ADD:I Saw Her As She Came And Went (Bayard Rustin)

Subject: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went - Bayard
From: rich-joy
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 04:31 AM

by Bayard RUSTIN ...


any takers???



related to refreshed thread : Chris Couveau : Ballad of Reading Gaol

Cheers! R-J

Subject: Lyr Add: I SAW HER AS SHE CAME AND WENT (B Rustin)
From: Stewie
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 06:01 PM

Here you go, R-J. My copy of 'And So Will We Yet' appears to be disintegrating with paint peeling off the disk. However, 'I saw her' can still be read by the laser:

I SAW HER AS SHE CAME AND WENT

I saw her as she came and went
I saw her queenly, meek and mild
As innocent as any child
A flower among her flowers
Among her flowers content

I come again and in her place
A silence and a vacant room
And in my heart a sudden gloom
That I no more shall see
No more shall see her face

There was a word I might have said
But what it was I do not know
I let the days fly by and now
Now I must say it to
Must say it to her dead

Source: transcription from Bok, Muir and Trickett 'And So Will We Yet' Folk Legacy CD-116.

--Stewie.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went - Bayard
From: rich-joy
Date: 30 Mar 04 - 09:23 PM

THANKS heaps, Stewie!!!

Now, how close is Bok, Muir and Trickett's tune of the above, to that version you have on tape of Lawls singing "The Ballad of Reading Gaol"???

Cheers! R-J

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went - Bayard
From: rich-joy
Date: 03 Apr 04 - 08:22 PM

refresh

wadyareckon Stewie?!


also, surely Mudcat should have some info on Bayard Rustin entered - perhaps on this thread? (can anyone oblige?)

Cheers!
R-J

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went - Bayard
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 05 Apr 04 - 10:19 AM

Bayard Rustin was an important civil-rights leader who worked closely with Martin Luther King. He was black, a Quaker, a pacifist, a former communist, and gay ("relatively open for his time"). He worked for peace and justice on many fronts. For a 1-page biography, click here.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rus
From: Franz S.
Date: 05 Apr 04 - 11:09 AM

Bayard was a fascinating man with a beautiful voice. His connection with Martin Luther King is particularly interesting. According to some sources, they met in Montgomery when he arrived to explain to MLKJr that preaching nonviolence and keeping guns at home for self defense was a little inconsistent.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: rich-joy
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 05:36 AM

Could some kindly Link Pixie please do a blickey for me between this thread and the Chris Couveau ? Ballad of Reading Gaol thread ???!!!

Thanks.

Cheers! R-J

Done. --JoeClone, 12-Aug-04.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: Vashbul
Date: 09 Sep 10 - 03:24 AM

This is a six year old thread that I am reviving. I have been searching for the source of the melody to this song. I've known it for years as a tune used by my uncle Donald Mork, known in folk circles in the fifties and sixties as Seraffyn the Wandering Minstrel, to back up his reading of Yeats' "Song of Wandering Aengus",

Here is a recording "Wandering Aengus" you can download.
http://www.mediafire.com/?z0fujf34gtmx2n6
It's a home recording made by my dad in his back yard, Uncle Donnie plays the lute, and his wife Ania Romaine sings the wordless tune. It's a beautiful combination, and I wondered for years where this plaintive song came from. The only clue I had was when, a few years later, Uncle D. made a record of "Wandering Aengus" (the same arrangement but with a different singer behind him), and in the album notes says "The accompaniment is an old lute exercise, to which a friend of mine composed the little melody you hear". On the label, the credit was "Yeats/Rustin".

That's what lead me to Mudcat and this thread. Someone mentioned Bayard Rustin and a recording of his song, "I Saw Her As She Came and Went" made by Bok, Muir and Trickett; I checked Amazon and the snatch they let me hear was most definitely the Eureka! moment. (It has also apparently been set to an Oscar Wilde poem; see the thread linked above called "Chris Couveau ? Ballad of Reading Gaol" for more on that.)

So, aside from the Seraffyn record I can also tell you this about the Bayard Rustin song: when I read the words above, I realized they were more or less the words to a song called "I Saw Her" by the Flamin' Groovies, from their Shake Some Action LP in 1976. What's interesting is the tune of "I Saw Her" is not the same as "I Saw Her As She Came and Went" (or "Wandering Aengus"), though it's very similar - you could almost sing the two together and make a nice Mamas and Papas harmony.

Questions not answered: where did the Groovies get this song? They credit it to "Jordan/Wilson/Wilhelm/Hunter", no mention of Bayard Rustin. Jordan and Wilson were in the band, Wilhelm is surely Mike Wilhelm, who was in the Charlatans and played solo before joining the Groovies after this record, Hunter I don't know who, unless it's the Grateful Dead lyricist Robert which is surely possible. In any case, they should have given due to the real author, even if they wroth their own melodic variation - but I'm more interested in where they got the song, because I don't know of any sheet music nor recordings made of that tune with those words together until Bok and company, many years later. The other question, what is the "old lute exercise" Uncle Donnie mentioned, from which Rustin is supposed to have fashioned this haunting air?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 09 Sep 10 - 08:28 AM

Ed Trickett has a few words to say in the liner notes to the Bok Muir Trickett recording: "This was written by Bayard Rustin, the civil rights activist. I first heard this song in the early 1960s at a coffeehouse in Washington, DC. It was sung by a group of blind musicians.... You can hear another rendition on Harry Tuft's Across the Blue Mountains (Folk-Legacy FSI-63)."

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Sep 13 - 09:58 AM

It's to my understanding that this piece is based on a poem. I can't remember the name of the poem but I do believe it was written for a nun. I came across this piece in an old book years ago and always loved it. I never knew it had been turned into a song. I've been trying to find the original author of this piece via the internet and not having much luck. That's how I stumbled upon this page.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: rich-joy
Date: 03 Aug 18 - 09:32 AM

This is just to say that in the "Chris Couveau - Ballad of Reading Gaol" thread from yonks ago, there are now details of my YouTube upload of the "Reading Gaol" song and its provenance, so far as I can ascertain - including the Bayard Rustin connections.

/mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=67831&messages=12

I hope Vashbul is still around ....


Cheers! R-J
Down Under

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: rich-joy
Date: 30 Jun 20 - 10:32 PM

2020 update :

Interestingly, though Bayard Rustin has been credited with the writing of “I Saw As She Came and Went” and folks have said it was his “signature tune”, there is NOW a recording on YouTube of Bayard in 1952 playing lute and singing this song in classical style – and its provenance is listed as “unknown”!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfKHTN4Ua-M

I do wonder if GUEST of 02 Sept 2013, ever found the poem for the nun??!!

Cheers,
R-J

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 01 Jul 20 - 08:07 AM

Just because someone who put up a video on Youtube in 2019 thought the composer was unknown, doesn't mean it wasn't Rustin.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: rich-joy
Date: 01 Jul 20 - 07:43 PM

Good Point, Gerry!

R-J

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: rich-joy
Date: 28 Mar 21 - 08:03 PM

refresh

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Feb 22 - 11:57 PM

I've been on the hunt to learn more about this song and its origins as I'm a big fan of the Flamin Groovies version. At one point there was a version of this song on YouTube by some country singer (I wish I could remember the name) and it made reference to it being based on an Elizabethan tune, I even shared it on Facebook but it has since disappeared.

recently stumbled on this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5qB2U5Cnv8

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Feb 22 - 12:08 AM

on Addis & Crofut LP Such Interesting People (1963) on Verve records

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Feb 22 - 12:21 AM

also this now:

https://genius.com/Carolyn-hester-i-saw-her-lyrics

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Saw Her As She Came And Went (B Rustin)
From: rich-joy
Date: 27 Feb 22 - 01:04 AM

The SERAFFYN LP recording is now up on YT (twice) and credits Bayard Rustin with the music, which has Yeats' "Song of the Wandering Aengus" set to it : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRJ3LG48Wsg


"SERAFFYN - The Last Great Troubadour . 1964 . Columbia - CS 8957 . Seraffyn (Donald Mork) is, according to his record cover, the "last, great troubador." Now he is certainly not the last, and is greatness is arguable (although the album is entertaining enough), but he certainly seems to have been a troubadour, and a wandering one at that (again according to the record cover). He also was born & raised in New England (not Old Scotland), graduated from Harvard and the Royal Academy of Dramatic Arts, and in 1953 won the Folksong Award at the International Eisteddford in Wales."

There are quite a few YT clips now from the 50s of Seraffyn & Cherubim (his wife at the time, Ania Romaine), doing their Wandering Minstrel thing, e.g. : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGg-wNdcAQg   ("Song of the Wandering Aengus", to Bayard's tune).


Cheers, R-J

Subject: RE: ADD:I Saw Her As She Came And Went (Bayard Rustin)
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 02 Dec 23 - 04:20 AM

Someone asked about the Flamin' Groovies crediting of this song to "Jordan/Wilson/Wilhelm/Hunter". 'Wilhelm', as mentioned, is almost certainly Mike Wilhelm, guitarist of the Charlatans. Given that the Charlatans recorded this song back in their classic period:

The Charlatans "I Saw Her"

I would say that the 'Hunter' in that list is almost certainly George Hunter, singer in the Charlatans.

Subject: RE: ADD:I Saw Her As She Came And Went (Bayard Rustin)
From: leeneia
Date: 03 Dec 23 - 09:57 PM

Here's a nice recording of 'I saw her as she came and went' on Youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=heW7SmaweBo

Subject: RE: ADD:I Saw Her As She Came And Went (Bayard Rustin)
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Dec 23 - 05:42 AM

There's a few more interesting facts about this song, that I came across in this piece on Bayard Rustin on the Early Music America website. (It's a very interesting article about Bayard Rustin, and specifically about his involvement with the New York City Early Music scene.)

The lyrics actually come from a book called 'Vedanta for the Modern Man' edited by Christopher Isherwood. Rustin would have come across this from his own interest in Vedanta, as a part of becoming acquainted with Gandhi and his non-violent protest philosophy. You can see the page in question from the 1952 edition here.

The poem is by Frederick Manchester (who was also involved with publishing other books on Vedanta). Its title is 'Sister Lalita'. Sister Lalita (aka Mrs. Carrie Wyckoff, lived 1859-1949) was a woman from southern California who became a Vedanta nun and donated her house for the use of the Vedanta movement. So what sounds like an 'olde timey' love song was actuially written by Frederick Machester following the death of a 90 year old woman whom he would have known from seeing her about the house when he visited as part of his own Vedanta interests. Note that Sister Lalita was known for her love of working in the backyard flower garden -- hence the 'flower among her flowers content' line. There is an article on Sister Lalita here.

Bayard Rustin opened side 2 of his original LP with this song, describing it as 'an Elizabethan song of unknown origin'. It seems almost certain that Rustin actually wrote the music (though perhaps only writing the melody and setting it over an actual old lute exercise, if the note from Seraffyn's LP mentioned above is accurate). In any case, the original words of the poem are:

I saw her as I came and went,
I saw her queenly, meek, and mild,
As innocent as any child,
A flower among her flowers content.

I come again, and in her place
Are silence and a vacant room,
And in my heart a sudden gloom
That I no more shall see her face.

There was a word I would have said,
Though what it was I hardly know;
I let the days glide by, and lo,
I now must say it to the dead.

(While researching things connected to this song, I also came across this New York Times obituary for Donald Mork/Seraffyn. Tragically, he died in a car crash in South Carolina in 1964, not long after the release of his one LP. The obituary mentions that he was wearing his medieval troubadour outfit when he died.)