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BS: The Mother of all BS threads

Acme 23 Nov 04 - 06:02 PM
Tweed 23 Nov 04 - 11:06 AM
Rapparee 23 Nov 04 - 09:16 AM
Amos 22 Nov 04 - 11:17 PM
Rustic Rebel 22 Nov 04 - 10:57 PM
Rapparee 22 Nov 04 - 10:12 PM
GUEST,Charles Ulysses Farley 22 Nov 04 - 02:56 PM
Acme 22 Nov 04 - 01:59 PM
Acme 22 Nov 04 - 10:31 AM
Acme 22 Nov 04 - 01:58 AM
Amos 21 Nov 04 - 11:15 PM
Amos 21 Nov 04 - 01:48 PM
Rapparee 21 Nov 04 - 12:16 AM
Amos 21 Nov 04 - 12:01 AM
Acme 20 Nov 04 - 11:32 PM
Rapparee 20 Nov 04 - 08:55 PM
Acme 20 Nov 04 - 07:51 PM
Rapparee 20 Nov 04 - 03:09 PM
Amos 20 Nov 04 - 01:51 PM
Acme 20 Nov 04 - 01:06 PM
Amos 20 Nov 04 - 12:37 PM
Acme 20 Nov 04 - 12:14 PM
Acme 20 Nov 04 - 12:06 PM
Amos 19 Nov 04 - 11:47 PM
Acme 19 Nov 04 - 10:29 PM
GUEST,Harry Kludge 19 Nov 04 - 09:11 PM
Amos 19 Nov 04 - 08:57 PM
GUEST,Harry Kludge 19 Nov 04 - 08:48 PM
Amos 19 Nov 04 - 04:21 PM
Acme 19 Nov 04 - 03:40 PM
John MacKenzie 19 Nov 04 - 12:10 PM
MMario 19 Nov 04 - 11:55 AM
Acme 19 Nov 04 - 11:40 AM
Rapparee 19 Nov 04 - 11:20 AM
Acme 19 Nov 04 - 10:54 AM
MMario 19 Nov 04 - 10:50 AM
Acme 19 Nov 04 - 10:45 AM
John MacKenzie 19 Nov 04 - 10:20 AM
MMario 19 Nov 04 - 09:45 AM
Rapparee 19 Nov 04 - 09:26 AM
Amos 19 Nov 04 - 09:24 AM
Rapparee 19 Nov 04 - 09:20 AM
Amos 19 Nov 04 - 12:12 AM
Rapparee 18 Nov 04 - 11:40 PM
Amos 18 Nov 04 - 11:25 PM
Acme 18 Nov 04 - 10:59 PM
Rapparee 18 Nov 04 - 10:48 PM
Rapparee 18 Nov 04 - 10:22 PM
Bee-dubya-ell 18 Nov 04 - 10:11 PM
Rapparee 18 Nov 04 - 09:49 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 23 Nov 04 - 06:02 PM

Machine, propel thy shaft mightily,
Through grime, grease and dirt, vitally.
Mechanics transcendent,
Through kluge's ammendment,
This craft operates all-rightily.

(Kind of falls down on that last line)


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Tweed
Date: 23 Nov 04 - 11:06 AM

Rustic my darling, I live for your mos' looridly explistif muses. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Tweed


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 23 Nov 04 - 09:16 AM

It was dirty and grimy and covered with grease
But it was stuck in shaft alley by twos and threes
All hail the mighty shaft of propellors!!



Nah....


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 22 Nov 04 - 11:17 PM

Well, the shaft I was referring to was a large propellor shaft, abut four feet in diameter, and the area on either side of it as it led aft to the propellor was called the shaft alley. The shaft, in turn, was driven by the gigantic pistons of a Harland and Wolff Diesel engine -- the cylinders were tall enough that you could stand inside of them with your feet on the cam lobes and not reach the piston heads. Big, like.

But, well, RR, I gotta say your version is pretty impressive!!!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 22 Nov 04 - 10:57 PM

Well now I have to agree with Charlie Farley, we are spending to much time talking about kludge when we should be talking about that thing Amos said. Let's see what was it now? Oh yes, the shaft that is all grimy and covered with dirty grease. Quite an interesting topic. I'm not sure I like the idea of any shaft around me that is grimy and covered with old grease, but non-the-less I am far more interested in the idea than I am in kludge.

The Shaft

It wasn't a small shaft that I saw that day,
It wasn't really huge.
It was grimy and greasy and layed in the dirt,
I think it fucked a kludge.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Nov 04 - 10:12 PM

Dear Mr. Farley,

Thank you for your recent submission to MOAB. We regret to inform you that it does not meet either our present needs nor the exceptionally high quality needed for BS to be included in this thread.

Thank you for thinking of us.

Sincerely yours,
Rapaire.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: GUEST,Charles Ulysses Farley
Date: 22 Nov 04 - 02:56 PM

My, my, but you people do just go on and on about it, don't you?

Your country is involved in a senseless war that could potentially become World War Three, you recently chose an idiot to be your leader, and there's a move afoot to amend your Constitution to allow a Nazi weightlifter to become the next idiot president.

And you don't have anything more important to worry about than whether "kluge" rhymes with "huge" or "budge".

Splendid! Keep up the good work.

Chuck U. Farley


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 22 Nov 04 - 01:59 PM

chuck

Geez, guys, I was just yanking his chain!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 22 Nov 04 - 10:31 AM

up up up


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 22 Nov 04 - 01:58 AM

It looking like something your pal Kluge might have upchucked after messing up the room. . .


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 21 Nov 04 - 11:15 PM

Ok, ok, ok....so it wasn't top-grade. I admit it. But it wasn't poison, either!


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 21 Nov 04 - 01:48 PM

I had a dawg,
We called Ole Kluge
His eyes were black an' his gums were rouge
He was brown and huge,
Ole Kluge.

Ole Kluge had a habit,
I must confess,
Every place he found order, he would leave a mess
Big and huge,
Ole Kluge.

....


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 21 Nov 04 - 12:16 AM

We had to sell ours to help pay the mortgage.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 21 Nov 04 - 12:01 AM

I had one of them, SRS, but the back wheels just fell off one day!


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 20 Nov 04 - 11:32 PM

Da mangler De mye i Deres livstid, Herr Rapaire. Kvinner som er frem er upfront, fremragende, toppene, og lever deres livfull-krets.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Nov 04 - 08:55 PM

MY momma brought me up not to mess 'round with them "forward" wimmin.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 20 Nov 04 - 07:51 PM

Amos, I think I accused you of not doing something more exotic than Spanish. This is simple Chinese.

Rapaire, you read it forward, which means you read it backward. Read it backward and see what I said. I was being forward.

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Nov 04 - 03:09 PM

SRS, that's disgusting. I thought that yo mama brought you up better than that.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 20 Nov 04 - 01:51 PM

I sure hope you remember what that said, SRS, 'cuz that translator site only does one-eay from English. We'll have to take your word for it, too!

:D

A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 20 Nov 04 - 01:06 PM

阿摩司,我认为你可能尝试稍微更异国情调的某物较之西班牙人。


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 20 Nov 04 - 12:37 PM

¡Mi Dios, yo estoy atemorizado por su espíritu aventurero y la imaginación de gran alcance! ¡Yo no pensé sería jamás posible comunicar a noruegos!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 20 Nov 04 - 12:14 PM

I want to poke this in somewhere for others to play with:
http://www.freetranslation.com/ I found this place when wanting to translate English to Norwegian (Babelfish doesn't do it). I sent a question to a Norwegian craft web site, and received an answer from an apparently not-much-English-speaking Norwegian woman and hope my answer was at least as comprehensible as hers to me was.

I wonder what other language translation sites are out there (she asks hoping for some great BS generated from the experiment now possibly to be conducted)?

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 20 Nov 04 - 12:06 PM

Back to the top!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 11:47 PM

Harry,

I am sorry to tell you that the word as applied to engineering crud was established long before your Cerfiot pals started using it. We would apply it, for example, to the shafts, gears, rods, miscellaneous couplings and spare rings stored along the shaft alley. All grimy and covered with old grease. And there was no question how it was pronounced. We're talking late 1960's here; if anyone had rhymed it with Trudge OR Fudge he would have been laughed back up onto the deck where he belonged. You just had to know these things to be a snipe. :>)D

But perhaps that wasn't where the family jewels ended up from the Hudson River valley; maybe your derivation is from the Dutch, while hours is from the Yiddish or Alsatian or even Schleswig-Holsteinian.

When it is applied to junk it is Kloooodge; clearly not applicable in the case of your family name.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 10:29 PM

Perhaps they experienced one of those mythic Ellis Island name changes--though in this case, since they just visited and weren't processed there, it wasn't changed, just mispronounced.

SRS (Former NPS park ranger at Ellis Island)


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: GUEST,Harry Kludge
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 09:11 PM

Sir,

I found this web site while researching my family genealogy and thought it might have some pertinent data. As you might imagine, I have taken some teasing and even abuse over my name, and I find such things to be offensive.

Your crack about Ellis Island is in poor taste, as my family settled in the Hudson River Valley in the early 1700s. My many-times-great grandfather, Otto Kludge, fought at both Saratoga and Yorktown. Other of my ancestors fought at Gettysburg, Belleau Wood, and an Uncle died on Wake Island. My father hiked out of the Chosin Reservoir. My twice-great grandmother was one of the first women physicians in the Oregon Territory and another climbed the Chilkoot Pass. I myself have worked with computers since the middle 1960s and I count Vinton Cerf, Ray Tomlinson, Bob Kahn, and Bob Metcalf among my former co-workers.

It rhymes with "trudge."


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 08:57 PM

Oh, Harry, what do you know? A late immigrant whose parents lied to the authorities on Ellis Island and sold their patronym for a mess of pottage!!

KLOOOOOOOOODGE!!!!!!!! KLOOOOOOODJE!!!!!!


KLOOOODZHE!!!


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: GUEST,Harry Kludge
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 08:48 PM

Believe me, it's pronounced to rhyme with "fudge."


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 04:21 PM

I love Rapaire's kludge which is obviously designed to control an automated dispenser of air freshener, using a flexible product labeling scheme in XML to accommodate future new product attributes or scents, for example.

Very clever.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 03:40 PM

Geez, Louise, Leo, you're lucky he didn't burn the house down. Or did he?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 12:10 PM

My Uncle used to love me, but she died
Giok


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: MMario
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 11:55 AM

for example - the "good as new" stove he "rescued" from the dump - which required rebuilding the kitchen counter (he made the cabinet to enclose it out of an old bureau) then replacing the cooktop with two portable electric stoves set into an old stainless steel sinktop (vbecause the oven worked but the burners didn't); and the oven timer replaced by a windup-clockwork gadget originally intended to control a lawn sprinkler (which was wired to the sink/cooktop because he didn't want to put screw holes in the stainless) - of course the oven and the two sets of heating elements all had to be plugged in seperately.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 11:40 AM

Something tells me that didn't display properly, Rapaire.

Ignore that man behind the curtain. . .


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 11:20 AM

Here's one. I've put the k-word in bold italics.

int main(int argc,char *argv[])
{
GladeXML *gx;
GtkWidget *w;

gtk_init(&argc,&argv);
gx=glade_xml_new("idea85.glade",NULL,NULL);
g_assert(gx != NULL);

if !> NULL then do something else;

glade_xml_signal_autoconnect(gx);
w=glade_xml_get_widget(gx,"window1");

g_signal_connect(G_OBJECT(w),"destroy",G_CALLBACK(gtk_main_quit),NULL);

gtk_widget_show_all(w);


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 10:54 AM

Please give us an example of one of these fine one-of-a-kind products, MMario!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: MMario
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 10:50 AM

hmmmm- yes. I guess my take on it comes from my father - whose various inventions and make-dos were both kludged and goldberged!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 10:45 AM

No, not Rube Goldberg, because that implies crafting a device that is needlessly complicated to perform a simple task. Rube Goldberg is a sort of left-handed antithetical approach to cobbling together something that necessity decrees must be invented. IMHO.

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 10:20 AM

Is that like a cludgie MMario?
{Glasgow dialect word for a WC)
Giok


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: MMario
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 09:45 AM

golly jeeps - you mean there are people who *don't* know that something kludged is basically a rube goldberg?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 09:26 AM

...'s ancestors.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 09:24 AM

A man of great erudition, fallen into the Siren arms of mere ad hominem remarks, a posture laughable if intentional and tragic if taken seriously. Alas, Rapaire, I knew him well...


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 09:20 AM

I'm no longer using the "K" word except to describe Amos....


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 19 Nov 04 - 12:12 AM

Your loss, and my sorrow. That your intransigence and reluctance to acquire new knowledge should lead you to cutting off a whole WORD from your vocabulary is indeed tragic, like a man cutting off his whole foreskin because he could only find one of them.
Painful, melodramatic and unproductive. Tsk, tsk...


Wake up, Rapaire!! Join the living!! Arise to a NEW day!! Wake up and smell the KLOOODJ!!!


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 11:40 PM

I'm no longer using the "K" word....


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 11:25 PM

The two are surely full cousins, at the very least. For is not one man's kludge another man's bricolage?? I give you Levi-Strauss, himself, on the bricoleur and his kludgy appetites:

"The analogy is worth pursuing since it helps us to see the real relations between the two types of scientific knowledge we have distinguished. The 'bricoleur' is adept at performing a large number of diverse tasks; but, unlike the engineer, he does not subordinate each of them to the availability of raw materials and tools conceived and procured for the purpose of the project. His universe of instruments is closed and the rules of his game are always to make do with 'whatever is at hand', that is to say with a set of tools and materials which is always finite and is also heterogeneous because what it contains bears no relation to the current project, or indeed to any particular project, but is the contingent result of all the occasions there have been to renew or enrich the stock or to maintain it with the remains of previous constructions or destructions. The set of the 'bricoleur's' means cannot therefore be defined in terms of a project (which would presuppose besides, that, as in the case of the engineer, there were, at least in theory, as many sets of tools and materials or 'instrumental sets', as there are different kinds of projects). It is to be defined only by its potential use or, putting this another way and in the language of the 'bricoleur' himself, because the elements are collected or retained on the principle that 'they may always come in handy'. Such elements are specialized up to a point, sufficiently for the 'bricoleur' not to need the equipment and knowledge of all trades and professions, but not enough for each of them to have only one definite and determinate use. They each represent a set of actual and possible relations; they are 'operators' but they can be used for any operations of the same type.

The elements of mythical thought similarly lie half-way between percepts and concepts. It would be impossible to separate percepts from the concrete situations in which they appeared, while recourse to concepts would require that thought could, at least provisionally, put its projects (to use Husserl's expression) 'in brackets'. Now, there is an intermediary between images and concepts, namely signs. For signs can always be defined in the way introduced by Saussure in the case of the particular category of linguistic signs, that is, as a link between images and concepts. In the union thus brought about, images and concepts play the part of the signifying and signified respectively."




Guess that kinda says it all, don't it?

Now you---BWL--have yourself a FANTASTIC Xmas sale and make tons o' dough. My wishes ride with you.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 10:59 PM

Amos, sounds like anyone who masters kludge is a bricoleur, non? And to prove that they are related terms, I did an advanced Google search in which these two terms MUST appear in the text. I found a nice example.

Here is chapter 6, the summary of the doctoral thesis of one David Cavallo at MIT. Kludge appears on page 3, bricoleur on pages 4 and 8. He seems not to have named this fine document, but it has to do with education in Thailand and other places.

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 10:48 PM

I'll betcha you can't do this.

Lift your right foot off the ground and make clockwise circles with it (it's easier if you're sitting down).
While your right foot is circling clockwise, write the number 6 in the air with your right index finger.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 10:22 PM

Ah, Bee-Dubya, may your trip be very, very, very, very profitable. And may your turkey be dead when you eat it.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 10:11 PM

I must away
at break of day
unto the wilds of Tampa Bay
to sell my pots
to idiots
whose stuff Charlie did blow away.

From thence I will
to Jacksonville
for Thangsgiving, my gut to fill
to sit and joke
with lots of folk
with whom I have in common, nil

Then to the clean
and quite serene
old city of St. Augustine
to hawk my ware
to people there
I only hope their money's green

Then on the road
to my abode
where all my crap I must unload
back to the sand
of Bubbaland
where cotton blooms and hay is mowed

Don't think me dead
or out of my head
when you don't see me on this thread
eleven days
I'll be away
if you don't like it, fuck you, Jed!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Nov 04 - 09:49 PM

I have decided. And when I have decided, I stay decided. Rather than engage in mental fisticuffs with Amos, the Sage of San Diego, known from the halls of Montezuma to the shores of Tripoli as lettered, as wise, as sagacious, as insightful, as savvy, as caring, as a true Renaissance gentleman of the Twenty-First Century, indeed, as I say, a true Son of Knowledge, one whose Knowledge About Knowlege is second only to my own, I will, henceforth and forevermore, eschew the word "kludge." I will banish it from my vocabulary, and never again will it pass bidden or unbidden from my lips or fingers.

I have spoken.

Goddamn thing still rhymes with
“fudge” and always will . . .


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