Ibanez Artist 5string on eBay

Subject: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 09:51 AM

I'm nothing to do with the seller but I have noticed from the newsgroups that there is a 1970s Ibanez Artist up for auction here.

I'd check with someone like Rick Fielding before bidding both over values and what this one is but I think someone may stand a chance of getting a very nice instrument at a reasonable price here.

Jon

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 11:51 AM

Nice looking banjo. It also seems to have a bunch of accessories, so you wouldn't have to spend anything on having spikes installed, case etc, strap(?), it has a few sets of spare strings.

I wonder what this will sell for? I'm betting about $600-650.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 11:58 AM

Hi Jon. Hmmmmmm, interesting. The seller says this is based on a "TB 6" implying that it's a TENOR banjo. Gibson's five stringers were all "RB-100s, RB-250s stc. the "R" meant "Regular" which I guess in the thirties meant "Five string")

I suspect that's just a slip. Very few players are as "nurdy" as I when it comes to tiny details.

I own one of these at the moment....and sadly, it's a real dog! I have tried EVERYTHING to get a better sound out of it with no success. Now lemme emphasize that at least a dozen people have played my banjo with no complaints....but then again I've seen bands who've used Framus and Korean banjos, and are happy as clams.

Now the good news: The one I've got now is the FIRST bad one I've ever seen. I'm a huge believer in these (pretty authentic) Gibson knock-offs. Over the years, I've helped at least fifty students find "High-end" Ibanez and El Degas banjos....which were selling for a fraction of the Gibson price, and could be set up to sound like damn near anything you'd want.

Generally the store value of these in Toronto is about 900 Canadian (575 American app.) The private sale value is about 600-675 Canadian (400+ American app.)

Hey, here's an idea. Why not entice the owner to come over to MC and discuss his instrument. We've got enough five string players here to make it worth his/her while.

Cheers

Rick

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 12:12 PM

Hey Rick,

Is yours from that era? I have heard that there is a huge difference in these from the seventies (very good) to the eighties and newer (not so good).

You sure steered me in the right direction with your advice on my Aria. It's just sounding better and better all the time. (I have tinkered a bit).

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 12:38 PM

Thanks Rick, I'd wondered about the TB too...

I've leave it to someone else to get hold of the seller (who looks to be a dealer) if they wish.

I just remember past conversation here and elsewhere and thought as a few sometimes ask about 5 strings here, it may be worth informing people what I thought was one of the good ones was up for auction.

The only Ibanaz I ever tried was a tenor I got to try after a conversation in a session. It was a beauty. I only met the player that once and that was years ago but looking at this page,it remains his favourite tenor.

Jon

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 03:54 PM

I see that this one has dual Co-Ordinator Rods. I have seen an Ibanez from approximately the same era that looked identical (I don't think that it was yours rick, but it might have been) but had a single rod. It had a tone ring, but it was a fair bit lighter than my dual rod Aria. I wonder if there were different models of Ibanez back then, One a lighter, single rod, cheaper tone ring entry version and one that copied the Gibosn's in every way. Anyone?

I mentioned the $600-$650 amount that I think this will go for. I'm not saying that I would pay it, but I have found eBay's Banjo's to be quite pricey these days. I did look more closely, this one indeed has a starp, a Shubb style Capo, a banjo key, a case key, picks. It would be a good package for someone who has progressed from a rank beginner to wanting to move up.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 04:03 PM

I'm guessing Steve but I think it likely that Ibanez would have covered a variety of budgets and quality and that the Mastertone type ones (like that one) would have been the high end.

Jon

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 04:08 PM

Jon,

I'm thinking the same thing. The one that I saw was the same beautiful natural Blonde finish, same Fretboard design, purfling etc. as the one shown on eBay. I would guess that it was the second from their top of the line whereas this one was their top of the line. I'm really curious as to whether Rick's is this one or like the one that I saw and played.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Charley Noble
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 04:27 PM

My word of caution about e-Bay listings is that sometimes the "seller" really is acting as an intermediary and doesn't have the banjo on hand; he/she may be merely assuming the description is an accurate one. Do ask the seller a few clarifying questions before bidding. Most sellers are happy to comply, but if they appear to be evasive beware!

Charley Noble, who only surfs for S. S. Stewart banjos

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 04:47 PM

You snob, Charlie!! Ha ha!

Yeah, Steve, mine's the high end, and I simply don't know if it's late seventies or early 80s. To me.....it stinks. Two co-ordinator rods, heavy rim, 4 Scruggs tuners (don't use 'em)

But I am SOOOOOO picky you wouldn't believe it!

Jon, I've played about four top of the line Ibanez Tenors and they sounded amazing.......BUT.....apparently only for tunes. Jazz players want a much more "metalic" sound.

Cheers

Rick

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 05:03 PM

Rick,

I know that you know a ton about setting up banjos, but I wonder if a quick trip to your buddy Bruce Dowd is in order?

I know how picky you are. I guess maybe one of the differences is that you have had a chance to play higher end banjos, old Gibsons, Deerings, Stellings etc. I never have. The nicest sounding banjo that I have ever played is my uncle's old Fender Concertone, which is the only banjo that I have played that is heavier than mine. I am very happy with mine, but then again I'm coming from an alumnium pot starter banjo.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: CraigS
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 05:31 PM

A friend has a 70s single rod version which he uses for jazz, without the fifth string. I have played it with five strings on. It sounds good, is very loud, and plays easily. Take the back off and it sounds like an old Vega, but three times as loud.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 09:07 PM

When I got my banjo last year I tried to find out more about it. I noticed that Arthur Hatfield had bid on similar ones on eBay, so I e-mailed him trying to find out more about it. Here is a summary of his comments.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
All of those Imported banjos in the 70 Aria,Ibanez,Alvarez and the Gold Star
were good banjos, even in later years than the others. I'm not sure just what year they went to almost junk on the imported banjos, I think maybe the early 80's.I know these better ones soon as I glance at them but I'm not sure exactly what year.

I bid on a lot of these banjos so if I can buy one cheap I can make fifty to a hundred dollars on it but I won't bid hardly anything on the newer imported ones because I can't try to sell someone something that I think is junk even if they don't know the difference. Some of the Gold Star banjos are the best imports I've ever tore down. The 1 pc.flange Gold Stars are as good as some of the Gibsons. Hope this helped. Arthur
----------------------------------------------------------------

Here's another neat Asian Banjos site

Paul Hawthorne Asian Banjos

Yeah, one day I'll have a good Gibson, but my Aria is all the banjo I need now.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 25 Mar 03 - 09:50 PM

Steve, after I'd exhausted EVERYTHING that Bruce taught me over the years, I took it to him. He's a very conservative guy, and simply said "If you want a Gibson, don't buy a Japanese copy"!

He's wrong about this, cuz (as I said earlier) the vast majority of HIGH END (only) Ibanez, and El Degas are sometimes MORE consistant than Gibson. Certainly better than many of the NEW Gibsons (60s to about 8 years ago)

My experience has been that Japanese Fenders and Washburns (once again, only the top of the line) are exceedingly heavy and loud with decent flexibility in tone, The Aria Pro II is usually a very nice sounding banjo (yours is) but the "German style" inlay isn't to my taste, and I'm very visually oriented.

Rick

Currently there is one cheap good banjo on the market....and that's Gold Tone. I VERY impressed with these people...they make two great Bluegrass banjos, and a wonderful Vega copy frailer (plus a strange looking six string that sounds good) all for a grand or so Canadian!

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 07:39 AM

Rick,

From what I've heard, if Bruce can't make it sound good, nobody can.

It took me a while to get used to the Tree Of Life inlay on mine, but I'd say that I've got it figured out now. If I ever replace the Aria it will have a more traditional inlay pattern.

I have never heard a bad word said about Gold Tone.

Hey, maybe I'll loan you my old alumnium pot one for a week, it will make you appreciate the Ibanez.

I'm surprised to see that the one on eBay that started this thread hasn't had any more bids. Hmm.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 08:12 AM

I don't look at ebay enough to get an idea how many bids an instrument like that may get. It's clear from a previous post of yours that there is one seller interested in that type of stuff but perhaps there are not too many who know that some of the Japanese stuff is good.

I have heard of crazy bidding for instruments on ebay though but that seems to me to be on the big names like Martin and Gibson. I've also seen comments and even one example shown by someone from alt.banjo who knows what he's talking about over items not being what they are supposed to be. One should always be careful (and if needed, get an opinion from someone else) but I get the impression one needs to be especially careful with these.

Jon

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 11:05 AM

Ya know Jon.....I guess I just have this suspicious nature, but I wouldn't buy ANYTHING without playing it A LOT. I forget....what's yer banjo? An Orpheum or Paramount.....or is my memory playing tricks on me?

I think the other thing is that when I'm talking tone, I may be getting awfully picky. There's a kind of trade off that I've lived with all my life....my ear is so good, that at times it's really annoying....but my reading skills are SO bad, that I've probably lost thousands of dollars a year in studio gig revenues.

So.... my ideal banjo sounds like Earl Scruggs' 1950s recordings. I DID have one like it, but like an idiot, I sold it twenty five years ago (figuring I'd have no problems finding another, ALONG with pocketing an extra thousand bucks!) Moron! They're as rare as hen's teeth.

Cheers

Rick

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 01:23 PM

Well Rick I'm another that wants to try an instrument before I buy it. I'm no great player but still I know what I like and think that even with the few instruments I've played, make/model can only be a guide. As you indicated above, you have found 1 out of about 50 of this type of 70s Japanese Gibson copy that is poor. I'd guess it equally posible that you could come accross one that for whatever reason stands head and shoulders above the rest...

I'm afraid your memory is playing tricks with you regarding my banjo. Mine is a 17 fret "Kildare", one of Sully's It's a flathead mastertone type construction with mahogany neck and resonator. Last time I spoke to Sully, he said I was one of a rare few so I'd guess there were probably only 4 or 5 of this 17 fret version made.

One day I'll get a little money together and treat myself to a second banjo. I think for me, a Vega would be favourite. I'm not up on models - is it the style M which is the basic one with the tubaphone tone ring? If so, it would probably be the one I'd go for. I'm not as visually orientated as you and would prefer not to spend more just for decoration, however nice that decoration may be.

Jon

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: GUEST,Martin Gibson
Date: 26 Mar 03 - 02:29 PM

I have a fabulous sounding and playing Iida (aka Jida/Aida) top of the line "Masterclone" that I bought new in 1978. These banjos seem to really rate and I've seen them go for a good buck on ebay. I've been very happy with mine.

Does anyone else have one?

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 27 Mar 03 - 11:04 AM

Well, this one is still at $360. I know that there is some time left, but this might turn out to be a great buy. It seems to meet all of the criteria of one of the good ones.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 27 Mar 03 - 11:23 AM

Steve, you have a good job. BUY IT. Then loan it to me so I can get rid of mine!

Just kidding.

Yup Jon....now I remember. Hmmmmm that's an interesting site. Look like really fine instruments.

Martin Gibson, you bet I remember IIDA (what a dumb logo idea!!) Really good banjos.... Gibson was really pissed at their advertising copy in Guitar Player and Sing OUT.

The company implied that if you bought a Gibson or Vega, you were a "slave" to tradition. Very funny actually. They also used hellacious babes with extry-long fingernails in their advertising photos....hence implying that if you played an IIda gorgeous gals would be interested, and as we all know, not to many Playboy Models hang out with banjoists.

Rick

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 27 Mar 03 - 01:21 PM

Rick,

How about I hold for an old Gibson and then loan the Aria to you? (You could be waiting a long time).

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 27 Mar 03 - 02:50 PM

Go to the twelfth fret. Your Gibson is waiting for you. Don't be a cheapskate. It costs less than a car.

Cheers

Moi

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 27 Mar 03 - 04:34 PM

Rick,

The reason that I don't try out Mastertones when I'm at The Twelfth Fret is the same reason that I don't test drive Porsches. I know that I would love one, I would crave one, but at this point there is no way that I could justify the expense. The laws won't let me drive a Porsche the way that it should be driven, my LOFT won't let me play a Mastertone the way it should be played. Besides, it would be wrong to use your mute on a Mastertone.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 28 Mar 03 - 10:46 AM

Well, it has gone up by $20. I still think this could turn out to be a good value for someone.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: GUEST,Martin Gibson
Date: 28 Mar 03 - 02:54 PM

To Rick Fielding:

Wish I could see those IIDA ads. Information has been scarce. I am familiar with the asian banjo website someone else alluded to in this thread, but have never seen anything from the company itself. Do you know if they still exist?

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 28 Mar 03 - 10:58 PM

Well Martin, the answer would have to be YES. They're in old copies of Sing-Out. I've moved my collection or I'd be able to photo copy a couple for you, but why not just write to Sing-Out. Worth a try.

Cheers

Rick

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 30 Mar 03 - 06:03 PM

Just thought I'd refresh this. There's a day remaining and it's still at $385.00

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 30 Mar 03 - 06:23 PM

Buy it Steve. You'll feel better AND you can give it to Susan for her Birthday...or Christmas....or cuz you're a wonderful brother.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 31 Mar 03 - 10:46 AM

Well it seems to be up to $404 now - people usually wait until the he very last minute and then the bidding can really begin.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 31 Mar 03 - 12:49 PM

Rick,

Believe me, I've been thinking about it, but I'm going to pass. I already gave my old banjo to Sue. She hasn't played it yet, she's working on some new songs of her own, some covers (her latest is a killer version of one of your favourites, Step It Up and Go), and she is working on the Bass, she's playing it with Phil Halliday's band. Phil is the fellow who produced her CD. For the time being I'm the best Latimer banjo Picker in Whitby. That will change half an hour after she decides to pick up the banjo. We're having an addition put on the house, I don't think Karen would agree that $500 U.S. is a necessary expense right now. Women!!

Dave, you're probably right, things will heat up with about half an hour to go.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 31 Mar 03 - 10:04 PM

Sold, $592.27. I think that's a pretty good buy.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 01 Apr 03 - 06:41 AM

Not too far off your $600 estimate in end.

Going by Rick's price guide and your comments about the case and accessories, I would think someone has a nice buy.

Jon

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 01 Apr 03 - 12:22 PM

Jon,

I'd say you're right. I don't think it's a great buy, but a good one. I seriously considered throwing a bid in of up to $550, only because I know a few people who are looking for a decent banjo and I'm sure that one of them would have bought it. It's funny, I've seen Arias similar to mine go anywhere from $300 to $825. A lot of it is in the presentation, pictures, descriptions etc. It also depends on who's paying attention to eBay.

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 08:36 PM

Well, it turns out that this was purchased by a fellow on another forum that I visit regularly. www.banjohangout.org

He bought it as a second banjo.   

He got it today. Here's what he had to say. Damn, I should have bid.


Hi Steve and here's the report. To start with it is a beauty. Very hard to believe it is 26 years old. The ONLY things to take notice of were what was listed on ebay and they AIN'T noticable. I'd rate it near mint.
As far as sound at first I was a bit skeptical but then I settled down to work that banjo magic. Probably the most important thing I found was that the co-ordinator rods that tighten the rim to the neck were loose so I tightend that up TIGHT!, new D'addario medium strings, Moon bridge cause the hot spot was a 3/4 and I like 5/8, tightened the head about a quarter turn, adjusted the action to a tad above 1/8 inch above the 12th fret, tuned it up and set the bridge for intonation.
Sounded pretty darn good compared to how it sounded when I got it but still not quite there so..........................
I tweaked the head a bit tighter, re-tuned it and........
W-O-W!!!!!!
I must have found that sweet spot because it was really a noticable difference.
Great solid tone, fourth string roars and the trebles crack. The nut action is perfect and it plays very easily.
I have to say I was really surprised that it came that much alive.
I have played banjos that cost 4 to 5 times as much that didn't sound as good as this one does now.
I guess I'll find out if my ear is telling me a lie or not if banjoists come up after a show and want to know, " what kind of banjo is that????"
All of the above may sound like a load of banjo hooey but I'm not exaggerationg.
Maybe your buddy on that forum needs to tighten those co-ordinator rods?

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 09:25 PM

Love the report Steve. I (and I know I could have been wrong) sort of felt sure somone would end up with something nice when I started this thread - have been sitting with "fingers crossesd" since.

Jon

Subject: RE: Ibanez Artist 5string on Ebay
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 10:02 PM

Jon, Nice to hear a happy ending. I should have bid!!!