A Plague of Songwriters?

Subject: RE: A Plague of Songwriters?
From: PoppaGator
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 04:07 PM

We do need a continuing supply of good new songs, so there do need to be new songwriters learning their craft at all times. And, I suppose, it is only to be expected that even the best writers' early efforts be less than impressive.

But, sheeeesh! There are just so *many* really lousy self-penned songs, many not showing a glimmer of promise.

Part of the problem is that the current structure of the music business offers greater compensation for writing/publication than for performance, and anyone hoping to make a living at music is almost forced to take a shot at being a "composer."

Hence the appeal of non-commercial music.

Subject: RE: A Plague of Songwriters?
From: Amos
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 03:41 PM

It can take as much time and focus to learn how good songs work as it does to learn how to play an instrument well. It is not a trivial proposition. And people who bumble around with it, without bothering to understand why songs survive and why they don't, are just blocking traffic and imposing. "It's Henglish, ain't it? Well, there y' are!! Hi speeks Henglish!! Woddyer tink?"

A

Subject: RE: A Plague of Songwriters?
From: PoppaGator
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 03:23 PM

I just posted a fairly lengthy rant in another thread, decrying the abysmal quality of "original" material imposed upon the audience by individuals and groups who can be perfectly enjoyable performers as long as they stick with good, established, proven songs.

The way El Greko posed his opening argument here gave me pause. Why, indeed, should aspiring songwriters be judged more harshly than other amateur performers? Perhaps I've been unfair in my attitude.

NAAAHHHHH!

Ron has got it right. Amateur/mediocre singers and players of known tunes (traditional or popular) tacitly invite the audience to participate (by "active listening" if not by outright sing-along-ing), but with aspiring songwriters, we have no alternative but to sit still and listen, for better or for worse.

In my salad days as an active busker, a great many of my fellow performers were writing songs, and most of them, well, sucked -- big time. The offenders were still my friends, and were usually fairly talented singers and/or pickers as long as they stuck to proven material, but I rarely enjoyed listening to their efforts at composition, and it was worse when they asked me to comment. (I'd usually white-lie, of course.)

There are rare exceptions, of course. Only one of my many musical acquaintances from that era ever really impressed me as a songwriter, even when she was just a teenager. After many years laboring in obscurity, and she did eventually "make it" to moderate commercial success (and substantial critical success as well). But, that's just the exception that proves the rule, as far as I'm concerned.

Subject: RE: A Plague of Songwriters?
From: mg
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 03:16 PM

well, if someone is pretty awful but they sing a song everyone knows, you can all chime in and keep them on key etc...if it is not a song anyone knows, but has a tune or chorus, you can hum along etc..but if it is a tuneless sort of tune there is sfa you can do except listen to the lyrics and I am not one who really listens to the lyrics..I'd rather read them..who knows...there are some great ones that come along this way...mg

Subject: RE: A Plague of Songwriters?
From: The Shambles
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 03:03 PM

The writer (and usually the performer) of original songs does have a hard time. They can be accused of pushing their creations upon people but of course if they don't sing their song - no one else will. So they are rather damned if they do and damned if they don't.

We are all different and I would liken songs to houses, which we all need. Songs (to folkies anyway) are just as necessary. Some of us will move in to a house exactly as it is, some of us will knock it around a bit, to our own personal preference and some will need to build from scratch.

Subject: RE: A Plague of Songwriters?
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 02:48 PM

a) The difference is that usually in a folk club, the below average singer and or instrumentalist is "participating" in a communal setting - everyone is usually joining in. This indidividual is usually doing their thing for fun, not profit.

The songwriter usually "performing" in an environment where the listener is an audience, not a participant. Songwriters often have aspirations of performing on a higher stage. They become open to criticism.

If I am given a home cooked meal, I am likely to be less criticial that I would if I pay to have a similar meal in a restaurant.

Please note - I am using the words "usual" and "often" in my comments. There are no universal truths in the scenario that El Greko suggested.

b) Be patient and open to suggestion.


Ron

Subject: RE: A Plague of Songwriters?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 02:30 PM

a) Do we judge songwriters more harshly than other folk singers/ musicians and if so, why?

The audacity of public originality?

b) What advice would you give to a songwriter wanting to inflict their "baby" project on you, in order to make it more interesting for you?

For me? Well, don't suck for starters... heh (Good advice eh?? LOL) I donno.. how do you write a song so that I'll like it? I'd be happy if -I- could write songs that -I- liked!

Subject: A Plague of Songwriters?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 18 Dec 03 - 02:23 PM

In the world of collective nouns, my favourite is a "business" of ferrets (so apt!). But recently in various threads there seems to be a tendency to create a new one: a "plague" of songwriters.
Now, why is it that in the folk club or session environment we often (rightly) endure and support the average or below-average singer or player of an instrument, yet we judge songwriters so much more harshly; as if they are to be scolded simply for wanting to inflict their creation/abomination on us?
Songwriting is a form of expression, like singing, playing music, reading poetry or prose, story-telling, joke-telling etc. The majority of songwriters do not aspire to greatness; only to tell the others about the world as they see/feel it. It's like somebody lending you their kaleidoscope - you may not see what they see, but you get the idea.
So, two questions:
a) Do we judge songwriters more harshly than other folk singers/ musicians and if so, why?
b) What advice would you give to a songwriter wanting to inflict their "baby" project on you, in order to make it more interesting for you?

Seconds away...Round one: Discuss