and irregular line lengths - might it have been translated ffrom French, given that was still the language of polite society in the early 14th century?

Found this old thread on the topic - can anyone throw any light?

'The Outlaw's Song'

Sourcetrans. Gillian Spraggs from 'Trailbaston' ed. Isabel S. T. Aspin in Anglo-Norman Political Songs (Oxford, Blackwell for the Anglo-Norman Text Society, 1953), pp. 67–78
Another editionThe Political Songs of England, ed. Thomas Wright (Camden Society, 1839), pp. 231–236
Datebetween April 1305 and February 1307
The Outlaw's Song
                   [1]
I am seized with desire to rhyme and tell a tale
of an institution that's established in the land.
It would be better if the thing were still to do.
Unless God intervenes, I think there will be war.

                   [2]
These are the articles of Trailbaston.1
Save for the King himself, may he have Gods curse
who first granted this sort of commission,
for some of its clauses are very far from fair.

                   [3]
Sir, if I wish to punish my serving-boy
with a thump or two, to mend his ways,
he will lay information and have me detained,
and before I leave jail I must pay a large ransom.

                   [4]
Forty shillings they take for my ransom,
and the sheriff turns up for his bribe
for not putting me in a deep dungeon.
Now, lords, consider, is this fair?

                   [5]
For this reason I shall stay in the woods, in the pleasant shade;
there is no false dealing there, nor any bad law,
in the wood of Belregard, where flies the jay,
and the nightingale sings daily without ceasing.

                   [6]
But ill-disposed people, from whom God keep his pity,
out of their lying mouths have indicted me
of wicked robberies and other crimes,
so that I do not dare to visit my friends.

                   [7]
I have served my lord the King in peace and war,
in Flanders, Scotland, in Gascony, his own land;
but now I do not know how to provide for myself;
all my time I've wasted in pleasing such a man.

                   [8]
If these wicked jurors refuse to mend their ways
so that I may go riding to my country,
if I can capture them, I'll make their heads fly off.
I'll not give a penny for all their threatening words.

                   [9]
Martin and Knoville are men of piety,2
and pray for the poor that they may live in safety;
Spigurnel and Belflour are men of cruelty;
if they were in my bailiwick, they would not find a refuge.

                   [10]
I will teach them the game of Trailbaston,
and break their backs and their arses,
their arms and legs, it would be fair,
crop their tongues and their mouths, too.

                   [11]
Whoever began this business
will never amend in his life.
I tell you the truth, there is too much sin in it,
because for fear of prison many will turn robber.

                   [12]
Some will become robbers who never used to be,
who dare not lead a peaceful life for fear of jail;
they lack what it takes to keep them alive each day.
Whoever began this business embarked on a great task.

                   [13]
Well may merchants and monks give a curse
to all those who ordained the Trailbaston.
The royal protection will not be worth a garlic head
unless they hand over the coins without getting anything back.

                   [14]
You who are indicted, I advise you, come to me,
to the green wood of Belregard, where there is no entanglement,
just wild animals and pleasant shade;
for the common law is too unreliable.

                   [15]
If you know your letters and are tonsured,
you will be summoned in front of the judges.
You may be sent back to jail again,
in the keeping of the bishop, until you are cleared.

                   [16]
[two lines missing in manuscript]

and suffer privations and very hard penance,
and perhaps you will never be released.

                   [17]
For this reason it is better to stay with me in the woods
than to lie in chains in the bishop's prison.
The penance is too great and hard to bear.
He is a fool who will not choose the best.

                   [18]
Before, I knew something of what was good, now I am not so wise.
This the wicked laws do, subjecting me to abuse,
so that I dare not come and live in peace among my kin.
The rich go for ransom, the poor fade away.

                   [19]
It were a hard matter to stake that that cannot be redeemed,
that is, a man's life, that is so dearly loved;
and I have not the goods to arrange a ransom,
but if I were in their bailiwick, I'd be given over to death.

                   [20]
I shall yet obtain pardon and hear human voices.
Some speak ill of me who dare not approach me,
and would willingly see my body mistreated;
but God may save a man from a thousand devils.

                   [21]
The one who can save me is the son of Mary,
for I am not guilty, I was indicted out of malice.
Whoever drove me to this place, may God curse them.
The world is so changeable, he is a fool who trusts it.

                   [22]
If I belong to a fellowship and know something of archery,
my neighbour will go about saying, 'That man belongs to a fellowship
which goes shooting in the woods and doing other stupid things.
If he lives as he wants to, he will lead his life like a swine.'

                   [23]
If I know more than they do of the law,
they will say, 'That conspirator begins to plot treachery,'
and I won't come near my home by ten leagues or by two.
May they be held in shame in every district.

                   [24]
I ask all good people that they will pray for me,
so that I may go riding to my country.
I was never a killer, of my own will, at least,
nor a wicked robber, to cause people harm.

                   [25]
This rhyme was made in the wood, under a laurel tree.
There sing blackbird and nightingale, and the hawk ranges.
It was written on parchment to be better remembered,
and thrown into the highway so that someone should find it.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Jack Campin
Date: 21 Mar 12 - 02:54 PM

Yup. It was in French.

original with translation

I started a thread about a Hungarian outlaw song a while back:

Elment a madarka

There are a lot more where that came from.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Artful Codger
Date: 21 Mar 12 - 09:16 PM

Stepan (Stenka) Razin was a famous and much venerated outlaw about whom a number of poems and songs have been written, notably "Iz-za ostrava na strezhen'" and "Utyos [Stenki Razina]" (The Cliff of Stenka Razin), also known as "Est' na Volge utyos" (There's a cliff on the Volga--written by Mikhail Lermontov).

Iz-za ostrava: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXc4AXAm7l0
Utyos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AC9spdqnkoI

I also have memories of a song about horse thieves, though I don't recall the title or whether it's Russian or Czech.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Jack Campin
Date: 21 Mar 12 - 10:02 PM

One of the more famous horse-thief songs is the Hungarian "Laszlo Feher", mangled by some American folkie of the 1960s into "Anathea". A few threads about it here - that may be what you're thinking of.

More recently:

Songs of the Neapolitan Camorra

Narcocorrido

and of course quite a lot of rap. Like this rap for Al Qaida, if it's real (I haven't explored that one any further).

A bit more political - how about the Chechen anthem? Here is a video of a group of women singing it. It seems to portray the entire nation as a collective outlaw.


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Subject: RE: Outlaw songs - not in English
From: Artful Codger
Date: 22 Mar 12 - 12:05 AM

No, Jack, it was definitely a Russian or Czech song I was thinking of--I'm leaning toward Czech.

There's also Pushkin's poem "Uznik" (The Prisoner, 1822), which pops up in both traditional and modern settings. Here's the most famous trad setting:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-oGsbSdF9I

I think there's also a prisoner song made from a poem by Lermontov. If my neurons start working...


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