Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd

Subject: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: Chris in Wheaton
Date: 30 Sep 03 - 10:09 AM

It is a bit disconcerting to think that I may be the only person in folk music land who tries to sing the songs of Myrddin, but I have been learning to speak Welsh - even though at an advanced age (chwe deg) - and have discovered the great Welsh folk group Plethyn. I am hoping that there may be a 'Cath"er" with this same interest.
I am particularly enjoying the new Best of Plethyn cd on Sain.  As with their prior work, I can hear the lyrics clearly, and the background instruments do not intrude.  Unfortunately, while the booklet notes tell about the songs, the lyrics are not printed - and I am certainly not up to figuring out the Welsh lyrics.
Is there anyone who might help me learn songs written for Plethyn by the Welsh poet, Myrddin ap Dafydd, by providing Welsh lyrics, or a source for them?  I would particularly like the words to "Yn Dawach Na Dwr" (Thicker than Water) about the Falklands War and the meeting of a Welsh nurse and an Argentinian with Welsh roots.
Diolch yn fawr am eich help, Chris yn Wheaton

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: GUEST,Bruce O.
Date: 30 Sep 03 - 06:01 PM

There must be two (or more) 'Myrddin Dyfed', the earliest known
by that name being a bard of Maelgwn Gweyned (as was Taliesin)
just before 547 CE, when Maelgwn died of the plague. However, his
known works are some prophecies known as 'Triads'.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: sian, west wales
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 05:31 AM

Bad timing, Chris!

I was with Myrddin on Saturday (so, Bruce, neither of the one's you had in mind ...) He gave a really good lecture at the Welsh Folk Song Society weekend on writing traditional-style lyrics to old tunes and meters. I don't have those particular lyrics but you could always phone/write to him and ask him yourself (he's very approachable) at his publishing company.

A lot of us sing his songs, and a lot of his songs are already well on their way to being 'folk' as more and more singers lose track of who wrote the original. And I think that's happening because he chooses trad songs and Welsh meters which have a resonance with us culturally. (I think some of his are also Welsh translations or adaptations of Irish songs.)

Hwyl ar y canu!

sian

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: Chris in Wheaton
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 11:09 AM

Thanks, Sian - story of my life - I've glimpsed the gravy train, but only it's after it has left the station - in any event, good suggestion - I'll contact him - which of his songs are sung the most!
Chris
Also, you might contact Lynn with Ffynnon, and, if interested, see if you and Danny can get to the Chicago Celtic fest next year. The Chicago Welsh contingent would give you a good welcome. We enjoyed hearing Ffynnon this year.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: sian, west wales
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 04:54 AM

Haven't seen Lynne for a bit - must get in touch. Thanks for reminding me. Danny ... KilBride? The mind boggles at the thought of spending time in Chicago with KilBride! Would I have to sit next to him on the plane too? (Then I ain't goin'!)

Myrddin's written more songs than I can think of ... and I'm sure there are a lot which I didn't realize he wrote. I think he wrote "Y Gwylliaid yn y Gwydd" (on the measure 'Mentra Gwen') and I know he wrote "Mi Gysga Di, Mhlentyn" which Plethyn sings and is written to a well known Plygain tune. Again, I *think* he wrote "Gwaed ar eu Dwylo" about the Irish interred at Fron Goch, Bala and that's recorded by Plethyn too.

You're right: if he hasn't published a collection of all these, he should! Heck - he owns a Publishing House! If he doesn't, who will?

sian

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: pavane
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 03:46 PM

Bruce,

Dyfed is a place, Dafydd is a name (Welsh form of David).
Not the same thing

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: pavane
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 03:48 PM

Of course I am probably wrong, and someone could point out that Dyfed was an old version of the name... Was it?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: GUEST,Bruce O.
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 04:24 PM

pavane, you're probably correct, not me. For a few Welsh
name/places I know the apparent origins, and/or subsequent derivations
or spelling changes, but that's few indeed.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: GUEST,Bruce O.
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 04:27 PM

Chris, what Wheaton do you live in (I used to live in that in Wheaton, MD, USA)?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: GUEST,Bruce O.'m
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 04:53 PM

I'm even in the wrong thread. What's the original thread title where I introduced 17th century broadside ballads in Welsh? I think I can relocate i

t in the broadside ballad index on my websiiiite.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: sian, west wales
Date: 03 Oct 03 - 05:06 AM

Dyfed and Dafydd are from different roots, I'm pretty sure. But just to confuse things, Dyfed is also used as a man's name (usually for people born in Dyfed or with family connections.)

Bruce - you want to look for your "Welsh Songs" thread!

sian

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: pavane
Date: 03 Oct 03 - 08:34 AM

Of course, I'm an Alien, I'm a legal Alien, I'm an Englishman in South Wales.

So not an authority on Welsh!

(btw Mrs Pavane is singing in a pub in Pontardulais tonight)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: sian, west wales
Date: 03 Oct 03 - 08:52 AM

Oh, I see, Pavane. I thought you wuz lookin' a bit pale ...

sian

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: Chris in Wheaton
Date: 03 Oct 03 - 11:15 AM

Sian a phawb, I contacted Myrddin and he offered to fax me some of the lyrics. I'll certainly suggest that his fans would like to see the songs published.   But I can post some if anyone else is interested.
I also bought the new Meic Stevens tribute album and am enjoying most of it. Fortunately, his book does have lyrics for some of the songs on the cd.
Bruce, hope that you found the right thread. I was only joking about concentrating at more modern music (since 1634). It is always interesting to find the wide variety of topics on Mudcat - more power to 'y all.
I live in Wheaton IL and started to learn Welsh, because I wanted to stay awake on the loooong trainride downtown. I also enjoy singing Welsh songs, but my preference is for more modern songs, although - to me- this means songs from the 1890's on! Have a good weekend of music - canu'r dydd a chanu'r nos.
Chris

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: sian, west wales
Date: 03 Oct 03 - 11:27 AM

Told ya he was a good egg! (Tho' sounds a touch Luddite on the technology front!)

Some good songs on the Meic Stevens set too. (I take it you have the relatively recent 3-CD one?) Some are definitely in the 'anthem' category these days!

sian

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 03 Oct 03 - 08:50 PM

Meic Stevens (no 'v' in Welsh tho' !)
'Y Brawd Houdini' is the last one I recall, possibly ony because of the line "beth am bottel o gwrw" (what about a bottle of beer?!)

CHEERS (Hwyl Fawr)

Nigel

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 03 Oct 03 - 08:58 PM

Also , for the benefit of those with no Welsh (or very little, like myself!) Myrddin is the Welsh version of Merlin (sage to King Arthur), and Carmarthen town is 'Caerfyrddin' (the castle of Merlin). It includes an ancient tree Merlin's Oak

Nigel

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Myrddin ap Dafydd
From: GUEST,Bruce O..
Date: 03 Oct 03 - 10:12 PM

I think that Merlin is the English form of the Welsh Myrddin.