BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 07:34 PM

"I was asked if I was a careful man once which I believe is one of their coded messages about membership, but no-one has asked me to join. Perhaps I sing from the wrong song sheet!

Flash Company, you will never be asked to join freemasonry and it will have nothing to do with whatever song sheet you sing from.
To become a freemason YOU have to ask. Nobody is invited but everyone is welcome.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 08:33 AM

"Woke up this morning
With an aching head
Got ratarsed at the Lodge last night
Barely made it to my bed

Got my trouser leg rolled up
Exposed my nipple to the air
But a copper told me
You can't do that there 'ere, sir.

So now I'm up in court
Tried to "square" it with the judge
If he's a fellow Mason
Will he free me with a wink & nudge?"

[loud sound of Willie Dixon turning in grave]
RtS
(could it be a washboard in those cases?)

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Nov 04 - 08:04 AM

My school (orphange strictly speaking but you have to look-up the definition of orphan to understand) was sponsored by Masons (and Lions and....) and it did once cause a boit of confusion for one guy who thought I must be. I have a lot to be grateful - so does one other Old Royal - "nudge nudge, wink, wink, sayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy no more" though HE never mentions the school - with good reason.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Flash Company
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 10:32 AM

I live next door to a Masonic Hall (Very handy for telling taxi drivers where my house is!). They tend to have an annual open day, and I usually go and win bottles of beer on their tombola.
I was asked if I was a careful man once which I believe is one of their coded messages about membership, but no-one has asked me to join. Perhaps I sing from the wrong song sheet!

FC

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: freda underhill
Date: 16 Nov 04 - 06:41 AM

George Bush's Yale secret society

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Feb 04 - 02:24 PM

First Night in Alexandria 2002 was hosted in part at the Masonic Temple (not particarly secret) and featured some great Celtic music plus a great variety of other traditions ...

Ciao

Brian

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 18 Feb 04 - 10:52 AM

Read the first post carefully and note the use of the emotionally-loaded word "infiltrate." How exactly does one infilrate a public thing like a folk club?

When I think of Masons, I think of Shriners' Hospital and Shriners' parades -- both good things. If they need more members, I'm glad they are setting about to get them.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST,sorefingers
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 07:56 PM

Ok Tinker all that you say, but most of the signatures on the Declaration of Independence were members, most US presidents were / are members. Who sain anything about 'Skull and Bones' meee harties .. and 'ahoy thar in that fat Iraqi Gally full of gold ready fer the takin.... are ye ready to be hoarded?'

American masonry, Sir, is very very well , thank you.

Also not widely known these days, in the 1700s secret societies were very popular. Indeed besides 'musik' and 'math', 'science' might have offended many - not the least of these being the Church.

In addition, though few of todays members are artisans much less 'proper masons' the organisation claims origins in Jerusalem and would by that account be more likely Egyptian than anything else. Fez's and Mace's - sure I seen that as well ... somewhere in my travels.

Still, today I think the organisation is more into charity and doing good than anyother activity.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST,Tinker from Chicago
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 05:12 PM

Sorry, but just a guest here. A long-time Mason and a much longer time folkster. Please note that Masonry is England isn't Masonry in the US. Our British brothers have a long tradition of being power brokers and men of influence. In the US, Masonry has little influence, except in charity work (e.g. the Shriners), and we are lumped together in the public mind with a lot of other organizations, like the Rotary or the Kiwanis.

The history of the order explains why it started out with a bunch of secrets. To get the best architects and contractors to work on their castles and cathedrals, medieval powers-that-be granted them coveted advantages, like tax-free status and exemption from military service and, of all things, religious freedom. To keep pretenders from claiming to have these privileges, the secret passwords and handshakes were invented. We still do them as part of our tradition, nothing more. Nothing insidious.

Secret society? When Masons wear Masonic symbols on their person and stick 'em on their cars as well, when Masons put huge signs on the buildings where they meet and often publically announce the meeting times in the local paper, when Masons march in parades in Masonic regalia--this is a "secret" society? Pretty bad at being secret, eh wot? Try the Mafia. No one knows who's in it, where they meet, or when. And they don't generally march in parades in Mafia uniforms.

Yeah, we don't allow atheists in the club. That's true. If that one rule makes us elitists, then I don't understand who the elite are. But no Masonic order, in the US anyways, is interested in power. Fact is, we're warned flat-out when joining that we are not to expect "material advantage" from membership. Nope, the lodge and the Job girls and the DeMolay and the rest are all about ethics and personal moral integrity, not power. I don't see the harm in that.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 10:22 AM

OK, sorry Phot. I'll try that site too.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 10:16 AM

And Tigger too.
eric

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Sttaw Legend
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 08:06 AM

I've been to the Masonic Hall mentioned above by Les from Hull, someone from work who was retiring hired the hall for their function. The people behind the bar serving drinks and washing glasses had "pinnies" on, that may answer your question eric the red - purely functional - we read to much into these things. On entering the hall someone was scrubbing the steps, they also had a "pinnie" on. I believe a book has been written about the subject "Pinnie the Wooh".

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 07:39 AM

eric the red

Everyyhing masonic has a symbolic meaning - mostly derived from the craft of masonry.

Carpenters, butchers, shoemakers, blacksmiths, and many other tradesmen wore aprons. They acted as tool holders, storage for things like nails, etc, as well as having a protective purpose.

The "mason's pinnies" you refer to have a symbolic purpose (one of the 'secrets' you will be told when you are accepted as a memeber) and are a historicial remnant of what was once a practical object.

Robin

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 07:08 AM

Poor mans masons Bobjack.
What are mason's pinnies for.
eric

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Bobjack
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 05:51 AM

Interesting point about press coverage there Phot. In our local paper there are still weekly reports about the "royal Ancient of the Buffaloes" Is this organisation masonic, or just a pub darts team?

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Phot
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 05:26 AM

Peter K, if you care to read my last post on this thread again, you will find the address for the web site of The Grand Lodge of England, which contains pretty much all the info you are looking for, thats why I put it there!
Freemasonry, like folk music, is somthing that I throughly enjoy but I don't think I drew any parallels between them, or insinuated any link between the two. I am just an odinary person, I have no special privaleges, and have earned no special privalages or favours through freemasonry.

Once again here is the address of the GLE,   
      
www.grandlodge-england.org

As for finding nothing in the papers, up until the first world war, masonic meetings were regulary reported on, it was only after that time that the craft became more inward looking, and certainly now we are moving away from that and are becoming more open again, you will find many lodges are now having open days to show the public the inside of masonic halls, and let them see what we do.

Wassail! Chris

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 03:33 AM

It may be a step in the right direction that they are now allowing all genders into the brother/sisterhood.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 17 Feb 04 - 03:29 AM

Funny secretive folk them thar Dixons! I believe they all gather in a circle, roll their left breast up, bare one leg, and play the bodhran! Scares the sh-1-t outta me!
John

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Peace
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 10:40 PM

Anybody want to start a Mason-Dixon Lodge? I'm leaving now.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 05:51 PM

Ah - there was the classic case that made it onto ABC TV about The USQ Journalism Dept. Made it onto the ABC Media Watch Show - you should be able to sesarch for it in their archives - http://www.abc.net.au/mediawatch/transcripts/100602_s7.htm.

"Lern Jurnilisim at USQ :: 10/6/2002"

It was also mentioned in the Foolestroupe Yahoo list.

In that case apparently the input was from Word documents converted into HTML nad the result had partial fragments of sentences repeated and scattered everywhere, making hysterical nonsense out of their claims of producing the best Journalism Students.

Some Classic Quotes:

"They will be given considerable practice in quotations" - isn't that er ... plager.. plagism, er ... pinching someone else's ideas without credit... ya'no....

"Students will be regularly imposed on print practitioners."

~~~~~~~~~

From the Yahoo List foolestroupe

"Students will be students"

Quotation from the Public Official USQ Handbook Webpage for JRN1000 as reported in the (Australian) ABC Media Watch Program in June 2002.
File http://groups.yahoo.com/group/foolestroupe/files/Member%20Files/USQ-100602_s7f1.jpg

refers.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

University of Southern Queensland.

JRN1000 Introduction to Journalism (ART-UG1)#    1163 of 1739

Semester 1 (ONC)TWMBA(EXT)TWMBA(ONC)WBAY

Semester 3 (EXT)TWMBA

Units 1.00 (Journalism)Band 1

This course is designed to introduce students to the Australian news media and their practices. Emphasis will be placed on the need for This unit is designed to introduce students to the Australian news students to think objectively about the main news events of the day, media and their practices. Emphasis will be placed on the need for and the ways the print media have reported them. Students will be students to think objectively about the main news events of the day, encouraged to achieve accuracy and objectivity within the constraints and the ways the print media have reported them. Students will be regularly imposed on print practitioners. Students will be introduced encouraged to achieve accuracy and objectivity within the constraints to news values, journalism research, interview skills, and the elements regularly imposed on print practitioners. Students will introduced that make up news stories. They will be given considerable
practice in to news values, journalism research, interview skills, and the elements writing introductory paragraphs and handling direct and indirect that make up news stories. They will be given considerable practice in quotations. To pass this course students must complete and hand in all writing introductory paragraphs and handling direct and indirect terms of assessment. The final grade will be calculated on the total quotations, mark only. Grades will be awarded at the percentiles of HD = 90 or more: A = 80-89; B = 65-79; C = 50-64; F = less than 50.

Check the synopses database for further information.

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Modified on 28 Sep 2001 at 10:32 PM.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 05:23 PM

Thanks for the link, jeffp. In my first browse round I couldn't see any way to find info about UK lodges, so I'll have to go back and dig more deeply. The tone of what I did see was more open-spirited than printed leaflets I remember seeing some years ago in the UK, which were full of abbreviations like TTOBTR (tongue torn out by the root, I think).

One thing puzzled me. A page addressing the question "what is freemasonry" was full of curious, and on the face of it inexplicable, wrong words, albeit phonetically near-misses. Thus: winch for which, mariner for manner, waits for wants, etc, etc. It's the sort of thing I've been known to do since using text processors instead of typewriters, but surely no-one else has this affliction. There must be some other explanation.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST,G-string
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 04:41 PM

fat B****rd, I to am glad of it. Can they sing the Blues ? I am quite confident they can. They will have had plenty of practice in their recruitment campaign attending various sessions/concerts in their drive for new recruits. As you will be aware many sessions often drift into the "good old blues" and they will have taken advantage to add another string to their bow - be it singing or signing someone into the brotherhood (or sisterhood apparently).

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: fat B****rd
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 03:32 PM

Eee !! G string, see what you've started, it takes all kinds to make a Mudcat and I for one am glad of it. But can Freemasons sing the Blues ??

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: katlaughing
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 02:59 PM

That's a lot of rot, Fionn. There was and is nothing covert about Job's Daughters and the main advantages ANY of us received from it were to develop the ability to speak well in public, carry ourselves with grace, appreciate the arts, learn the value of patience and perseverance, and be of service to others. Any claim of anything else is a lie.

freda brought up a good point. I've met fellow Rosicrucians, from eastern Europe, who were persecuted for not walking the party line. Their last winter there, before they fled to Canada, they had to burn all of their furniture and books to stay warm. The only ones they didn't burn were their Rosicrucian ones. I've also studied the history of the Rosicrucians during WWII and other troubles times, when secrecy was of utmost importance in order to save lives.

Oh, and if anyone is interested, just look for their ad in the back of Popular Mechanics and other *strange* magazines. Haha!! Otherwise, you can go HERE

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: jeffp
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 02:35 PM

Peter, www.freemasonry.org looks like it might be a start.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 01:29 PM

Secret organisations (or organisations with secrets) are pre-disposed to sit uneasily in any society. Witness the hysterical reaction of 19th century capitalists to secret oaths within their workforces - the taking of such oaths sometimes being a capital offence. Any spirit of openness in Freemasonry nowadays has been wrung from it at gunpoint. Books such as "Inside the Brotherhood" by Martin Short give some indication of the extent to which, for instance, careers have been advanced simply on the strength of membership.

Even now it is impossible to know with confidence which judges, which police officers giving evidence to those judges, and which senior civil servants making public appointments are masons. Where can I view a list of members?

In March 1912, at the Old Bailey, Frederick Seddons was convicted of murder. His response was: "I declare before the Great Architect of the Universe that I am not guilty." In sentencing him to death, the judge replied: "You and I know we both belong to one brotherhood, but it is not a brotherhood that encourages crime." Poor Seddon must have wondered why he ever joined.

Kat, if Job's Daughters is in any way related to masonry, it will exist in order to secure, by covert means, privilege and advantage for its members. So it is hardly to be wondered that you found membership invaluable. (Incidentally there is no reason at all why association with an old-testament character should imply some association with Christianity.)

I have huge respect for those who were brought up with the privileges of masonry in easy reach, but who chose to spurn them. I have some very close acquaintances specifically in mind, but also John/Giok MacKenzie, who posted above.

Phot, when you say freemasonry has some secrets "but who hasn't?" do you mean to imply that masonic lodges and (say) folk clubs are broadly similar in terms of the secrets they have? I've had a quick skim through my local newspaper and can find no listings of masonic meetings/events, and I can find no freemasonry phone numbers in any phone directory. Where do I go to find out if freemasonry might be the thing for me?

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Mark Clark
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 01:01 PM

Around here the Scottish Rite Temple—A Masonic subdivision, I think—has been hosting concerts from Jazz to accoustic folk. Usually the concerts are fundraisers for some worthy community cause not related to Freemasonry. The SRT has also been allowing their facilities to be used by the Greek Orthodox Church across the street for their annual, and very popular, Greek Dinner fundraiser.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST,Jim Knowledge
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 11:38 AM

I `ad that Grand Master of the local lodge in my cab this morning. I asked `im if they were cajoling folk singers to join their club. `e said only the girls. We`re gonna roll up our trousers and they`re gonna do a Janet Jackson!!
What am I like?

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST,Buffy the pigeon slayer
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 10:40 AM

I'm on my way. oh,   sorry, wrong thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Sttaw Legend
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 09:39 AM

Is Kate Rusby a member of "The Eastern Star" ?

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Phot
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 08:38 AM

Ms Lemon, I suppose it is!

Bobjack, the vast majority of lodges are male only, however there are a few that have lady members, the order for ladies is called The Eastern star.

For more info on Freemasonry, look here, www.grandlodge-england.org
I would make it a blue clicky, but I can't get it to work!!

Wassail! Chris

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 08:11 AM

Phot... isn't Mudcat already a folk 'lodge'?

Sal

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 08:08 AM

Masons don't 'recruit'. If you want to become a Mason, you have to approach someone that you know is a Mason. At least that's what I was told when I became one 24 years ago. mmmmm mmmmmm Ouch who stole my tongue!!! Pass me my wellies and spade someone.

Sal

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Bobjack
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 07:57 AM

I'd join, but I don't think they would have me. Are the Masonic Lodges male only? Please tell me they are.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 07:43 AM

Hey Cllr, are you the one that used to be Tory Cllr ?
eric

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST,Bells & Braces
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 07:25 AM

Links seem to go back even further than first anticipated. When discussing the Morris and Masons fraternity within our folk world it is interesting to note that in 1583 Captain Haies of the Golden Hinde wrote upon sailing from Plymouth: "We were in number in all about 260 men; among whom we had every faculty good choice, as Shipwrights, Masons, Carpenters, Smiths and suchlike. Besides for solace of our people and allurment of savages we were provided of Musike in good variety; not omitting the least toys as Morris dances Hobby horses and Maylike concerts to delight the savage people"

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: freda underhill
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 07:25 AM

when people start things secretly, sometimes its not out of elitism but can be self protection.

religious wars, witch burnings, who can criticise someone for choosing secrecy?

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Cllr
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 07:18 AM

Yeah Yeah yuk it up guestpb. Cllr

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: katlaughing
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 07:05 AM

LaFayette signed the charter of the Lodge in Northampton, MA.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST,pooh bar
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 06:45 AM

Greetings brother cllr.These plebians are simply jealous because they are not of sufficient social stature to have been invited to join us.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Cllr
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 06:38 AM

Its not a secret society it is a society WITH secrets, there is a difference, yours fraternally Cllr

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Sttaw Legend
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 06:32 AM

Emma Rugg is the person you need to ask she's played in the establishment on many Wednesday evenings.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Bobjack
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 06:12 AM

In Beverley?? You didn't mention this at friday's lodge meeting Dave. Are you involved in setting it up?

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 05:21 AM

IT'S STILL A SECRET SOCIETY.
eric

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Sttaw Legend
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 05:18 AM

Masons are planning to open a cafe in Beverley, same concept as the one on Princes Quay in Hull.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Bobjack
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 05:13 AM

Masons are not elitist, they are just careful.

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Daithi
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 04:51 AM

Intteresting postings - and glad to see a more balanced view coming through. I attend a regular folk session and know for a fact that there is at least one Freemason there, so its obviously not THAT elitist!

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 03:56 AM

Well Chris, I hold none of that against you; EXCEPT liking Landrovers.
John.......Toyota Hilux Surf

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: Phot
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 03:06 AM

Well I'll come out now and say that I am a Freemason, and a Folkie, and I throughly enjoy both, I don't consider myself elitist, just ask those who know me and they'll probably say I'm just a fat p*sshead who likes trains and Landrovers!
The religon thing does come into it, as one of the requirements of being a mason is the belief in a supreme being, but that may be God, Bhudda, Allah, Krishna, or any other deity. we are not a secret society but a world wide brotherhood, that has a few secrets, but then who doesn't?
As for the infiltrating of folk clubs, I haven't a clue! But in the province of Somerset, we have a musicians lodge, I'm don't know how many are folkies, but why not see if we could start a folk lodge?

Wassail! Chris

Subject: RE: BS: Masons Lodges and Folk Clubs
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 16 Feb 04 - 01:33 AM

A certain Robert Burns' mother lodge was in Tarbolton, Ayrshire--