Folklore: Why do folkies have beards

Subject: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST,Firkin Freddie
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 07:25 PM

Hey, what is it with you folkies and your beards? I was in Whitby this summer for a spot of quiet fishing and all the folkies arrived, they all looked like Harold Shipman Clones!! I saw them again in Trafalger Square during the President's visit, "the great unwashed brigade" When I was a lad, a clean cut complextion was to be admired in a man. The women folk of these beardies also look the same, all frizzy long hair and even hairy armpits!!. Bring back national service, I hear the bugle sound.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST,Ely
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 07:46 PM

I don't know--is it a holdover from the Sixties protest era?

My dad isn't an active musician but he loves music (folk music, all kinds of music). He did graduate field work in Michigan 30 years ago and, if he had a beard, he could feel the bugs coming before they could bite him, but I don't think that's why the majority of folkies have beards. I grew up in Quaker meeting with plenty of bearded men but most of them were Sixties holdovers. Shall we examine photographic documentation--when did folkies start growing beards?

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Amos
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 07:48 PM

Aw g'wan. Real folkies have always been beard-wearers as often as not.


A

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Joe Offer
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 07:54 PM

It got me into some difficulty last year. I was supposed to meet somebody at Whitby Folk Week, and I described myself as "mid-50's, a bit of a paunch, and a white beard and thinning white hair." Somebody commented that during Folk Week, all the men in Whitby look like that.
It's our uniform, that's why!!!
-Joe Offer-

(Is this really a folklore thread???)

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 07:54 PM

I know plenty who don't have beards: Harvey Andrews, Archie Fisher, Iain Mackintosh, Andy Irvine, Dick Gaughan! Besides, I think it is perfectly possible to have a beard AND look tidy. Harold Shipman is a case in point ...

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST,pdq
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 07:56 PM

So their mothers won't recognize them!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 08:11 PM

Um, because I hate to shave?

"Did I shave my beard for this?"

~S~

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 08:17 PM

"When I was a lad, a clean cut complextion was to be admired in a man"

A POX on the eunuch who first invented shaving!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: SINSULL
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 08:20 PM

Not by choice. Menopause is a bitch!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Bill D
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 08:20 PM

because I don't like to shave, because I have a long, narrow chin which NEEDS 'softening'.......and because all the women in my life threaten me with terrible things if I shave it...*grin*

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 08:32 PM

Most male fokies do have beards, but I don't. I never liked them (on me, I mean...they look good on some people). I like being clean shaven all the time, and concentrating on having a good head of hair on top (Bob Dylan style mop/halo). Perhaps I have not gone bald because the hair didn't all migrate to my chin... :-) Getting a few gray ones now, but not bad.

Check out my pics.

- LH

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: allanwill
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 09:08 PM

As the old saying goes, and in my case it's true, "beards hide funny faces".

Allan

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Leadfingers
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 09:08 PM

I HAD to shave every day for fourteen years ( R A F Service ) so when I got promoted to civilian I stopped shaving ( and having my hair cut evrey seven days)   That's my story and I am sticking to it.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 09:12 PM

I doubt very much if "most male folkies" have beards. It's another of those silly stereotypes which would be considered racist if applied to identifiable ethnic groups. Consider, for example, these leading questions:

Why are Scotsmen mean?

Why are Irishmen stupid?

Why are Englishmen snobs?

Why are Welshmen dishonest?

Why are Frenchmen smelly?

All of these imply a generally-applicable (and, in context, pejorative) characteristic without offering any evidence to support the assertion: the usual example is "When did you stop beating your wife?"

Generally speaking, men have beards unless they choose to remove them. Facial hair suits some people and not others. It's a fairly pointless subject for a conversation.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: momnopp
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 09:12 PM

I prefer my men furry. And what's wrong with hairy armpits? The hair grows there for a REASON, same as all hair. Personally, I don't understand the current American penchant for hair-less-ness; men shaving their heads, women shaving ALL hair that's not on their heads and even men shaving exceptionally sensitive areas...

I'll take a bearded folkie any day! :-)

JudyO

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST,ozmacca
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 09:32 PM

Despite the apparent evidence to the contrary, I shave every day. If that razor blade was good enough for my father, and his father before him, then it's good enough for me.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: JennyO
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 09:33 PM

I have a bearded folkie around here these days, and very nice he is, too! I can't imagine him without his beard.

Jenny

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 09:33 PM

Since The Lord Almighty saw fit in His infinite wisdom to allow the bountious curly locks that once adorned the top of my head to fall out and be swept down the drain-hole, I find that if I wish to experience the miracle known as "hair growth" I have to use my face as the growing ground.

And... I would have a beard whether I was a folkie or not. I could just as easily be a bearded rock-n-roller or a bearded bluesman or a bearded jazzman. It just happens that more of the music that I play tends to fall under the folk umbrella than outside of it so I guess I'm a bearded folkie.

Bruce

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Beer
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 09:48 PM

This is a great thread (well maybe not THAT great). I bet guest thought of this over a few joints.
Job Offer: "It's Our Uniform That's Why" What a great line. Hay you song writers pick up on it.
Malcom Douglas: Great Ending
    Beards are not just from the 60's and 70's. Check out our ancestors. Hell they all had beards.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Padre
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 10:08 PM

The wearing of facial hair has gone through cycles, which can easily be seen by looking at portraits of US Presidents:

George Washington NB
John Adams NB
Thomas Jefferson NB
James Madison NB
James Monroe NB
John Qincy Adams NB
Andrew Jackson NB
Martin Van Buren MuttonChops
William Henry Harrison NB
John Tyler NB
James K Polk NB
Zachary Taylor NB
Millard Fillmore NB
James Buchanan NB
Abraham Lincoln B
Andrew Johnson NB
Ulysses S Grant B
Rutherford B Hayes B
James A Garfield B
Chester A Arthur MuttonChops
Grover Cleveland Mustache
Benjamin Harrison B
William McKinley NB
Theodore Roosevelt Mustache
William H Taft Mustache
Woodrow Wilson NB
Warren G Harding NB
Calvin Coolidge NB
Herbert Hoover NB
Franklin Roosevelt NB
Harry Truman NB
Dwight D Eisenhower NB
John Kennedy NB
Lyndon Johnson NB
Richard Nixon NB
Gerald Ford NB
Jimmy Carter NB
Rondald Reagan NB
George Bush NB
Bill Clinton NB
George W Bush NB

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Cluin
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 10:24 PM

Testosterone will do that to ya.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Blackcatter
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 10:27 PM

For goodness sake. Why, oh, why is this not listed as BS? At least somebody mention song lyrics!

And Padre, thanks for the historical note, but what cycle are you talking about? I see:

7 NB
1 mutton
6 NB
1 B
1 NB
3 B
1 mutton
1 mustache
1 B
1 NB
2 mustache
16 NB   Where exactly is the cycle?

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: HuwG
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 10:35 PM

Sorry, Suzanne (skw), but a beardless Andy Irvine ? Possibly on old album covers, but having carried sound and lighting gear for the guy once or twice, I beg to differ.

One might use beards to distinguish the true folkie from the ones that still need day jobs. And among the hirsute, one can also contrast the "Captain Birdseye" set of the shanty-singer from the "Worzel Gummidge" style of the Somerset agricultural song specialist.

Most of the (male) folkies I know have four or five days' growth and resemble Stilton cheese that should have been thrown out last week (though most violinists are clean shaven). I usually wear moustache only See photo. Obviously a lightweight !

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 10:52 PM

Shaving helps me maintain my boyish good looks, my youthful innocence, my childlike sense of wonder. Besides, every time I've tried to grow more than a mustache I've given up because of the coarseness of the stubble.

It's a horrible thing to wake up in the night and find that you chest is all raw and bleeding from the beard you are trying to grow.

Now, I actually don't shave. I do what the loggers do: drive 'em in with a hammer and bite 'em off inside. (Hairballs, however, are becoming a problem recently.)

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Amos
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 11:47 PM

Rapaire:

I would expect you'd be scratched twice by your stubble under that regimen!

A

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 20 Nov 03 - 11:49 PM

"women shaving ALL hair that's not on their heads and even men shaving exceptionally sensitive areas"

Nothing beats an uncarpeted basement!

:-)

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Mooh
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 12:03 AM

Bearded. Lots on unbearded guys (and gals) in Mudcat Photoland though. My kids have never seen me without I think.

Peace, Mooh.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Blackcatter
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 12:05 AM

Rapaire - you're not supposed to SWALLOW the beard hair!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Margret RoadKnight
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 01:13 AM

Always intrigued why people in this scene label others & themselves "Folkies"?
(No wonder the general public can be dismissive of this fantastic genre).
"Jazzies"? "Bluesies"? "Classicies"? - I don't think so!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: mouldy
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 01:33 AM

It took me 10 years of "pre-folk" nagging to get his lordship to grow one. He's had the beard for 20 years now, and I used to have nightmares tht he'd shave it off and terrify our youngest, who has never sen her dad without one. He looks better with it, too. He used to joke that when his balding head reached a certain stage, he'd have a facelift.
The other advantage is that you can catch any beer dribbles in it, and collect them before they drip off.

My son informed me last night that he'd grown a goatee over the last 2-3 weeks, but that his skin became very dry and irritated under it, and so he's had to shave it off again. (He's one of these allergic types. He tried water soluble moisturisers from the chemist, but all it did was moisturise the whiskers).

As to why beards are so prevalent amongst the folk circuit - I don't really know. It may be just hearkening back to the "rustic". Any photographs of rural dwellers from the 19th century have quite a high proportion of men with side-whiskers or beards. Anything earlier is second hand, via an artist's (sometimes idealised) interpretation. At one time, in some cultures, the beard was supposedly the badge of the barbarian!

Andrea

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: ossonflags
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 03:07 AM

As in the navy, we dont grow beards we just stop shaving.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: ossonflags
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 03:11 AM

And in answer to an earlier thread, what is wrong with hairy armpits? you dont shave your arse do you?

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Dave Masterson
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 03:45 AM

I was at a Morris Ring meeting years ago attended by about 250 dancers and overhead the following conversation -
"Have you seen so-and-so?"
"What's he look like?"
"Oh, you know, white shirt and a beard."
White shirt and a beard at a Ring meeting..............

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 03:50 AM

...and strangely, whereas the jazz audience has always been prone to beards, full-on for traddies and goatees for modernists, the blues audience tends to be clean-shaven (though the bald forehead and ponytail look is still, [unwisely, IMHO]favoured by some).

RtS
(handsomely* cleanshaven)

*A lawyer writes:this contravenes the Trades description Act

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 05:02 AM

My beard hides a multitude of chins.

At one of the Bracknell "Handsome Mouldiwarp" Folk Festivals there was a prize for correctly challenging "Frank Ignobody" who was a character in a wonderful cartoon strip "Borfolk" which Lawrence Heath used to produce for "Southern Rag" the predecessor of "Folk Roots". The picture of a bearded folkie would have fitted over half of the fellows - and quite a few of ladies as well !

I can understand why some women do feel it neccessary to depilate their arms, legs, upper lips etc - more than a light down on these areas is thought to be unfeminine. Genital and underarm hair are normal after puberty for both sexes and I see no reason to think of them as at all unattractive and definitely not unfeminine in women (rather the reverse in fact). If a woman wants to look like a little girl why doesn't she have mastectomies as well ?

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST,Clint Keller
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 05:15 AM

In the Army I had to get a haircut weekly and shave twice a day.

The hell with it.

clint

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Dani
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 07:47 AM

Because they look good!

But our own Kendall is another fine and handsome example of the exception. There are plenty, but I do think it seems to be a folky thing.

Maybe as a group (grossly over-exaggerated) they're just a little less concerned with what others think of how they look, and how long it takes to make yourself fit another's mold? Lord, think of the singing we could do if we weren't shaving, and the whiskey we could buy instead of razors!

A pox on him AND her who started shaving. It's probably the guy who invented nylon stockings.

One thing I wondered while watching the otherwise admirable Master and Commander movie was how in the hell those guys (who were OLD enough) mananged to stay so cleanshaven on board that rollicking ship with straight-razors?!

Dani

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Peterr
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 07:56 AM

Before I got into folk, I did a lot of caving and climbing (late 60s-70s) and it was beards then. Something to do with the mindset, though I didn't grow one to have the uniform. My daughter now 24 has seen me twice without a beard. First time she was about 5, burst into tears and wouldn't come near me until it grew back.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 08:02 AM

Why do folkies have beards? Because they have more sense than to stand in front of a mirror scraping their faces. Why on earth do you beardless guys do it anyway?

(please note I am a woman and beardless)

Sal

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 08:24 AM

There are some people who shave the hair off the top of their heads every day. They are often considered a little bit eccentric for doing this, since the more customary procedure is to let it grow to a less or greater extent and then trim it.

I've never understood why the attitude towards hair at the top end of the head is different from that towards hair at the lower end.

Incidentally - do men ever go bald in the beard area?

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Bill D
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 10:03 AM

I'm sure there are men whose jobs insist on shaving...implicitly, if not explicitly. I also think that men whose taste runs to folk music and the social whirl THAT entails, 'tend' to not have the kind of jobs that require shaving (and 3 piece suits..etc.) And as noted, guys who have endured military rules for a few years often quit shaving as soon as they're out!

As to presidents, it seems to me that the decline of beards roughly parallels the introduction of photography, easy travel via train & airplane, movies, and finally... TV. The candidates can easily be seen now, and are afraid to do ANYTHING which might affect their 'image'. Remember how much comment there was about Al Gore temporarily growing a beard, even after the election?

One thing about MY shaving is that I tend to get irritation and ingrown hairs just below the chin, thus the faily uncommon muttonchop style...every now & then I let the center grow, and I am always sorry...

And regarding shaving other areas of the body...it has been theorized that genital & armpit hair were retained during evolution as ways to retain and concentrate pheromones and served to enhance sexual awareness. (My ex-wife years ago specifically preferred me in that state between "scrubbed clean" and "overripe") [a delicate balance]......But now that western society and the advertising industry promotes daily scrubbing away of any trace of 'natural' odor, and modern swim suits have been reduced to a few square inches..*grin*, what chance do those poor, embattled nether locks have?

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: muppett
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 10:12 AM

I had a beard in my early folkie days, as I didn't have much money I found my beard a useful way of storing food in it, so didn't have to leave the pub to go for a meal !!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: EBarnacle
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 10:17 AM

One time, many years ago, I was interviewing for a job with the Army. The Interviewer asked whether I was very attached to the beard. My response: It grows on me. end of interview.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 12:43 PM

folkie beards... love them !

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST,Les B.
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 12:47 PM

I'm reminded of what my uncle said to me on seeing my first attempt at a beard - "Jesus Christ, why are you cultivating on your upper lip what grows wild around your asshole ?!?"

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 12:53 PM

Real men wear beards, drink cider and make their own dresses.


I have a beard for medical reasons - clinical ugliness


Doug C

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST,pdq
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 01:11 PM

This thread provides more evidence that Jerry Garcia was a Folkie!

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 01:25 PM

When people ask me why I have a beard-which I don't at the moment - I always turn the question around and ask why most men don't have beards. Having a beard is, after all, a more natural state because to not have a beard entails a conscious decision to shave very day.

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 02:26 PM

Surely the reason is because kissing a man without a beard is like eating an egg without salt.

Dave
www.collectors.folk.co.uk

Subject: RE: Folklore: Why do folkies have beards
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 21 Nov 03 - 02:43 PM

Ya kissed a lot of men with and without beards Dave?

heh