To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)

Subject: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Sep 03 - 05:43 AM

I know that there are a lot of folk club and festival organisers on Mudcat, as well as 'bookers' for more 'mainstream' venues. I just wondered, from your point of view, do you assume that, if a performer/band is interested in playing at your club/festival/venue, they will approach you (and therefore that if they haven't contacted you, they are probably not interested) or do you spend much time actively contacting performers yourselves, who you want specifically to book?

Subject: RE: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 09 Sep 03 - 05:59 AM

It's a bit of both really, When I am at festivals or clubs and see someone really good, I approach them. I also get loads of demo cd's in the post from performers from all over the world. some...yawn, yawn, but some are so good I play them over and over. If you are a performer, get a good cd done and post it to clubs, festival organisers etc. Take care with your presentation and packaging. First appearence means a lot and shows how serious you are. It'll cost you, but it'll pay off in the long run.

We're not actually booking anybody for next year's event, because BCFW is just a pub session fest. So saying, I always enjoy listening to stuff and can recommend you to other organisers.

Sal (Bishop's Castle Folk Weekend)

Subject: RE: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: Blowzabella
Date: 10 Sep 03 - 02:26 PM

I agree with Linda - if you decide to send a demo CD and promotional pack, make sure it looks as good as it sounds. Also, take time to be sure you aren't going to be wasting your time and money sending out stuff that's not appropriate - eg, a person organising something that is purely a blues festival won't want to receive a cd of maritime music for instance. It might be the best maritime cd in the world, but if the organiser's not looking for that kind of stuff, it won't get you a gig.

In answer to your question, I think it's quite common for organisers to expect an initial approach to come from a performer - unless there is a particular performer/band that they are interested in, of course, or they get lots of recommendations from their members/festivalgoers/regular audience - then they might take time to trawl the net for their contact details. Remember that they will have no trouble filling their schedule with people who have approached them, without having time to think about those who haven't.

Good luck

Subject: RE: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: Joan from Wigan
Date: 11 Sep 03 - 03:34 AM

As a folk club organiser, and a Day of Folk organiser, I too get many CDs from acts wanting gigs. But the folk club only runs on a singaround basis, and, by and large, so does the Day of Folk (although some local acts do approach me wanting to do extended sets for no payment for that, and I'm happy to accommodate them).

While I'm very happy to receive CDs, it never fails to amaze me that the people who send them, with a little homework, would easily be able to find out that we don't book acts, and thereby save themselves a fair bit of postage.

Another point to consider is that I rarely get a follow-up phone call after receiving said CDs. A phone call a week or two after sending, to an organiser who does book guests, may well turn into a definite booking. It's not enough to send the CDs out and then just sit back and wait.

So, do the homework beforehand, and the follow-up after, and the result should be more bookings for less expense.

Subject: RE: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: treewind
Date: 11 Sep 03 - 04:25 AM

OK - so what do you like to see in a promo pack? I know this has been done in another thread, but it didn't go into much detail about what actually goes into a mailshot like this.

Here's what's in one I've just designed, but I'm open to suggestions as it can always be changed.

CD - this is now a combined sampler (of two albums) and a demo. There are 9 tracks but they are all very short - none is a complete track, so there shouldn't be a serious copyright problem (the copyright for one album is not ours, but Wild Goose Studios). Total playing time about 15 mins. I have taken care to avoid tracks with extensive multitracking and/or other musicians so that they are reasonably representative of the live performance. I tip I picked up from that other thread was that a whole album may seem nice and generous but it does not make a good demo as your busy organiser effectively has a short attention span.

The label on the CD has full contact information in case the CD should part company with the printed material sent with it.

In the current version the CD is not in a jewel case, but in a self-seal paper envelope with transparent front. This cuts down on weight and postage cost (we might be sending out a lot of these)

That comes wrapped in a leaflet of a single A4 sheet of 110gsm paper folded in half (A5 sized). Printed on it is:

Front: big picture and title, not much else.
P2: The inside has a brief description of what we do, individually and together (we are a duo), then small pictures of the CD's and their names, then extracts from reviews.
P3: Track listing of the demo, showing which tracks come from which album
P4 (back): lots of small photos just for fun.

All except front page have contact info at the bottom: postal address, phone no. web page, email address.

All the pictures are in colour.

We think it looks nice, but I'd love to hear from organisers who have seen lots of these things about what's effective and what isn't. How about publicity posters - included optimistically on the assumption that they'll be needed, or sent on later if there's something to publicise? Anything else? Business cards, perhaps? Gig lists (these are always out of date!) Covering letter? Can you send too much? I'm considering slimline jewel cases for the CD to protect it better in the post. Does anyone care?

I'm fully aware of the need to do the research first - we have also made the mistake of turning up with instruments at a local-ish club to do an unannounced floor spot only to find out that the club's format was strictly booked support and main act. I always phone first now.

I take the point about following up afterwards - I suppose it's obvious when considered from the organiser's point of view, but the prospective perfomer might think that going to the effort of putting all that stuff in the post means the job's done.

Anahata

Subject: RE: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: Hovering Bob
Date: 11 Sep 03 - 04:52 AM

Yes, you've got to 'tout' for business; the folk world is full of reasonably talented performers sitting waiting for the knock on the door, for the majority it just doesn't happen!
I've some experience from both sides of the question, as 'an agency' and currently a folk club and festival organiser. Like Joan from Wigan, my festival, The Flanders Experience, doesn't book people to perform but I still get deluged with CD's. I can't complain, as the Festival is a member of, and listed in the Association of Festival Organisers mailing list. I have a standard reply that I send to applicants explaining the festival basis.
As a folk club organiser the situation is different and I can only emphasise the point made earlier, that presentation is everything. The range in standard of material that comes through the letterbox is amazing. I've had a tape, no case, with a (badly) sellotaped label that the would be performer had recorded at a live session in a busy pub. The best presentation, from the USA, was a well-produced CD in a very plush folder containing biog details and copious reviews of live performances. I didn't book either aspirant, the former for obvious reasons or the latter because they would have 'died' at our strongly traditionally orientated club.
Some performers and agents have a very screwed view of the folk world and get quite ratty when I don't immediately jump at the chance of making a booking. The simple facts are that at Herga we book one guest a month, that's twelve a year, which isn't many when you can get three or four requests a week. The club members vote each year on a wish list of performers that they have suggested they would like to see at the club. At least three quarters of the slots are filled from that wish list, so the dozens of hopefuls are actually competing for just two or three places. I tend to book between six months and a year ahead, so the phone calls and e-mails from performers sorting out a tour in the near future have no chance.
That's a long-winded way of saying, make it as good as you can but don't expect a massive response. In the last three years I have booked just one performer on the basis of their CD and that was as much due to the recommendation of a club member, another 'catter,' who had seen them perform and whose assessment I trust.
From the point of view of an Agent, keep at it, phone to see if a demo material would be appreciated, send it promptly and follow up at a sensible time after you've sent the package. Keep accurate records of all your approaches, you'll quickly lose track of all the contacts you have to make. And finally, grow a very thick skin, you'll need it.
(For 'Hovering' read 'waffling,' sorry!)

Subject: RE: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: GUEST,Windy Wailer
Date: 11 Sep 03 - 08:10 AM

That point about how far in advance you book is really interesting Bob. How does that compare to other bookers out there - is that about average?

Subject: RE: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: treewind
Date: 11 Sep 03 - 09:26 AM

It's about average.

Monthly clubs, or those with monthly guests, tend to book further in advance for obvious reasons. The Everyman in Saxmundham is booking over a year ahead. Beyond its published programme there is a short list of performers who are definitely in the queue but waiting for certain dates to be confirmed by those who have less flexible schedules before the others get fitted in.

Clubs with weekly guest nights seem to work on shorter notice. One example I can think of recently was booked about three months before the performance date. Shorter notice than that is rare - clubs often publish a quarterly newsletter.

Anahata

Subject: RE: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 11 Sep 03 - 11:12 AM

My club meets 10 times a year & usually has 2 acts, the first does 2 sets - 30 min & up to 60 min, the other 1 set of 30 min. Sometimes I change the format to 2 or 3 equal acts. We also have floor acts, usually chosen on the night (depending on who turns up), but sometimes booked.

The norm is 10 nights = 20 performers, however several nights are permanently booked - unaccompanied singing to start the year (the Dog audience is famous for its singing), 1 gig per year for my webmaster & the year finishes with my absolute favourite group (the audience like them too) - The Shiny Bum singers (Canberra Chris & friends). So that only leaves room for 16 or 17 acts & naturally lots more apply. Some can be wiped immediately - too late, not acoustic, not folk, & of course the most important one - I don't like it. One act will never get a gig cos he hounded me at work.

Normally I book months ahead (at Easter I inadvertently had the whole year booked) & as had been said above folks who contact me just before they tour ain't got a chance.

My audience is fairly traditional, as I am (Oz, UK, US) & is a singing audience (me too!!) & my predecessors & I have learnt that acts too far outside this just don't get audiences. We are also the best acoustic venue in Sydney & our lease precludes amplified music & the audience doesn't want it either. When we say traditional we don't just mean 19th or earlier 20th century work. Some songs written last year are traditional in style/format, some are dirges (& that artist didn't get a booking).

Presentation of demo CDs is irrelevant to me as I hand them over to the appropriate person for audition after having a listen. I'm not a performer so I ask performer friends for their professional opinions.

my rambling thoughts late at night.

sandra

Subject: RE: To Tout or Not to Tout (sort of)
From: vectis
Date: 11 Sep 03 - 07:21 PM

Seaford Folk Club books a guest almost every week we are open so that's about 40 a year.
Members ask for performers they have seen and liked.
I sus out good performers when I go to festivals or other clubs. Sometimes I hear a really good CD and am tempted but a CD does not tell me that the performer can 'work' an audience.
Quite a few people get bookings if they come along and do a floor spot and go down well.
I book up to 18 months in advance but usually have some vacant slots that can be filled at short notice (3 months).
The festival I co-organise does not book guests but some cracking performers have turned up and got local bookings because they went down a storm there.
Hope this helps
Mary