BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support

Subject: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 09:46 AM

My attention has just been drawn to a thread started by Ellen - Host of the BBC4 music forum.

Any response to our June Tabor session over the weekend? Is she a national treasure or do we show too much folk?

I think with BBC4, some steps forward in the showing of folk music have been made and I'd hate them to think there is not much interest around or that they are showing too much.

If you can, let them know thier efforts are appreciated.

(here is the thread)

Jon

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: el ted
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 09:59 AM

I tried to log into the BBC4 site but I aren't clever enough to do it! Could you draw their attention to the June tabor thread on this site?
Can you also ask the buggers when all the good stuff they show is going to end up on God's own channel, ie: BBC2! What am I paying a bloody licence fee for?

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 10:05 AM

El Ted, you can not give URLs over there but I did mention that there was a thread on the June Tarour concert at Mudcat.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: s&r
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 01:15 PM

What a difficult site to access. Thanks Max for Mudcat.

Stu

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Ed.
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 02:42 PM

Thanks for the alert, Jon.

I've added my own ha'p'orth.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 02:47 PM

Difficult? Jon's link went straight there.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Ed.
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 02:59 PM

Guest,

I think that the comments on 'difficulty' refer to the way you have to register, and the slightly unintuative way (for people used to this type of system) of replying to messages

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: fat B****rd
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 03:56 PM

I shall be getting on their (BBC 4s) case as soon as cybernetically able.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 05:49 PM

The post to which I replied referred to access not posting. My reply was about access not posting.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Blowzabella
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 06:34 PM

I've tried to register but it hasn't acknowledged my reply to the email they sent me confirming that I have use of my email address! And some people think THIS site is over controlled!!!

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Mark Dowding
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 06:48 PM

Blowzabella - If you log out of the BBC4 forum and log back in again it should recognise you - just try replying to a thread once you've done that. I've just registered and logged out and in again to reply to the June Tabor thread.
Cheers
Mark

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: s&r
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 07:04 PM

I found the posting directly. The whole of the site is difficult to access (IMHO) being laid out in a confusing and inconsistent way. I say again: Thank You Max.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: s&r
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 07:11 PM

Strangely the message boards have opening and closing times - is this in case there is a naughty word? Or is it for maintenance?

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: s&r
Date: 09 Jun 04 - 07:14 PM

even more confusingly the opening times are shown as 09.00-00.00. Wasn't midnight always 23.59?

Stu

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Morticia
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 08:15 AM

finally got to put my sixpenn'orth in...let's hope someone pays some attention

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Pete_Standing
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 08:32 AM

Between Mudcatters and the Beeb F&A forum, we've almost made a sensational takeover of the site! 3rd highest posting so far and RISING!

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 08:45 AM

I got straight on from jons link and added my support.
All the BBC message boards are strictly controlled, obviously for censorship purposes. With all their resources they are not half as good as the Mudcat

eric

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Sir Roger de Beverley
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 09:00 AM

I've added my comments too. Tried to encourage them to do more by praising the June Tabor thing and also the Richard Thompson programme that was on last Friday

Roger

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: el ted
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 09:04 AM

Right you lot! You can all go back and ask them when all this stuff will make it to BBC2. I live in a hole in the ground and can't get satellite telly.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Pete_Standing
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 09:10 AM

el ted, what is your post code?

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: el ted
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 09:13 AM

Hu5 something or other pete, you know... the posh bit of Hull. But the nice man in Comet says my area wont pick it up. I can't get channel 5 either.. not that I'm bothered about that!

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Sir Roger de Beverley
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 09:33 AM

We can get Freeserve in Beverley (HU17) but it is very patchy in the East Riding generally. Must be all the mountains that we have round here getting in the way.

R

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Pete_Standing
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 10:35 AM

el ted

Go to the Freeview web site and stick in your postcode; you might be surprised. My bother-in-law lives in a digital hole but found out that it works. If you know someone who has a box, ask to borrow it just to test the reception.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: el ted
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 10:45 AM

Thanks peter,
            The BBC sent a message back saying " NO CHANCE! serves you right for living in Hull ha ha ha "
            I think I will just stop paying my licence fee because BBC2 was set up to broadcast Arts etc, and now it is full of pet/cookery/house worshipping shite!

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Pete_Standing
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 11:01 AM

Yes, I was kind of confused about broadcasting the F&A awards on BBC4. Was it an attempt to make viewers more aware of folk music or to make more aware of BBC4? Either way, I reckon it failed. The F&A "Oscars" is a depressing thing anyway and I'd sooner watch a concert or documentary on folk. I have sympathy with any of you folk who can't get digital to enjoy the lamentable amount of folk music aired on UK national TV/radio.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Rain Dog
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 11:50 AM

Peter, 3rd highest posting and rising but it is still only 19 posts.
The fact is that music is covered very poorly on TV. You have numerous pop / rock video TV stations on satellite ( I think I am right in saying that the UK has the most music tv stations ) yet if you ever spend any time flicking through them all you find they are playing the same old stuff. Of course, folk does not get a look in.

BBC4 has been a revelation. The documentaries and concerts they are showing now were not being shown on the other channels. It is a not a case of these programs being shunted over to BBC4. How many gigs were shown on BBC / ITV / Channel 4 before BBC4 appeared ? Not many. BBC4 has provided a chance for these type of programes to be shown. I am grateful for that at least.

I hope they continue to show many more.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 11:53 AM

I can't figure out how to use the bbc site, i know i neeed to register, but can't figure out how to.

Ted-get KIT, basic package is only about £5 a month, and you get all the free bbc digital tv and radio channels.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Rain Dog
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 12:07 PM

jOhn from Hull

Go here and follow the instructions

register for BBC message boards

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 12:11 PM

thanks Rain Dog.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: pavane
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 12:29 PM

Notice a lot of Mudcat names there...
Pavane was already taken, so I got Pavanemudcat instead

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: pavane
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 12:33 PM

I think the Beeb need some guidance on usability. Each time I tried a name that was already taken, it cleared the page, including the email address I had entered. Other sites don't seem to need to do this.

(I am currently working on Lotto Online)

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Pete_Standing
Date: 10 Jun 04 - 02:51 PM

Rain Dog, I agree with your sentiments, but when I posted yesterday, I was 4th to reply to the thread. There have since been an additional 15 making 20 (now the second highest). Of the 26 posts made since my first visit, 17 have been about June Tabor and of the rest, most have been about folk music with a high proportion of first time or newish posters. To the established BBC4 music posters, it must seem like we have overun the place.

What did Arlo Guthrie sing? "You can get anything you want, at Alice's restaurant...."

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 06:17 AM

its not bad, but its still a long way inferior to even average folk club music ....superstars, or would be superstars of the folk world are only half the story. you wouldn't really have been surprised to have June Tabor, Martin Simpson, Martin carthy et famille, Christy Moore or Paul Brady on the live with Jules Holland thing. they've all had the nod of critical approval bloody years ago. They don't need it financially - they've all had more creative opporunities than I've had chip sandwiches.

What about some real daring .... Derek Brimstone, Bob Fox, Vin Garbut, the Blackpool Taverners, John Connolly, Andy Caven, or some really new talent like Jez Hall.


it's still aunty beeb dipping her prim little toe in the water. it's too bloody tame to excite anybody and one suspects its organised by some prat who has never darkened the doors of a folk club.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: s&r
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 06:24 AM

Blackpool Taverners would be difficult. Big Pete died some years ago: Brian Osborne within the last couple of years from a heart attack. Not sure whether Stuart Robinson plays actively at the moment. Alan Bell has a band which is active consisting of Alan and Eddie and Andrew Green. Alan's voice is still splendid, but his playing is limite due to tendon problems in his hands (3 ops, and more to come).

Stu

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 06:29 AM

keep posting on the bbc4 page .power to the people and all that.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST,fay
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 06:49 AM

just been and done it - loads of posts there now, great job. Maybe we could rule the world?

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 07:15 AM

the point about Alan Bell and Connolly and Eric Bogle is that these guys have written songs which the whole world sings abd never have been on the telly once - folk on beeb4 is the usual suspects. Jez hall has written songs which the whole world might be singimg one day - the others have all written songs that should at least have been hit records - but the beeb was too busy showing programmes of the kind described....look its better than a Jimmy Tarbuck Special .... support enough?

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST,Mike Harding
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 08:21 AM

Bugger off you lot will you?

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 08:28 AM

wellittledrummer, I do take the point that what gets shown is predictable but I do view this as a start and a step in the right direction. Perhaps rather that criticising the rather limited selection we are likely to get, we should show our appreciation of at least some effort being made and from that point try to persuade them to broaden their range?

Jon

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 08:37 AM

weelittledrummer, One final point, if we show our appreciation of this broadcast, they may soften up and show a few programmes devoted to my personal hobby which is transvestism.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST,Mike Harding
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 08:46 AM

Hey JON, we have the same hobby. I take a size 14, how about you? You should listen to my programme on Radio 2 I devote the back end of it to the noble art of men wearing dresses. A proud Lancashire tradition and no mistake!

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Ben Dover
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 09:31 AM

Glad youlads have finally come out in support of Lancashire's finest tradition. I prefer a nice M&S frock meself, size 12. It's what made Lancashire great.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 10:51 AM

I have a certain amount of sympathy with weelittledrummer's opinion. It is pretty tedious and irritating that just a few artists get the awards year in year out at the BBC F&A awards when there is so much talent on the circuit; and I say this despite Tabor and Simpson being artists that I have a huge respect for. So yes it would be nice to see some other artists featured on TV (and the radio), but to come across well on TV is a different kettle of fish to performing at clubs and festivals. I reckon BBC4 ought to be commended and encouraged as they are so new to the scene, especially as it seems they are courting opinion via the message board – in contrast to another programme.

So 'catters, make a habit of checking out the BBC4 listings for more folk music and make sure that the message board gets your input too, despite its clunky interface.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Pete_Standing
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 10:55 AM

Whoops, lost me cookie.

Hey guys, where do you keep your hot-pot then?

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: el ted
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 11:06 AM

Remind me never to go t'lancashire.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: rhoda horse
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 11:24 AM

It's all very well you Lancashire pansies coming out, but this is a bit of serious deviation from the intent of this thread. Please can we focus on putting pressure on the BBC?

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Ben Dover
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 11:36 AM

If Mike harding is only a size 14, I'm a dutchman!

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 03:28 PM

Look all I'm saying is, it must be nearly 30years ago, or thereabouts June's fantastic record airs and graces was on the back of Folk Review on a major label.

A few weeks ago I was at Weymouth festival, I saw Paul Downes play a guitar with such virtuosity that, as a fan of guitarists for 50 years whose seen nearly everything, it left me breathless and unbelieving - it was just so stunning.

I DO give credit where its due. A couple of weeks ago I was doing somersaults on these pages because a BBC Scotland DJ played a couple of tracks by Jack Hudson.

The point is this Paul is in his 40's. Jack is in his 60's. WHEN do they get their chance.

The powers that be got it wrong in the 70's - they chose the wrong artists to promote to kick down the doors of public indifference to our music. And they've held fast to that view.

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: GUEST,Sarah
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 03:37 PM

They keep their hot-pot in their lunchboxes - beware!!!!!!

Subject: RE: BBC4 folk(UK) - please voice support
From: PennyBlack
Date: 11 Jun 04 - 07:38 PM

The BBC don't support the bread and butter Folk Scene even our own Radio Lancashire programme has dropped it's local listing and started playing more Main Line Folk hoping and I quote: " that more people will listen to the programme that before found it boring". When you consider it follows a programme on fishing it makes you wonder or maybe even worry.

In other areas BBC Folk programmes have been dropped all together.

Some of the problems lie with the people who produce the programmes (not present) who have no knowledge or interest in folk music, but I still think local radio should be just that.

PS Mike Harding is a size 18

PB