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BS: The Mother of all BS threads

Amos 08 Mar 08 - 10:27 PM
Janie 08 Mar 08 - 10:15 PM
Acme 08 Mar 08 - 09:33 PM
Rapparee 08 Mar 08 - 09:22 PM
Janie 08 Mar 08 - 09:17 PM
Rapparee 08 Mar 08 - 07:29 PM
Rapparee 08 Mar 08 - 06:57 PM
Rapparee 08 Mar 08 - 05:15 PM
Amos 08 Mar 08 - 11:48 AM
Rapparee 08 Mar 08 - 11:04 AM
Amos 08 Mar 08 - 10:44 AM
Rapparee 08 Mar 08 - 10:18 AM
Amos 08 Mar 08 - 09:34 AM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 10:38 PM
GUEST,Gluon 07 Mar 08 - 09:50 PM
Little Hawk 07 Mar 08 - 08:01 PM
Acme 07 Mar 08 - 07:41 PM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 06:27 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 06:04 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 05:30 PM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 05:25 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 05:21 PM
Little Hawk 07 Mar 08 - 05:00 PM
Rapparee 07 Mar 08 - 04:47 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 03:53 PM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 03:43 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 03:23 PM
Rapparee 07 Mar 08 - 03:20 PM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 02:48 PM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 02:36 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 02:34 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 02:32 PM
Rapparee 07 Mar 08 - 02:30 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 02:28 PM
Rapparee 07 Mar 08 - 02:26 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 02:19 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 02:19 PM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 02:13 PM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 01:50 PM
Little Hawk 07 Mar 08 - 01:21 PM
Rapparee 07 Mar 08 - 01:07 PM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 12:37 PM
Little Hawk 07 Mar 08 - 12:19 PM
Rapparee 07 Mar 08 - 12:06 PM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 11:35 AM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 10:32 AM
Amos 07 Mar 08 - 09:41 AM
Rapparee 07 Mar 08 - 09:07 AM
Janie 07 Mar 08 - 08:54 AM
Amos 06 Mar 08 - 11:20 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 10:27 PM

The birth of Gluon was recorded on 20 Apr 05 - 06:06 PM (#1466593)
"Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos

I suggest we adopt such an animal, a cross between a duck and perhaps an Airedale, name it Gluon, and have it be...oh, ther ehe is!! Glun, welcome to MOAB. Sit. Spea!


"QUARK! QUARK!!"

Good dog, Gluon!! pad your little webby feet over here and get a treat! Look what I got you!! Radicals!! Aren't they DELICIOUS!!??

"QUARK!!"


Yes, I agree, Gluon, this is a very interesting place, and now that you're here....OH!!! BAAAAAAD GLUON....where's my newspaper....NO pee on the MOAB floor, Gluon!! BAD!!

Huh?? It's gone!!

Amazing. Gluon has invoked the Uncertainty Principal to re-cast a past event from P into anti-P!!! I'll be damned.... This bears scientific observation. I wonder if he can play chess..."

Gluon will therefore be approaching his third normal space-time birthday in 1.7 months approximately.

In dog years, of course, this would be cause for celebration of his emanicipation, being the human equivalent of 21. But time does not behave well in the clouds of Uncertainty whch make Gluon's days, so he may well be having amidlife crisis, going senile, or just learning to walk. No telling. It's the eigen-cloud, you see. We don't know how to measure it and tell the tale.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 10:15 PM

S/he's here. Arrived right at the half. Gee, she looks cute with the little reindeer antlers sporting the Carolina logo I tied on her head.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 09:33 PM

At least no snow will stick around her house. Gluon does put out a peck of heat when she gets going (you've been calling Gluon a "he" but I distinctly remember that she was female. Or does it change now and then, like the earth's magnetic poles?)


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 09:22 PM

You said the wrong thing. The duckdog is on his way to your place, as you said "Heel." He'll be there now, or perhaps in the past, or the future. You can never tell.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 09:17 PM

If you'll excuse me, I have to go listen to the Carolina-Duke Basketball game.

GO HEELS!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 07:29 PM

In fact, it's eating a hole through the Earth....


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 06:57 PM

Nevermind, it's eaten a hole in the floor.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 05:15 PM

Does duckdog pee stain?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 11:48 AM

That's because he was paying attention when you crossed your wires on that peyote experiment, and decided you were the creator of everything. So he figgered he'd go to the Source. Makes sense in a duckdog sorta way; goes to show that even Solipsism can have its drawbacks.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 11:04 AM

Yeah, but I didn't mention him! You did. How come he's...aw shit, Gluon! Excuse me, but I gotta toss a duckdog out into the yard.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 10:44 AM

Ya wanna be careful there--transference i instantaneous with these subatomic wonder-critters.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 10:18 AM

Mention his name and he's humping your leg. Goddamn duckdog.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 08 Mar 08 - 09:34 AM

...Maybe, Janie; but you might have fallen asleep at the wheel, also. Hawkings is no Grisham.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 10:38 PM

I would understand all of this so much better if the traffic had been lighter when I was listening to Steven Hawkings on the car cassette.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: GUEST,Gluon
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 09:50 PM

QUARK! QUARK!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Little Hawk
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 08:01 PM

Gluon is a perfect name for one of those Greys that Shane has been a Guest of for the last while.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Acme
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 07:41 PM

You know what I haven't heard in ages?


Gluon!!!

Get down off the house!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 06:27 PM

If the tedium is the message...who is sending it? And who is the messenger? Should we shoot him/her?

Actually I would rather shoot the author, except that such a rash action might tend to have suicidal consequences...



A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 06:04 PM

WOOHOO - a sound I haven't heard for a very long time - water rushing down the little creek that marks the boundary of my back yard - It's been dry as bone for months and months!


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 05:30 PM

What is the message?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 05:25 PM

That is one BIZarre representation of Te Deum, there, Janie.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 05:21 PM

There's tedium , and then there's tedium


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Little Hawk
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 05:00 PM

Gawd. The tedium.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 04:47 PM

Youse am what you eats, as Popeye used to say.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 03:53 PM

Oh good! I was afraid you were going to say were doing the butterfly stroke.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 03:43 PM

It is therefore not necessary to introduce new non-standard model fermions to produce flavor scale physics. As a result dynamical models may become simpler.


Well, there you have it Janie. Peanut butter and jelly are both very much part of flavor scale physics. So you do not need any special fermions, just the ordinary kind. (I guess that means throw away the Viagara from two years ago Christmas...or somp'n).




A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 03:23 PM

Which means the particle constituents of the peanut butter and jelly sloshing around in the stomach acid right now are doing what?

Or perhaps it would be more accurate to ask about the probabilities of what they are doing?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 03:20 PM

Oh, fer...Amos, back in 2000 Roux and Torma wrote, in part:

...The situation at such high scales is that fermions are (effectively) massless so that a chiral symmetry exists. Above the electroweak scale there would not be any 2-point functions that involve fermions with electroweak quantum numbers, because these would break the electroweak symmetry. The same applies to any other n-point function that breaks the electroweak symmetry. There are however some 4-point functions involving fermions with electroweak quantum numbers that are allowed at scales above the electroweak scale. One can
distinguish five such 4-point functions on the basis of the chiralities of their external lines: three are chirality preserving and two are chirality changing. The chirality preserving 4-point functions can obviously respect any chiral symmetry. The chirality changing 4-point functions can be invariant under a chiral isospin symmetry, which may contain the SU(2)L of the electroweak symmetry, but these 4-point functions break larger chiral symmetries. If it can be generated nonperturbatively, such a 4-point function would signal the following breaking pattern

SU(Nf )R × SU(Nf )L ! SU(2)R × SU(2)L × SU(Nf /2)V . (1)

(The subscript V indicates a vectorial symmetry.)

Hence, these chirality changing 4-point functions act as order parameters for this partial breaking of chiral symmetries, which may occur at scales high above the electroweak scale. (Note that all fermions transform nontrivially under chiral isospin, which implies that masses are not allowed.) The significance of this is that the partial chiral symmetry breaking gives a new scale high above the
electroweak scale. The surviving chiral isospin symmetry can contain the SU(2)L of the electroweak symmetry, which means that this mechanism can exist for standard model fermions. It is therefore
not necessary to introduce new non-standard model fermions to produce flavor scale physics. As a result dynamical models may become simpler.
For 4-point functions to act as order parameters they must appear at higher scales than 2-point functions do. One can imagine that for certain combinations of number of colors, Nc, and number of
flavors, Nf , the critical coupling for the formation of 2-point functions may be higher than the critical coupling for the formation of 4-point functions. In an asymptotically free theory the 4-point functions would then be formed at a higher scale than the 2-point functions.


You KNOW this. Wuffo you bringing up that other stuff?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:48 PM

A chiral molecule is a molecule that cannot be superimposed on its mirror image (asymmetrical).

In physics, and specifically, particle physics, isospin (isotopic spin, isobaric spin) is a quantum number related to the strong interaction and applies to the interactions of the neutron and proton.

Rapaire is making the hard words march around in circles (like Micky Mouse in the Sorcerer's Apprentice in order to appear powerful. "Pay no attention to the librarian behind the curtain".


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:36 PM

Oh, Rapaire, get serious. There's no such thing as jouronium.

In particle physics, preons are postulated "point-like" particles, conceived to be subcomponents of quarks and leptons. As a theory, the preon concept got supplanted by string theory as a better way to explain things. That doesn't mean it is any more true, of course.

I am going to whistle up the duck-dog, Gluon to run up to your library and pee between the stacks, Rapaire.




A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:34 PM

At least, that's what MOM always says.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:32 PM

Hopefully not a problem as long the stomach lining is chiral isospin side up.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:30 PM

Be careful, for the mass always falls chiral isospin side down.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:28 PM

*sigh*


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:26 PM

A preon, boson, and jouronium sandwich?


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:19 PM

means two two four five oh is mine!

Burma shave.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:19 PM

two two four and forty-nine


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 02:13 PM

I just knew I was being conspired against today. Quantum physics, a theory of everything, LH trying to refrain from insulting Amos, HIPPAA compliant forms for the new practice, the resurfacing of an HTML practice thread, and the disappearance of the first time I typed and posted this into the far, lost reaches of cyberspace.

I tell you, I am not paranoid, this is a cosmic conspiracy!


Oh well. Think I'll go forth and make a PB&J sandwich for lunch. Not only will I be comforted by the warm, fuzzy childhood memories thus evoked, I'm also confident of my ability to digest it.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 01:50 PM

Depends on whether matter is something you view, or something you identify with, LH...

"Theoretically, the big bang should have yielded equal amounts of matter and antimatter that annihilated each other, leaving a largely empty universe. So why is our universe almost exclusively matter? The movements of distant galaxies and supernovae hint that the dark expanse of space holds vastly more matter and energy than we see in all the stars and galaxies. The LHC could shed light on this dark matter and dark energy."


Now, the LHC is turning into a really interesting tool, by expectation, anyway.

THis means Europe will march ahead of the US in being the leading front of physics endeavours.

I don't mind if it means we'll get a little closer to FTL drives, hyperspace transits, and anti-grav field generators.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Little Hawk
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 01:21 PM

It could explain our differences too, Amos. Keep your mind on what really matters, I say...


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 01:07 PM

But they're also jealous of the White House and would paint it if they could.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 12:37 PM

My gawd, Rapaire! You may be on to something there; the notion that negative values of S are the governing principle behind ignorance is breathtaking in its possible implications!! That could also explain the tensions that keep recurring in human dynamics, such as tribal spats, wars, and global warming. If the value of -S is constant, then all interactions between viewpoints within the frame of reference in which the constant prevails atre just tugs of war for more or less of it. This explains why the terrorists hate us, too. THey're jealous of our Space!   Someone call the White House.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Little Hawk
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 12:19 PM

I like your approach to telemarketers, Rapaire. I would hire you if I could afford it, but I'm totally strapped now due to having to hire all those other people to remove all the insulting things I said about Amos in previous posts on this (and other) threads.

We're talking about a project that could still be going on years from now. It rivals the building of the tower of Babel, only it's sort of the opposite way around.

If it weren't for all the dreadful and pretentious codswallop that Amos deluges this forum in all the time I wouldn't be in this unpleasant posi---

Oops.

"Strike that last remark, Miss Penseley."


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 12:06 PM

Amos, the formula is S=e(c/m^2). c/m^2 is called the "Constant Constant" and defines the amount of ignorance in the Universe. Ignorance, of course, is neither created or destroyed, but simply rearranged.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 11:35 AM

IT is a faskinatin' thing, Olive....

THe notion that a sea of Higgs' bosons is what imparts variable degrees of mass to all other particles, I mean.

In the most fundamental definition I know of, mass is defined as "resistance to acceleration". Acceleration of course is the change of rate of movement through space. The strange limiter of c on velocity is tied to the fact that it is the nature of space that it seems to increase mass of particles when they approach that speed. And the more mass, the more resistance to accelerating particles.

Well, suppose an equation were to be formulated that said S=m/c^2, or something like that -- in other words, defined a relationship between mass and "space".

Two interesting consequences, sketchily appearing, are:

1. That increasing mass with acceleration approaching c could be defined as space approaching infinity because "going faster adds to the amount of space carried by the particle". This would in some wise simplify the measurement of continua, I suspect.

2. The psychological link is tantalizing also. Consider that an individual's sense of space is a function of his viewpoint, and his ability to look at different spaces at will is one index of his psychological well-being. You can build a whole model of human dysfunction and therapy around the priciple of restoring space and command of space tothe viewpoint of the individual. There is a strong implication in all this that space is a function of a viewpoint generating dimensionality, in other words. To cut a long explanation short, suppose the relationship between space and mass on the side of the space-time continuum had a corrollary relationship between space and viewpoint on the consciousness side. THis could lead to a unified theory not only of space-time-energy, but of mind and matter. A single theory which harmonized the spectrum of phsyics studies and the spectrum of consciousness or psychological studies.

The notion of a big sweet unified construct addressing all these critters sure is temptin', ain't it?


Kinda like that Obama feller.

Thanks fer listening, Mom.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 10:32 AM

"The preferred name for the God particle among physicists is the Higgs boson, or the Higgs particle, or simply the Higgs, in honor of the University of Edinburgh physicist Peter Higgs, who proposed its existence more than 40 years ago. Most physicists believe that there must be a Higgs field that pervades all space; the Higgs particle would be the carrier of the field and would interact with other particles, sort of the way a Jedi knight in Star Wars is the carrier of the "force." The Higgs is a crucial part of the standard model of particle physics?but no one's ever found it.

Theoretical physicist John Ellis is one of the CERN scientists searching for the Higgs. He works amid totemic stacks of scientific papers that seem to defy the normal laws of gravity. He has long, gray hair and a long, white beard and, with all due respect, looks as if he belongs on a mountaintop in Tibet. Ellis explains that the Higgs field, in theory, is what gives fundamental particles mass. He offers an analogy: Different fundamental particles, he says, are like a crowd of people running through mud. Some particles, like quarks, have big boots that get covered with lots of mud; others, like electrons, have little shoes that barely gather any mud at all. Photons don't wear shoes?they just glide over the top of the mud without picking any up. And the Higgs field is the mud"...


Janie, this is a really well-done article and a good find. Thanks.

I suspect the Higgs boson may be the spation of which I spoke. Maybe the field will be called bosonics.

Not to be confused with bos'nics, which is the art of luring young ladies up to the foc's'le locker.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 09:41 AM

"But even an endeavor of this scale isn't going to answer all the important questions of matter and energy. Not a chance. This is because a century of particle physics has given us a fundamental truth: Reality doesn't reveal its secrets easily.

Put it this way: The universe is a tough nut to crack."

See, there's the rub. In my view it comes down to the question, "What could we know if we didn't already believe we know what we learned to know?"

I suspect there is a deep shift needed in our approach, and what makes sense to me is shifting from particle physics to spationics. Either that, or turning over the whole fielsd to psychologists, to create the subject of psionics. I think the whole "Chase me, I'm a particle" flirtation has gone too far, so to speak.

The trouble is no-one really has the first idea of how tof ormulate the fields of spationics OR psionics, because we don't "know" how.
It's a damned conundrum, is what.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 09:07 AM

I have little patience with organizations that purport to collect money for those who have suffered tragedy in their lives but which keep up to 90% of the money raised for "administrative costs."

I once told a salesman for a photo company that I couldn't have pictures taken of my children even though my wife and I very much wanted them, I had been wounded by a "castrator mine" in Vietnam. I was "sobbing" as I said this; NOBODY called again for three years. Now I'm on the "Do Not Call" list.

I've also told callers for political candidates that "I wouldn't vote for that goddamned Commie bastard if s/he were the only one running!" and then I launch into an imaginary speech about WHY the person is a "Commie." This is even more effective if they ARE the only one running as it confuses the caller.

I do like killing off my brothers, however. And they don't mind at all.


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Janie
Date: 07 Mar 08 - 08:54 AM

Being mentally challenged in all things regarding cosmology and particle physics, I don't know what the heck you guys are talking about - though the topic facinates nontheless.

Soon, all may be revealed.

In search of the God particle


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Subject: RE: BS: The Mother of all BS threads
From: Amos
Date: 06 Mar 08 - 11:20 PM

What a good borther you have!!! ROFLMAO!! I pity that poor woman -- you've given hernightmares!!


A


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