Origins: Anathea (from Judy Collins)

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 17 Mar 02 - 05:45 PM

Joan Baez sang the song as "Geordie," probably about the same time as Bok. In the Baez lyrics, he stole 16 royal deer and sold them in "Boeny."

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 17 Mar 02 - 10:31 PM

The reference on the website Dicho sited earlier on was wrong; it should have been Child #95, The Maid Freed from the Gallows, not #15, which is Leesome Brand.

I see no significant relationship between the Hungarian song and Geordie in any of its forms, and I don't believe that they can usefully be considered analogous.  The theft of horses and cattle is a commonplace in traditional song, as it was in life.  If there is a useful analogy to be made with anything in the Child corpus, it would be with #95, where the sexes of the protagonists are sometimes reversed, and where there is also a cumulative ransom motif.  Child cites a Swedish form which also includes a series of curses.  The song under consideration here was not known to Child, so we can't know how he would have classified it; so far, I am convinced that he would have referred to it under #95, not #209.

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: Art Thieme
Date: 17 Mar 02 - 11:13 PM

Frank Hamilton did a wonderful version of "Geordie" on a LP for Folkways.

Maybe this is the wrong place to mention it but in a Hungarian neighborhood along Lincoln Ave. in Chicago there is a wonderful small Hungarian bistro that is fairly well known for the contests they have every January to see which one among all the regular female patrons of the place is the most notorious rapper in the old country styles of that nation. Each year they make quite a show of giving her an award and naming her, officially, as the belle o' bar talk.

art

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Mar 02 - 12:35 AM

There are similarities to all of these.
Laszlo Feher-Annathea-
Man stole animal(s)
Man bound in chains
Man sentenced to hang
Maid rides to save him
Judge wants (gets) sexual favors
Man is hanged.

Child 95-
Maid (or man) stole silver cup (or crime not specified)
Maid (or man) sentenced to hang
Relatives won't help
Lover antes up and prisoner set free.
(A prickly bush or briery used in a chorus)

Child 209- (C versions)
Man stole animal(s)
Man may or may not be chained
Maid brings gold to save her lover
Her man confesses or he was already condemmed
Lawyer (or judge) says he has condemmed himself or been condemmed
Man is hanged.
(Main versions of 209 group concern a killing in battle)
The many variants make these songs difficult to classify, but the actions of relatives in Child 95, to me, sets that group apart. On the other hand, the venal judge sets Laszlo Feher-Annathea group apart. Admittedly, I am not a student of these songs, but I see more correlation in basic story between the "Hungarian" story and some of Child 209 versions.
So far, no history of the Hungarian song has been cited.

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 18 Mar 02 - 08:57 AM

I heard Bert Lloyd sing it (Laszlo / Anna Feher) and he claimed to have translated it himself. Incidently it was Toni Arthur who sang laszlo Feher - Dave just provided the guitar accompaniment.

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: GUEST,Rosemary Barrios
Date: 24 Dec 03 - 03:57 AM

Has anybody got the chords??? Thanks so much

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: breezy
Date: 24 Dec 03 - 04:47 AM

the 3rd Verse, 'Judge oh judge'

Is it at all possible that this verse is out of chronological order and ought to appear after she has gone to the judge?

I do think Dave Arthur would be interested in this thread.

I also think '!3 shelves of drugs wont ease his pain' has a more dramatic effect

start in an Am key

Am Lazlo..........................lion
F Stole him.......Am misty mount A major tains
F and they    ......   Am and they caught him
Am and G in F ir   Em on Dm chains they Am bound him


very dramatically and dynamic,like Toni, and wild hair

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: LesB
Date: 24 Dec 03 - 05:03 PM

I have just come across this thread and read it with interest. My memory of this song was from the singing of Mike Harding many years ago, and a right fine job he made of it too. He use to introduce it as having been translated from Hungarian.

Les

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Dec 03 - 09:43 PM

Those chords are close but not quite as I hear it.

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: breezy
Date: 25 Dec 03 - 06:28 AM

HAVE YOU HEARD THE tONI aRTHUR version to compare ?

as thats my only source

Could nt stand listening to bert at the best of times.

Listen out for a revival of the song in St Albans.

happy Christmas

Subject: RE: Lyrics for Anathea stole a stallion
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 25 Dec 03 - 11:35 AM

By the way, Odetta recorded it about the same time as Judy Collins. I'd have to pull out the LP to give you more particulars, but it was late '60s, and was similar to the Judy Collins version, but had some differences (which at this date I can't remember).

Linn

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Leadfingers
Date: 20 May 05 - 08:29 PM

Am                              Dm               Am    A
Laszlo Feher stole a stallion - stole him on the Misty mountains
Dm                   Am                        Dm    Am   E   Am
But they chased him and they caught him - And they hanged him from
G   Am
the gallows

Thats the basic Chord run I have used since nineteen canteen , wish I could do the ABC or dots or whatever !! I have this as done by Bert Lloyd - but dont ask me for more info as its a LONG time ago !!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Le Scaramouche
Date: 11 Jul 05 - 03:59 PM

Brother was listening to Led Zeppelin's reworking of "Gallows Pole" and a thought struck me. Judy Collins was rather big in the 60s wasn't she? Could this possibly be where they had the idea for their ending, or maybe used Seven Curses?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: GUEST,Jack Campin
Date: 15 Nov 05 - 12:37 PM

Here's the ABC as somebody asked:

X:1 T:Laszlo Feher S:Dave and Toni Arthur Songbook, 1970 Z:Jack Campin http colon slash slash www dot purr dot demon dot co dot uk slash jack slash N:bugger this stupid forms interface that won't let me insert a real URL N:and use a fixed width font M:4/4 L:1/8 Q:1/4=120 % guess, not in the book K:D Minor D3 E F2 D2 |zA-A G F2 D2| w:Lasz-lo Fe-her stole* a stall-ion B3 B c3 B |A2 D2 ^F2 A2 | w:Stole him on the mis-ty moun-tain B3 B c2 B2 | A2 D2 E2 D2| w:And they chased him and they caught him A3 G F2 E2 | D6 C2 | D2 D6|] w:And in ir- on chains they bound him

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 18 Nov 05 - 08:58 AM

Dicho's post of 16 Mar 02: Wrong translation!
The title used by Bartok in his "Magyar népdalok" is "Fehér László lovay lopoll." According to this site, the song was taken by Bartok from Child # 15, The Briary Bush

The original:
John Bauldie behauptet eine Verwandtschaft zur Child-Ballade Nr. 15 "The Briary Bush" und übersieht dabei nicht nur die völlig andere Konstellation der Personen sondern auch den ungarischen Namen des Protagonisten.
[John Bauldie claims a relation to Child #15 and ignores not only the totally different constellation of the persons, but the protagonist's Hungarian name, too.]

Tatsächlich existiert ein ungarisches Volkslied mit dem Titel "Fehér László lovat lopott", das auch Béla Bartók bei seinen Bearbeitungen "Magyar népdalok" verwendet hat.
[In fact there is a Hungarian folk song "Fehér László lovat lopott" which Béla Bartók used in his adaptions of "Magyar népdalok".]

character code: Western (ISO-8859-1)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: GUEST,Noelle
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 03:48 PM

Hi...

I would like to listen to the song "Anna Thea" on line as Judy Collins sang it...but I haven't been able to find it.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: bobad
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 04:34 PM

Noelle, try here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJvpRn5K23w

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: GUEST,DanLewis
Date: 30 Mar 09 - 08:22 PM

"Curse'd be that judge so cruel
Thirteen years may he lie bleeding
Thirteen doctors cannot cure him
Thirteen shelves of drugs not heal him!"

Great curse! Song structure and references to the powerful judge and overlord as well as the judge's golden bed all point to an 18th century origin more or less.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Jack Campin
Date: 30 Mar 09 - 09:00 PM

Here's one of the Hungarian versions: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ap5O9HHeOLk

There are a LOT of them. I have an MP3 CD of Bartók's cylinders (came with a book of transcriptions: Vera Lampert, "Népzene Bartók Müveiben", Néprajzi Múzeum, Budapest 2005, ISBN 9 789637 363092) which has 4 versions.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Jack Campin
Date: 30 Mar 09 - 09:12 PM

Another try at the ABC I posted before, this time with the linebreaks right:

  X:1
  T:Laszlo Feher
  S:Dave and Toni Arthur Songbook, 1970
  Z:Jack Campin
  M:4/4
  L:1/8
  Q:1/4=120 % guess, not in the book
  K:D Minor
  D3 E F2 D2 |zA-A G F2 D2|
  w:Lasz-lo Fe-her stole* a stall-ion
  B3 B c3 B |A2 D2 ^F2 A2 |
  w:Stole him on the mis-ty moun-tain
  B3 B c2 B2 | A2 D2 E2 D2|
  w:And they chased him and they caught him
  A3 G F2 E2 | D6 C2 | D2 D6|]
  w:And in ir- on chains they bound him.

Not a lot in common with the Hungarian original.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Jack Campin
Date: 30 Jul 10 - 08:23 PM

The Judy Collins version from 1963:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJvpRn5K23w

Introduced as "in the style of a French tragic ballad of the 13th century" and attributed to Lydia Wood. Complete with gratuitous yodelling and cowboy-horse-rhythm guitar accompaniment.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 31 Jul 10 - 12:18 AM

As someone ((possibly John Roberts) pointed out, the phrase "misty mountains" is almost a signature phrase for Bert Lloyd's work.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 26 Aug 11 - 07:35 AM

I have included a link to this thread in the information for this video which I have just uploaded to my YouTube channel. This is also attributed on the LP to L. Wood.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: GUEST,Don Wise
Date: 26 Aug 11 - 08:08 AM

In the dim recesses of my memory I seem to recall that 'Anna Feher' was the 'B'-side of a Dave and Toni Arthur single(!)-the 'A' side was 'Bushes and Briars' and was an attempt to cash in on the film version of 'Tess of the d'Urbervilles' starring Julie Christie. 'Bushes and Briars' as sung by Toni was featured in the film, possibly as the theme music.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Anglo
Date: 28 Feb 13 - 02:20 AM

I revive this thread as I just sat within 10' of Judy Collins as she sang Anathea, as part of a retrospective concert set she did at Folk Alliance Toronto. She attributed it to the Lydia Wood mentioned above in this thread, but not in a way that indicated that she knew who she was. I spoke to her very briefly about this as she was on her way out, saying I thought A.L. Lloyd had translated it from the Hungarian, but she seemed more interested in leaving (in all fairness she had spent quite a while signing autographs and stuff backstage, and not everyone is as interested in song origins as I am).

Like some others who posted above, I would like to know who Lydia Wood is. As I said long ago (in another thread, I think), whenever the phrase "misty mountains" comes up in a folk song, you can put your money on Bert's hand being there. And with the British-based singers' attribution of the song to Lloyd, I can only assume that someone ripped it off for the US copyright.

I know Judy Collins to be generous with copyright - many years ago she learned a song from Lou Killen (it might have been Tarwathie), and attributed it to Trad. Arr. Collins/Killen. The first Lou knew about it was when the check came in the mail.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 28 Feb 13 - 07:04 AM

Judy Collins will be touring England and Ireland later this year.

What an amazing performer - her 12 string guitar must weigh more than she does!

Dates announced so far;

Sunday   16th June Lagan Valley Leisureplex Lisburn
Monday   17th June Waterfront Hall Auditorium & Studio Belfast
Thuesday 20th June Tivoli Theatre Wimborne
Sunday   23rd June Kendal Town Hall

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: GUEST,guest, JoanC
Date: 21 Nov 13 - 03:50 PM

I've thought that the key theme in both "Anathea" and "Seven Curses" was that of supernatural vengeance. The gallows groaning or the ground beneath the gallows groaning is the natural order asserting itself when human justice fails.

The payment to the judge is not a bribe, but a payment of what Germanic tribes called "weregild" - practice common to many tribal societies - that could be demanded by the relatives of a murdered man in lieu of the death penalty for the murder. This restores the social order by paying to the relatives an amount equal to what the dead man would have contributed to their clan. In both cases, the judge accepted the payment, but killed the thief anyway. This was the unavenged injustice. The judge is also cursed with a disease that cannot be cured by natural means. Thus, justice is meted out by supernatural means.

We have something similar in the "Bonnie Swans" or the "Twa Sisters", where a harp made of a murdered girl's breastbone and hair sings out the name of the murderer. In this case, we can only assume that justice will be brought about by the girl's relatives having the murderer arrested; but, it is initiated by supernatural means.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Jack Campin
Date: 21 Nov 13 - 05:54 PM

The Laszlo Feher story is not Germanic, and Hungarian society had such extreme and pervasive class inequalities for so long that the idea of a poor person demanding "weregild" from an aristocrat would be unimaginable.

Subject: ADD: Seven Curses (Bob Dylan)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 30 Apr 14 - 02:57 PM

This morning, I heard an American version of this story. I didn't catch the name of the song or the (female) artist. I thought it started out "Bold Riley stole a stallion," and then went on with the same story as "Anathea." Has anyone else heard this, and can they tell me the title of the song and name of the artist?

-Joe-

---

I should have searched a little more.

I'm the one who posted it above (click)
Source: http://www.bobdylan.com/us/songs/seven-curses

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: GUEST,Peter L. Neff
Date: 04 Jun 21 - 12:47 PM

I interviewed Ethan Kenning (George Edwards-The Village Singers/H.P. Lovecraft) on May 26, 2021. Here is an excerpt that maybe helpful. "There was this woman out there years ago called Lydia Wood, and when I mention that name to people, nobody’s ever heard of her. She wrote one song that was recorded by Judy Collins, it was called “Anathea." Lydia Wood was a phenomenal talent. David Crosby used to back her up on twelve-string guitar. She was around the Chicago scene and later on for a very brief time in the New York scene. When I mention her name, no one knows who she is. In my opinion, she was one of the best woman writers, performers, guitar players. She played kick-ass guitar. She had a Martin D-28, played her butt off, and had the greatest smoky voice you ever heard in your life. Nobody ever heard of her. It’s something how these people fall through the cracks."

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 04 Jun 21 - 01:24 PM

Date: 07 Mar 01 - 11:51 PM I've never been completely satisfied with the lyrics in the database, so let me post what I found in the Judy Collins Songbook. Joe Offer
ANATHEA (words by Neil Roth, music by Lydia Wood)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: Jack Campin
Date: 04 Jun 21 - 02:19 PM

To put Don Wise straight for something he wrote upthread in August 2011: the film where Julie Christie's character sings "Bushes and Briars" was "Far from the Madding Crowd". That scene is all I remember from it except a lot of green hills.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Anathea (from Judy Collins)
From: GUEST,Jerry
Date: 04 Jun 21 - 03:06 PM

Quite right; a version of The Bold Grenadier also featured alongside the scenes featuring Sergeant Troy.