|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: Pete_Standing Date: 09 Jan 04 - 03:29 AM Now I know why I've never been able to find it second-hand in a book shop, most people who have one copy then got a second! It's kind of ironic that the cheaper paper-whitening process referred to earlier should have made the pages go yellow (hey isn't sulphur yellow?). Trivia aside, this is really great news and well done and many thanks to Malcolm. There are plenty of other books with folk songs out of print. Amongst those that I have borrowed from the library in Oxford are two by Cecil Sharp, at least one by Frank Kidson, another by Lucy Broad-whats-her-name - I was a wee bit upset that someone had chosen to scribble and makes notes in some of them, if I hear "Froggy Goes a Courting" at Oxford FC, my suspicions will be raised. Once again, thanks Malcolm. You've made it a little bit easier for those of us who can't just pop in to the EFDSS or afford to buy a series of CD's like the "Voice of the People" to enjoy some of the old songs. |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: Watson Date: 16 Jan 04 - 07:56 AM Our copy arrived in the post yesterday, ordered by post directly from EFDSS. I'm going to be spending endless hours going through all the songs I'm singing wrongly! Thanks Malcolm. Nobody with an interest in English traditional song should be without this book. |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: John Routledge Date: 16 Jan 04 - 09:28 AM Thanks Malcolm. Have just ordered a copy by telephone from Cecil Sharpe House. Phone 020 748 2206. Ask for The library and give card number. Book despatched same day. Now watch UK postal system. Happy reading singing and learning!! |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: John Routledge Date: 16 Jan 04 - 09:30 AM SORRY Phone number is 020 7485 2206. Must proof read |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 20 Jan 04 - 10:59 PM I've been asked to mention that the charge for postage and packing is now £2.00; it turns out that £1.50 was a pre-Christmas offer. There's now a review at Musical Traditions: Classic English Folk Songs Rod Stradling has some (perfectly reasonable) reservations about the way we approached the revision, but 'restoring' the texts to their unmediated forms and quoting all the material on which Bert Lloyd drew for his modifications would have, at a conservative estimate, more than doubled the size of the book; it simply wasn't an option. I can't expect anyone who hasn't spent several months exploring all the background (I may be the only person who has done this in recent years) to appreciate the extent of it all. On the whole, Rod approves of the material I've added (if not of my introduction, which was always likely to fall a bit uncomfortably between two or more stools, aimed as it was both at new readers and at people long since familiar with 'Penguin', some of whom will also be aware of at least some of the editorial issues involved) and of David Atkinson's new bibliography. I value Rod's opinion, and am rather relieved that I got off so lightly, and that he recommends it as "an essential purchase". Couldn't reasonably ask for more. |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: DADGBE Date: 21 Jan 04 - 01:20 AM I also had the 1959 edition - long gone now. It was a gem. Thank you Malcom for your hard work. I'll buy one from you Dick. |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: John Routledge Date: 21 Jan 04 - 05:01 PM Malcolm - I loved your introduction. To me it tried to set out the reality. Following my order from Cecil Sharp House at 2.15pm Friday book arrived at 9.30am Saturday. Very traditional service :0) |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: Bob Bolton Date: 22 Jan 04 - 04:22 PM G'day Malcom, I just got the Mulga Wire (Inc. Singabout) review copy (Sydney, Australia ). It was addressed to Colin Fong, my co-editor for Mulga Wire, but I'm sole editor of Singabout - the folklore section, so I've snaffled it for review!) It was accompanied by your Press Release ... details of direct sales &c ... is there likely to be a direct distributor in Australia? ... If not, do I just suggest that punters send off an Australian currency cheque for the equivalent of £16.99 ... or will overseas postage be higher? ... Can we of the Antipodes order directly from the EFDSS web site? ... In what currency? BTW: It looks bloody good - nice layout, notes, lovely paper and feel ... as well as all those classic English songs! Regards, Bob Bolton |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 22 Jan 04 - 05:19 PM Best thing is to email Felicity Greenland at EFDSS for details; fortunately I have nothing to do with distribution or sales! felicity.greenland@efdss.org |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: Roberto Date: 29 Jan 04 - 11:54 AM I've just received my copy of the book from EFDSS. I am very pleased with it. I have the Penguin's, that I've had to bind. I remember that when I bought it, many years ago, there also was a Penguin Book of Carols. Was it a good book? Is it still available? My congratulations to Malcolm Douglas. Roberto |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: GUEST,JohnB Date: 29 Jan 04 - 12:30 PM My old copy has no cover, so I had to look inside, it is a 1961 reprint of the 1959 original. It was sitting on the shelf next to the Penguin Book of Canadian Folk Songs. It's not that I am organized, it's just that the books are about the same size. I sure will be buying the new one, but I will have to buy another pack of toilet rolls to interleave in what looks like MOST of the pages. Well done Malcolm, JohnB |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 29 Jan 04 - 10:09 PM There were three Penguin carol books; The Penguin Book of Carols (ed. Ian Bradley); The Penguin Book of Christmas Carols (ed. Elizabeth Poston); and The Second Penguin Book of Christmas Carols (ed. Elizabeth Poston): the last being a collection of carols from American sources. So far as I know they are all out of print, the Bradley was I think last issued in 2000. Search results via BookFinder.com: Penguin Book of Carols You can also find second hand copies via Amazon. |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: dick greenhaus Date: 17 Feb 04 - 03:54 PM Hurrah! (or maybe Hooray!) I finally received a shipment of Classic English Folk Songs for resale. The discount is less than I can often provide, but that's 'cos EFDSS doesn't discount as heavily as some other publishers. Anyhow, you can get a copy for $26 (US) which is a bit less than the $28.50 that EFDSS charges. Shipping within the US is $2.75 (first class mail) or $1.50 (media mail.) I don't know what shipping charges overseas would be, but I can find out if anyone's interested--EFDSS charges $2.85 for shipping within the UK. It's a nice edition (thanx, Malcolm). You can order by E-mail, PM, or phone (800/548-FOLK <3655>). The most secure way to order over the net is to send the 8 of the 16 digits of a credit card number via PM and the remaining 8 digits, along with the expiry date, by E-mail. dick greenhaus CAMSCO Music dick@camsco.com |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: dick greenhaus Date: 19 Feb 04 - 12:17 AM Just to point out that Malcolm's work was in no way inconsequential. The 154 page volume has over 75 pages of copius, literate, interesting notes. |
|
Subject: RE: Penguin Folk Songs re-issued From: Stilly River Sage Date: 19 Feb 04 - 12:46 AM Dick, I got your message that it was in--sorry I didn't respond before. I was on the road and on someone else's slow computer. I'll send a PM later and work out the purchase. SRS |
|
Subject: Folklore: Classic English Folk Songs From: Shanghaiceltic Date: 25 Feb 04 - 03:57 AM The EFDSS has republished the old tome the Penguin Book of Englsih Folk Songs under the title 'Classic English Folk Songs' I just noticed the mention of it in the latest fRoots mag. Go to www.efdss.org and look at 'Mail order' I moved this message here from another thread on the same topic. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Joe Offer Date: 25 Feb 04 - 04:12 AM I got my copy today, and it really is a nice revision. The $26 (US) price tag was a bit steep for a 154-page paperback, but I think supporting a notable reissue like this is worthwhile. If only 1,000 copies were printed, it's no wonder that it's expensive. Malcolm's background notes are up to his usual standard of excellence. It's hard to imagine that anybody could improve upon the work of R. Vaughan Williams and A.L. Lloyd, but I think Malcolm did it. Nice work, Malcolm. -Joe Offer- Malcolm posted this link above. Be sure to take a look, and follow the links to reviews. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: greg stephens Date: 25 Feb 04 - 04:18 AM Well, I've just got my copy. I notice that Malcolm Douglas has failed to correct Bert Lloyd's ridiculous assertion that Walney Island is in Westmorland. As any skoolboy knows, it was in Lancashire when Bert was writing, and has since been reallocated to Cumbria. I really think Mr Douglas should do a bit of basic research before putting pen to paper. (PS only joking, Malcolm) PPS It could be,of course, that Bert L was only quoting a geographically challenged source singer, but that case this should be covered in a footnote. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: greg stephens Date: 25 Feb 04 - 04:38 AM Another point: earlier in this thread there is some speculation as to who the pictures on the front, and I dont think it was ever answered. It looks like McColl on the right(is this a joke on Malcolm's part, as he claimed to be Scottish?). The middle looks vaguely like Phil Tanner, but I dont think it is(unless this is Malcolm having another joke, as Tanner was Welsh?). Can someone identify these for sure? |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Joe Offer Date: 25 Feb 04 - 04:50 AM Greg - Click, and ye shall find - and it's an interesting review, too. -Joe Offer- |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: greg stephens Date: 25 Feb 04 - 06:23 AM Thanks for the lnk, Joe. To save people time, the answer to my request for identification of all three pictures on the cover: they are Eliza Carthy, Henry Burstow,and Ewan McColl. An interesting set. I can see why Burstow(example of source singer that supplies the contents of the book);Carthy(most successful young person who sings material out of the book); but why McColl? The book is not about fantastic sonwriters, slobbering adulators of Stalin, or great interpreters of Scottish ballads. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 25 Feb 04 - 08:44 AM I fear that Geography was never my strong suit, and it doesn't seem to have been Bert's, either. I did correct a few cases where he had mixed up Lancashire and Yorkshire. He also placed Casterton in Lancashire; I put it back in Westmorland in line with contemporary references (first decade 20th century); nowadays I suppose it's Cumbria (though I think it has a Lancashire post code?). Political and administrative boundaries are rather a minefield! I missed Walney Island, so thanks for pointing that out. I'm in the process of putting together a series of webpages for additions and corrections to the book, and will add the information. "Additions" will eventually include supplementary material that there wasn't room to print in full, and further stuff that I've become aware of since, such as a late 18th century broadside text of One Night as I lay on My Bed that I didn't find in time to mention in the notes. A number of people were involved in consultation for the cover design (including me; but obviously the final decision was made by the people who were paying for it). The intention was to make the point that folk song has a long history but is alive and well, belonging to (and sung by) young people as well as older generations. This is not a new approach, but in the past has resulted in cover designs featuring young female guitar players dressed in the fashion of the day, which look dated almost immediately. I wanted to avoid that insofar as was possible, and not tie the design too much to any one particular period. You need iconic images, though, of one sort or another. The pictures of Eliza and Henry were my suggestions (I particularly wanted to use a picture of Eliza singing and playing fiddle. Guitars are not compulsory!), while the photos of Ewan -and Peggy Seeger in the background- came, if I recall correctly, from the VWML. While these last have no direct connection with the contents of the book, they are certainly iconic figures associated with the revival. The photo of Eliza is identified on the back cover, as it's recent and copyright; ideally the other pictures should have been listed too, but design was finalised at quite a late stage in production and those details were overlooked. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: dick greenhaus Date: 25 Feb 04 - 09:01 PM Greg- You may be one of many who don't like MacColl's songs, or one of the very many who don't like his politics, but it's asinine to deny his vast importance in performing, collecting and promulgating traditional music. |
|
Subject: Classic English Folksongs(Penguin) From: greg stephens Date: 26 Feb 04 - 06:19 AM The thread on the subject of this re-issue(the book is excellent, by the way, everybody buy a copy) is closed with a big red notice. Anybody got any idea why? Havent seen any signs of racist trolls, personal abuse or whatever. Messages from multiple threads combined. Messages below are from a new thread. The original thread must have been closed by mistake, and I was offline last night because my phone line was dead. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English Folksongs(Penguin) From: treewind Date: 26 Feb 04 - 02:51 PM Beats me. The reference to Ewan McColl hardly merited closing the thread. Surely Penguin books didn't object to their name being mentioned parenthetically in the title? Also fairly recent from EFDSS is "Still Growing" well worth a look and we've got a new song out of it! Anahata |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English Folksongs(Penguin) From: dick greenhaus Date: 26 Feb 04 - 03:36 PM And just to remind folks, CAMSCO is still accepting orders. $26 (US) + $1.50 media mail postage. Call 800/548-FOLK (3655) |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English Folksongs(Penguin) From: Ed. Date: 26 Feb 04 - 05:31 PM "Still Growing" well worth a look and we've got a new song out of it! An old song surely... :-) Agree. Seems very strange to close the thread. Someone must have made a mistake, I think |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Joe Offer Date: 27 Feb 04 - 03:03 AM Click here to get to the EFDSS book order page, which includes information about Classic English Folk Songs and Still Growing, collection of fifty songs from Sharp's original manuscripts. -Joe Offer-
-Joe Offer- |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: greg stephens Date: 27 Feb 04 - 03:27 AM Dick Greenhaus: I dont like Ewan McColl's politics, this is true. But dont say I dont like his songwriting: I sing them regularly, and as you will see in the post you were referring to, I actually referred to him as a fantastic songwriter. I just thought using his photo in the context of this particular book of English folksongs was questionable: what exactly was the implication? Why not Bert Lloyd himself, for example? I am disappointed this thread was closed by accident: I had a much more interesting conspiracy theory, in which the power-that-be closed all threads where someone criticised a Stalinist. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: dick greenhaus Date: 27 Feb 04 - 05:48 PM First, conspiracies. Sorry, but the thread was closed by accident (mine.) Obviously, I've re-opened it. The folksong Revival in England was kicked off by Lonnie Donegan, who got a significant portion of UK's teenagers picking guitars nd singing folksongs (motly from the US.) MacColl was running a folk popular club (in London, I think)and used all of his considerable inflence to insist that singers perform music from their own neck of the woods. I'd have absolutely no objection to having Bert Lloyd on the cover, but Ewan seems equally appropriate to me, at least. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Tattie Bogle Date: 01 Mar 04 - 06:38 PM Thanks to the info in this thread, my daughter has ordered me a copy from EFDSS. Apparently the lady taking the order thought she sounded a bit young for this (she's only 26!) "No, it's for my Mum, she's a real old folkie" daughter said. "Ah that explains it" says lady from EFDSS! But I have been a "folkie" since my teenage years, having come up through the 60s revival, certainly since much younger than my daughter is now! |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 01 Mar 04 - 07:28 PM I was 16 when I bought my copy of Penguin (in 1971). I have to say that I'll be disappointed if the market for the new edition is restricted to people around my own age, though obviously a fair proportion of initial sales are likely to be replacements and "upgrades", and I expect the lady at EFDSS has mostly been taking orders of that kind; it's a revision, after all, not a new book (though it is a lot more detailed than the original) and it will sell, to begin with, largely on the strength of its history. I do very much hope that younger people, to whom the material may not be familiar except through recorded arrangements of it, will gain something worthwhile from going back a little closer to the sources; and that this edition will also sell on its own merits as well as on those of its predecessor. That is in the hands of fate, I suppose. We'll just have to see. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: GUEST,Tunesmith Date: 30 Jan 05 - 02:19 PM Does the book contain any extra information - to that which appeared in the orginal book - about one of the key source " folk singers" William Bolton. I used to live in Southport, where Bolton was living when interviewed, and was always interested to know more about him. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 30 Jan 05 - 04:23 PM Yes, it does. There was only room for a fairly short summary of the available information, though references are given to sources for more, including the Gilchrist MSS collection at the Vaughan Williams Memorial Library (Cecil Sharp House, London) which contains documents relating to Miss Gilchrist's meetings with him, and some songs written out in his own hand. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Desert Dancer Date: 30 Jan 05 - 04:35 PM Malcolm, is your web site with supplementary material (mentioned above, 25 Feb 04) live somewhere? ~ Becky in Tucson |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Desert Dancer Date: 31 Jan 05 - 05:06 PM refreshing the question |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 31 Jan 05 - 07:18 PM The trouble with a work in progress is that, by definition, it's never finished: and therefore never quite ready to be sent out into the world. It's high time, though, that I put up what there is of it. There's a lot more unfinished, to be found and to add, but it's a start. http://www.folk-network.com/miscellany/penguin/ I'm deliberately avoiding lists of links to websites of the sort I've often provided here, and I'm being very careful about copyright. Anyway, you'll see what I mean. I won't be putting up any other external links until I've run it past Malcolm Taylor of the VWML, so this is a "preview", if you like. Where there is staff notation, clicking on it will play a midi. |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: Desert Dancer Date: 31 Jan 05 - 09:55 PM Thanks, Malcolm! I know the problem with that "work in progress" feeling. ~ Becky in Tucson |
|
Subject: RE: Classic English (Penguin) Folk Songs re-issued From: greg stephens Date: 01 Feb 05 - 03:02 PM Malcolm Douglas: thanks very much for publishing that additional stuff here. This is a great way to add up-to-date research as it becomes available. |
| Share Thread: |
