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BS: Yank Spelling
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Subject: BS: Yank Spelling From: Pied Piper Date: 27 Apr 04 - 06:50 AM Do you find the term "Yank" offensive? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: el ted Date: 27 Apr 04 - 07:01 AM No,but that's probably because I am not American. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Hrothgar Date: 27 Apr 04 - 07:03 AM When one of the rhyming slang alternatives is "septic tank," they prefer "Yank." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: GUEST,guest Date: 27 Apr 04 - 07:42 AM is that spelt with a "W" |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Dave the Gnome Date: 27 Apr 04 - 07:45 AM Not me. I find a good yank helps considerably when the front door jams shut... Cheers DtG How yer doing btw John? Did I see pictures of you looking very slim and dapper at Ted Edwards birthday bash? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: artbrooks Date: 27 Apr 04 - 08:52 AM Calling a person from the US a 'Yank' is like calling a person from Glasgow or Cardiff 'English.' 'Yankee' refers to the states that were on the Union side during the American Civil War, which represent neither a majority of the states not a majority of the (current) population. It can be offensive to those from the states that were on the opposite side. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: GUEST,MMario Date: 27 Apr 04 - 08:59 AM for some people in the US (mostly southerners) a 'Yank' or 'Yankee' is someone from those states that were on the Union side - for many a 'Yankee' is somneone from New England. If you are from New England - you probably only think of people from Maine as "yankees" it's not offensive per se - just not accurate. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Irish sergeant Date: 27 Apr 04 - 10:07 AM I don't find it offensive but some people south of Mason-Dixon would.Kindest regards, Neil |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: ced2 Date: 27 Apr 04 - 10:16 AM Not offensive, more like euphamistic |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Once Famous Date: 27 Apr 04 - 10:47 AM It's not offensive at all. It's just dumbly inaccurate. Let me ask this. What is so offensive about a Brit being called a limey? Or is it not? What does it really refer to anyway? I happen to like limes. I'll even eat the green one in a pack of Chuckles. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: WFDU - Ron Olesko Date: 27 Apr 04 - 11:03 AM As a Mets fan I find the term extremely offensive. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Metchosin Date: 27 Apr 04 - 11:04 AM Calling a Brit a limey is innaccurate too. Very few of the population, even during the time frame of the reference, served on the ships where citrus fruit was used to prevent scurvey. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Mrs.Duck Date: 27 Apr 04 - 11:41 AM Where does spelling come into it? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Dave the Gnome Date: 27 Apr 04 - 11:41 AM Calling me a Brit is highly inacurate and offensive;-) I am not a Brit. I am not even sure I am an Englishman. I am definitely a Lancastrian. Except when I am in Yorkshire but that is another kettle of fish. I pretend I am Irish there... Cheers :D |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: GUEST,MMario Date: 27 Apr 04 - 11:46 AM I thought you were |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Amos Date: 27 Apr 04 - 12:33 PM Martin: The first discovery of vitamin C as a preventive of scurvy was made in the British navy, and the practice of carrying limes on board naval vessels to supplement the crew's diet started there. Fromt his practice the British sailor became known as a "limey" and the expression, as song often will, stretched out to cover all Brits. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: CarolC Date: 27 Apr 04 - 12:56 PM I'm a Yank in the stricktest of terms. I am originally from one of the New England states (Rhode Island). JtS, being Canadian, calls me a Yankee because I'm from the US. The people here in the Sunny South of USA call me a "damned Yankee", because I'm from the "North", and I came here (to the South) and didn't leave. If you call a Southerner a Yankee, you'll probably eat shot pellet for lunch. To people in the southern US, anyone from the north is a Yankee. JtS probably finds it offensive when people around here consider him a Yankee. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: GUEST,sorefingers Date: 27 Apr 04 - 12:59 PM Every American person in english speaking Europe is a Yank. Nobody ever explained to me why that is, but I would never have thought to ask, accents be they from Ontario or Oregon sounding the same. Or are we talking about American strangeness in spelling? Mr Gibson seems to think it offensive to call a British person a 'limey', it isn't. It is a little bit out of date, since today in the 'colonies' a British person is called a 'Pom'. Again I have no idea why, nor do I think anybody would take offence since the expression is always one of endearment, like 'Cuz' in the Hillbilland. A poet might like the word 'Yank' for it's rhyming qualities, lots of nice easy words sound like it; Bank, Tank Thank, Lank, Crank, Flank Frank, Wank, Dank Drank, Hank, Nank, Prank, Rank, Sank and so on, but too much of that would be a bit 'ankish'. A little goes a long way.. lol It's meaning is always about the hasty forced shoving or pulling of something, which might be misunderstood in some situations .. ahem, but OTOH it is clear that the agent is in a hurry. Perhaps that is why the name stuck? - haste, hurry, "quick! pull this" , etc |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: WFDU - Ron Olesko Date: 27 Apr 04 - 01:26 PM I think it was probably the WWI song that created the nickname. "The Yanks Are Coming" did not differentiate between North & South. And what "strangeness" in spelling? We spell it our way and you spell it yours - that is not strange. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: mike the knife Date: 27 Apr 04 - 01:46 PM From what I understand of the whole "Yankee" thing- it was a bastardization of "Jan Kaese" (Jan Cheese) referring to the Dutch of New York (New Amsterdam). While living in Europe, I was often referred to as "Yank". The only time it bothered me was when there were more than one of us "Yanks" being referred to. BTW- I am a Southerner (a Virginian to be more exact) and as a Southerner, you must have pity on those poor, benighted, ignorant souls who lack the subtle grace to distinguish a person of substance and merit from a scalawag, simply because they share a common passport. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Rapparee Date: 27 Apr 04 - 03:11 PM Yankee was in use before the US Civil War. Here's what the Sciencedaily.com encyclopedia says about the word: "The phrase was probably popularized by the English in the song Yankee Doodle Dandee to describe New Yorkers, and perhaps, all (Northern) Americans in the colonies. Others – that is, speakers from outside of the USA – often use it to refer to any resident of the USA (as opposed to American in general), especially in the form Yank. The words are sometimes spelt with a lowercase initial, yankee and yank, and may be used in a disapproving sense. In sum, the phrase probably originated in old New Amsterdam, New Holland and New York, in the Mid-Atlantic. It then was adopted by the British to describe (Northern) colonists. In the Civil War, the phrase referred to all residents and soldiers of northern or free states, usually used derisively by rebel troops and secession sympathizers. The Yankees baseball team refocussed attention on New York, and the need to describe the rural, New Englander of puritan stock probably caused reporters and authors to bring back the slang shorthand term of Yankee. Finally, citizens of other countries, including the British during the World Wars, referred to all Americans as Yanks. Hence, the term has had different positive, negative, contextual and regional associations over the years, as books, media, troops, teams, and peoples have used it differently for different purposes. To foreigners, a Yankee is an American. To Americans, a Yankee is an Easterner. To Easterners, a Yankee is a New Englander. To New Englanders, a Yankee is a Vermonter. And in Vermont, a Yankee is somebody who eats pie for breakfast. ––(an old definition)" I've been called a Yank (or even a Yankee) in Korea, France, Ireland, Canada, England and Scotland and never been offended by it. I always felt it was sort of generic, like "GI" or "Tommy." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Johnny in OKC Date: 27 Apr 04 - 04:01 PM Amos: THANK YOU for using the term "a preventive of scurvy". You may have noticed Americans using the word (?) "preventative". There is a tendency to make things sound more important by adding extra syllables. It just sounds stupid. And it looks even more stupid in print. Dave the gnome: Doesn't British simply mean anyone or anything on the island of Great Britain? Wouldn't that include the Scottish and Welsh? or the Lancastrian? Is "Brit" an acceptable abbreviation? What would be better? Mike the knife: There was an interesting show on NPR where a gentleman described Yankee as being derived from the Dutch term janker, meaning a young man or new-comer. Thus the city of Yonkers, New York. We have somehow managed to retain the original spelling of York, a splendid city in England. Maybe because there are only four letters. Thanks for another great BS topic. Love, Johnny |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Nigel Parsons Date: 27 Apr 04 - 04:36 PM Johnny in OKC: We have somehow managed to retain the original spelling of York Assuming you're referring to the spelling, of 'New York', it is only recently that the spelling has been corrected to match the English. I seem to recall that it used to be spelt 'New Amsterdam'. And, if I recall correctly, in John Brunner's "Times Without Number" it was spelt 'Neuvo Castille' CHEERS Nigel |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Johnny in OKC Date: 27 Apr 04 - 08:06 PM Nigel, "only recently" ~~ well maybe. It has been New York for maybe 300 years. Of course to an Englishman, 300 years isn't much. And actually it was Nieuw Amsterdam. Thanks for your reply, though! Love, Johnny |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Mudlark Date: 27 Apr 04 - 09:04 PM Limey...hmmm, always thought it was a reference to the slice of lime found in a well-made G&T, who's native home is obviously England. On the other hand, nobody calls the English Pinkies (I'd like to see them try!) altho a Pink Gin is found nowhere except in England, whereas G&T's have spread around the colonized world. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Hrothgar Date: 28 Apr 04 - 04:12 AM But pronounced Noo Yark, or Noo Yuck? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Dave the Gnome Date: 28 Apr 04 - 04:37 AM Dave the gnome: Doesn't British simply mean anyone or anything on the island of Great Britain? Wouldn't that include the Scottish and Welsh? or the Lancastrian? No, no and a thousand times no!!! We believe fully and fervently in home rule for Lancashire;-) I make the distinction that I am NOT a Mancunian but from Swinton, and they are only 4 miles apart! Let us keep our insularity to within a mile of where we were born:-) You will be telling us that England is in Europe next. Who do you think you are? Tony Blair? Cheers DtG (I guess you are in the US - Come and visit for a better understanding of REAL xenophobia...) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Bagpuss Date: 28 Apr 04 - 05:58 AM Adding extra syllables: to press -> to pressure -> to pressurise -> ??? Its a common phenomena in english language. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Geoff the Duck Date: 28 Apr 04 - 06:11 AM Actually they gave LEMONS to sailors to prevent scurvy. Lemons are very high in Vitamin C and limes are not as effective. The name used for sailors came from somebody mistaking the one for the other. Quack! GtD. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Geoff the Duck Date: 28 Apr 04 - 06:13 AM By the way - I'm pleased the thread is not about YAK spelling, as I originally misread... Quack! GtD. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Bagpuss Date: 28 Apr 04 - 06:27 AM Even moire pleased it is not about Yak Smelling... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: freda underhill Date: 28 Apr 04 - 08:10 AM re pom or pommie for English - two theories, one that pom is an abbreviation of pomegranate, rhyming slang immigrant and also a reference to their rosy cheeks. 2nd that Pom derives from Prisoner of Mother England. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Rapparee Date: 28 Apr 04 - 12:16 PM Lobsterbacks? Red Coats? Imperialist Warmongering Colonial Superpower? (Although I suspect that the last isn't very historical.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: mike the knife Date: 28 Apr 04 - 12:28 PM Johnny in OKC: I had heard that too- I lived in NYC a while & had a friend in Yonkers. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Hollowfox Date: 28 Apr 04 - 04:23 PM I tried to use the term UnitedStatesian for a while, to distinguish citizenship in the USA from Canadian or Mexican or Peruvian citizenship, but it didn't catch on. I don't take offence at being called a Yank, myself. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 28 Apr 04 - 08:18 PM Yankee, according to H. L. Mencken is derived from the Knickerbocker Dutch. Yankey was a common nickname among the buccaneers, applying it to Dutch pirates, from Janke, diminutive for Jan. How did it get transferred to the English? He has trouble explaining that one, but the OED lends some support. It is likely that the name spread during the period after the Dutch turned over their colony to the English. The Dutch who stayed, a number of them entrepreneurial and the early English newcomers, also entrepreneurial, possibly used Yankey as a nickname, and it became confused and transferred. Just one idea, preferred by some of the experts; no certainties. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: YorkshireYankee Date: 28 Apr 04 - 09:31 PM As a transplanted Michigander (aka Meshuggenah) now living in Sheffield (yes, it *is* in Yorkshire; howdja guess?), I'm often referred to as a Yankee, as well as Yank or Colonial. I don't take offense, as I don't feel any is intended -- it's affectionate ribbing at worst -- and often refer to myself as a Yank. (My (English) husband says that I don't need to worry until they start calling me a "damned Colonial".) I also often get asked if I'm Canadian (when we're in the US, my husband often gets asked if he's Australian...). One fellow asked me if USians & Canadians like each other. I told him that folks in the US think well of Canadians, but that I didn't think Canadians were all that fond of their neighbours to the south. He asked if I was saying that because I'm prejudiced against Canadians. I said, "Well, I don't really think so, but you can check it out for yourself if you want. All you have to do is ask a Yankee if they're Canadian; if anything, they will probably be pleased/tickled to be mistaken for Canadian. However, if you ask a Canadian of they're from the US, they will probably be offended." "You're right!" he said. "I did once ask some Canadians if they were from the US, and they were *not* pleased!" Not that I blame Canadians for reacting that way, given the rep that USians seem to have. Over here, I find myself holding back from saying something when customer service is not up to standards, because I don't want to confirm the stereotype & come across as yet another pushy/obnoxious Yank. You will be telling us that England is in Europe next. I was surprised to learn (after I'd been here for a bit) that the British do not seem to consider themselves part of Europe. Case in point -- the newspaper headline that read: "Storms in Channel: Europe Cut Off" I think that pretty much sums up the British attitude... ;-0 Cheers, YY |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Irish sergeant Date: 29 Apr 04 - 09:29 AM "A Yankee is someone who goes south of Mason-Dixon to visit. A damned Yankee is someone who stays south of Mason-Dixon." Guy Bottoms, Atlanta Georgia. By the way the Dutch version of the origin or the term Yankee is likely the correct one. :~) Neil |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: GUEST,Robomatic Date: 29 Apr 04 - 12:45 PM Rapaire: I've always defined it a bit differently: In Europe a Yankee is an American In America a Yankee is someone from the U.S. In the U.S. a Yankee is someone from North of the Mason Dixon Line. In the north, a Yankee is someone from New England. In New England a Yankee is someone from Massachusetts. In Massachusetts a Yankee is someone from Boston. In The City of Boston Yankee is someone from Beacon Hill. In Boston's Beacon Hill Yankee is someone from the upper part of the hill. These are the Boston Brahmins. A "Maine Yankee" is something else entirely. Totally calls for a new thread. Meanwhile, the original version of the Yankee Doodle song was written by an Englishman on seeing New England militiamen practice. It pokes fun at colonial Americans, particularly Boston. A song group in my hometown of Needham Massachusetts issued it on a bicentennial recording: It starts out: Brother Ephrem sold his cow and bought him a commission Then he went to Canada to fight for the nation But when Ephrem he come home he proved an arrant coward He wouldn't fight the Frenchmen there for fear of being devoured. and it ends: Heigh ho for our Cape cod, Heigh ho Nantasket To not let the Boston Whites feel your oyster basket Uncle is a Yankee man, in faith he pays us all off He has got hisself a fiddle big as Daddy's hogrough. the chorus is: First we take a pinch of snuff, then a drink of water Then we say "How do y'do, and that's a Yankee supper! Time to move this thread upstairs! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - And this is goad old Boston, The home of the bean and the cod, Where the Lowells talk to the Cabots And the Cabots talk only to God. John Collins Bossidy, verse spoken at Holy Cross College alumni dinner in Boston, Massachusetts, 1910 |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: annamill Date: 29 Apr 04 - 06:36 PM I'd rather be called a "BoSox"!! (Boston Red Sox fan!) Love, Annamill |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: dianavan Date: 30 Apr 04 - 02:08 AM When my daughter and I were in Italy, two young men asked her if she were American. No, she said, Canadian. Oh well, same thing, they replied. Yeh, she said, sort of like Italians and Greeks are the same. They got the point. ...but this was supposed to be about Yankee spelling! Everyone knows they can't spell. examples: gray, color, honor, etc. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: GUEST,Dáithí mag Fhionnaín Date: 30 Apr 04 - 08:09 AM ...and it's not just spelling. How about "different than.." or "I don't got..." ? Also, "alternate" for "alternative", and in American English "momentarily" means ina moment whereas in British english it means "for a moment". Fascinating the way language usage develops. D |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: HuwG Date: 30 Apr 04 - 02:11 PM My mother tells me that dudring World War 2, the underwear available to British women was apparently American in inspiration, design or manufacture. "One Yank, and it was off" What, incidentally, is the accepted term for someone from the southern states of the US ? I should imagine that "rebel" (or "reb" or "Billy Reb") is rather outdated. I have seen on film and TV and in print, inhabitants of those states refer to themselves as "Louisianans", "Mississippians" etc, which does not seem to apply to the northern states (I cannot recall having heard of "Wisconsinians" for example, and seen "Minnesotans" only in Garrison Keillor's works. "Pennsylvanian" seems to be the exception). |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: GUEST,MMario Date: 30 Apr 04 - 02:30 PM well - I'm "from Massachusetts" - but I am a 'Cape Codder' - *grin* don't know what the people in the rest of the state did... Maine /Down Easter New York / New Yorker California/Californian Texas/Texan Kansas/ Kansan (I've seen it in print - never heard anyone use it) Buckeye / Ohio Sooner /Oklahoma (I think) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: robomatic Date: 30 Apr 04 - 03:50 PM As above, the term Yankee has multiple shades of meaning. Some of the terms used elsewhere: Cajuns: A shortening of the term 'Acadian' and referring to the Francophone people and culture of Louisiana. A pejorative which I've also heard used in a friendly manner is "coon-ass" Creoles: Same state, referring to the locals of mixed race descent and longtime habitation and cuisine. Sooners: A term for Oklahomans referring to the land-rush that occurred as a part of settlement. Other terms which may or may not be pejorative depending on usage but judged by whether you're smiling when you say them: Cracker Bubba Redneck Texas probably has a host of terms I'm not qualified to get into. The main thing to remember is that Texas is not part of the 'South'. Texas is Texas. They need to remember that Alaska could split in half and make Texas the third largest state in the union. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Desert Dancer Date: 30 Apr 04 - 07:00 PM "Yonkers" is entirely unrelated to "Yankee". From the Library of Congress: "Yonkers, N.Y. This name is believed to derive from the title of an early Dutch settler, Jonkheer Adriaen Van der Donck, who had an estate in the area. Van der Donck wrote one of the first accounts of the New Netherland settlement." Or here: "We learn that the name for the area of Yonkers originated from Van der Donck himself, who resided on a huge tract of land north of Manhattan and whose title Jonker, or young squire, would forever be fused with the territory." (From a review of "The Island at the Center of the World: The Epic Story of Dutch Manhattan, the Forgotten Colony That Shaped America" By Russell Shorto, Doubleday -- I'd heard an interview with him recently.) ~ Becky in Tucson |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Jim McLean Date: 01 May 04 - 05:51 PM Did you know that England lost her independence before America gained hers? Not a lotta people know that (or want to know). |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: dianavan Date: 02 May 04 - 01:08 AM Jim - I didn't know that. Please explain. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: paddymac Date: 02 May 04 - 01:04 PM Adding to MMario's listing: Illinois - Illini (a prominent tribal group when the Europeans arrived) Florida - Floridian, Seminole, Gator or Hurricane Wisconsin - badgers Iowa - Iowan (a prominent tribal group at the time the Europeans arrived), or Hawkeye Taxas - some folks there prefer "Texican" or "Tejano" (tay-han-o) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Yank Spelling From: Gypsy Date: 02 May 04 - 11:35 PM Nah, it's Yanqui! |
