Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums

Subject: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: DMcG
Date: 20 Jun 04 - 04:41 AM

Yes, we all know such lists are pointless and just a way of papers filling gaps.

However, the UK Observer has published today (20 June 2004) a list of 'the 100 greatest British Albums' taking up about 2/3 of a 68-page magazine, and "Penguin Eggs" by Nic Jones made number 79. This seems to have caught them unawares because the article finishes with a 'Have your say' section as follows:

Enraged by the OMM Top 100 Albums? Perhaps you're angered at an omission: four Smiths albums and no room for Cure? ... Just who is Nic Jones? Have your say now on our dedicicated talkboard at www.observer.co.uk/omm

(There are others that are a bit unexpected: Unhalfbricking by Fairport Convention reached 27!)

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 20 Jun 04 - 04:53 AM

who is the observer?

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Ed.
Date: 20 Jun 04 - 11:44 AM

The Observer is a newspaper, click here for the full list.

The fact that 'Penguin Eggs' made it, is probably down to the fact that Martin Carthy, Kate Rusby, June Tabor and Norma Waterson were all part of the 100 strong voting panel. 'Unhalfbricking' at 27 is certainly a suprise, though!

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: DMcG
Date: 20 Jun 04 - 11:53 AM

I quite agree, Ed. But even so, there were 96 other people choosing the lists. I guess it is that there is more concensus in the folk world than elsewhere (also known as 'less to choose from'). And, from what I know of NW, MC, JT et el, I would not be at all surprised to find some non-folk choices in their lists.

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: GUEST,john c
Date: 20 Jun 04 - 12:29 PM

I see Vashti Bunyan is in there,too. Now, that really is a (well deserved) surprise.
But why no Incredible String Band? Conspiracy theories abound...
John

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 20 Jun 04 - 07:57 PM

Yes, I too find it quite extraordinary that the ISB isn't there. Nor are Billy Bragg, Richard Thompson, Suede or Madness, which is odd.   But what is interesting is just how many of those who did make the list perform (or have done at some stage) what is arguably "folk" music.

Included are Nick Drake, Van Morrison, Led Zeppelin, David Bowie, the Clash, the Specials , Rod Stewart, Kate Bush, John Martyn, the Kinks, Pentangle, Eurythmics, the Smiths, Elvis Costello, Radiohead and Ian Dury, all of whom have performed at clubs or festivals.

I'm really pleased that Penguin Eggs made it, and some early Fairport though I'm a bit puzzled at Unhalfbricking. Liege and Lief spent twice as long in the album charts.

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 20 Jun 04 - 09:30 PM

It's arguable, I suppose, that Unhalfbricking was the "mould-breaking" recording that was consolidated by Liege and Lief; but such lists are always very subjective. I expect that Peter Paphides (a recent and so far quite ignorant -though very opinionated- convert, but who may in time learn) is behind Vashti Bunyan's appearance; though Diamond Day was a pleasant enough album (and I still regret not buying it at the time) it is pretty much an evolutionary dead-end.

Perhaps the ISB were a bit compromised by recent "revival" tours, which don't seem to have done the romantic memory any favours. I was a big fan 30 years ago, but that's certainly a band that should never have tried to resurrect itself.

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Ross
Date: 21 Jun 04 - 08:09 AM

It can't be a serious top 100 without

a Herb Albert & his tijuanna brass LP

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 21 Jun 04 - 08:44 AM

Wot no Lonnie?
But the Temperance Seven were on Brian May's list!

RtS

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Folk Form # 1
Date: 24 Oct 04 - 07:02 PM

For those of you who are wondering what all the fuss is about Nic Jones, then why not pop into HMV and buy the CD, Penguin Eggs, as it is currantly selling for £6.99, which is good value in my books. Shame his other albums are a) not released or b) have been released but are only available from obscure outlets. They should all be let loose on the public!

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 24 Oct 04 - 09:38 PM

Penguin Egg-
I resent being referred to as an obscure outlet. CAMSCO Music carries "Penguin Eggs", "In SEarch of", "Unearthed", "Nic Jones" and ""Songs and Ballads".

WE also carry the other 99 CDs on the Observer list.

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: GUEST,vinyljunkie
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 03:16 AM

dick greenhaus. I had never heard of you before I bought Nic Jones and Songs and Ballads from you. It is bizarre that England's finest is not available through the usual retail outlets. Since Virgin, HMV do not carry these CDs -hey, great job distributors! - people will not realise they exist.

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: JohnB
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 08:57 PM

You can also buy direct from the artist by going direct to Nic Jones at Molly Music. The Julia named on the site is his wife. That's where I got all my CD's of his from. You will note it is a bit more expensive than buying from a cut priced distributor from whom Nic probably gets, not a lot.
JohnB

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Folk Form # 1
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 10:08 PM

Why would anyone want to pay twelve quid when you can go to HMV and get it for a lot cheaper. Ok, Nic - doncha just love the way everyone calls him Nic, as if he is an old freind - will make more money if I buy it directlly from him, but I will lose money, and anyway, I didnt realsie that I owed him a living. I think £8 is more than enough for a CD recorded over a quarter of a century ago. Don't, I repeat, don't pay more than you have to. I think the idea of Nic Jones' CDs being sold by his old lady on some web site that only Mudcatters know about to be small minded in the extreme. This is okay if you are some small artist struggling to make a name for yourself, but Nic Jones! Come off it! This is a major name in UK folk music. Even Bob Dylan listens to him! He should be out there in the real world, not lurking in shadows frightened to play with the big boys. If you ask me, he should shove his old lady back into the kitchen and get himself a proper manager who can sell him properly.

I can never understand people in here who insist on buying CDs directly from the artist. Do they write to Paul McCartney if they want to buy a Wings album?

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: JWB
Date: 25 Oct 04 - 11:39 PM

As for the list that started this thread, I wonder if Brass Monkey made it. That's an awesome British band, IMHO.

Jerry

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Nerd
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 02:28 AM

This is okay if you are some small artist struggling to make a name for yourself, but Nic Jones! Come off it! This is a major name in UK folk music. Even Bob Dylan listens to him! He should be out there in the real world, not lurking in shadows frightened to play with the big boys. If you ask me, he should shove his old lady back into the kitchen and get himself a proper manager who can sell him properly.

Perhaps you're not aware of this, PE, But Nic Jones was in a terribnle car accident in the 1980s and no longer performs; in fact, he cannot remember many details of his days as a folk performer due to the brain damage. He has regained most of his faculties, is fine mentally apart from the memory loss from the time before the accident, and can even play the guitar again though not as well as he did (physical limitations), but he's not going to be performing or making new recordings any time soon.

As we have detailed on other threads, many of his recordings are owned by a defunct record company with an owner who has no desire to reissue them. The recourse Nic's family came to was to issue CDs made up of archival recordings owned by the family or sources who were willing to donate them. Nic may be a major name, but since he can't tour in support of an album it's tough to get a label deal, and for simplicity's sake the family released the CDs on their own label. Hence the website. It's not small minded at all, just the best of a bad situation.

It's true that you don't owe him a living, but others are capable of making their own decisions as to whether they wish to pay more and buy direct from Nic or pay less through HMV. Either way, I urge people to buy the CD as it's great. Then go and buy the others available from Mollie Music, as they are too!

Finally, your crack about shoving his wife back in the kitchen was tasteless and misogynistic. But you knew that, didn't you?

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: pavane
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 03:41 AM

And if you were able to listen to the recordings made 'over quarter of a century ago' you would understand why Nic is still popular.

(Incidentally, his first album was entitled Nic Jones - that's always been his preferred spelling)

These classics do not age, unlike much of the stuff being made now.
I still play them regularly.

(Oh yes, and the record company who currently own the rights are 'allegedly' notorious for denying royalties to the performers. They are known to put out reissues on CD-ROM, instead of real CDs, which means that they do not have to disclose how many they have pressed or sold.)

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 05:04 AM

I thought the crack about his wife was really funny.

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Nerd
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 03:35 PM

I didn't actually say it wasn't funny, GUEST. Just that it was tasteless and misogynistic.

Then again, I didn't think it was funny either. But that's just me.

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 03:47 PM

No, its notjust you, Nerd, it actually WASN'T funny....& sorry to diasappoint the Trolls, but it wasnt shocking or embarrassing either....*G*

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 06:28 PM

Penguin Eggs was a brilliant album and among my top 10 of all time. How come a Catter called Penguin Egg (not an anonymous guest) could be so oblivious to the reasons why Nic isn't making money out of his recording? (see Celtic Music threads).

Kitty

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: Ralphie
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 06:51 PM

Nerd/Kitty/Pavane.
Thanks. On the day that my mate John Peel died. (A stout supporter of Nic Jones and many others). Your support is appreciated.
As for Mr/Ms Penguin Eggs.... Words fail me. Save your money by all means, hope the savings fill you with the milk of human kindness.
Regards Ralph.

Subject: RE: Penguin Eggs and top 100 British Albums
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 26 Oct 04 - 11:52 PM

"Penguin Eggs" was recorded (and is owned by( Topic. "Unearthed" and
In Search of" are self-produced and owned by Mollie Music (whom, I guess, is Mr. Jones) "Nic Jones" and "Songs and Ballads" are owned by Celtic Music, who bought out Leader Trailer.

Sadly, nobody can even come close to making a living from royalties on folk recordings. The money, as it is, comes from flogging CDs at performances.